IL - Fed judge rules illegal invaders have 2nd amendment rights

[Anti Federalist]

https://twitter.com/Rightanglenews/s...51573599588419

[Anti Federalist]

When the Marxists "nationalize" all private property and savings, like Chavez did 20 years ago, the invaders will be the standing army that will be deputized and sent out to enforce the collections and occupations.

Resist and they will kill you.

[69360]

When the Marxists "nationalize" all private property and savings, like Chavez did 20 years ago, the invaders will be the standing army that will be deputized and sent out to enforce the collections and occupations.

Resist and they will kill you.

Meh, they are outnumbered and outgunned by the natives.

[jkr]

...does it l00k lyke a military yet?

[PAF]

So let me take a stab here:

1. The 2nd A only applies to people born here.

2. The 2nd A only applies to people who the government defines as “legal”.

3. We must sacrifice the 2nd A in order to protect it.

I can’t wait to see how the “let’s pretend we are republicans” deal with such things in the OP, while I am constantly told “they hate us for our freedoms”.

[Anti Globalist]

Another Marxist judge probably put there by the likes of Soros.

[unknown]

Trying to find the backstory.

WTF...

https://casetext.com/case/united-sta...bajal-flores-1

"The government argues that Carbajal-Flores' conduct is not covered because he is not a “law-abiding” resident of the United States and therefore not one of the “people” entitled to “keep and bear arms.”

Carbajal-Flores violated the law, the government contends, because he remained in the United States unlawfully, possessed a weapon without a valid FOID card, possessed a firearm not registered to him, received the firearm in an illegal street transaction, and pointed and shot the weapon at passing cars. (Dkt. 68, at 9-10.)"...

[Anti Federalist]

https://twitter.com/iamyesyouareno/s...17653181735174

[PAF]

sent out to enforce the collections and occupations.

https://twitter.com/iamyesyouareno/s...17653181735174

So rather than to work to reduce/eliminate collections/agencies, and declare the ruling a WIN for the 2nd Amendment which is an outline of all peoples Natural Born/God Given Right, it sounds to me like you are once again begging Fed.gov to do something else, such as eliminate and/or rewrite the 2nd Amendment.

"They hate us for our freedoms."

[Anti Federalist]

So rather than to work to reduce/eliminate collections/agencies, and declare the ruling a WIN for the 2nd Amendment which is an outline of all peoples Natural Born/God Given Right, it sounds to me like you are once again begging Fed.gov to do something else, such as eliminate and/or rewrite the 2nd Amendment.

"They hate us for our freedoms."

No, I don't want the invading army to be armed.

They should not be here in the first place.

Because once here, it's already been adjudicated numerous times that invaders and illegals are protected by the Bill of Rights.

So, this judge's ruling will probably stand.

Now, if it were me, failing to properly dot an "i" on ATF form 4476, I'd get marched off to prison.

Or if I spoke out against the current regime.

They arrested three more real Americans as polticals this morning.

Can't spare any outrage for them, huh?

[PAF]

No, I don't want the invading army to be armed.

They should not be here in the first place.

Because once here, it's already been adjudicated numerous times that invaders and illegals are protected by the Bill of Rights.

Then my suggestion is for you to stop supporting Joe Biden, and Trump too, for funneling them in [the revolving MIC door], and demand to stop funding NGO's to transport invite them in with tax payer money.

Other than that, I really don't understand the point of this thread, when to me it is a WIN for the 2nd Amendment and should be left at that.

[CaptUSA]

No, I don't want the invading army to be armed.

They should not be here in the first place.

Because once here, it's already been adjudicated numerous times that invaders and illegals are protected by the Bill of Rights.

So, this judge's ruling will probably stand.

Now, if it were me, failing to properly dot an "i" on ATF form 4476, I'd get marched off to prison.

Or if I spoke out against the current regime.

They arrested three more real Americans as polticals this morning.

