Amash is all over Drudgereport

[angelatc]

You find me some principles other than "Orange man bad" and I'll concede the point. You still have to explain why sometimes Ron Paul agrees with Trump and sometimes he lets him have it and doesn't hold back. At least when he finds fault with Trump he doesn't pull his talking points out of CNN transcripts. You are making it more about the man than the issues. In all his years in office, Ron NEVER did that.

This ain't the sword to fall on, friend.

People used to accuse Ron Paul of exactly that when he railed against the wars.

Are you implying that Amash never agrees with and/or votes with Trump?

[angelatc]

Ron talked about troops on the border not overseas. Justins tool company manufactures in China so justin is putting personal preference over people and country

Now THIS is classic. Using this ''logic'' Trump is obviously colluding with Russia because he has Russian business interests.

Amash has always been anti-tariff. That is consistent with his position on free trade. We don't need to fabricate some hidden agenda. He stated quite clearly that he read the report and based on the content he is of the opinion that Trump attempted to obstruct the investigation.

[nobody's_hero]

People used to accuse Ron Paul of exactly that when he railed against the wars.

Are you implying that Amash never agrees with and/or votes with Trump?

Is Amash railing against wars?

I'm not trying to be obtuse, but what I'm saying is that there is a plethora of other issues that Amash could throw down with Trump over. Stopping a war would DEFINITELY be one what I'd say is worth him going "all in" on.


Perception counts for a lot in politics. A lot of people here have a better idea of what really goes on than your average republican voter. The problem is, you kind of need the average republican voter. Changing perception is not easy. Finding ways to use it to your advantage is at least manageable. [libertarians take a note on that: there will be a test later ]


We haven't acknowledged, since day one of this presidency, that the PERCEPTION of the average republican voter is that Trump is anti-establishment. I said this as early as the debates, that it was not a smart move for Rand to go for Trump right off the starting line, that he should have picked off the small fries so at the very least, he could have a shot at getting it down to just him and Trump on stage, and we could actually have a real debate without the "noise." The result is that he "went to the light" and got zapped by the bug zapper just like the rest of the swarm who couldn't resist as the debates went on. From what I remember, Rand was slain in battle fairly early in that fight. Sure, maybe it wouldn't have worked—maybe it would have come down to Rand and Trump on stage and Trump still coming out on top—but as it happened it was like watching a slow-motion train wreck. It should have been easy picking to at least remove the full-blown neocons on stage one by one until folks were able to determine which candidate between Trump or Rand was TRULY anti-establishment. Republicans were obviously ready for a change, they just didn't get the best one in the bunch. Sorry, I digress.

So, what is this impeachment stuff? Noise. There is NOT going to be an impeachment. Even if there is, we're past the midway point so you're looking at a potential of nearly 10 years of Pence if he takes over now. Amash just bet the farm on noise. So what's gonna happen when the guns are loaded and ready to fire? —Amash gone and Massie in the House trying to hold the line. That's what we're looking at now. I cannot, under those circumstances and with that prospect in mind, cheer this on.

I suppose Amash wasn't aware that the vast majority of republican voters are absolutely fed up to the eyeballs with the constant battering of Trump by the media 25 hours a day, 8 days a week since he took office. The racism smears. The redundant investigations. The nothing-burgers replayed over the airwaves ad-nauseum simply for the meaningless conclusion of shrugging their shoulders and saying "maybe he did, maybe he didn't". . . Noise. If Amash was aware of this fact, then he just committed suicide-by-voter.

Amash has not always voted on every issue in the way the majority of his constituents want, but he had a relationship with them to where he can usually explain WHY he voted like he did and they seem to have respected that for about a decade of him being in office, and disagreements were tolerated. (Ron Paul's experience was probably the same way in Texas.) Why now? Why over noise, is he going to throw that away?

We should know by now that most voters don't really care how you vote, especially once you're in office. The truth, whether we like it or not—as much as we wish it weren't so—is that they care about what you say that can make them smile. There'd better be one big-ass rabbit in Amash's hat.

[TER]

Amash still going at it with the impeachment nonsense. Very disappointing. I was hoping he would cool it after the backlash.

I think this is only going to do irreparable damage to him within the GOP at a time when we need stronger leadership coming from the House Freedom caucus.

