Amash is saying Trump has engaged in an impeachable offense

[fcreature]

Came here to say I'm done with Amash. I regret all my donations to his campaigns.

The "impeachable offense" is obstruction of justice? Really, Justin? The man had his fourth amendment rights ripped from him and had the full fledged force of the US government attempting to sabotage, spy, and entrap his campaign. The underlying "crime" he "obstructed" (according to Justin) did not even occur.

How in the world does a small government libertarian support the ability for the federal government goons to put you in prison for obstruction on falsified crimes that never happened? Crimes that were invented with the sole intention of later charging you with obstruction.

TDS does terrible things to people.

[acptulsa]

poisonous tree.

poisonous tree.

poisonous tree

poisonous tree.

poisonous tree.

Thank you for not spamming.

[Swordsmyth]

Thank you for not spamming.

LOL

It's over, get over it:

[ATruepatriot]

Even Romney came out against it. And I DID read Rand didn't agree either, just got to find it again.

Romney: Mueller report did not show obstruction, 'I don't think impeachment is the right way to go'

Soon after Rep. Justin Amash, R-Mich., went against the GOP consensus by claiming President Trump committed "impeachable conduct" in the form of obstruction of justice, another known Trump critic took the opposite position.

Sen. Mitt Romney, R-Utah, acknowledged that while he has called out Trump when he's deemed it appropriate, he does not believe the Mueller report provided evidence that supports impeaching the president.

"I just don’t think that there is the full element that you’d need to prove an obstruction of justice case," Romney told host Jake Tapper on CNN's State of the Union on Sunday, while acknowledging, "Everyone reaches their own conclusion."

Still, Romney said he "was troubled by it," but did not feel the allegations laid out in the report were enough to rise to the standard of an obstruction charge.

Romney specifically pointed to the element of intent, which is required as part of an obstruction charge. He said that the lack of any underlying crime -- such as any conspiracy between the Trump campaign and Russia -- makes it difficult to show that Trump's actions were based on a corrupt intent to cover something up.

"You just don't have the elements," Romney said.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/rom...ight-way-to-go

[angelatc]

No need to read a report on how Trump reacted to a witch hunt.

Instead of condemning the witch hunt, Amash is condeming the victim of the witch hunt.

Dastardly.

Amash isn't favoring the victim of a witch hunt. He is of the opinion that the president attempted to obstruct a legal investigation.

I haven't read the report, but the point remains that a guy who banned bump stocks and seems intent on going to war with Iran is being favored over a guy who has a 94% Constitutional voting record.

[susano]

Bill Clinton was a big wake up call for me.
I was shocked and angry a politician lied, and tried to destroy the truth tellers.
I still did not see it as an impeachable offense.
Because who he had legal sex with, was nobodies business in the first place.
I don't care if it was in the oval office.
That should have stayed between him and Monica.
Should have never been dragged out into the light, and certainly not for the sake of impeachment.

While I felt he should have impeached and also charged with treason over China, his actions with Lewinsky made him a security risk (never mind the extreme impropriety). She was under his desk giving him a blow job while he was on the phone planning the bombing of Serbia, ffs. He made himself subject to blackmail and sure as hell didn't have a security clearance to be listening on such a conversation. I never cared that he lied about it as much as I cared that he did it.

[angelatc]

TDS does terrible things to people.

On both sides of the issue.

[fcreature]

I haven't read the report, but the point remains that a guy who banned bump stocks and seems intent on going to war with Iran is being favored over a guy who has a 94% Constitutional voting record.

Amash can be right on every other issue and still be incredibly wrong on this. The only thing I am speaking to right now is the subject of this thread. His actions and statements on this are enough for me to never give him a penny, or advocate on his behalf again. If he continues down the path of supporting the police state tactics used on Trump, I'll be supporting his primary challenger.

[nikcers]

Nope..
Cannabis legalization was well underway before him..

[Stratovarious]

Oh? And can you summarize for us what he was correct about?

: )

Why do you post on this forum?

[acptulsa]

: )

Why do you post on this forum?

I thought not.

[specsaregood]

Amash isn't favoring the victim of a witch hunt. He is of the opinion that the president attempted to obstruct a legal investigation.

Meh, I think the target of a witch hunt has the right to do anything to defend themselves. if there is an impeachable crime here, who is the victim?

I haven't read the report, but the point remains that a guy who banned bump stocks and seems intent on going to war with Iran is being favored over a guy who has a 94% Constitutional voting record.

If Amash was attacking him on those issues I would have no brook with him on that.

[Stratovarious]

I thought not.

Oh boy!! You're on fire son, nice work!!.........

[Stratovarious]

Under Amash's careful (cough) guidance ( 'He said' ) ,name Presidents
since and including George Washington that had not committed 'impeachable'
offences.........

I thought not.

You sure get quiet quick.


: )

[nobody's_hero]

I am so proud of Justin.

I can't wait to see the names our resident alt-right trolls will call Ron Paul after he weighs in on this.

Even Ron Paul thinks the left is acting like a bunch of retards over the Russia collusion crap. Hell he's even sided with Trump a few times in the liberty report. There are a lot of things Ron Paul would have problems with as far as how Trump does things, but he draws the line at siding with democrats over a nothing-burger. Amash wants to join the impeachment bandwagon, he's welcome too, but I think he's siding with a bunch of people that would happily see him out of office as well.

[acptulsa]

...but I think he's siding with a bunch of people that would happily see him out of office as well.

Principle makes strange bedfellows. Following principle doesn't give one the luxury of choosing allies.

That's why 99 44/100% of politicians avoid principles like the plague.

[nobody's_hero]

Principle makes strange bedfellows. Following principle doesn't give one the luxury of choosing allies.

That's why 99 44/100% of politicians avoid principles like the plague.

