Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 41

Thread: Governor Ron DeSantis signs largest tax hike in Florida history:

  1. #1

    Thumbs down Governor Ron DeSantis signs largest tax hike in Florida history:

    From Politico:

    While you are sleeping (maybe), Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis signed FL SB50 (21R) into law, which will require online retailers to collect sales taxes and then use the more than $1 billion in new tax revenue generated by this change to cut unemployment taxes paid by businesses as well as the commercial rent tax. DeSantis' decision to sign the bill came just hours before the measure would automatically became law. The governor's office waited until 11 p.m. to officially file his bill-signing letter with the Department of State. This led to speculation from some Democrats that the governor did not want to publicize his bill signing because it could be seen as a massive tax increase — a viewpoint that even some Republicans have suggested. Regardless of whether it's a "tax increase" or a "tax collection" change, consumers shopping online will pay more. And the money will be used to help large corporations.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #2
    Wonderful trend, Trump, DeSantis & Co.

    Give them all (R) passes.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer

  4. #3

    Thumbs down

    Oh Boy.

    Republicans are really worthless.

  5. #4
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  6. #5
    It's not a tax hike. It just collects tax on out of state purchases and uses it to help in state businesses. There is nothing wrong with it. The net result of it will help the state's businesses be stronger and add jobs in Florida.

  7. #6
    which will require online retailers to collect sales taxes and then use the more than $1 billion in new tax revenue generated by this change to cut unemployment taxes paid by businesses as well as the commercial rent tax
    Do they offset? Does Florida have a sales tax that currently does not apply to Amazon or other online sellers? Is this taxing Amazon purchases to reduce state business taxes?
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    It's not a tax hike.
    Of course it is a tax hike. More money will be leaving my pockets and going into government coffers.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Do they offset? Does Florida have a sales tax that currently does not apply to Amazon or other online sellers? Is this taxing Amazon purchases to reduce state business taxes?
    The new law appears to be in response to a 2018 US Supreme Court decision that overturned an earlier decision that held that a state couldn't require an out-of-state seller to collect sales tax if the seller had no physical presence in the state. Under the prior law the buyer paid no sales tax but instead owed use tax to his state of residence. But it was usually impossible for the state to enforce the use tax, except with respect to very large purchases (e.g., an aircraft) or business assets. If you lived, say, in New York and ordered a computer and monitor from Dell for your use at home, you owed NY use tax (because no sales tax was collected on the purchase), but no one ever paid it.

    So it's not really a tax increase. It's just requiring the seller to collect what the buyer owes anyway.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous



  10. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    The new law appears to be in response to a 2018 US Supreme Court decision that overturned an earlier decision that held that a state couldn't require an out-of-state seller to collect sales tax if the seller had no physical presence in the state. Under the prior law the buyer paid no sales tax but instead owed use tax to his state of residence. But it was usually impossible for the state to enforce the use tax, except with respect to very large purchases (e.g., an aircraft) or business assets. If you lived, say, in New York and ordered a computer and monitor from Dell for your use at home, you owed NY use tax (because no sales tax was collected on the purchase), but no one ever paid it.

    So it's not really a tax increase. It's just requiring the seller to collect what the buyer owes anyway.
    Practically speaking, replacing a tax that buyers can easily evade without consequence with one that they cannot, is the same to them as a tax hike.

  12. #10
    I didn't realize this wasn't nationwide yet.
    Since the supreme court decision I thought states got on this quickly.

  13. #11
    I'd like someone to make the case over how it helps large corporations.

    Seems like it could just as easily hurt companies like Amazon.

    Most of your mom & pop businesses have physical stores. I know people who will actually do their window shopping in stores and then check online to see if they can get it cheaper, and when you subtract a ~7% sales tax, it's always cheaper. Leave the store, place your order, and in a few days it's at your doorstep. The small business is the one getting screwed in this scenario.

    The alternative is that they could slash sales tax paid through physical storefronts to nothing, to balance it out. That's not likely to happen, and hell will freeze over before it happens in a state that doesn't have income tax.

