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  1. #1

    Chauvin - Guilty on All Charges

    Derek Chauvin - Guilty on All Charges
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  3. #2
    Still gonna be riots regardless of whatever the verdict was.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Still gonna be riots regardless of whatever the verdict was.
    Celebrations are also great excuses to riot and loot.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Celebrations are also great excuses to riot and loot.
    I'm fully expecting the media to justify all riots that happen as joyous celebrations.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  6. #5
    Does this send a signal to cops that they’re not protected?? Somehow I doubt it.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Does this send a signal to cops that they’re not protected?? Somehow I doubt it.
    It only makes people not want to be cops.
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  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post
    It only makes people not want to be cops.
    Good. I've been trying to send that message to youngsters for years!

    (for many years now, "cop" was a default career option for high schools kids who didn't have a good direction for their lives. Very similar to "nurse")
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    for many years now, "cop" was a default career option for high schools kids who didn't have a good direction for their lives.
    I'm more concerned that it's the default career option for people who first join the military, realize that it doesn't give them what they were looking for, and turn to policing as a better option to get it.


    It seems to me that the thing that they are looking for is some combination of a power trip / ego boost and the ability to intimidate and control others.
    "The one permanent emotion of the inferior man is fear - fear of the unknown, the complex, the inexplicable. What he wants above everything else is safety."
    H. L. Mencken

    Quote Originally Posted by Contumacious View Post
    In conclusion THE ONLY WAY BIDEN IS GOING TO SEE THE INSIDE OF THE OVAL OFFICE IS VIA THE A WHITEHOUSE PUBLIC TOUR



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  11. #9
    Mob rules.
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


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  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    Mob rules.
    It was a political show trial to satiate the leftist mobs.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  13. #11
    Speaking of celebration, the MSM backrooms will be celebrating another propaganda victory.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  14. #12
    I didn't realize that Chauvin tried to plea to third degree murder.

    I suspect that he knew that his goose was cooked.

    There may be room for appeal down the road.

    But that leaves plenty of time for him to break in his soap on a rope.

    He did it to himself.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Does this send a signal to cops that they’re not protected?? Somehow I doubt it.
    It sends a clear signal. Don’t kill black people. But it’s still open season on everyone else.



    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    It sends a clear signal. Don’t kill black people...
    ...on camera.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    It sends a clear signal. Don’t kill black people. But it’s still open season on everyone else.

    A much better comparison can be made between ^this video and the Adam Toledo video or the Tamir Rice video or the Philando Castille video than to George Floyd. I'm sad Mr. Shaver died. But at one point he clearly made a move that could have been interpreted as going for a gun. People want to talk about "Play stupid games and win stupid prizes?" Well Mr. Shaver pointed a scoped pellet gun out of a hotel window. That's what brought in S.W.A.T. Pretty stupid. I don't think Shaver should have been shot. I don't think Toledo should have been shot. I don't think Tamir Rice should have been shot. I don't think Philando Castille should have been shot. But in each of those cases there was a possible "I was in fear for my life" defense. Derek Chauvin never could claim to be in fear of his life. Police convictions are rare. The Somali born cop that killed the white woman from Australia because he freaked out and fired blindly after hearing a "bang" was convicted even though he used the "I was in fear of my life" defense. And he should have been convicted. But so should some other cops. (Philando Castille's killer at least). The guy that shot Oscar Grant in the back after he was on the ground handcuffed because he thought he had a taser got convicted. We'll see if this latest taser / shooter gets acquitted.

    If you want to compare apples to apples talk Tony Timpa.

    I'll reserve judgement on this one as I haven't seen a good angle of the video. But from what I saw it seems to back up the claim that she was attempting to jump through the barrade door window. That was another stupid game to play. When Capital Hill Police murdered Miriam Carey (black), they pulled her daughter out of the car before gunning her down. I don't recall any police ever being charged.

    I hope Tony Timpa (white) gets some justice. I hope the same for Kelly Thomas (white). Both of those killings seem completely unjustified and there's no evidence of "stupid games" being played. But the same standard has to be applied. If cops get the benefit of the doubt when they shoot someone who happens to be unarmed because they think he has a gun, even if it really is a wallet (Amadou Diallo - black), then they get the benefit of the doubt when the same thing happens and the suspect is white. If they don't, then they don't.