Oh I have no problem with someone siding with the "other side" over an issue. Heck, Rand Paul working with Democrat Ron Wyden to repeal long-standing parts of the Patriot act comes to mind. What I'm calling into question is the "issue" that Amash is siding with the left over. I don't think principle has a whole lot to do with it. Someone would have to explain that one to me. It's pretty damned popular to attack Trump, so if anything, from what I've seen, he's going with the flow.

"I don't like you so . . . IMPEACH!" is a pretty lousy principle to stand with democrats on.

[Krugminator2]

A If he continues down the path of supporting the police state tactics used on Trump, I'll be supporting his primary challenger.

I can never remotely understand this line of thinking. Justin Amash is probably one of five most liberty minded congressmen of the last 100 years. The odds of replacing him with someone better are 0.000000000000000000%. I don't support impeachment but it is a very reasonable position. Judge Napolitano seems to think Trump is on thin ice.

[susano]

The other side will never impeach for unauthorized killing because they plan on expanding it quite a bit more .

Not to mention they were all down with the destruction of Syria and Libya. Mass murder is okay by libtards as long they're the one's in control. Other George W Bush (who is a globalist lib, AFAIC), what big wars haven't been started by libs?

[susano]

Here is the real reason that shill Amash has had stage 5 TDS for years now:



Amash is just another politician in it for himself and owned by China. At least be honest and admit you oppose Trump because the tariffs will hurt your family business instead of appeasing the libtard morons by promoting the debunked collusion and obstruction hoax.

https://theconservativetreehouse.com...ests-in-china/

Wow. His lying about it is bad. It may be not be as personal as his business but that plus the broader Libertarian POV of "free trade" (in actuality, neoliberal). He's also made it clear he sees nothing detrimental in trade deficits.

I must say, this also the kind of thing Trump would lie about, too, but it shows Amash to be willing to do the same.

[susano]

And yet he disregards his personal interests in favor of the good of his country.

[Anti Federalist]

Serious question:

What did Trump do, specifically, to "obstruct justice"?

Did he himself, or did he order evidence destroyed?

Did he order people to lie under oath?

Did he delete or erase digital evidence?

I'm seriously asking of anybody who has read the report in depth.

I'd still like to know...

[Swordsmyth]

Amash isn't favoring the victim of a witch hunt. He is of the opinion that the president attempted to obstruct a legal investigation.

I haven't read the report, but the point remains that a guy who banned bump stocks and seems intent on going to war with Iran is being favored over a guy who has a 94% Constitutional voting record.

That's what should happen when the guy with the great voting record LIES about the guy who banned bump stocks and has a bad foreign policy (it is NOT clear that he is intent on going to war with Iran) and joins an treasonous coup attempt.

[Swordsmyth]

I can never remotely understand this line of thinking. Justin Amash is probably one of five most liberty minded congressmen of the last 100 years. The odds of replacing him with someone better are 0.000000000000000000%. I don't support impeachment but it is a very reasonable position. Judge Napolitano seems to think Trump is on thin ice.

Judge Swamp is a bigger liar and TDS victim than Amash.

They are both participating in Treason.

[Swordsmyth]

Principle makes strange bedfellows. Following principle doesn't give one the luxury of choosing allies.

That's why 99 44/100% of politicians avoid principles like the plague.

And Amash just Joined the 99 44/100%.

[Swordsmyth]

I am so proud of Justin.

That is a point against him.

I can't wait to see the names our resident alt-right trolls will call Ron Paul after he weighs in on this.

Ron will either not comment or disagree with Amash.

[susano]

Besides the anti-Zionist angle and Amash being Palestinian, his family's business being affected by the China tarrifs etc...

I think he is doing it to get press and name recognition ahead of his announcement of a third party run for the LP in 2020.

Not a smart move to use the Mueller saga as a vehicle for that imho, but I think that is the most likely motivation.

By the way:
From a legal point of view, obstruction does NOT require an underlying crime, because obstruction is aimed at preventing the collection of evidence and therefore getting an indicment (H. Clintons deletion of 33000 emails qualifies for sure). The threshold of proof in criminal cases is very high ("beyond reasonable doubt") which is why prosecutors love process crimes like lying to them or obstruction. They are much easier to prove. It is BS and contrary to any common sense, but that is the legal theory behind it.
The Mueller report, however, is NOT claiming that they proved obstruction (beyond reasonable doubt). Instead, they are saying that they could not "exonerate" Trump. Exoneration is NOT a concept of criminal law. It would require proving a negative which is impossible. It also puts the principle of "inncocent until proven guilty" on its head. According to this principle, you are automatically deemed innocent once the prosecution closes the case without an indicment. The exoneration terminolgy used by the Mueller team is a bone thrown to Congress, so that they have a political football to toss arround.

I really learned what a crock of $#@! federal charges are when I watched the CNN documentary (shocker that they showed it) called, "Sue, the T-Rex" which exposed the feds using these bull$#@! charges to take down someone for political and power tripping reasons. Federal law is a racket.

While I do not know, I suspect that our founders never envisioned anything like this. I would guess that federal law and courts would have only been intended for disputes between the States.

[acptulsa]

And Amash just Joined the 99 44/100%.

Oh? So tell us. If his principles didn't get him into this mess, what did?

Oh, yeah. Admitting that someone could stand against Trump on principles is against your principles. Except they aren't principles, are they? It's just blind partisanship.

[susano]

You mad bro?

Up against the wall commie scum!

[angelatc]

That's what should happen when the guy with the great voting record LIES about the guy who banned bump stocks and has a bad foreign policy (it is NOT clear that he is intent on going to war with Iran) and joins an treasonous coup attempt.

Oh, stop being a drama queen. Treasonous coup attempt? That ridiculous.