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Thread: For those getting started in food preps...

  1. #1

    For those getting started in food preps...

    A good friend of mine wrote asking me for advice in this area. I don't believe I wrote him back a 6 page letter about it...

    I'm posting about half of my reply here, as I thought other RP supporters would be interested.

    Properly stored, grains will last 30 years and powdered milk 20.

    For grain orders you need to order at least 200 lb or shipping will be astronomical. Superpails or bulk bags are much more cost effective than #10 cans, however for some items like baking aids, #10 cans make more sense. Items packed just in mylar bags will not have the same shelf life as a superpail. There are a couple of very important things to keep in mind:

    1 – STORE WHAT YOU EAT, AND EAT WHAT YOU STORE!
    2 – STORE FOOD THAT YOUR FAMILY LIKES!
    3 – Cooking with basic and dehydrated foods is “different”. An emergency is not the time to learn how to do it. If you have a sudden dietary change during an emergency, your family will revolt.
    4 – Incorporate cooking with storage food with your regular cooking. You will get used to it, learn how to make it taste better and you'll end up saving a lot of money. It's also healthier for you because it's not processed. I highly recommend the book “Emergency food in a nutshell”. Most of these places sell it. You might get it from Amazon with express shipping while you are looking.

    Shelf life info:
    http://grandpappy.info/hshelff.htm
    http://waltonfeed.com/blog/showCategory/category_id/62

    Information on reconstituting and using dehydrated foods:
    http://waltonfeed.com/blog/showCategory/category_id/35

    Food Storage FAQ:
    http://www.survival-center.com/foodfaq/


    Suppliers:

    Emergency essentials:
    http://beprepared.com/

    pluses:
    very prompt shipping, rotates items on sale every month, has unusual items. Shipping is included in price. Tells you on web site if superpails, etc. are in stock. Build your own first aid kit. Friendly Mormon family run business. These folks have been doing it for years and don't fear monger or price gouge.
    Negatives: all their boxes and buckets have their logo on them. They don't have some common things other places do. Number of types of grains available is limited.

    MRE Depot
    http://www.mredepot.com/

    so far, quick ship and boxes usually don't advertise.
    You should still be able to get a 21% discount on your entire order by typing in “fluwikie” on the checkout form.

    Internet Grocer
    http://www.internet-grocer.net/
    http://www.internet-grocer.net/dehydrtd.htm

    good prices, better selection. Was taking 6+ weeks to ship. Probably less now. Take order total and add 33% to get an approximation of shipping. They will contact you prior to shipping for an OK on total price. For grains, things will ship from Walton. Other things ship from different places.

    Of particular note, is that they offer trail packs so you can see what you like before you buy a ton of it:
    http://www.internet-grocer.net/trialpak.htm

    If you are only looking for a short term capability, trial packs are probably the way to go. I STRONGLY recommend that you have a years worth of food at all times!

    Rainy Day Food (Walton Feed)
    http://waltonfeed.com/

    Has been around forever. When you order bulk grains from anywhere, they probably come from here. They are reporting a 2 week backlog for UPS.

    There was another one that had a greater variety than any of those I listed, however my HD died and I lost the bookmark. If I can find it again, I'll send it to you. I have done business with all the companies listed above and been quite happy.

    Grain Grinder:
    I had one before that was a total pain to use – very hard to to crank and you had to put wheat through twice to get a good flower. I bought a Country Living Grain mill and love it! It's expensive, but worth it. Absolute joy to use, you can get different attachments for it as well as spare parts. You can certainly get by with a much less expensive grain mill if it's just for emergencies. The lowest tech is a piece of pipe w/ an endcap and a longer piece of pipe of smaller diameter. Pour in a small amount of grain, start ramming, pour out flour, repeat. Total PITA! But it works. Note that Walton does not carry the repair parts kit.
    http://waltonfeed.com/category/54
    http://countrylivinggrainmills.com/i...p?action=store

    Boxed water kits are the most cost effective way to store water:
    http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_...oxed+Water+Kit

    You can also get new, clean trash cans and position them under your gutter drains.

    A camping water filter is OK for an emergency, but most people get a Berkey for home use and use it daily. These really do make water taste better. Pick up extra filters when you get one – they last a loooong time, but not forever.
    http://www.berkeyfilters.com/

    Sprouts are a great way to get greens:
    http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_...outing%20Seeds

    A luxury item, but I got one of these to re-constitute powdered milk. It's very well made!
    http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_...rank%20Blender

    Instant milk isn't as nutritious, doesn't store as long in the fridge and doesn't give you as much milk per volume of powder as powdered milk does. However, powdered milk is harder to get into liquid from powder – hence the blender.

