Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 31 to 54 of 54

Thread: Mike Lee Slams HR 1 ‘For the People Act’ — ‘As if Written in Hell by the Devil Himself’.

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...
    It's also fascinating that you just... assume that anyone immigrating is probably a future Democrat.
    ...
    Democrats believe that fervently. They would never support more immigration of they did not believe it, and reality did not bear it out.

    A few outliers like some immigrants from Vietnam or Cuba don’t change the general trend.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Democrats believe that fervently. They would never support more immigration of they did not believe it, and reality did not bear it out.

    A few outliers like some immigrants from Vietnam or Cuba don’t change the general trend.
    Maybe if "conservatives" weren't so hostile to them and didn't assume that they're democrats-in-waiting, things would be different.


    It's the same with non-immigrant blacks and hispanics. Given their religious tendencies, they would have more in common with the Republican party if only the party didn't actively drive them away.
    "The one permanent emotion of the inferior man is fear - fear of the unknown, the complex, the inexplicable. What he wants above everything else is safety."
    H. L. Mencken

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Survival trumps liberty every time
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.



  4. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    HR1 doesn't say anything about immigration. People applying for green cards have already immigrated and are already living in the country. H1-B programs have no connection to voting.

    It's also fascinating that you just... assume that anyone immigrating is probably a future Democrat.



    What does anti-trust oversight have to do with whether or not social media companies can moderate their content and ban their users as they wish?

    You don't think it's possible that he simply believes that private companies should be able to make those decisions?



    Again, seems like you don't like that he has principles. You want someone who is "on the team."
    Like I said, I don't think you read what I wrote above and that's why you are talking about completely separate things. I never said HR 1 contains anything about immigration. It's the other bills that he wrote like S.386. Go through that.

    And no, not all people applying for green cards have immigrated in the country. Since 2004, 5.5 million new arrivals have received lawful permanent residency in the form of a green card. And the H1-B visa is effectively a non-immigrant visa which has a pathway to permanent residence; companies often support it for cheap labor with the agreement to support the employee with green card petitions. And that eventually leads to citizenship.

    And are you suggesting that the vast majority of immigrants tend to vote Republican rather than Democrat?

    A 2012 study of 2,900 foreign-born, naturalized immigrants . . . showed that about 62 percent identified themselves as Democrats, while 25 percent identified as Republicans, and 13 percent identified as independents.”

    Immigrants provide Democrats easy reliable votes in their effort to expand government. In 2014 the Center for Immigration Studies published a study digging into the numbers. Researcher James Gimpel of the University of Maryland found that

    • Immigrants, particularly Hispanics and Asians, have policy preferences when it comes to the size and scope of government that are more closely aligned with progressives than with conservatives. As a result, survey data show a two-to-one party identification with Democrats over Republicans.
    • By increasing income inequality and adding to the low-income population (e.g. immigrants and their minor children account for one-fourth of those in poverty and one-third of the uninsured) immigration likely makes all voters more supportive of redistributive policies championed by Democrats to support disadvantaged populations.
    • There is evidence that immigration may cause more Republican-oriented voters to move away from areas of high immigrant settlement leaving behind a more lopsided Democrat majority.

    Regarding Mike Lee's position on anti-trust, if you properly go through what I wrote above you will see that what I said was that he used to call for antitrust oversight of Google and used to urge the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) to investigate “whether Google’s actions violate antitrust law or substantially harm consumers or competition.”

    But ever since Google and other big tech companies started fundraising for him and pouring money for his campaign efforts, he made a complete U-turn. Now he questions the need for congressional antitrust investigations, complains about big fines imposed on Google, and defends it against charges of leftist bias.

    That's not having "principles". That is taking money from Big Business and changing positions overnight.
    Haul out that picture of Stonewall, tack it up with an old gray pin
    Raise up them Stars and Bars, the South shall rise again!"- Johnny Rebel


    All I know is that to see and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell, Rivers of Blood Speech


    "Unless we make sure that there is no infiltration of our country, then just as certain as you sit there, in the period of our lives you will see a red world."
    -Joseph McCarthy

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    I would add that one reason for the continuing “need” for imported low skilled immigration is the welfare state. Americans will not tale a low wage, hard work job when they have easy alternatives, whether that is living in their parents house forever, being on welfare programs, or a combination of the two.

