Trump election panel asks all 50 states for voter roll data

[Ender]

No that would be :
ARTICLE I, SECTION 4, CLAUSE 1

The time, place, or manner of holding an election.

Guaranteeing a republican form of government means to ensure that the states are being run as republics, voter fraud converts a republican government into a dictatorship.

And ARTICLE I, SECTION 4, CLAUSE 1 gives the federal government jurisdiction anyway.


Real ID is an unfunded mandate in an area that is not part of the feds constitutional purview. However they get away with it because it is not strictly mandatory, I am against it but it is not the same at all, and it is not the subject of this thread so I will not get lost debating it's details.

Prove that what Dump is doing is unconstitutional on it's own merits if you can.

Actually, a driver's license is essentially unconstitutional. A license was originally ONLY for things that would be otherwise illegal- the right to travel was always part of freedom- marriage licenses are also unconstitutional; they came into being to stop inter-racial marriages.

The SSN is also unconstitutional.

[Swordsmyth]

Actually, a driver's license is essentially unconstitutional. A license was originally ONLY for things that would be otherwise illegal- the right to travel was always part of freedom-

DL laws make it illegal to drive a motor vehicle on public roads without one, Should it be illegal? that is a question for another thread.

marriage licenses are also unconstitutional; they came into being to stop inter-racial marriages.

Actually The U.S. Constitution has nothing to say about marriage, and again marriage licenses are a debate that belongs in another thread.

The SSN is also unconstitutional.

Absolutely.

[Ender]

DL laws make it illegal to drive a motor vehicle on public roads without one, Should it be illegal? that is a question for another thread.


Actually The U.S. Constitution has nothing to say about marriage, and again marriage licenses are a debate that belongs in another thread.


Absolutely.

If your talking about the constitutionality of using driver's license info for Fed scrutiny, then it is quite viable on this thread.

[Swordsmyth]

If your talking about the constitutionality of using driver's license info for Fed scrutiny, then it is quite viable on this thread.

That was @TheCount trying to distract, this thread is about the voter fraud commission and voter records.

[Ender]

That was @TheCount trying to distract, this thread is about the voter fraud commission and voter records.

Which should be headed by individual states and not the Fed.

[Swordsmyth]

Which should be headed by individual states and not the Fed.

I have shown that the Feds have jurisdiction, if you wish to convince me otherwise it will take more than your assertion.

[Ender]

This is just lame, the "guarantee to every state in this union a republican form of government" clause is in no way the same as the "interstate commerce" clause, and if it were you are still stuck with the clause giving congress power over federal elections, and the exectuive branches power to enforce federal election law.

Maybe the Fed should start with itself first- it has not operated like a republic since at least 1913 and even before.

[Ender]

I have shown that the Feds have jurisdiction, if you wish to convince me otherwise it will take more than your assertion.

Article 1, Section 4 of the US Constitution.


Clause 1. The Times, Places and Manner of holding Elections for Senators and Representatives, shall be prescribed in each State by the Legislature thereof; but the Congress may at any time by Law make or alter such Regulations, except as to the Places of chusing Senators.

Explanation:
The Constitution generally leaves it up to the states to organize congressional elections, but gives Congress the power to set new rules for federal elections as it sees fit. In 1842, Congress passed an important law requiring single-member district elections in every state, standardizing congressional election practices nationwide. The same law set one standard Election Day—the Tuesday after the first Monday in November—throughout the country. We still use the same Election Day today.

http://www.shmoop.com/constitution/a...section-4.html

[Swordsmyth]

http://www.shmoop.com/constitution/a...section-4.html

Since the executive branch is tasked with carrying out the laws that congress has created, then if congress has made a law to deal with voter fraud then that would authorize Dump to act on it, I am not an expert on federal voting law but I would be highly surprised if there is not a law about it.

[Swordsmyth]

Maybe the Fed should start with itself first- it has not operated like a republic since at least 1913 and even before.

Since Federal office holders are elected in elections held by the states it would be impossible for the feds to reform if the states are conducting voter fraud.