And by "stronger leadership" you apparently mean toeing the party line.

Uh no. I never mentioned or implied toeing the party line. At least I didn’t mean it to come out that way.

I mean that if Amash is out of the House for insisting on continuing this witch-hunt and loses his seat in the Freedom Caucus, where he should be as one of its leaders, then that would be a huge loss.

[donnay]

What is that supposed to mean? where did u get this idea that Koch industry is a bad place to work at? I would probably want to work there not because I am from a third world country but because they probably pay better than my current employer. What am I missing here?

The Kochs’ free-market ideology has not prevented their companies from taking economic development subsidies from state and local governments. In 2013 it was reported that Koch Industries was the largest investor in the Big River Steel project in Arkansas that was slated to receive some $139 million in state and local financial assistance.

The Good Jobs First Subsidy Tracker lists state, local and federal subsidy awards to the company amounting to more than $196 million.

https://www.corp-research.org/koch_industries

[donnay]

Starving? Not in America.

Keep your blinders on if you must.

[devil21]

Liberty is not natural, tyranny is the law of the jungle and the result you would get.

You are supporting world wide communism.

Going on record as disagreeing with the Declaration of Independence and BoR? Ballsy but not surprising.

[Superfluous Man]

Keep your blinders on if you must.

I'm not wearing blinders. If you actually know of evidence for your claim that many Americans are starving, please share it. I don't see how that's even possible with the availability of so many sources of help for those who need it here.

[donnay]

I'm not wearing blinders. If you actually know of evidence for your claim that many Americans are starving, please share it. I don't see how that's even possible with the availability of so many sources of help for those who need it here.

[Superfluous Man]

Those people are clearly not starving.

[Swordsmyth]

People used to accuse Ron Paul of exactly that when he railed against the wars.

Are you implying that Amash never agrees with and/or votes with Trump?

This is not equivalent to opposing wars, in fact he is making it harder for Trump to resist the Neocons push for wars by supporting the treasonous coup, the bigger the push for impeachment the more Trump will be reminded that he needs Neocon votes to survive it.

[Swordsmyth]

Going on record as disagreeing with the Declaration of Independence and BoR? Ballsy but not surprising.

LOL

GOD endows man with rights but he doesn't enforce them for him and we live in a world of fallen men who do not respect them.
The founders new that liberty was a manmade creation, a drop of civilization in a jungle of tyranny, they read Locke, you should too.

[angelatc]

This is not equivalent to opposing wars, in fact he is making it harder for Trump to resist the Neocons push for wars by supporting the treasonous coup, the bigger the push for impeachment the more Trump will be reminded that he needs Neocon votes to survive it.

Whatever. I'm not ever going to walk away from a #TeamLiberty member because Donald Trump's sycophants are up in arms over whatever the drama of the day is.

Like it or not, Amash's voting record is far more conservative than Trump's. I have principles.

[Swordsmyth]

Whatever. I'm not ever going to walk away from a #TeamLiberty member because Donald Trump's sycophants are up in arms over whatever the drama of the day is.

Like it or not, Amash's voting record is far more conservative than Trump's. I have principles.

So once you label someone as on your team they can do no wrong?
Amash is wrong in a big way here.

[angelatc]

So once you label someone as on your team they can do no wrong?
Amash is wrong in a big way here.

He most certainly isn't wrong if he is saying something he legitimately believes to be true. Truth is treason in an empire of lies.

[specsaregood]

He most certainly isn't wrong if he is saying something he legitimately believes to be true. Truth is treason in an empire of lies.

That no crime and dishonorable behavior is grounds for impeachment?

[Swordsmyth]

He most certainly isn't wrong if he is saying something he legitimately believes to be true. Truth is treason in an empire of lies.

I don't believe he legitimately believes it or he would have called for impeachment over the bumpstock ban or something else that actually had a basis instead of waiting until now to jump on board the treasonous coup, not to mention that he never called for O'Bummer's impeachment for crimes that were much worse and committed in the open.

[angelatc]

That no crime and dishonorable behavior is grounds for impeachment?

It is entirely possible to be guilty of obstructing an investigation even if the investigation eventually produces no evidence to support the underlying theory.