    And there is a fallacy about alternatives and the destructive nature of welfare. There is a common meme that if welfare provides equivalent support as one would get from a job, the person will choose not to work, therefore welfare should pay a little less. My hypothesis is that welfare must pay much less than the lowest paying job. If it means not having to work, many (most?) people will take 50% less in welfare than working.

    The children of low wage immigrants can fall into the welfare trap just as much as any American. This is why there is a continuous need for more low skilled immigration. A recent immigrant may be a hard worker, but that only lasts as long as they don't find a way to better their situation.

    And their children will be raised in the coddling arms of the welfare state, where they either succeed on their own, or fall into the welfare trap. Either way, they won’t be low wage workers*.


    * We need to make the distinction between low wage work and teenage work like McDonalds or Starbucks. Those were never meant to be permanent careers, or living wages. They are the kindergarten of work experience.
    You are absolutely correct here.
    Haul out that picture of Stonewall, tack it up with an old gray pin
    Raise up them Stars and Bars, the South shall rise again!"- Johnny Rebel


    All I know is that to see and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell, Rivers of Blood Speech


    "Unless we make sure that there is no infiltration of our country, then just as certain as you sit there, in the period of our lives you will see a red world."
    -Joseph McCarthy

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    Like I said, I don't think you read what I wrote above and that's why you are talking about completely separate things. I never said HR 1 contains anything about immigration.
    Yes, I agree. That makes it not a flip flop because for him to have flip flopped, he had to have held contradictory views on the same issue.


    You can't say "Mike Lee flip flops by not supporting HR 1 but supporting immigration" because those two things have nothing to do with each other.


    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    And no, not all people applying for green cards have immigrated in the country.
    Not all, but the other types of immigrants that you go on to talk about involve becoming a temporary immigrant first and a permanent immigrant second. In addition, many people who are waiting on the green card process receive some kind of temporary visa while the process is ongoing.


    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    And are you suggesting that the vast majority of immigrants tend to vote Republican rather than Democrat?
    Holy $#@!, no, reread what I've said.

    Do immigrants vote Democrat because immigrants are magically Democrats because reasons, or do they vote Democrat because Republicans are anti-immigrant? It should be obvious that someone would simply not vote for a party which is directly hostile to them, no matter what they think about that party's policies.


    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    Immigrants provide Democrats easy reliable votes in their effort to expand government.
    Immigrants provide Democrats easy reliable votes because Republicans have fearmongered about immigrants for decades.


    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    Regarding Mike Lee's position on anti-trust, if you properly go through what I wrote above you will see that what I said was that he used to call for antitrust oversight of Google and used to urge the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) to investigate “whether Google’s actions violate antitrust law or substantially harm consumers or competition.”

    But ever since Google and other big tech companies started fundraising for him and pouring money for his campaign efforts, he made a complete U-turn. Now he questions the need for congressional antitrust investigations, complains about big fines imposed on Google, and defends it against charges of leftist bias.
    Again, you're conflating unrelated issues. Antitrust oversight of Google because of its competitive practices and antitrust oversight of Facebook because it bans "conservatives" are not the same thing.
    "The one permanent emotion of the inferior man is fear - fear of the unknown, the complex, the inexplicable. What he wants above everything else is safety."
    H. L. Mencken

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Survival trumps liberty every time
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Ok, but here's the thing... It seems like you want government to decide what our country's specific needs are and then craft policy to fill those needs. I would MUCH rather the market decide that. Just make legal immigration easier and allow the market to determine which needs can be filled and can draw the right type of people.


    I think we can all agree that government support programs need to be eliminated. But for everyone, not just immigrants.
    Can't do that, the market calculates in dollars and sells our birthright for a mess of pottage every time.
    Controlling immigration to assure assimilation and protect the rights of Americans and our posterity is a legitimate duty of government.