    2nd alternative: Get rid of sales tax completely and implement income tax. (yeah, literally no one is a fan of that one)

    No one likes taxes, but Politico making the claim that this will hurt small business seems awfully like they're playing right into the hands of companies like Amazon.
    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 04-20-2021 at 11:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men

    Some of you still watch the news, and it shows.

    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato

    We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me

  14. #12
    Here is the SCOTUS case in question which allows governments to enforce tax laws across state lines:


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_...._Wayfair,_Inc.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Of course it is a tax hike. More money will be leaving my pockets and going into government coffers.
    Money that you legally should have been paying already. .

    DeSantis didn't raise any taxes or impose any new taxes.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    It's not a tax hike. [because hand-waving]
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    So it's not really a tax increase. [because hand-waving]
    Some people will pay more taxes now than they were paying before. Don't piss down their backs and tell them it's raining.

    If you're going to make excuses for it, fine - make excuses for it. But at least have the guts to call it what it is.

    It's a tax hike, period - all hand-waving to the contrary notwithstanding.
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 04-20-2021 at 11:43 AM.

    Libertarian Party Mises Caucus
    "The libertarian wing of the Libertarian Party."

    Platform · Our Actions

    Mises PAC
    (Libertarian Party membership not required)

    #TakeHumanAction · Donate · Merchandise


    HOME · Facebook · Twitter · YouTube

  17. #15
    Yeah, me too. "It's not a tax hike, it's a new tax." That's supposed to make me feel better?

    Because if someone doesn't "feel comfortable" with someone in this brave new middle school Official Culture, a death sentence is perfectly reasonable.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Some people will pay more taxes now than they were paying before. Don't piss down their backs and tell them it's raining.

    If you're going to make excuses for it, fine - make excuses for it. But at least have the guts to call it what it is.

    It's a tax hike, period - all hand-waving to the contrary notwithstanding.
    +Rep

    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Yeah, me too. "It's not a tax hike, it's a new tax." That's supposed to make me feel better?

    + Rep
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer



  19. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Some people will pay more taxes now than they were paying before. Don't piss down their backs and tell them it's raining.

    If you're going to make excuses for it, fine - make excuses for it. But at least have the guts to call it what it is.

    It's a tax hike, period - all hand-waving to the contrary notwithstanding.
    "You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Occam's Banana again."

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    From this article:
    The bill is estimated to tax consumers $1 billion a year, with the money first earmarked for the unemployment trust fund, which became depleted because of massive job losses during the COVID-19 pandemic. Businesses pay taxes that go into the trust fund and, without another source of money, would have faced higher taxes to replenish the fund.
    To those saying this isn't a tax hike, if it isn't a tax hike then how is it supposed to result in the state having more revenue to replenish its unemployment fund?
    Last edited by Invisible Man; 04-20-2021 at 01:50 PM.

  22. #19
    It's not a tax hike, it's a mandatory request for voluntary donations
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  23. #20
    Actually, maybe there's a way to capitalize on the rhetoric of this not being a tax hike.

    So the argument goes that there now exists a tax that has no way of being enforced that the state says people are supposed to pay, but that's entirely up to them to choose to pay voluntarily, and hardly anybody does, and there's no consequence for those who don't. And this tax is being kept nominally the same as far as its rate, but its method of enforcement is being changed to make it much more difficult to evade so that it's expected that the actual amount the state will collect will be much closer to the amount that's theoretically mandated by the letter of the law.

    If this is not a tax hike, then the opposite must also obtain. If we replace all the obligatory taxing and spending of government with something voluntary, then this would not be a cut in any taxation or spending. The letter-of-the-law rates and dollar amounts would all stay the same, but it would be left up to taxpayers to decide whether or not to contribute, and face no consequences if they choose not to. For example, the entire public education budget of a state could be replaced with funding that is 100% collected by voluntary contributions (which may or may not be given), and nobody who refuses to call this Florida bill a tax hike would have any grounds for calling that cut in public education spending.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    From this article:


    To those saying this isn't a tax hike, if it isn't a tax hike then how is it supposed to result in the state having more revenue to replenish its unemployment fund?
    The state of FL will now be collecting sales tax that was already imposed but not collected in most cases.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    The state of FL will now be collecting sales tax that was already imposed but not collected in most cases.
    So they'll be collecting more taxes than they did prior to the signing of this bill.

