Is President Trump selling out his base and embracing illegal immigration?

[johnwk]

I understand your concern. I don't have a problem with any of those terms. I'm just a little taken aback to be discouraged from using the un-PC word "capitalism." As noted elsewhere, if Marx attacked it, then that's even more reason.

Marx used the word "capitalism" to attack "free enterprise" and a "free market system". Socialists, Marxists and Progressives fear the word "free", which is self defining.

This may be a small point to ponder, but tell me, what is more descriptive, "capitalism" or "free enterprise" and "free market"?


JWK

[phill4paul]

millions of good paying jobs in the construction trades and other industries have been taken by illegal entrants who work off the books, below the going wage, and do not pay taxes on their eared wages.

That's what I do. Why shouldn't they?

American citizens are sick and tired of being made into tax slaves and forced to finance the personal economic needs of millions of foreigners who have invaded America’s borders.

That's your choice. I've chosen not to.

[phill4paul]

I'm not the one that wants more immigrants coming here who will work longer hours for considerably lesser pay and no benefits

I am. They are great workers. I actually pay more because I give no benefits. And since there are no "citizens" willing to do the construction job I task them with it works out great for me and them. No whining, no laying out of work, no feeling entitled to anything more than a good days pay for a good days work. Kinda what it used to be before "citizens" grew up to feel entitled. Want a job? I pay $15/hr. under the table.

[phill4paul]

My freaking husband looked for work for 4 years before he found a job. $#@! the Mexicans.

Should have just started his own gig. I did.

[phill4paul]

I'd like to know how many of you are in favor of punishing businesses for hiring illegals. That really pisses me off. I'm not against some control over immigration but that should be the government's job, not private companies. If you happen to catch an illegal speeding or committing a crime then deport them but don't force businesses to be agents of the government.

Your welcome to try. This is the exact reason why I have not formed a business. I hire and fire at will. And it's nobody's business but my own.

[phill4paul]

I see you are not one of the millions who can't find decent work.

Plenty of jobs out there. To those that can't find "decent work" I say get of your ass and create your own. Or perhaps adjust your attitude as to what "decent work" is.

[phill4paul]

sry, but the real crime is letting in 20 people who shouldn't even be here compete for one job that belongs to a citizen of THIS country. How is THAT fair!!! Of course it's artificial manipulation of wages because they only made 30 cents per hr where they came from and will work for half what an American worker will make. He won't complain about things like breaks, over time, insurance, retirement, asbestos this and silica that either unlike you lazy over payed snowflakes In the meantime, as a company owner, just because I only pay half the wages I had to pay, if you think I'm lowering the price for my services by half...lol...your nuts. I'm gonna outbid my competitors now by just enough to get the job and hire even more people for half the pay, bid on lots more work, pocket all that money and buy me a a new Harley, a new friggin Hellcat so I can go on Vacation every 3 months. thanks dude. Free Market (capitalism) is what MAKES MERICA GREAT

Your such a self entitled snowflake. Get off your ass and go make a living and quit expecting it to be handed to you because you were born here.

[phill4paul]

Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen.
There is a reason that people hire illegals. It is because they are willing to...work.
Get up off your asses, quit your belly-aching and go make a living.

[Swordsmyth]

Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen.
There is a reason that people hire illegals. It is because they are willing to...work.
Get up off your asses, quit your belly-aching and go make a living.

And you know all of us?
Just because you had different opportunities and have never experienced our lot in life does not mean you know everything.
If you want to hear someone defend a wrong with more arrogance and viciousness than is reasonable, find someone who makes money on that wrong.

Americans Own America, and have a perfect right to limit and control who comes here to our own benefit.

[phill4paul]

And you know all of us?
Just because you had different opportunities and have never experienced our lot in life does not mean you know everything.
If you want to hear someone defend a wrong with more arrogance and viciousness than is reasonable, find someone who makes money on that wrong.

Americans Own America, and have a perfect right to limit and control who comes here to our own benefit.

I made my opportunities. I remake them everyday. That's what the people that founded this country did. Being such a failure at life sounds like a personal problem to me.

[klamath]

Your such a self entitled snowflake. Get off your ass and go make a living and quit expecting it to be handed to you because you were born here.

Really makes you wonder if these are liberty forums or the united workers against free enterprise forums! I deserve it! It is MY right! Kill the scabs!
Start your own goddamned business and hire only certified citizens people! Labor and business are just different words for trade. Nobody forces you to by my product at a price I tell you to pay. Nobody should be required to buy your labor (AKA as your product) for a price you demand.

[H. E. Panqui]

"Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen."



...what do you to say about 'the banksters' who are apparently 'entitled' to illion$ in free money?...maybe save some of your scorn for the real $cumbags who prey upon/enslave/etc. humanity...and have for eon$...

[klamath]

"Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen."



...what do you to say about 'the banksters' who are apparently 'entitled' to illion$ in free money?...maybe save some of your scorn for the real $cumbags who prey upon/enslave/etc. humanity...and have for eon$...

Ah maybe not bail them out with taxpayers money, like trump advocated....

[phill4paul]

"Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen."



...what do you to say about 'the banksters' who are apparently 'entitled' to illion$ in free money?...maybe save some of your scorn for the real $cumbags who prey upon/enslave/etc. humanity...and have for eon$...

I don't pay federal tax and I use a small local bank. I don't give a $#@! about them. You can keep on getting bent out of shape about them if you want or you can simplify your life. Instead of wasting time caring about the bankers I spend more time looking for the next job opportunity. Time is money.

[Ender]

Listen up you wasted, blubbering, snowflakes, that feel that you are somehow entitled to "decent work" because you had the good fortune of being born an American citizen.
There is a reason that people hire illegals. It is because they are willing to...work.
Get up off your asses, quit your belly-aching and go make a living.

Never found harder workers than Mexicans.

And I have told the story several times on this forum about living in an entitled spoiled tourist city where no service jobs were filled by anyone but Hispanics. One woman looked for weeks trying to fill some well paying home care jobs and couldn't find a soul until she went to the local service org and got some Mexicans to take the jobs. AND these jobs started at $15-$20 an hour.

[Swordsmyth]

I made my opportunities. I remake them everyday. That's what the people that founded this country did. Being such a failure at life sounds like a personal problem to me.

Again with the self righteous arrogance, I am not a "failure at life" and I do everything I can to make opportunities but I am not omnipotent and state/local/fedgov do a pretty good job of limiting options/messing up the economy.

And I see you were incapable of responding to what I said, so you responded with ad-homenims.
And don't even start with the argument that groups don't exist or that group ownership doesn't exist at some level, you will make a fool of your self denying the obvious and I will not respond.

[phill4paul]

Again with the self righteous arrogance, I am not a "failure at life" and I do everything I can to make opportunities but I am not omnipotent and state/local/fedgov do a pretty good job of limiting options/messing up the economy.

And I see you were incapable of responding to what I said, so you responded with ad-homenims.
And don't even start with the argument that groups don't exist or that group ownership doesn't exist at some level, you will make a fool of your self denying the obvious and I will not respond.

I responded as I usually do to those that feel a need to whine about their state of affairs and want a government to make life better for them. So please, don't bother to respond if it is just going to be more whining.

[Superfluous Man]

You say you cannot speak for “undergroundr”, so why speak for me and assert something false about what I favor?

It's not false. Your main point in this thread has been to push immigration control.

[phill4paul]

Never found harder workers than Mexicans.

And I have told the story several times on this forum about living in an entitled spoiled tourist city where no service jobs were filled by anyone but Hispanics. One woman looked for weeks trying to fill some well paying home care jobs and couldn't find a soul until she went to the local service org and got some Mexicans to take the jobs. AND these jobs started at $15-$20 an hour.

Well, can't say I "never found." But the ones I've worked with do good by me. Honestly, it's tough finding good help. I've gone through the phase of friend, neighbors, acquaintances, recommending me their son, cousin, nephew for hire. I just nip that $#@! in the bud anymore. My ladies son works as a lineman. There is good pay, but hard work. He recently was pulled from the lines and put in charge of new hire training. He said on the day that the new hires had to show they could climb a pole 3/4 of the class was cut. Who the hell signs up for a lineman's job that can't even scale a pole?

[69360]

I've never believed Trump actually hated messicans and mooslims. It was all a show to get elected. He's a businessman and knows illegals are good cheap labor. The economy would utterly fall apart if you really rounded up all the illegals.

[johnwk]

That's what I do. Why shouldn't they?



That's your choice. I've chosen not to.

So, you are in disagreement with the rule of law and our Constitution. OK, that's your prerogative.


JWK




There was a time not too long ago in New York when able-bodied people were ashamed to accept home relief, a program created by Franklin D. Roosevelt in 1931 when he was Governor. Now these ticks and fleas not only demand welfare, but use it to buy beer, wine, drugs and Lotto tickets.

[H. E. Panqui]

I don't pay federal tax...Time is money.

...this is asinine...even if you don't 'pay income tax' you pay all kinds of federal taxe$!...do you buy ammo?...firearms?...gasoline?...natural gas?...do you ever fly?...drink alcohol?...etc. ad goddamned nau$eam...GET REAL...

...your 'time is money' is just another stooooooooooopid, tired, bs cliche!...time is time...it is 'created' by 'god' if you will...money is money...it is created BY MAN! (some real scumbag men)...and anyone who truly understands our stinking rotten goddamned insane MAN-MADE monetary order is horrified..your lack of concern reveals a butt-ignorance typical of republicrats and other monetary ignoramuses...

[phill4paul]

...this is asinine...even if you don't 'pay income tax' you pay all kinds of federal taxe$!...do you buy ammo?...firearms?...gasoline?...natural gas?...do you ever fly?...drink alcohol?...etc. ad goddamned nau$eam...GET REAL...

...your 'time is money' is just another stooooooooooopid, tired, bs cliche!...time is time...it is 'created' by 'god' if you will...money is money...it is created BY MAN! (some real scumbag men)...and anyone who truly understands our stinking rotten goddamned insane MAN-MADE monetary order is horrified..your lack of concern reveals a butt-ignorance typical of republicrats and other monetary ignoramuses...

I do what I can. More importantly, less than most. I understand the stinking rotten goddamned insane MAN-MADE monetary order as much as you. I also learn to work within it. And outside it.

Call me ignorant but I'm not crying that Mexicans are stealing my jerbs.

[phill4paul]

So, you are in disagreement with the rule of law and our Constitution. OK, that's your prerogative.


JWK

I just happened to be born here. I didn't come out of the womb and sign a paper authorizing anyone's authority over me. I was indoctrinated to believe in it. And to feel I didn't have a choice. And then I decided that I did.

[nikcers]

This is the darkest timeline

[H. E. Panqui]

'I understand the stinking rotten goddamned insane MAN-MADE monetary order as much as you.'



...i really really really doubt that!!...really..

[phill4paul]

'I understand the stinking rotten goddamned insane MAN-MADE monetary order as much as you.'



...i really really really doubt that!!...really..

Yeah, do the teenager "rolleyes" one more time. That will convinced me that I know nothing and you know everything.

I have a good life. A happy life. As secure as one can be on any given day. Or into the given future.

I don't really care what you think you know. Or what you think you know about me.

I'm sure that will hurt you some. But, that's a personal problem.

[nikcers]

Never found harder workers than Mexicans.

And I have told the story several times on this forum about living in an entitled spoiled tourist city where no service jobs were filled by anyone but Hispanics. One woman looked for weeks trying to fill some well paying home care jobs and couldn't find a soul until she went to the local service org and got some Mexicans to take the jobs. AND these jobs started at $15-$20 an hour.

There are lots of hard working Americans-just not ones that will work hard doing something they perceive to be beneath them. Service jobs used to be first jobs that taught you how to work hard, or jobs people picked up because they needed extra money. The destruction of low skill labor wage is what's caused a lot of people to never have to learn how to work hard. You could say that there are positives and negatives to letting a lot of cheap labor come in and take jobs for cheaper then the market would normally allow, but one could argue that in many ways it has hurt a lot more people then it helps. I don't think it helps enable the Mexican cartels and the Mexican government to rob their people and take advantage of them by letting their citizens come here to fix our problems (labor costs too much and we need to stay competitive).

[otherone]

So, you are in disagreement with the rule of law and our Constitution. OK, that's your prerogative.

"our"
It is to laugh.

[H. E. Panqui]

I have a good life. A happy life. As secure as one can be on any given day. Or into the given future.

[...said 'the house n!gger' to his not-so-lucky fellows...said the top of the pyramid dweller to the lower-level pyramid dweller$..ps..i bet i live 'higher on the hog' than you!...]

"The real menace of our Republic is the invisible government, which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy legs over our cities, states and nation. To depart from mere generalizations, let me say that at the head of this octopus are the Rockefeller–Standard Oil interests and a small group of powerful banking houses generally referred to as the international bankers. The little coterie of powerful international bankers virtually run the United States government for their own selfish purposes.
They practically control both parties, write political platforms, make catspaws of party leaders, use the leading men of private organizations, and resort to every device to place in nomination for high public office only such candidates as will be amenable to the dictates of corrupt big business.
These international bankers and Rockefeller–Standard Oil interests control the majority of the newspapers and magazines in this country. They use the columns of these papers to club into submission or drive out of office public officials who refuse to do the bidding of the powerful corrupt cliques which compose the invisible government. It operates under cover of a self-created screen [and] seizes our executive officers, legislative bodies, schools, courts, newspapers and every agency created for the public protection."