I don't believe he legitimately believes it or he would have called for impeachment over the bumpstock ban or something else that actually had a basis instead of waiting until now to jump on board the treasonous coup, not to mention that he never called for O'Bummer's impeachment for crimes that were much worse and committed in the open.

Whataboutism is misdirection. Again, he did nothing wrong by making this statement if he sincerely believes it. His job in Congress is certainly not to provide a safe haven for the president or the party.

You can't convince me that there's not another Republican that secretly thinks this has merit, nor will you convince me that there aren't any Democrats that quietly wish his colleagues would get over the non-stop cult of personality issues and admit this whole thing was a huge waste of time.

Amash is just the crack in the cognitive dissonance on both sides.

[specsaregood]

It is entirely possible to be guilty of obstructing an investigation even if the investigation eventually produces no evidence to support the underlying theory.

ok, but amash specifically said that grounds for impeachment didn't even require a crime and could just be for dishonorable behavior. If he really feels that way, he should have moved to impeach Obama and Trump long ago.

[Swordsmyth]

It is entirely possible to be guilty of obstructing an investigation even if the investigation eventually produces no evidence to support the underlying theory.

It's not an impeachable offense, especially when the investigation was an illegal treasonous cuop.

Whataboutism is misdirection. Again, he did nothing wrong by making this statement if he sincerely believes it. His job in Congress is certainly not to provide a safe haven for the president or the party.

You can't convince me that there's not another Republican that secretly thinks this has merit, nor will you convince me that there aren't any Democrats that quietly wish his colleagues would get over the non-stop cult of personality issues and admit this whole thing was a huge waste of time.

Amash is just the crack in the cognitive dissonance on both sides.

My post was not misdirection, what I said indicates strongly that he does NOT sincerely believe the garbage he is spouting and is just doing this for personal reasons or political gain, unfortunately for him he won't get any from it.

Nobody on either side believes this garbage.

[devil21]

LOL

GOD endows man with rights but he doesn't enforce them for him and we live in a world of fallen men who do not respect them.
The founders new that liberty was a manmade creation, a drop of civilization in a jungle of tyranny, they read Locke, you should too.

What part of being endowed by their Creator with liberty is a man-made creation? The only man-made creation is the government.

[Swordsmyth]

What part of being endowed by their Creator with liberty is a man-made creation? The only man-made creation is the government.

The part where it is enforced so that people actually enjoy their rights to some degree.



And yes it takes a government to do that, that's why the founders had state governments and created the federal government.

You are the one out of step with the wisdom of the founders.

[devil21]

The part where it is enforced so that people actually enjoy their rights to some degree.



And yes it takes a government to do that, that's why the founders had state governments and created the federal government.

You are the one out of step with the wisdom of the founders.

The usual moving of the goalposts from you. You said liberty is a man-made creation, which is contrary to what the DoI says. The DoI says government is instituted to secure liberty. It does not create it, however. That's like saying that a vault creates what is stored inside of it. If you build a vault, gold will magically appear inside of it?

[Swordsmyth]

The usual moving of the goalposts from you. You said liberty is a man-made creation, which is contrary to what the DoI says. The DoI says government is instituted to secure liberty. It does not create it, however. That's like saying that a vault creates what is stored inside of it. If you build a vault, gold will magically appear inside of it?

Liberty is the state of being where your rights are enforced and protected, it is not natural nor does GOD provide it, it is a mandmade condition.

The DoI doesn't say anything to contradict that, securing liberty is how it is created, if it isn't secured it doesn't exist in this fallen world.

[devil21]

Liberty is the state of being where your rights are enforced and protected, it is not natural nor does GOD provide it, it is a mandmade condition.

You just keep on doubling down. Are you british, by chance?

DOI:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

Endowed by Creator with liberty. It's plain language. You can say that you disagree with the DoI if you want but insisting that it isn't what the DoI says is ridiculous.

The DoI doesn't say anything to contradict that, securing liberty is how it is created, if it isn't secured it doesn't exist in this fallen world.

Dude you gotta be a brit with your whole "never let go of a lie, just double down on it" that brits are so well known for. I can see how subjects of the Crown would think that liberty comes from another person. It's how you're accustomed to living.

[Stratovarious]

I am OK with open borders. ...