    The tax burden being born by the people of Florida, that is, the amount of money people will be paying in taxes, all else being equal (i.e. the same people spending the same amount of money in the same ways), will be higher.

    In other words, this is a tax hike.

  26. #23
    Eh, don't care. DeSantis is still the best governor in the country and it's not even close. I'd still move to Florida in a heartbeat and will continue to make moves to do so. I'm more than happy to pay a couple more dollars in an online purchase in exchange for saving the 6.85% New York takes out each of my paychecks.

  27. #24
    It is a consumption tax which is fine if it excludes food which it does, this encourages savings and Buffy should have to pay tax on her $200 hat from Amazon. When online prices for China junk is higher people start going to thrift stores to by a flashlight which is what they should have been doing all along. DeSantis 2024!



  28. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by James_Madison_Lives View Post
    Buffy should have to pay tax on her $200 hat from Amazon
    Why?

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by James_Madison_Lives View Post
    Buffy should have to pay tax on her $200 hat from Amazon.
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Why?
    Because Buffy voted for the politicians who are dumping money on Bezos. Better you should ask, why should the rest of us pay tax money that goes to Bezos?
    Because if someone doesn't "feel comfortable" with someone in this brave new middle school Official Culture, a death sentence is perfectly reasonable.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Because Buffy voted for the politicians who are dumping money on Bezos. Better you should ask, why should the rest of us pay tax money that goes to Bezos?
    If I have to pay tax online then Bozo loses when I can get the same flashlight for the same price now at the hardware store down the street. An online sales tax is pro-brick and mortar store. I don't want Bezos to have the entire supply chain in his warehouses. He and his party answer to the Chinese Communist Party.

  32. #28
    I was being tongue-in-cheek with IM, because I knew he was addressing a different topic.

    Quote Originally Posted by James_Madison_Lives View Post
    I don't want Bezos to have the entire supply chain in his warehouses.
    Agreed. However I may feel about sales taxes, I absolutely agree with that.
    Because if someone doesn't "feel comfortable" with someone in this brave new middle school Official Culture, a death sentence is perfectly reasonable.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    So they'll be collecting more taxes than they did prior to the signing of this bill.

    The tax burden being born by the people of Florida, that is, the amount of money people will be paying in taxes, all else being equal (i.e. the same people spending the same amount of money in the same ways), will be higher.

    In other words, this is a tax hike.
    Nice spin. They already were responsible for those taxes, they just weren't paying them.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    It's a tax hike, period - all hand-waving to the contrary notwithstanding.
    So cameras at stop lights constitute fine increases because they catch people who break traffic laws (and increase the risk of a collision) and who would skate but for the cameras?

    And radar guns should be called fine increases as well. For that matter, hiring more IRS employees or increasing the IRS's budget is a tax hike. In fact, anything that helps the enforcement of tax collection or the detection of unlawful activity that carries a monetary penalty is a tax/fine hike, right?

    "Tax hike" in this context is a misleading rhetorical phrase designed to appeal to people who are either ignorant about the existence of use taxes or don't care about complying with them.

    Will the revenue collected by state governments in general or Florida in particular increase? Yes. Did the tax payable by purchasers increase? No.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast


Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 02-17-2021, 11:08 AM
  2. Replies: 9
    Last Post: 10-04-2020, 08:44 PM
  3. Nevada Passes Largest Tax Hike in State History
    By AuH20 in forum U.S. Political News
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 06-03-2015, 08:23 AM
  4. House Democrats Pass Largest Tax Hike in History.....
    By sluggo in forum Economy & Markets
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 03-31-2008, 05:37 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •