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Thread: Saudi Arabia arrests princes, ministers in sweeping purge

  1. #31
    $800 Billion In Confiscated Assets

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-11-08/real-motive-behind-saudi-purge-emerges-800-billion-confiscated-assets
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

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  3. #32
    Oil Tycoons Make Billions In Saudi Purge

    https://oilprice.com/Geopolitics/International/Oil-Tycoons-Make-Billions-In-Saudi-Purge.html
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  5. #33
    It seems the crown prince is far from finished, as news has emerged that one of the Arab world’s leading broadcasters, MBC, has been put under government control. Part of its management was removed and the owner detained. News is also emerging that even the former Saudi Minister of Oil Ali Al Naimi, Saudi Arabia’s media face for decades, has been forcibly confined to his quarters.

    Other sources state that a travel ban has been imposed for Saudi officials, including some figures within Saudi Aramco. The latter have been informed that travel requests are currently on hold.

    Regarding the Saudi royals, most princes and princesses are currently prohibited to travel, except with the permission of King Salman. Foreign money transfer also has currently been limited to $50,000 per month, with a two-month limit. Security sources indicate that Saudi princes in Tabuk, Eastern Province and Mecca have been put under house arrest. At the same time, Saudi special forces have moved to surround the residencies of Prince Mishal bin AbdulAziz, Prince AbdulAziz bin Fahd and Prince Khalid bin Sultan.
    These developments are going further than the original anti-corruption crackdown. The already long-foreseen power struggle to take the Saudi throne seems to be entering its second phase. Crown Prince bin Salman seems—supported by signs of support coming from Washington, Moscow and even Arab neighbors—to take the chance to overwhelm his local opponents by shockwave tactics. Some indicate that they expect a possible change of guard at the top in the next couple of days.
    Each day’s developments grow more significant. MBS was able to increase his own position dramatically this weekend, and continues to remove remaining opposition by the dozen.

    More at: https://oilprice.com/Geopolitics/Int...-Kingpins.html
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #34
    Saudi Arabia said Thursday that it had detained more than 200 people as part of an expanding “anti-corruption” campaign that has led to the arrests at least 11 princes and some of the country’s wealthiest and most prominent business tycoons.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...=.7064c978b005
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #35

  8. #36
    Saudi King May Relinquish Throne To Crown Prince Within 48 Hours

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-11-09/saudi-king-may-relinquish-throne-crown-prince-within-48-hours-reports
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #37
    Saudi Billionaires Scramble To Move Cash Offshore, Escape Asset Freeze

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-11-09/saudi-billionaires-scramble-move-cash-offshore-escape-asset-freeze
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  10. #38
    Saudi authorities froze former Crown Prince Mohammed bin Nayef's bank accounts as part of the ongoing anti-corruption crackdown, Wall Street Journal reported Nov. 8.

    https://worldview.stratfor.com/situa...-bank-accounts
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Saudi Billionaires Scramble To Move Cash Offshore, Escape Asset Freeze

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-11-09/saudi-billionaires-scramble-move-cash-offshore-escape-asset-freeze
    Big boom in tech stocks expected - http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=516596

  12. #40
    Billionaire With Deep Investments in Ethiopia Arrested in Saudi Anti-corruption Sweep

    https://www.voanews.com/amp/saudi-corrution-probe-mohammed-hussein-al-amoudi/4108025.html
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  14. #41
    Dubai gets sucked into Saudi corruption turmoil

    http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/09/news/economy/dubai-shares-saudi/index.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&u tm_campaign=Feed%253A+rss%252Fmoney_latest+(CNNMon ey%253A+Latest+News)
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  15. #42
    Saudi "Deep State" Prince Bandar Bin Sultan Among Those Arrested In Purge

    According to a new report by Middle East Eye, Prince Bandar bin Sultan - Saudi Arabia's most famous arms dealer, longtime former ambassador to the US, and recent head of Saudi intelligence - was among those detained as part of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman's (MBS) so-called "corruption purge" that started with the initial arrests of up to a dozen princes and other top officials last weekend.
    If confirmed, the arrest and detention of Bandar would constitute the most significant and high profile figure caught up in the purge - even above that of high profile billionaire investor Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal - given Bandar's closeness to multiple US administrations and involvement in events ranging from Reagan's Nicaraguan Contra program (including direct involvement in the Iran-Contra scandal), to making the case for the Iraq War as a trusted friend of Bush and Cheney, to directing US-Saudi covert operations overseeing the arming of jihadists in Syria.

    More at: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-1...d-purge-report
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #43
    Middle East Eye issued the report based on multiple contacts "inside the royal court" and indicates further that the scale of MBS' aggressive crackdown is much larger than previously reported, and even involves the torture of "senior figures" among those detained:
    Some senior figures detained in last Saturday's purge in Saudi Arabia were beaten and tortured so badly during their arrest or subsequent interrogations that they required hospital treatment, Middle East Eye can reveal. People inside the royal court also told MEE that the scale of the crackdown, which has brought new arrests each day, is much bigger than Saudi authorities have admitted, with more than 500 people detained and double that number questioned.