Can't spare any outrage for them, huh?

Government solutions for government-created problems.

I think PAF has legitimate concerns here. As individuals, all humans - especially on our lands - have the right to defend themselves.

But as an illegally invading horde, those rights for individuals can be dangerous. But the effort should be on stopping the illegal invasion rather than trampling the rights of self-defense.

[RJB]

In 1776, I am glad that my ancestors didn't extend 2nd Amendment rights to the Redcoats.

[Anti Federalist]

Then my suggestion is for you to stop supporting Joe Biden, and Trump too, for funneling them in [the revolving MIC door], and demand to stop funding NGO's to transport invite them in with tax payer money.

Other than that, I really don't understand the point of this thread, when to me it is a WIN for the 2nd Amendment and should be left at that.

Demand to $#@!ing who, man?

FFS, don't you think I have already?

Look, here's how it's going to go down: once word gets out that as soon as any invader who makes it into the country can legally purchase and carry weapons, it will set off a crime wave the likes of which has never been seen before, because these are not older, sane, white people invading us.

The hue and cry that will rise up from that will prompt a successful push to repeal the second.

Game over at that point.

Which is, of course, the point of all this.

You do not honestly think that judge is a supporter of the RTKABA, do you?

[Anti Federalist]

This is equivalent to saying if, during WWII, the Japanese Imperial Army had invaded the US west coast, we should have been passing out M1s to them as they came ashore.

[PAF]

Demand to $#@!ing who, man?

FFS, don't you think I have already?

If you have, you'd know who. Standing behind the likes of Trump, Biden, do no good. All that does is reinforce the lobbyists who make it happen. Have you hammered your representatives like I have to stop any funding at all? If more effort was given to this, rather than calls to destroy our Bill of Rights, we just might get somewhere.

Look, here's how it's going to go down: once word gets out that as soon as any invader who makes it into the country can legally purchase and carry weapons, it will set off a crime wave the likes of which has never been seen before, because these are not older, sane, white people invading us.

The hue and cry that will rise up from that will prompt a successful push to repeal the second.

Game over at that point.

@CaptUSA termed it very correctly in the other thread: "protectionist".

So, you are opposed to the freedom to travel freely without "papers please". You are for signing human beings up with Fed.gov in order to be deemed "legal". You believe Natural/God Given Rights apply only to "nationalists" and nobody else.

AF, it appears to me that you are following the Pied-Pipers behind these schemes right into hell, and you seem good with that [hoping that I am wrong, and that you just aren't seeing things with clarity].

I can’t wait to see how the “let’s pretend we are republicans” deal with such things in the OP, while I am constantly told “they hate us for our freedoms”.

[acptulsa]

Government solutions for government-created problems...

But the effort should be on stopping the illegal invasion rather than trampling the rights of self-defense.

All Hegel all the time.

Stop the government op which is importing criminals and refusing to jail them.

Hello..?

Everything else is just window dressing, and any time they go to the trouble to decorate the shop window for us, they're trying to sell us something we don't need and really, really don't want.

The psyop is underway. They'll lead us around with bait and little shocks until we can't find our way out of their maze.

[TheCount]

Trying to find the backstory.

WTF...

https://casetext.com/case/united-sta...bajal-flores-1

"The government argues that Carbajal-Flores' conduct is not covered because he is not a “law-abiding” resident of the United States and therefore not one of the “people” entitled to “keep and bear arms.”

Carbajal-Flores violated the law, the government contends, because he remained in the United States unlawfully, possessed a weapon without a valid FOID card, possessed a firearm not registered to him, received the firearm in an illegal street transaction, and pointed and shot the weapon at passing cars. (Dkt. 68, at 9-10.)"...

Is this the ruling? It says the exact opposite of what the OP claims.

[Anti Federalist]

Is this the ruling? It says the exact opposite of what the OP claims.

That was what he was charged with.

The judge dismissed it.

