You are here advocating on behalf of letting people die from easily preventable diseases, because 10,000 years from now something something something something.Originally Posted by H_H
All these things have been explained politely and patiently multiple times. If you don't know the answers by now, you're not paying attention. Apparently we need a cure for people who are allergic to facts.
There's no debate with people who are still hiding behind the same sad debunked theories they were using 10 years ago.
You mean like this fact you brought up in this thread?
Again @Cleaner44 is right your so apted to believe the scientists who work for the CDC, Universities and other alphabet agencies who are on the pharmaceutical pay rolls and you find absolutely no conflict of interest at all.
Also trying to make it look like I have no credentials or I don't do the research only proves you're the bigger fool. No interaction from you has been polite and civil. You are nasty women--plain and simple.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
'' You can keep your doctor'' "the science is in" Ny and Ca are under 22 ft of water
''I'm from the government and I'm here to help ''
Moving goalposts.
The only debate about vaccines these days are if they should be mandatory. Screeching that they don't work, they gave autismz and it's all a NWO plot to rake in billions before killing us off in 10,000 years only serves one side.
And it isn't the freedom side.
-
I never deny an answer or explanation to anyone that
asks, I don't have any friends that avoid answers with
'slights' , if you had the answers to my questions , like
anyone with 'facts' you would answer them, you do
not have the answers, your position on vaccines is
clear , your facts are not, because you don't have them.
Yep, there we are. Everybody who works in science, academia and government is on on some secret plot plot. But by golly, you're able to see right through them all.
And I don't have to make it look like you don't have any credentials, because YOU DON"T HAVE ANY CREDENTIALS! Google and YouTube isn't "research" FFS.
Last edited by angelatc; 01-07-2019 at 05:19 PM.
Search the forums, search google. None of your questions are breaking any new ground, and asking them doesn't make you look clever. Again, all those things have been answered both here and in pretty much any other venue, ad nauseum.
Go look up your own answers.
You are attributing me to statments and stances I have
not made, you don't have facts, that is abundanly clear,
it is not me that is moving goal posts.
You don't have the answers.
lol
You browbeat Donnay for using youtube/google, and in
the next breath send me there.
That isn't what I am asking.
Let me ask a different question...
Why is it that Paul Krugman is widely viewed as a rational professional, with numerous advanced degrees, from many of the finest Universities (Yale, MIT) and yet you think he is full of $#@! when it comes to the subject that he is an expert in?
Citizen of Arizona
@cleaner4d4
I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.
I already posted the facts about the corruption. You simply ignored it on numerous occasions.
You don't know what credentials I have, you THINK you know, but you don't know anything about me. You love to attack the messager, but never dig into the message well enough to realize just how idiotic YOU sound.
If you don't like what I post, than simply butt the $#@! out. These threads are for people who want to debate the issues.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
Moving goalposts. This thread isn't about Krugman.
YOU DROPPED OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL! YOU LITERALLY DON'T HAVE ANY CREDENTIALS!
You are not cabable of debate. We have been doing this for 10 years. You proudly post trash, sane people explain with great detail that it's garbage, then you post something totally unrelated, or leave the thread entirely.
How does one FORCE VACCINES and PRESERVE FREEDOM? Thats the real doublethinking trash. Dont take it personally, its exactly the type of topic confusion the elite use to get the focus off of themselves.
1776 > 1984
The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.
The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide
Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled
Of course I do. If you weren't too lazy to search the forums, you would see that I and others have answered all those questions multiple times. Dude, you've been here 2 years, I've been here 11. I understand you weren't here, but I'm not typing out that crap again and again and again in some useless attempt to satiate the stupid.
You don't. But that's what pisses me off about the rabid anti-vaxxers. They're freedom's worst enemy.
Then you prove it--right here and right now.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
Because angelatc is a fake and phony. She doesn't love Liberty and Freedom and this discussion proves it rather well. She'll back pedal and say she is not for mandatory vaccines but believes in Herd Immunity.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
I am not moving anything. It is called an Analogy. You didn't answer my first question so I thought I would address your distraction. You took the position that experts with fine degrees should be trusted more than the less educated critics. So on general terms it seems you believe that a highly educated person, such as Krugman, should be believed and trusted more than someone like Ron Paul or any other critic.
Going back to this subject, I just want a real answer. I know that experts in economics and other fields have agendas and are educated with bad information sometimes. We see it all of the time in many areas. I am genuinely wondering why you don't seem to think this is possible in the medical field. I suspect you would agree with me in regards to other fields. Am I wrong? Do you think that highly educated experts are sometimes wrong, either intentionally or because of bad information?
Citizen of Arizona
@cleaner4d4
I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.
Your personal attacks identify your toolbox and what it contains.
Your refusal to back up your claims is a gallery of what you can't back up.
https://thevaccinereaction.org/2018/...s-not-settled/Harvard Medical School Doctor: Vaccine Science is Not Settled
In 2016, I wrote an opinion piece suggesting that many medical doctors vaccinate their patients out of fear. I noted that many doctors do not entirely agree with the vaccine schedule recommended by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) or are unconvinced that the science of vaccination is settled, but many of these physicians are reluctant to share their concerns because they are afraid of damaging their reputation, and so they remain silent.