    And you will never eliminate welfare as long as the left can import voters.

    Let the market adjust to a tight labor market once in awhile and watch the middle class grow and leftism wither on the vine.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post


    In fact, in real terms the average wage peaked more than 40 years ago. . . . What gains have been made, have gone to the upper income brackets. Since 2000, usual weekly wages have fallen 3.7% (in real terms) among workers in the lowest tenth of the earnings distribution, and 3% among the lowest quarter. But among people near the top of the distribution, real wages have risen 9.7%.


    As has been pointed out ad nauseam, incomes have risen dramatically over the last 40 years. People get a larger share of compensation in the form of health insurance and benefits. You can take three seconds to use Google and find this.


    You don't even need data to show that middle income earners are far better off today than 40 years. Just a simple thought experiment. Would you rather earn $50,000 and live in 2021 or $50,000 and live in 1981? 100% of people if they are honest would say $50,000 in 2020, which demonstrates inflation data is actually overstated and productivity understated.


    Since 2000, usual weekly wages have fallen 3.7% (in real terms) among workers in the lowest tenth of the earnings distribution, and 3% among the lowest quarter. But among people near the top of the distribution, real wages have risen 9.7%.

    These inequality talking points always leave out transfer payments. Total compensation has risen.


    I don't get the class warfare stuff. I care not even one iota about income inequality even it were a real thing, which it is not.
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 03-13-2021 at 08:25 AM.

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    ...
    You don't even need data to show that middle income earners are far better off today than 40 years. Just a simple thought experiment. Would you rather earn $50,000 and live in 2021 or $50,000 and live in 1981? 100% of people if they are honest would say $50,000 in 2020, which demonstrates inflation data is actually overstated and productivity understated.
    ...
    Where's the time machine? Sign me up. 1981. Hands down. What am I missing out on? Cell phones and big screen TVs? Throw them in the woods.

    $50,000 in 1981 would take 2 or 3 times annual salary to buy a house. $50k today would take 20x to 30x annual salary for the same house.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    As has been pointed out ad nauseam, incomes have risen dramatically over the last 40 years. People get a larger share of compensation in the form of health insurance and benefits. You can take three seconds to use Google and find this.
    I am sick to death about hearing about health care insurance.Insurance has risen the cost of health care because of all the extra people needed to process forms.
    I just got off the phone with someone calling about health insurance and my SS. My mail box is stuffed slam full almost everyday of medicare part D BS and death insurance and burial plots for sale. It must cost over $1000 a year to mail me this crap.
    If I had a choice of $50,000a year now or 1980 I would chose 1980 because there weren't as many laws and regulations back then as there are right now and everything was much cheaper than it is now.

    The way things are going right now is just depressing as hell..

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Where's the time machine? Sign me up. 1981. Hands down. What am I missing out on? Cell phones and big screen TVs? Throw them in the woods.

    $50,000 in 1981 would take 2 or 3 times annual salary to buy a house. $50k today would take 20x to 30x annual salary for the same house.
    Median Home Price end of 1981 - 62k
    Median Home Price end of 2020- $301k
    https://dqydj.com/historical-home-prices/

    Median Square Footage 1981 - 1550
    Median Sq Footage 2018- 2426
    https://www.thezebra.com/resources/h...me-size-in-us/

    Mortgage rate 1981- 16.6%
    Mortgage rate 2021 for same 15 year fixed that you had in 1981- 2.38%
    https://www.valuepenguin.com/mortgag...mortgage-rates

    Estimating that the median price for 1550 sq feet is 220k today at a 2.38% with 20% down would give you a monthly payment: $1164.
    For a 62k house in 1981 with 20%, the monthly payment would be: $755

    So yes, you would pay $409 more in nominal dollars today than in 1981 or 1.5x as much for housing in nominal. Not whatever you were trying to say. The way I calculated this is the correct way, not the clickbait way.

    You would pay $5000 more in housing than 1981 with the same 50k in income but you would have Google, the internet, modern medical care, modern cars that last more than 3 years with modern safety technology.