    This trial should be looked at as the wierd 2020 outlier that it is IMO.
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  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    A much better comparison can be made between ^this video and the Adam Toledo video or the Tamir Rice video or the Philando Castille video than to George Floyd.
    ...
    No comparison to any other case was intended. The point was that those cops walked. And if a cop killed those same people tomorrow, they would still walk.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    No comparison to any other case was intended. The point was that those cops walked. And if a cop killed those same people tomorrow, they would still walk.
    So... all cops should walk?
    "The one permanent emotion of the inferior man is fear - fear of the unknown, the complex, the inexplicable. What he wants above everything else is safety."
    H. L. Mencken

    Quote Originally Posted by Contumacious View Post
    In conclusion THE ONLY WAY BIDEN IS GOING TO SEE THE INSIDE OF THE OVAL OFFICE IS VIA THE A WHITEHOUSE PUBLIC TOUR

  21. #18
    Keith Ellison, Minnesota Attorney General, just said that this was not justice. He said there needs to be reparations, and it is in the hands of the people (aka mob). He wants riots.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Keith Ellison, Minnesota Attorney General, just said that this was not justice. He said there needs to be reparations, and it is in the hands of the people (aka mob). He wants riots.
    Good grief.
    "I shall bring justice to Westeros. Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that."
    -Stannis Baratheon

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by sparebulb View Post
    I didn't realize that Chauvin tried to plea to third degree murder.

    I suspect that he knew that his goose was cooked.

    There may be room for appeal down the road.

    But that leaves plenty of time for him to break in his soap on a rope.

    He did it to himself.
    I'm not a huge fan of the police, but my problem is that there seems to be a legitimate "reasonable doubt" that Chauvin killed George Floyd. The drugs in George Floyd's system, the fact that George Floyd stated that he couldn't breathe before he was pinned, a sliver of doubt about the exact placement of the knee, a supposed lack of post-mortem injury to the neck, etc., are reasonable to consider. I didn't have personal investment in the outcome of this trial, but I have a hard time thinking that it is a win considering the legal standard of "reasonable doubt" was mostly likely slaughtered (not to mention the witness intimidation and other shenanigans clouding this case).
    "I shall bring justice to Westeros. Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that."
    -Stannis Baratheon

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of the police, but my problem is that there seems to be a legitimate "reasonable doubt" that Chauvin killed George Floyd. The drugs in George Floyd's system, the fact that George Floyd stated that he couldn't breathe before he was pinned, a sliver of doubt about the exact placement of the knee, a supposed lack of post-mortem injury to the neck, etc., are reasonable to consider. I didn't have personal investment in the outcome of this trial, but I have a hard time thinking that it is a win considering the legal standard of "reasonable doubt" was mostly likely slaughtered (not to mention the witness intimidation and other shenanigans clouding this case).
    IMHO and from what I know about the charges, he was definitely guilty of the second degree manslaughter charge. It was gross negligence on his part. The third degree murder charge was also valid, as he engaged in reckless and dangerous actions.

    Second degree murder was the huge stretch, which requires some level of intent, but without premeditation. That charge also involves some level of mind reading to know intent, absent some confession or testimony by someone who claimed to know intent.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    IMHO and from what I know about the charges, he was definitely guilty of the second degree manslaughter charge. It was gross negligence on his part. The third degree murder charge was also valid, as he engaged in reckless and dangerous actions.

    Second degree murder was the huge stretch, which requires some level of intent, but without premeditation. That charge also involves some level of mind reading to know intent, absent some confession or testimony by someone who claimed to know intent.
    It seems that, at worst, Chauvin was negligent, but that's assuming that George Floyd didn't die primarily or in totality from overdose. For what it's worth, my live-in, former pharmacist, father-in-law stated that an opiate (fentanyl) overdose can cause the respiratory muscles to stop functioning, resulting in a cessation of breathing. That seems like reasonable doubt to me.
    Last edited by Philhelm; 04-20-2021 at 04:51 PM.
    "I shall bring justice to Westeros. Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that."
    -Stannis Baratheon