Of course, there are independently-minded doctors who are willing to express their concerns about CDC vaccine policies and views promoted by medical trade associations and government agencies. Pro-vaccine pediatricians Bob Sears, MD and Jay Gordon, MD, who have been labeled as “anti-vaxxers” and “quacks,” are given those labels because they are not fans of mandatory vaccination laws and simply prefer to be respectful of the informed consent rights of their patients when it comes to vaccination.1 2 3
There are many other doctors like Sears and Gordon but they generally prefer to fly under the radar because it’s just not worth the trouble of being overly outspoken on vaccines, unless it’s all positive and in agreement with vaccine policies endorsed by their peers. John Abramson, MD of Harvard Medical School is one of the best examples of this tendency toward caution when doctors speak about vaccination.1
Dr. Abramson is the author of the national best-selling book Overdosed America: The Broken Promise of American Medicine. His bio states that he has served as a family physician for 22 years. He was twice voted “best doctor” in his area by readers of newspapers in his community and was chosen three times by his peers as one of “a handful of best family practitioners” in Massachusetts. He has been a member of the faculty of Harvard Medical School for 16 years.4
In other words, this is a topnotch veteran doctor with a stellar reputation and who works for an institution ranked 1st last year among the best medical research schools in the United States.5 Certainly Abramson is no “quack.” You would think that someone of Abramson’s stature would be able to say whatever he wished on any medical topic within his purview—that there would be no hesitancy on his part because he had earned that right to speak freely.
A few years ago, Abramson was asked at one of his lectures if he would care to give an opinion on the “push toward compulsory vaccination, in absence of clinical trials, and in violation of the Nuremberg Code.”6 7 Abramson responded:
I would have to take the coward’s way out. I can’t talk on that issue. The pharmaceutical industry watches everything I do, and if I take a stand that I can’t defend… But the bottom line is that I think, what the science is, is incomplete. There is no question about it. And the politics of it, as the way it’s done, as a legal matter, and the inability of people who are injured by vaccines to sue for compensation, preventing plaintiffs’ lawyers from getting to the scientific data, it’s big problems. And, uh, that’s really all I can say. Because again, everything I say in public, uh, is well read. So I apologize.7
Abramson’s words are chilling. The fear is evident in his first sentence. The coward’s way out? He can’t speak to the issue of compulsory vaccination because he is being watched? It’s straight out of Orwell’s 1984.
Interestingly, Abramson did manage to admit that he believed that the science of vaccines is “incomplete.” He basically acknowledged that vaccine science is not settled, and there was “no question about it” in his mind. That is significant, particularly coming from a well respected doctor who perceives such a threat from industry and Big Brother that he felt compelled to apologize.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
You are the one constantly calling for government bans and controls. And the reason I believe in herd immunity is because it's a scientific theory that has been proved repeatedly. (That means over and over.)
Look - here is Zimmerman's testimony: https://bolenreport.com/wp-content/u...Deposition.pdf
I know you're not going tocomprehendread it, but here's the Cliff Notes version:
Dr Zimmerman is pro vaccine and even vaccinates his patients. Dr Zimmerman does not conclude that vaccines cause autism. Dr Zimmerman believes that autism is primarily a genetic disorder. Zimmerman explains how he continues to vaccinate, even in children with mitochondrial disorders (see: Hanna Poling), as he understands the benefits outweigh the risks. He explains that in his opinion the Yates Hazelhurst medical records show no signs of regression. He asserts that encephalopathy is a separate condition from autism. He states that “mitochondrial autism” is not a valid medical term.
As usual, he didn't reach the conclusions your article attributes to him.
Last edited by angelatc; 01-07-2019 at 06:11 PM.
It has no useful purpose.
Again proving that you have no idea how science works. The burden of proof is on you. You implied you have some advanced degree in a vaccine science field. Let's see it.
Last edited by angelatc; 01-07-2019 at 06:16 PM.
Go away little boy. You bore me.
$#@! you. Where is the proof that I dropped out of High School and have no credentials? Answer the question and stop dodging it.
Herd Immunity is, in fact, a "Theory" by a man named, Arthur W. Hedrich and had nothing to do with vaccines. Herd Immunity, is about natural immunity from diseases that children would get, such as chicken pox, measles and other childhood disease which would give them lifetime immunity. However pro-vaxxers took on Herd Immunity as gospel with regards to vaccines and it has been debunked many times here, by scientist and medical doctors. So your point is moot.
Ref:
https://kellybroganmd.com/herd-immunity-fact-fiction/
https://thevaccinereaction.org/2018/...vaccination-2/
https://thevaccinereaction.org/2017/...dly-disproven/
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
I never imply anything, you were doing all the implying. So either you put up, or shut up.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
Actually herd immunity is the idea that if enough people in a population are vaccinated or otherwise immune, the disease the vaccine prevents would be too rare to infect much of those not vaccinated- the vaccinated herd protects the unvaccinated group.
When the protected group gets below a certain amount, the protection is no longer sufficient for the unprotected to be relatively safe. https://www.ovg.ox.ac.uk/news/herd-i...w-does-it-work
The unvaccinated do not have protection themselves but rely on others being protected. The immunity can come either from being vaccinated or getting the disease yourself.
Herd immunity does not mean no body can get sick. Outbreaks can still happen among those without immunity.
The term actually is from 1923 in a paper written by W. W. C. Topley and G. S. Wilson. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2167341/
Last edited by Zippyjuan; 01-07-2019 at 06:46 PM.
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