    You could just loosen the constraints on this to show how overstated inflation has been. 50k in 1981 is 145k in 2021 using CPI. The things that make up a person's quality of life like a TV, microwave, washer and dryer, clothing have not even come close to matching that. https://www.aier.org/article/the-myt...ss-stagnation/
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 03-13-2021 at 08:23 PM.



  13. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Median Home Price end of 1981 - 62k
    Median Home Price end of 2020- $301k
    https://dqydj.com/historical-home-prices/

    Median Square Footage 1981 - 1550
    Median Sq Footage 2018- 2426
    https://www.thezebra.com/resources/h...me-size-in-us/

    Mortgage rate 1981- 16.6%
    Mortgage rate 2021 for same 15 year fixed that you had in 1981- 2.38%
    https://www.valuepenguin.com/mortgag...mortgage-rates

    Estimating that the median price for 1550 sq feet is 220k today at a 2.38% with 20% down would give you a monthly payment: $1164.
    For a 62k house in 1981 with 20%, the monthly payment would be: $755

    So yes, you would pay $409 more in nominal dollars today than in 1981 or 1.5x as much for housing in nominal. Not whatever you were trying to say. The way I calculated this is the correct way, not the clickbait way.

    You would pay $5000 more in housing than 1981 with the same 50k in income but you would have Google, the internet, modern medical care, modern cars that last more than 3 years with modern safety technology.

    You could just loosen the constraints on this to show how overstated inflation has been. 50k in 1981 is 145k in 2021 using CPI. The things that make up a person's quality of life like a TV, microwave, washer and dryer, clothing have not even come close to matching that. https://www.aier.org/article/the-myt...ss-stagnation/
    Can't imagine why people consider you a troll. How often did people buy that stuff? My folks bought a microwave in 1981. I'm still using it. The modern ones are junk.

    How about stuff people bought and buy constantly? Talk about quality of life...



    Take your crappy, self-destruction modern Chinese microwave and stuff it. Where's that time machine? I want to be free again.

    That said, what the $#@! does any of this have to do with modern, cooked elections? Derailing important discussions of critical issues--like the death of a republic--is another thing trolls do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    These days? That's always what has passed for conservatism.

    And exactly the same thing goes for (modern) liberalism, too.

    They just disagree about what should be forced upon whom.

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Can't imagine why people consider you a troll.
    I post liberty stuff that I got from liberty economists and Ron Paul himself. Ron Paul is a staunch free trader who has never once advocated protection from foreign competition. Ron Paul has never talked about immigrants driving down wages. Last time I checked this isn't AgrarianPopulistForums.com

    Q: Apple Computer employs 46,000 Americans, but also employs about 500,000 people in China. How do you revive "Made in America"?PAUL: You have to create the right conditions to bring these companies back, and they have to bring their capital back and shouldn't be taxed. Apple's a great company, but the way you ask the question, it infers that because there's a bunch of workers overseas, it hasn't benefited a lot of people here. The consumers obviously have been benefited by a good company, well run. But a lot of people worry about us buying and the money going overseas. But if you send money to China, they have to spend those dollars. Unfortunately, they're buying our debt and perpetuating our consumerism here and our debt here. But also, when you get products, let's say the computer costs $100 instead of $1000. Well, the person's just saved $900. That helps the economy. That $900 stays in that person's pocket. So we shouldn't be frightened about trade or sending money on.

    Talk about quality of life...
    Which is what I am doing. Life is much better. Getting all of these ideas from people like Thomas Sowell in his book Economic Facts and Fallacies and people like Tom Woods and Don Boudreaux. Or Yaron Brook's book Equal is Unfair. I don't care what economic illiterates like Pat Buchanan or Donald Trump think about anything.

    That said, what the $#@! does any of this have to do with modern, cooked elections? Derailing important discussions of critical issues--like the death of a republic--is another thing trolls do
    The majority of the posts in this thread were about trade and immigration dumping on Mike Lee from a guy with a Confederate flag as a avatar. I haven't derailed anything. And the election wasn't cooked. Donald Trump lost soundly.