    If you buy food in pails – you absolutely have to have one of these:
    http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_...20Lid%20Lifter

    Even with one of the above tools, lids are a total pain to take off and put back on. Just about everyone uses gamma seals. Shop around, as prices vary and they do go on sale from time to time.
    http://beprepared.com/product.asp_Q_...9+Lid+%2D+Blue

    We have one on the cat food bucket that gets daily use. They just don't wear out.

    If you are packing your own pails, you can get the pails at Home Depot, etc. in the paint department. They should have a #2 molded into the plastic on the bottom. That's food grade. For home packing, you will need mylar liners, a hotjaw and ¼ lb of dry ice (Baskin and Robbins) per pail plus an oxygen absorber or two.. put mylar in bucket, add dry ice, add food then 02 absorbers – let dry ice evaporate (hours – we don't want any exploding buckets!). Seal mylar most of the way, then press down to get rid of excess CO2 and seal the last bit. Hammer on lid. The hotjaw and mylar are optional, but they greatly increase storage life. If you buy super-pails a hotjaw is a good idea anyway, so you can take a little out at a time and reseal the bag.

    http://safecastleroyal.com/item_243/HotJaw-Sealer.html
    http://safecastleroyal.com/item_244/...il-Liners.html
    http://safecastleroyal.com/item_245/...Absorbers.html

    A note about Safecastle – the owner is a former NSA analyst and they carry unusual items, like folding bikes and 12v fridges and freezers. Everything they have is high quality. They are membership based - $19 for a lifetime membership, or you can buy without that. You will save considerably more that $19 on just about everything they carry – so if you buy from them, get one. Go to the item you are interested in and put your mouse over the image for the members price. The discount is at least 20% of the price. Shipping is included. The only thing the discount doesn't apply to is Mountain House foods. The other side of their business is building fallout shelters, storm shelters and safe rooms:

    http://safecastle.com/

    Look here to find a place where you can buy food in bulk locally, or go to a restaurant supply house.
    http://www.coopdirectory.org/

    If you dehydrate your own food – it won't store as long as stuff from Walton.

    you may also be interested in:

    http://product.half.ebay.com/Make-A-...12749QQtgZinfo
    a bargain at $1.80 – it's a good book. Here is a review:
    http://homecooking.about.com/library...10730_3385.htm
    google books has most of it online.

    -t



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  3. #2
    Nice post. Regarding canned food and expiration dates:

    Quote Originally Posted by FDA.gov
    The steamboat Bertrand was heavily laden with provisions when it set out on
    the Missouri River in 1865, destined for the gold mining camps in Fort
    Benton, Mont. The boat snagged and swamped under the weight, sinking to the
    bottom of the river.
    It was found a century later, under 30 feet of silt a
    little north of Omaha, Neb.

    Among the canned food items retrieved from the Bertrand in 1968 were brandied
    peaches, oysters, plum tomatoes, honey, and mixed vegetables. In 1974,
    chemists at the National Food Processors Association (NFPA) analyzed the
    products for bacterial contamination and nutrient value. Although the food
    had lost its fresh smell and appearance, the NFPA chemists detected no
    microbial growth and determined that the foods were as safe to eat as they
    had been when canned more than 100 years earlier.
    http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/CONSUMER/CON00043.html
    Maxed out to ALL of Ron Paul's campaigns.

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  4. #3
    My neighbor across the street does ordering for a local supermarket chain, and we got her to order a 50 pound bag of wheat berries for us, which store indefinitely when kept in a cool, dry area away from rodents.

    In the PAW, I may open a bakery. We are getting a solar oven soon.

  5. #4
    List I put together a couple of years ago for a friend who was just getting started with stocking her pantry. Text of the email I sent her:

    Some general storage info from Making the Best of Basics that I thought might help with your planning. I've found that a LOT of products do not list their "expiration date" anymore. This book gives the general "use by" for ... damn near everything, lol.

    I'm only doing the most common grocery store stuff because that's easiest to get.

    Estimated shelf life for various stuff in months:

    Commercial ground cornmeal: 60

    Commercial ground wheat flour: 6 - 12 (if you buy the wheat berries and grind it yourself, the berries themselves have an indefinite storage life)