At least that's how I understand it.

[Anti Federalist]

You are for signing human beings up with Fed.gov in order to be deemed "legal".

I am for the fedgov doing its constitutionally mandated duty under article four section four.

Protecting the republic against invasion.

[PAF]

I am for the fedgov doing its constitutionally mandated duty under article four section four.

Protecting the republic against invasion.

Since Fed.gov is the one who is funding the NGO’s to invite and transport them in, while at the same time building the Police State apparatus to “protect” you, all there is left to do is to upset you enough that a rewrite of the 2nd A will be welcomed.

It is not “they” [who hate us for our freedoms], it is “we”. But certainly not me.

[69360]

Demand to $#@!ing who, man?

FFS, don't you think I have already?

Look, here's how it's going to go down: once word gets out that as soon as any invader who makes it into the country can legally purchase and carry weapons, it will set off a crime wave the likes of which has never been seen before, because these are not older, sane, white people invading us.

The hue and cry that will rise up from that will prompt a successful push to repeal the second.

Game over at that point.

Which is, of course, the point of all this.

You do not honestly think that judge is a supporter of the RTKABA, do you?

Whatever. Bring it on. I think you'll find that the vast majority of the illegals just want a job. Sure there will be some who want to commit crimes but as far as crime wave or invasion? The illegals are massively outnumbered and outgunned. It will be fine.

Just to be clear, I don't think noncitizens should be allowed to buy or carry guns. This is just what I think would happen.

[Anti Federalist]

Since Fed.gov is the one who is funding the NGO’s to invite and transport them in, while at the same time building the Police State apparatus to “protect” you, all there is left to do is to upset you enough that a rewrite of the 2nd A will be welcomed.

It is not “they” [who hate us for our freedoms], it is “we”. But certainly not me.

Yes, I understand that.

You asked what I was "for".

That is what I am for.

The fact that the fedgov is shot full of enemies of the republic does not change that.

All it means is that what I am for will not happen, as the unwholesome flood continues, unabated.

Look, all this is pointless anyway, your pov has taken the field, take your victory lap and never mind what inconsequential people like me have to say about it.

Between the invading hordes and the exploding debt, this nation is done for.

Will make it that much easier for the New Order to launch the death plague in a few years.

[PAF]

Yes, I understand that.

You asked what I was "for".

That is what I am for.

The fact that the fedgov is shot full of enemies of the republic does not change that.

All it means is that what I am for will not happen, as the unwholesome flood continues, unabated.

Look, all this is pointless anyway, your pov has taken the field, take your victory lap and never mind what inconsequential people like me have to say about it.

Between the invading hordes and the exploding debt, this nation is done for.

Will make it that much easier for the New Order to launch the death plague in a few years.

I understand your frustration. The point that I am trying to get across is, instead of voting/supporting Trump/Biden, who are both tyrants each in their own ways, and succumbing to the lobbyists, if even half the effort was put into demanding defunding these things, we wouldn’t be where we are today.

[Anti Federalist]

I understand your frustration. The point that I am trying to get across is, instead of voting/supporting Trump/Biden, who are both tyrants each in their own ways, and succumbing to the lobbyists, if even half the effort was put into demanding defunding these things, we wouldn’t be where we are today.

Trust me, I put much more effort into the latter than the former.

It takes 15 minutes to vote. Outside of that I do not rally or organize or canvass or stump or sign wave for Trump, or any other candidate for that matter.

I have only done that for two candidates in my lifetime, Pat Buchanan and Ron Paul.

I agitate in town and in the state house.

My federal representation is utterly worthless, I would do better talking to dogs.

[PAF]

Trust me, I put much more effort into the latter than the former.

It takes 15 minutes to vote. Outside of that I do not rally or organize or canvass or stump or sign wave for Trump, or any other candidate for that matter.

I have only done that for two candidates in my lifetime, Pat Buchanan and Ron Paul.