That's a fkg hoot, I thought you promoted open borders, ''okay with it''
:facepalm:

[Swordsmyth]

You just keep on doubling down. Are you british, by chance?

DOI:
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

Endowed by Creator with liberty. It's plain language. You can say that you disagree with the DoI if you want but insisting that it isn't what the DoI says is ridiculous.



Dude you gotta be a brit with your whole "never let go of a lie, just double down on it" that brits are so well known for. I can see how subjects of the Crown would think that liberty comes from another person. It's how you're accustomed to living.

Read it AGAIN man is endowed by his creator with A RIGHT TO LIBERTY, GOD doesn't enforce it any more than he enforces our other rights, we are also endowed with a right to life but millions are murdered every year.

Look around at the world and tell me that GOD is enforcing our right to liberty, I dare you.

You are the dedicated liar and follower of the father of lies.

[devil21]

Read it AGAIN man is endowed by his creator with A RIGHT TO LIBERTY, GOD doesn't enforce it any more than he enforces our other rights, we are also endowed with a right to life but millions are murdered every year.

Rights are innate simply by being born, therefore they occur naturally. Rights are not "man-made". The method to continually "secure" them is what is man-made. Liberty is a natural right you have simply by being born. I actually think the DoI is wrong regarding government being that which secures the natural right of liberty. Only YOU can secure your right of liberty. Relying on others to secure your rights is folly. Based on your quote below I think we do agree on that.

Look around at the world and tell me that GOD is enforcing our right to liberty, I dare you.

You are the dedicated liar and follower of the father of lies.

Always with the derogatory personal attacks when called out on your bs. Your entire posting history here is nothing but one giant lie. Who you are, where you're from, why you're here, all of it. All lies. Every last thing about your presence here is a lie. And worse, you spend an inordinate amount of time, day after day, defending the biggest liar in the country. And you accuse others of being liars? Please dude, your act is old, tired and reeks of desperation to maintain a narrative that you know is failing miserably. It's sad and I actually feel sorry for you if this is what your life has devolved into. 40 posts a day, non-stop 14 hours a day on a web forum that few read, pushing lie after lie for people that don't care one little tiny bit about you. I really hope you have a good reason other than just collecting a check.

[Swordsmyth]

Rights are innate simply by being born, therefore they occur naturally. Rights are not "man-made". The method to continually "secure" them is what is man-made. Liberty is a natural right you have simply by being born. I actually think the DoI is wrong regarding government being that which secures the natural right of liberty. Only YOU can secure your right of liberty. Relying on others to secure your rights is folly. Based on your quote below I think we do agree on that.

The right to something and the thing are two different things, the right to liberty is natural but liberty is not, man must create and secure liberty and he must create a government to do it, the failure of most governments to do it for most of history doesn't mean there is any other way to do it.

Always with the derogatory personal attacks when called out on your bs. Your entire posting history here is nothing but one giant lie. Who you are, where you're from, why you're here, all of it. All lies. Every last thing about your presence here is a lie. And worse, you spend an inordinate amount of time, day after day, defending the biggest liar in the country. And you accuse others of being liars? Please dude, your act is old, tired and reeks of desperation to maintain a narrative that you know is failing miserably. It's sad and I actually feel sorry for you if this is what your life has devolved into. 40 posts a day, non-stop 14 hours a day on a web forum that few read, pushing lie after lie for people that don't care one little tiny bit about you. I really hope you have a good reason other than just collecting a check.

You can dish it out but you can't take it?

Typical.

I do not lie but you do frequently.

[PAF]

That's a fkg hoot, I thought you promoted open borders, ''okay with it''
:facepalm:

I am not a restrictionist. Whether one wants or needs to travel is up to that person, not me, not you, certainly not government bureaucrats. The issue that I have is government taking my hard-earned money and passing it out like candy in the form of welfare/incentives, not one slight different than corporate bailouts. The problem with passing out money is that foreigners AND Americans learn to count on that, and that is where the "vote issue" comes to play. Eliminate the handouts, people will understand that they need to be responsible and work if they want to survive. Restricting travel does nothing to solve or educate, the problem will still persist and grow.

Once you become a restrictionist, you oppose/reject Natural Rights (Bill of Rights). Read them and see what I mean. Once you understand that, you will have arrived.