[CPUd]

Hopefully President Donald will use this database to eliminate voter fraud by purging the rolls of billions of dead Mexicans and on the next election we can get 100% turnout of Real Americans who will guarantee Donald gets reelected and also a tremendous popular vote win!

[TheCount]

Since the executive branch is tasked with carrying out the laws that congress has created, then if congress has made a law to deal with voter fraud then that would authorize Dump to act on it, I am not an expert on federal voting law but I would be highly surprised if there is not a law about it.

A law on a topic does not magically empower the executive branch to do whatever it pleases.

[Swordsmyth]

A law on a topic does not magically empower the executive branch to do whatever it pleases.

It authorizes it to enforce the law and investigate allegations of law-breaking.

[CPUd]

https://twitter.com/NYGovCuomo/statu...21475577659392

[specsaregood]

https://twitter.com/NYGovCuomo/statu...21475577659392

another grandstander that will quietly comply with the request while pretending to be tough. Otherwise, watching them go to prison for refusing to turn over public records requests will be fun.

[nikcers]

It wasn't the russians clinton has a clawhand.

[Ender]

It authorizes it to enforce the law and investigate allegations of law-breaking.

And states have the right of nullification. Here's Ron Paul on the subject:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...23#post6493523

[Swordsmyth]

And states have the right of nullification. Here's Ron Paul on the subject:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...23#post6493523

Nullification of laws against voter fraud would constitute declaring a non-republican form of government, the offending state should then be expelled from the union, or Federal intervention would be appropriate upon application for redress of grievances by the citizens of the offending state.

[TheCount]

Nullification of laws against voter fraud would constitute declaring a non-republican form of government, the offending state should then be expelled from the union, or Federal intervention would be appropriate upon application for redress of grievances by the citizens of the offending state.

And you say that you're not a statist.

[Swordsmyth]

And you say that you're not a statist.

I'm most certainly not, if the citizens of that state enjoy having a non-republican form of government they can chose to leave or be expelled from the union.

CALExit.

[Ender]

Nullification of laws against voter fraud would constitute declaring a non-republican form of government, the offending state should then be expelled from the union, or Federal intervention would be appropriate upon application for redress of grievances by the citizens of the offending state.

We don't have a republic now- that was destroyed by the War Between the States and completely buried by 1913.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

And you say that you're not a statist.

Kind of ironic coming from you.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

A law on a topic does not magically empower the executive branch to do whatever it pleases.

Who said it did?

[Madison320]

Kind of ironic coming from you.

I'd like to ask Count if he's thinks the states have the right to secede, but I don't have the energy to ask 3 times and then decipher the answers.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

I'd like to ask Count if he's thinks the states have the right to secede, but I don't have the energy to ask 3 times and then decipher the answers.

Too bad that schlep is stuck in South Carolina. He referred to it as the Anus of the Carolinas. He hates S Carolina more than he hates liberty.

[TheCount]

I'd like to ask Count if he's thinks the states have the right to secede, but I don't have the energy to ask 3 times and then decipher the answers.

I don't think governments have rights.


If you're asking if states should be able to secede, then yes, I do think that they should be able to.

[Madison320]

I don't think governments have rights.


If you're asking if states should be able to secede, then yes, I do think that they should be able to.

Do you support the south's right to secede before the civil war?

[euphemia]

Setting aside the details of Dump's request and just dealing with the philosophy, the Constitution states that the Federal government is to: guarantee to every state in this union a republican form of government
Voter fraud destroys a "republican form of government"
Federal investigation of voter fraud is therefore Constitutional, the details may not be.

Indeed, and anyone can walk into an election commission and ask for the records. It's public record.

[Madison320]

Indeed, and anyone can walk into an election commission and ask for the records. It's public record.

Yeah, I'm not sure this is a big deal anyway. Even if they pull your voting record, what does it tell them? They don't know who you voted for and that's seems to me to be the most important thing.

[TheCount]

Do you support the south's right to secede before the civil war?

...

I don't think governments have rights.


If you're asking if states should be able to secede, then yes, I do think that they should be able to.