I agitate in town and in the state house.

My federal representation is utterly worthless, I would do better talking to dogs.

Fair enough.

But, I still don’t get the point of this thread, especially the title, which suggests to me that “only certain people/groups of people” should be afforded Rights by God/Nature. Are you under some false assumption, or trying to persuade folks, that the 2nd Amendment should only be regulated and/or granted by politicians/governments?

[CaptUSA]

Fair enough.

But, I still don’t get the point of this thread, especially the title, which suggests to me that “only certain people/groups of people” should be afforded Rights by God/Nature. Are you under some false assumption, or trying to persuade folks, that the 2nd Amendment should only be regulated and/or granted by politicians/governments?

Come on. You know better. We all know the rights of individuals to defend themselves are endowed by the Creator. The issue here is that many people, including AF, are not considering these people as individuals - but an invasion force. Yes, our own government invited that invasion, but the same issue exists, regardless.

Here's a compromise... If we find someone here illegally with a gun, instead of arresting them for a gun crime, how about we just deport them immediately!

[TheCount]

That was what he was charged with.

The judge dismissed it.

At least that's how I understand it.

The last sentence of the order:

Defendant's motion to dismiss the indictment [64] is denied.

[PAF]

Come on. You know better. We all know the rights of individuals to defend themselves are endowed by the Creator.

Agreed :-)

The issue here is that many people, including AF, are not considering these people as individuals - but an invasion force. Yes, our own government invited that invasion, but the same issue exists, regardless.

Here's a compromise... If we find someone here illegally with a gun, instead of arresting them for a gun crime, how about we just deport them immediately!

The title, which I disagree with, speaks for itself.

You and I agree on many things, but the issue of "legal/illegal" does not sit well with me, which I have explained previously.

If it was up to me, the word "illegal" would be stricken when it comes to human beings. There is no reason for government to know/restrict/regulate human beings unless an actual crime has been committed, and the accused has an opportunity to face their accuser. There is no reason for people to become "legal" just to be tracked, monitored and forced to pay Federal Income Tax, and/or to draw from the system. This whole "legal/illegal" is an Agenda 2030 plot to ID every man, woman and child on earth. Every person on earth is granted Rights derived from God/Nature, it is up to the individual to defend and protect them.

Simply put, this whole "legal/illegal" is the Agenda 2030 plot to deprive each and every one of us every one of our Bill of Rights - no matter what country one happens to hail from.

The only solution: defund the NGO's, MIC profiteers and agencies/programs that are stripping us of our hard-earned money and Rights.

[CaptUSA]

The title, which I disagree with, speaks for itself.

You and I agree on many things, but the issue of "legal/illegal" does not sit well with me, which I have explained previously.

If it was up to me, the word "illegal" would be stricken when it comes to human beings. There is no reason for government to know/restrict/regulate human beings unless an actual crime has been committed, and the accused has an opportunity to face their accuser. There is no reason for people to become "legal" just to be tracked, monitored and forced to pay Federal Income Tax, and/or to draw from the system. This whole "legal/illegal" is an Agenda 2030 plot to ID every man, woman and child on earth. Every person on earth is granted Rights derived from God/Nature, it is up to the individual to defend and protect them.

Simply put, this whole "legal/illegal" is the Agenda 2030 plot to deprive each and every one of us every one of our Bill of Rights - no matter what country one happens to hail from.

The only solution: defund the NGO's, MIC profiteers and agencies/programs that are stripping us of our hard-earned money and Rights.

"Illegally" crossed our border. A crime has been committed. I don't want any part of any "Agenda 2030" or whatever, but I have come around on nations needing enforceable borders. Especially, when there's a welfare state! I would MUCH rather eliminate the perverse incentives to come here! But even absent those lures, nations have the obligation to authorize people coming into their lands. In our utopia, that would be a rather easy process that almost no one would object to - but that's not reality.