    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-1...d-purge-report
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by AZJoe View Post
    Misadventures of the Clown Prince MBS:

    It is becoming more difficult to hide the mess the Saudi clown prince Mohammad bin Salman creates. ...

    The clown prince of Saudi Barbaria practically abducted the Prime Minister of Lebanon, blackmailed him to resign and holds him since under house arrest. This is an unprecedented attack on the sovereignty of Lebanon and all other countries. Yet the U.S. and some European leaders cowardly pretend that Saad Hariri is free to go ...

    Hariri ... is as free to leave his current residence as Julian Assange in free to leave the Ecuadorian embassy in London. ...

    It is obvious that Hariri did not travel to Saudi Arabia last Saturday with the intent to resign from his job:
    Hariri had scheduled meetings in Beirut on the following Monday – with the IMF, the World Bank and a series of discussions on water quality improvement; not exactly the action of a man who planned to resign his premiership. ...

    The unofficial version of Hariri's meeting with the U.S. and French ambassador is diverging from the one above:
    Mr. Hariri, a dual citizen of Lebanon and Saudi Arabia, met the ambassadors of Britain and the European Union and the chargé d’affaires from the American Embassy on Wednesday and Thursday at his Riyadh residence. Other Western diplomats, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said that those envoys, too, came away with the impression that he could not speak freely.

    Even the State Department spokesperson lets slip that Harairi is not free to go:
    "We have seen him. In terms of the conditions of him being held or the conversations between Saudi Arabia and Prime Minister Hariri, I would have to refer you to the government of Saudi Arabia and also to Mr Hariri's office."

    Hariri's own political party in Lebanon has united with its enemy Hizbullah and the Christian President Aoun in a call for Hariri to come back and explain himself to the Lebanese people:
    “The return of the head of the Lebanese government, the national leader and the head of al-Mustaqbal Movement Saad Hariri is necessary to restore respect for Lebanon's balance at home and abroad, in the framework of full respect for the Lebanese legitimacy represented in the Constitution and the Taef Accord and in respecting the Arab and international legitimacies,” said Mustaqbal in a statement issued after an emergency meeting for its parliamentary bloc and political bureau.

    The Saudis have told their citizens in Lebanon to leave the country. Its allies Kuwait, UAE and Bahrain have followed suit. ...

    Without the 160,000 Lebanese book keepers and managers the Saudi economy would probably collapse.

    The similarities with the idiotic Saudi campaign against Qatar is obvious. ...

    The French and other countries' cowardliness towards the clown prince extends to the starving of Yemen. UN flights with immediately needed medical supplies and food have been blocked by Saudi authorities. The ports for food shipment are blockaded. UN officials warn of an imminent massive famine and are begging everyone to intervene. But nothing has been heard from Macron or any other "western" politician.

    Meanwhile the Saudi tyrant's purge ... continues. Some 500 people have been arrested ...

    One important aspect of the purge is the open robbery that is part of it. ... The Wall Street Journal reports that the people around MbS expect to steal up to $800 billion in assets from the ultra rich businessmen and princes they have now under their control. ...

    Who will be willing to invest even a penny in Saudi Arabia after such a shakedown? There is no rule of law and there are no reliable courts. ...

    Trump had voiced full support for the Saudi moves. ... Secretary of State Tillerson is finally rowing back Trump's grandstanding. ...

    On Lebanon Tillerson warns Israel of any intervention. ... He does not recognize the compelled "resignation" ...

    The two steps on Lebanon and on the internal purge seem too impulsive to be part of a greater plan. They begin to look like the other "adventures" MbS started in Qatar and Yemen. Aimless campaigns ... In all these cases the long term damage to Saudi Arabia will be huge.

    Any day now the clown prince will become king of Saudi Arabia. ... his country is unlikely to survive another five years of such impulsive and tyrannic behavior. ...

    As another example of MbS' impulsiveness re-consider this episode. In 2016 Salman spontaneously bought a used motor-barge for $550 million ... The boat had been constructed since 2007 and launched in 2011. Its price then was $330 million (€300m) ... After five years of use its the fair value was probably two-third of the original price. MbS paid 250% of the actual value because he wanted the boat right then and there and because he could. A thirty year old, who has never worked to make money, wasted $330 million on an impulse buy. Money that would rightfully belong to the people of the Arab peninsula. ...
    ...
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #45
    Blowback: Wealthy Saudis and others moving their money and assets out of Saudi Arabia

    "Wealthy Saudis are moving assets out of the region ... Saudi billionaires and millionaires are selling investments in neighboring Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) countries and turning them into cash or liquid holdings overseas, the people said. They spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter. In Saudi Arabia, some are in talks with banks and asset managers to move money outside the country, ...

    “There is no doubt that many offshore investors are reassessing their view of the Gulf as a stable and predictable place to do business,” said Philippe Dauba-Pantanacce, a London-based senior economist and geopolitical strategist at Standard Chartered Bank. ...

    The arrests have prompted investors from within the region to sell. The sell-off across the GCC has cost stocks $17.6 billion as of Wednesday, dragging the collective market capitalisation for bourses in the region to $900 billion, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. Gulf investors sold a net $92.5 million of Dubai stocks on Tuesday, the most since February. ...
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Dr. Ron Paul. "Stand up for what you believe in, even if you are standing alone." - Sophie Magdalena Scholl
    "War is the health of the State." - Randolph Bourne "Freedom is the answer. ... Now, what's the question?" - Ernie Hancock.

  19. #46
    Meanwhile, three or four other Saudi princes were reportedly kidnapped from Europe and sent home, leading to rumors that Saudi’s new ally, Israel, was involved.

    https://www.globalresearch.ca/what-c...arabia/5617923
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  20. #47
    The Crown Prince is an interesting character. He appears to represent both great opportunities (economic liberalization) and great risks (democratization). I'm reminded of some of the reforming monarchs of Europe in the 18th and 19th centuries, or their heirs (Crown Prince Rudolf, Menger's student, comes to mind). I hope that these recent actions are only an attempt to domesticate the extended royal family and not a precursor to a constitutionalizing of the monarchy. If there were any liberal economists remaining in the West, it would be an opportune time for them to get on a plane and offer advice, ala Pinochet.

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    The Crown Prince is an interesting character. He appears to represent both great opportunities (economic liberalization) and great risks (democratization). I'm reminded of some of the reforming monarchs of Europe in the 18th and 19th centuries, or their heirs (Crown Prince Rudolf, Menger's student, comes to mind). I hope that these recent actions are only an attempt to domesticate the extended royal family and not a precursor to a constitutionalizing of the monarchy. If there were any liberal economists remaining in the West, it would be an opportune time for them to get on a plane and offer advice, ala Pinochet.
    He is a bloodthirsty maniac, and I doubt he has any interest in libertarian economics.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    He is a bloodthirsty maniac, and I doubt he has any interest in libertarian economics.
    He's been a strong supporter of privatizing state-owned enterprises, esp. the oil companies (i.e. most of the Saudi economy).

    I imagine he's been looking over the border at Dubai.

    ...but I'm certainly not saying that the man is a libertarian.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    He's been a strong supporter of privatizing state-owned enterprises, esp. the oil companies (i.e. most of the Saudi economy).

    I'm certainly not saying that the man is a libertarian.

    I imagine he's been looking over the border at Dubai.
    All their recent proposals from the Aramco IPO to Neom are just extra large con-jobs trying to swindle as much money as they can before they go bankrupt, this "corruption purge" is another blatant money grab.

    I'm starting to believe the rumors that they will soon run out of oil in addition to their oil price problem and their welfare/warfare issues.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    All their recent proposals from the Aramco IPO to Neom are just extra large con-jobs trying to swindle as much money as they can before they go bankrupt, this "corruption purge" is another blatant money grab.
    That's a theory.

    Another is that the same material self-interest which you're condemning is driving bin Salman to finally liberalize.

    ...because he realized that it's better to rule this



    ...than this


  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    That's a theory.

    Another is that the same material self-interest which you're condemning is driving bin Salman to finally liberalize.

    ...because he realized that it's better to rule this



    ...than this

    If that was true he wouldn't be wasting untold wealth on wars.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    If that was true he wouldn't be wasting untold wealth on wars.
    That claim relies on two assumptions, neither of which is warranted:

    1) Salman is completely rational such that he only acts in a way that optimally advances his own goals

    2) He doesn't have a rational (this is not to say moral) basis for his foreign policy, from a selfish perspective

    It's perfectly possible for a state to liberalize internally and warmonger externally (rationally or otherwise, from its own perspective), or the reverse. And I'll now just repeat for emphasis that I'm not saying Salman is a libertarian or even well-intended. As I never tire of saying to you or anyone else who will listen, morality/ideas/ideology have very little to do with political outcomes, and greed or other unsavory motives don't always lead to bad results (queue Gekko, or Smith).
    Last edited by r3volution 3.0; 11-15-2017 at 10:42 PM.

  28. #54

  29. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    I see another con-job where you see green shoots of liberalization.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  30. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I see another con-job where you see green shoots of liberalization.
    Evidently..

    I think you have an overly moralistic view of the world my friend.

    Very few people are either good or evil; most are just greedy.



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  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Evidently..

    I think you have an overly moralistic view of the world my friend.

    Very few people are either good or evil; most are just greedy.
    Morality is not the difference in our views, I question the trustworthiness of the Saudis and I would do so even in the absence of morality, in a game for instance.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Morality is not the difference in our views, I question the trustworthiness of the Saudis and I would do so even in the absence of morality, in a game for instance.
    You mean that you question whether the reform described in the article is actually happening?

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    You mean that you question whether the reform described in the article is actually happening?
    I question how long it will be before the Saudis nationalize any businesses that are set up under the program.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I question how long it will be before the Saudis nationalize any businesses that are set up under the program.
    That could be the (very short-sighted) plan, though I doubt it.

    We'll see.

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