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    I post liberty stuff that I got from liberty economists and Ron Paul himself. Ron Paul is a staunch free trader who has never once advocated protection from foreign competition. Ron Paul has never talked about immigrants driving down wages. Last time I checked this isn't AgrarianPopulistForums.com

    Q: Apple Computer employs 46,000 Americans, but also employs about 500,000 people in China. How do you revive "Made in America"?PAUL: You have to create the right conditions to bring these companies back, and they have to bring their capital back and shouldn't be taxed. Apple's a great company, but the way you ask the question, it infers that because there's a bunch of workers overseas, it hasn't benefited a lot of people here. The consumers obviously have been benefited by a good company, well run. But a lot of people worry about us buying and the money going overseas. But if you send money to China, they have to spend those dollars. Unfortunately, they're buying our debt and perpetuating our consumerism here and our debt here. But also, when you get products, let's say the computer costs $100 instead of $1000. Well, the person's just saved $900. That helps the economy. That $900 stays in that person's pocket. So we shouldn't be frightened about trade or sending money on.



    Which is what I am doing. Life is much better. Getting all of these ideas from people like Thomas Sowell in his book Economic Facts and Fallacies and people like Tom Woods and Don Boudreaux. Or Yaron Brook's book Equal is Unfair. I don't care what economic illiterates like Pat Buchanan or Donald Trump think about anything.



    The majority of the posts in this thread were about trade and immigration dumping on Mike Lee from a guy with a Confederate flag as a avatar. I haven't derailed anything. And the election wasn't cooked. Donald Trump lost soundly.
    Pretty much agree 100%

    Free trade is essential to liberty. Most of the economic problems are caused by government- there are tons of laws to just open a small business- this is something .gov has no right to be involved in.

    People do not even understand the REAL meaning of capitalism any more & how it properly functions, as the the corporate state now runs everyone's lives.

    And, if .gov would get out of the welfare/insurance/ponzi scheme business, immigration, free travel, etc. would not be a problem.

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed
    There is no spoon.

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    The majority of the posts in this thread were about trade and immigration dumping on Mike Lee from a guy with a Confederate flag as a avatar. I haven't derailed anything. And the election wasn't cooked. Donald Trump lost soundly.
    If you stopped clutching your "I'm triggered" pearls for a moment and tried to see properly, if you have eyes, you would notice that it's not the Confederate flag per se. It's the Confederate flag with the papal seal on it, which I guess, you could say is a symbol for....Christian secession? I like it, no dealing with godless commies.

    And the fact that you believe that there was no election fraud and that Trump lost fair and square shows that you are either ignorant or have no credibility whatsoever.
    Haul out that picture of Stonewall, tack it up with an old gray pin
    Raise up them Stars and Bars, the South shall rise again!"- Johnny Rebel


    All I know is that to see and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell, Rivers of Blood Speech


    "Unless we make sure that there is no infiltration of our country, then just as certain as you sit there, in the period of our lives you will see a red world."
    -Joseph McCarthy

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Median Home Price end of 1981 - 62k
    Median Home Price end of 2020- $301k
    https://dqydj.com/historical-home-prices/

    Median Square Footage 1981 - 1550
    Median Sq Footage 2018- 2426
    https://www.thezebra.com/resources/h...me-size-in-us/

    Mortgage rate 1981- 16.6%
    Mortgage rate 2021 for same 15 year fixed that you had in 1981- 2.38%
    https://www.valuepenguin.com/mortgag...mortgage-rates

    Estimating that the median price for 1550 sq feet is 220k today at a 2.38% with 20% down would give you a monthly payment: $1164.
    For a 62k house in 1981 with 20%, the monthly payment would be: $755

    So yes, you would pay $409 more in nominal dollars today than in 1981 or 1.5x as much for housing in nominal. Not whatever you were trying to say. The way I calculated this is the correct way, not the clickbait way.

    You would pay $5000 more in housing than 1981 with the same 50k in income but you would have Google, the internet, modern medical care, modern cars that last more than 3 years with modern safety technology.