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm View Post
    It seems that, at worst, Chauvin was negligent, but that's assuming that George Floyd didn't die primarily or in totality from overdose. For what it's worth, my live-in, former pharmacist, father-in-law stated that an opiate (fentanyl) overdose can cause the respiratory muscles to stop functioning, resulting in a cessation of breathing. That seems like reasonable doubt to me.
    The primary negligence was holding him down and putting pressure on the chest of someone who couldn't breath and was essentially having a heart attack. The reason for the medical emergency was unknown, and not relevant.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    IMHO and from what I know about the charges, he was definitely guilty of the second degree manslaughter charge. It was gross negligence on his part. The third degree murder charge was also valid, as he engaged in reckless and dangerous actions.

    Second degree murder was the huge stretch, which requires some level of intent, but without premeditation. That charge also involves some level of mind reading to know intent, absent some confession or testimony by someone who claimed to know intent.
    This seems accurate to me too.

    I also think it's strange for the charges to stack like that, it should be one of the three, whichever it meets the criteria for, not all three.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    This seems accurate to me too.

    I also think it's strange for the charges to stack like that, it should be one of the three, whichever it meets the criteria for, not all three.
    Essentially the charges are presented as a hierarchy, with 2nd degree murder being the most severe, 3rd degree being the next, then manslaughter (in this case). Each one has its own elements to prove. Ergo, Chauvin was not found to have criminally killed Floyd three times; it was that he was found to have committed three separate crimes that all resulted in Floyd's death.
    Indeed I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just and that his justice cannot sleep forever. Thomas Jefferson

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm View Post
    I'm not a huge fan of the police, but my problem is that there seems to be a legitimate "reasonable doubt" that Chauvin killed George Floyd. The drugs in George Floyd's system, the fact that George Floyd stated that he couldn't breathe before he was pinned, a sliver of doubt about the exact placement of the knee, a supposed lack of post-mortem injury to the neck, etc., are reasonable to consider. I didn't have personal investment in the outcome of this trial, but I have a hard time thinking that it is a win considering the legal standard of "reasonable doubt" was mostly likely slaughtered (not to mention the witness intimidation and other shenanigans clouding this case).
    This whole cluster $#@! from day one is like every episode of Breaking Bad condensed into one painful hour.

    I have nobody to cheer for here...nobody to be in favor of...not even an anti-hero has emerged.

    Everybody involved sucks ass and I want no part of any of it.
    Where they have burned books, they will end in burning human beings. - Heinrich Heine 1823

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    This whole cluster $#@! from day one is like every episode of Breaking Bad condensed into one painful hour.

    I have nobody to cheer for here...nobody to be in favor of...not even an anti-hero has emerged.

    Everybody involved sucks ass and I want no part of any of it.
    Welcome to New York City.

    The worst thing about it is, so much of the media is based there, and they have always been arrogant enough to assume the rest of us give a flying $#@! what goes on there.

    Imagine how much nicer this nation would be if what happened in New York City stayed in New York City.
    Because if someone doesn't "feel comfortable" with someone in this brave new middle school Official Culture, a death sentence is perfectly reasonable.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    This whole cluster $#@! from day one is like every episode of Breaking Bad condensed into one painful hour.

    I have nobody to cheer for here...nobody to be in favor of...not even an anti-hero has emerged.

    Everybody involved sucks ass and I want no part of any of it.
    The criminal defense attorney seemed okay. Go figure.
    "I shall bring justice to Westeros. Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that."
    -Stannis Baratheon

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post

    Everybody involved sucks ass and I want no part of any of it.
    This is the camp I've been in since this started.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    This whole cluster $#@! from day one is like every episode of Breaking Bad condensed into one painful hour.

    I have nobody to cheer for here...nobody to be in favor of...not even an anti-hero has emerged.

    Everybody involved sucks ass and I want no part of any of it.
    I agree.

    If there could be any characters that might have been acting out of basic human decency, it may have been some of the bystanders who recommended that Chauvin take his knee off of Saint Floyd of Fentanyl's neck.

    Although it may be hard to tell what was human decency and what was knee-jerk F The Police vitriol on the part of the bystanders.

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