    White enriched rice: 24 - 48

    noodles (mac/lasagna/spag) 18 - 24

    oatmeal 12

    Nonfat instant powdered milk 24 - 48

    dehydrated butter 60 - 96

    dehydrated cheese 60 - 96

    buttermilk powder 24 - 36

    non dairy creamer 24 - 36

    dehydrated eggs 60 - 96

    evaporated milk 24 - 36

    condensed sweetened milk 24 - 36

    white, brown, powdered sugar indefinite

    corn and maple syrup indefinite

    iodized, pickling, ice cream salt indefinite

    vegetable shortening 12

    liquid vegetable oil 12 - 24

    olive oil 12 - 24

    baking soda 18 - 24

    baking powder 6 - 9

    baking chips 18 - 24

    cocoa powder 18 - 24

    cornstarch 12 - 24

    arrowroot 12 - 24

    hominy/hominy grits 12

    ready to eat dry cereal (corn, rice, shredded wheat) 12

    Fruit, canned - all EXCEPT citrus 12 - 18; citrus 6 - 12

    Fruit cocktail 12 - 18

    Dried potatoes 36 - 48

    Dried beans: 60+

    Canned veggies:

    Beans (green/pinto/kidney/red/yellow/peas) 24 - 36

    Beets 12 - 24

    Carrots 24 - 36

    Corn (whole kernel or creamed) 24 - 36

    Potatoes 24 - 36

    Canned soups/chili 24 - 36

    Canned spag/sauce 12 - 24

    Peanut butter 12 -24

    unshelled raw nuts 12 - 24

    roasted canned shelled nuts 12 - 24

    crackers 6 - 12

    graham crackers 12 - 24

    black pepper indefinite

    vinegar, Worcestershire sauce, soy sauce indefinite

    flavorings/extracts 12 - 24

    Mixed Italian, Mexican blended herbs 12 - 18

    Jerky 6 - 9

    canned corned beef 12 - 24

    canned deviled meats, vienna sausage 12 - 24

    canned chicken/turkey 12 - 24

    canned shrimp/tuna/mackerel/halibut 12 - 24

    canned salmon/sardines 24 - 36

    canned and bottled fruit juices, all 12 - 24

    cake mixes 12 - 24

    candy bars 12

    Chips 12 - 18

    Pudding mixes 24 - 36
    Why can't everybody else leave everybody else alone?

  6. #5
    Great thread, thanks!
    "I'm not just trying to win or get elected. I am trying to change the course of history" - Ron Paul

  7. #6
    If you are packing your own pails, you can get the pails at Home Depot, etc. in the paint department. They should have a #2 molded into the plastic on the bottom. That's food grade.
    That MAY be food grade, it may NOT be. #2 plastics can use non-food grade dye. If I were to buy something, I'd rather buy something I know for sure is food grade.

    For me, recent trips to WalMart have produced many FREE once-used icing buckets from their bakery department.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugerrand View Post
    That MAY be food grade, it may NOT be. #2 plastics can use non-food grade dye. If I were to buy something, I'd rather buy something I know for sure is food grade.

    For me, recent trips to WalMart have produced many FREE once-used icing buckets from their bakery department.
    So, just don't get the colored ones. The white ones use titanium dioxide (non-toxic), and the clear ones will have nothing.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugerrand View Post
    For me, recent trips to WalMart have produced many FREE once-used icing buckets from their bakery department.
    I've done this before and the pain of repeated washings to try getting the icing off the bucket made me drop it as a useful method of bucket accusation. How do you get the icing off?

    thanks,

    -t



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  11. #9
    Thanks, Survivors! ;-)

    Tangent, if you scrape off as much of the goo as possible c a flat case knife, or even cereal box cardboard "paddles," & then use a couple qts hot h2o, maximum, & some good grease-cutting detergent, & clean rags or even--gasp--newspaper, you should be able to rescue the pails.

    I'd feel like accusing them. I think you mean acquisition (from acquire). Love the slip!

  12. #10
    Try alcohol as well, that might work a little better. Or leave it outside for a bit near some ants...
    "Anarchists oppose the State because it has its very being in such aggression, namely, the expropriation of private property through taxation, the coercive exclusion of other providers of defense service from its territory, and all of the other depredations and coercions that are built upon these twin foci of invasions of individual rights." -Murray Rothbard

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by tangent4ronpaul View Post
    3 – Cooking with basic and dehydrated foods is “different”. An emergency is not the time to learn how to do it. If you have a sudden dietary change during an emergency, your family will revolt.
    Hah, that would suck.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  14. #12
    It doesn't really matter what kind of bucket you use if you have a sealed metalized mylar bag inside of it. The metalized mylar bag will isolate the food from the outside world. All the bucket is needed for is to help keep out the varmints.

  15. #13
    I went with www.homegrownharvest.com and bought a butt load of sealed buckets with food. I would recommend going to sams and buying 25 pound bags of rice. You will need 6 bags of rice per person which comes out to 600 calories a day. I would also get the black beans and wheat... The reason I say this is because the beans is 600 calories per cup and the wheat is the same. So in essence per person You would need 1 cup of rice, 1 cup of wheat, & 1 cup of beans to get Your 1800 calories a day... I would do this because its the cheapest way to prepare and like the above post says will last ten plus years if kept in air tight buckets....


    I have also found cheap wheat at montana wheat which is cheaper than home grownharvest .... I bought my buckets and gamma seal lids at emergency essentials I believe.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by jkm1864 View Post
    I went with www.homegrownharvest.com and bought a butt load of sealed buckets with food. I would recommend going to sams and buying 25 pound bags of rice. You will need 6 bags of rice per person which comes out to 600 calories a day. I would also get the black beans and wheat... The reason I say this is because the beans is 600 calories per cup and the wheat is the same. So in essence per person You would need 1 cup of rice, 1 cup of wheat, & 1 cup of beans to get Your 1800 calories a day... I would do this because its the cheapest way to prepare and like the above post says will last ten plus years if kept in air tight buckets....


    I have also found cheap wheat at montana wheat which is cheaper than home grownharvest .... I bought my buckets and gamma seal lids at emergency essentials I believe.
    That's going to lead to nutritional deficiency. Start with the Mormon Basic 4: Wheat, honey (or sugar), salt and powdered milk. (there are 4 basic food groups) Then add to that for variety. I would suggest adding multi-vitamins, spices and sprouting seeds at an absolute minimum! Granted, you can sprout the wheat. You're most of the way there - but try living off that for a month and you will realize you need more. Few buckets of dehydrated vegies would go a long way - say soup mix...

    Practice runs are key here - try it for a week to a month and you will know what's wrong. In the middle of an emergency is NOT the time to learn this!

    -t
    Last edited by tangent4ronpaul; 05-05-2009 at 08:28 PM.

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by tangent4ronpaul View Post
    I've done this before and the pain of repeated washings to try getting the icing off the bucket made me drop it as a useful method of bucket accusation. How do you get the icing off?

    thanks,

    -t
    The workers at my walmart had rinsed them out pretty throughly before they gave them to me. I washed them out again before using them ... but there were no traces of icing.

  18. #16
    I've been reasonably pleased with http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/

    $4.49 ships an entire order. Of course, their prices somewhat reflect this compared to some other places. Get on their mailing list and then send out discount codes on occasion. The last one was for 15% off an order.

    I also bought some from Wheat Montana. To buy directly from whem would have cost too much for me in shipping. I was able to find a (somewhat) local dealer that had their products at a respectable price. http://www.wheatmontana.com/dealer.php
    Last edited by Krugerrand; 05-06-2009 at 06:59 AM.



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  20. #17
    You can seal mylar bags with a common curling wand. Don't waste your money on a commercial grade sealer.

    -t

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by tangent4ronpaul View Post
    You can seal mylar bags with a common curling wand. Don't waste your money on a commercial grade sealer.

    -t
    Appreciate the bump. Lots of great links and info in this thread. + rep for you.

    I have sealed mylar with a curling wand and we're still holding tight after 5 years.
    Maxed out to ALL of Ron Paul's campaigns.

    Listen to Liberty Tree Radio! ::

    Pro-Liberty, Pro-Gun, Pro-Militia Radio 5 days a week, 10 LIVE HRS TALK RADIO PER DAY!

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  22. #19
    I keep a steady running 50-75lb of brown rice on hand at all times; always have going back about 10 years. We go through a little over 100 lb a year. I keep 25lb sacks in 5 gallon cornelius, cool stored in a root cellar. Cali grown organic gmo free.

    "corny keg" about $40 bucks used online, hermetic storage 25lb of any grain or flour.


    I keep a cow in one of these:


    A cow fits in about a 14 cubic machine just fine.

    I get about one a year on barter and have 150+ gallons of WVO on hand for my generator should the need arise.


    If I time it right I'm able to shove one of these in with the cow:




    Eggs are coming out of a hillbilly situation like so:





    Right now the garden is just meeting our annual tomato needs. Next year we're talking about taking on a years worth of frozen greens and trying out hay bale potatoes.

    I've got something about like this full of water:




    also have about 40 of these:

    Last edited by presence; 01-11-2013 at 07:30 PM.

    'We endorse the idea of voluntarism; self-responsibility: Family, friends, and churches to solve problems, rather than saying that some monolithic government is going to make you take care of yourself and be a better person. It's a preposterous notion: It never worked, it never will. The government can't make you a better person; it can't make you follow good habits.' - Ron Paul 1988

    Awareness is the Root of Liberation Revolution is Action upon Revelation

    'Resistance and Disobedience in Economic Activity is the Most Moral Human Action Possible' - SEK3

    Flectere si nequeo superos, Acheronta movebo.

    ...the familiar ritual of institutional self-absolution...
    ...for protecting them, by mock trial, from punishment...




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