    You could just loosen the constraints on this to show how overstated inflation has been. 50k in 1981 is 145k in 2021 using CPI. The things that make up a person's quality of life like a TV, microwave, washer and dryer, clothing have not even come close to matching that. https://www.aier.org/article/the-myt...ss-stagnation/
    Lies, damned lies, and statistics. Who do you think you are fooling?
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    If you stopped clutching your "I'm triggered" pearls for a moment and tried to see properly, if you have eyes, you would notice that it's not the Confederate flag per se. It's the Confederate flag with the papal seal on it, which I guess, you could say is a symbol for....Christian secession? I like it, no dealing with godless commies.
    That changes everything. No longer are the Confederate Flag and the Catholic church symbols of immoral collectivism. I'm sure whatever you are proposing will be very good at promoting reason and protecting the individual rights of atheists like me.

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    That changes everything. No longer are the Confederate Flag and the Catholic church symbols of immoral collectivism. I'm sure whatever you are proposing will be very good at promoting reason and protecting the individual rights of atheists like me.
    They aren't if you are not ignorant. And as long as you are not hostile to us, we ain't gonna be hostile to you. I also like the fact that you conveniently ignored the election fraud point. What, do you always pick and choose what part of an argument to respond to? You made a baseless claim saying that the 2020 election was free and fair and that Donald Trump lost fair and square. And you cannot back that up. Figures.
    Haul out that picture of Stonewall, tack it up with an old gray pin
    Raise up them Stars and Bars, the South shall rise again!"- Johnny Rebel


    All I know is that to see and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell, Rivers of Blood Speech


    "Unless we make sure that there is no infiltration of our country, then just as certain as you sit there, in the period of our lives you will see a red world."
    -Joseph McCarthy

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Joe McCarthy View Post
    They aren't if you are not ignorant. And as long as you are not hostile to us, we ain't gonna be hostile to you. I also like the fact that you conveniently ignored the election fraud point. What, do you always pick and choose what part of an argument to respond to? You made a baseless claim saying that the 2020 election was free and fair and that Donald Trump lost fair and square. And you cannot back that up. Figures.
    I didn't ignore it. My response involved paint chips and glue sniffing and I thought I should tone it down so I deleted it.

    The onus isn't on me to prove there wasn't election fraud. That's not how that works



  22. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Maybe if "conservatives" weren't so hostile to them and didn't assume that they're democrats-in-waiting, things would be different.
    Poll after poll after poll shows that first generation migrants overwhelmingly vote left.

    This is fact and not disputable.

    It's the same with non-immigrant blacks and hispanics. Given their religious tendencies, they would have more in common with the Republican party if only the party didn't actively drive them away.
    Oh god, this is high hilarity now.

    And the Orange Man did precisely this: reached out actively to those groups, saying in effect "Give me a chance. Whaddya got to lose?".

    And in 2020 he took larger portions of the black and Hispanic vote than any other GOP candidate in recent history.

    And everybody lost their collective $#@! because ORANGE MAD BAD! God Damn It!
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 03-14-2021 at 09:05 AM.
    According to government's own numbers, over half a MILLION people are dead, just in the US alone, because of a man made virus designed to be even more deadly than what would be found in nature, released, possibly on purpose, from a Chinese lab, a virus that that was created from funding and prior research given to the Chinese scientists by our own government because we, in fit of sanity, pulled the plug on funding here.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    I didn't ignore it. My response involved paint chips and glue sniffing and I thought I should tone it down so I deleted it.

    The onus isn't on me to prove there wasn't election fraud. That's not how that works
    Oh, I see. Very well then.

    In Pennsylvania, no ballots should have been received after 8pm election day. Trump of course was winning in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Wisconsin and Georgia late in the evening on election day. 1.8 million mail in ballots were sent out in Pennsylvania, but 2.5 million ballots were sent back in.

    In Wisconsin, over 200k mail in ballots were obtained without photo ID as required by state law and were still counted. In Georgia, actual surveillance video of Democrat vote thieves chasing out reporters and Republican poll watchers and then counting “ballots” that were hidden in suitcases under tables made the national news (although probably not any of the liberal networks).

    Other signs of fraud include: the simultaneous shut down of vote counting in the swing states, and the middle of the night ballot dumps that went overwhelmingly for Biden. In Detroit, 139 percent of registered voters voted in the election. In Nevada 40,000 duplicate ballots were found, which if eliminated would flip that state to Trump.

    If that’s not enough evidence, during an audit, a Dominion voting machine was found in Ware County, Georgia, which was giving Biden a 26 percent lead for an equal number of ballots for Trump and Biden. It should be noted that any “extensive and inclusive voter fraud” would almost certainly involve wiping the memory or resetting the Dominion machines after the fraud so the fact that any machines could be found that were still flipping votes is extremely significant.

    Another audit was done in Antrim County, Michigan, which revealed that Dominion machines had a staggering 68 percent error rate, which allowed unsupervised “remediation” by poll workers, many of whom were crooked Democrats, who simply gave all the “disputed” ballots to Biden. The sensitivity of the Dominion machines can be turned way up so that almost anything like a slight smudge will trigger an error and there were probably Democrat poll workers whose jobs involved putting smudges on ballots. Parts of the Michigan audit may still be sealed by a court order, which raises the question: Why seal the results of an audit —unless it showed damning signs of fraud?

    Dominion voting machines were used in 28 states during the 2020 election.
    Last edited by Joe McCarthy; 03-14-2021 at 09:00 AM.
    Haul out that picture of Stonewall, tack it up with an old gray pin
    Raise up them Stars and Bars, the South shall rise again!"- Johnny Rebel


    All I know is that to see and not to speak, would be the great betrayal.
    -Enoch Powell, Rivers of Blood Speech


    "Unless we make sure that there is no infiltration of our country, then just as certain as you sit there, in the period of our lives you will see a red world."
    -Joseph McCarthy

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Can't imagine why people consider you a troll. How often did people buy that stuff? My folks bought a microwave in 1981. I'm still using it. The modern ones are junk.

    How about stuff people bought and buy constantly? Talk about quality of life...



    Take your crappy, self-destruction modern Chinese microwave and stuff it. Where's that time machine? I want to be free again.

    That said, what the $#@! does any of this have to do with modern, cooked elections? Derailing important discussions of critical issues--like the death of a republic--is another thing trolls do.
    This.

    Cheap glittery things are poor compensation for all the freedom that has been lost over the past 50 years.

    And it's only a short matter of time before thos are gone too.
    According to government's own numbers, over half a MILLION people are dead, just in the US alone, because of a man made virus designed to be even more deadly than what would be found in nature, released, possibly on purpose, from a Chinese lab, a virus that that was created from funding and prior research given to the Chinese scientists by our own government because we, in fit of sanity, pulled the plug on funding here.

  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Where's the time machine? Sign me up. 1981. Hands down. What am I missing out on?
    The internet.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    That said, what the $#@! does any of this have to do with modern, cooked elections? Derailing important discussions of critical issues--like the death of a republic--is another thing trolls do.
    The OP derailed his on thread in the first post by conflating what he liked about Mike Lee (being against HR 1) with what he doesn't like about Mike Lee (being soft on immigration in his book.) You can't blame someone arguing with his second point for "derailing" his first. Totally wasted thread.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    That changes everything. No longer are the Confederate Flag and the Catholic church symbols of immoral collectivism. I'm sure whatever you are proposing will be very good at promoting reason and protecting the individual rights of atheists like me.
    There is a big difference between INDIVIDUAL "atheist" rights, and COLLECTIVIZATION and GOVERNMENTAL SPONSORSHIP
    of your beliefs.

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12


Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-27-2020, 06:43 PM
  2. Written Out of History - Sen Mike Lee's book on the Anti Federalists
    By Anti Federalist in forum Political Philosophy & Government Policy
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-11-2017, 12:39 AM
  3. Why Does the Devil Possess People At All?
    By Paulbot99 in forum Peace Through Religion
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 07-18-2014, 05:44 PM
  4. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-04-2011, 02:49 PM
  5. Replies: 14
    Last Post: 01-29-2008, 07:15 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •