Justin Amash is the anti-Ron Paul

[kahless]

He’s teaching libertarians how to lose
https://spectator.us/justin-amash-anti-ron-paul/

What Ron Paul did was to counteract neoconservatism in the Republican party with libertarianism and populism. Populism proved to be more potent, but libertarianism itself contributed important elements to populism, including an articulate anti-interventionist foreign policy and a sense of class warfare as about power, not just wealth. Amash was never comfortable with populism, but libertarianism without it has no market at all. The Washington Post and the NeverTrump neocons share Amash’s animosity toward Trump and the populist right, but they share even fewer of his professed principles than Trump does. Ron Paul won despite losing; Amash teaches libertarians simply how to lose by losing.

[pcosmar]

He’s teaching libertarians how to lose

Bull$#@!..

Read Ron Paul's Letter of Resignation..
because of the Reagan years.

there is nothing Republican about the Republican Party..

They just Elected a Lifetime Democrat who Bought the "R" Ticket on a whim.

seriously

unbunch your panties

[tfurrh]

Read Ron Paul's Letter of Resignation..
because of the Reagan years.

there is nothing Republican about the Republican Party..

That's exactly what I was thinking. Here's a portion of Ron's resignation letter:

I want to totally disassociate myself from the policies that have given us unprecedented deficits, massive monetary inflation, indiscriminate military spending, an irrational and unconstitutional foreign policy, zooming foreign aid, the exaltation of international banking, and the attack on our personal liberties and privacy.

After years of trying to work through the Republican Party both in and out of government, I have reluctantly concluded that my efforts must be carried on outside the Republican Party. Republicans know that the Democratic agenda is dangerous to our political and economic health. Yet, in the past six years Republicans have expanded its worst aspects and called them our own. The Republican Party has not reduced the size of government. It has become big government's best friend.

If Ronald Reagan couldn't or wouldn't balance the budget, which Republican leader on the horizon can we possibly expect to do so? There is no credibility left for the Republican Party as a force to reduce the size of government. That is the message of the Reagan years.

I conclude that one must look to other avenues if a successful effort is ever to be achieved in reversing America's direction.

I therefore resign my membership in the Republican Party and enclose my membership card.

[jkr]

Bull$#@!..

Read Ron Paul's Letter of Resignation..
because of the Reagan years.

there is nothing Republican about the Republican Party..

They just Elected a Lifetime Democrat who Bought the "R" Ticket on a whim.

seriously

unbunch your panties

he speaks sooth...

[nobody's_hero]

Bull$#@!..

Read Ron Paul's Letter of Resignation..
because of the Reagan years.

there is nothing Republican about the Republican Party..

They just Elected a Lifetime Democrat who Bought the "R" Ticket on a whim.

seriously

unbunch your panties

That's exactly what I was thinking. Here's a portion of Ron's resignation letter:

I'm sure you're not intentionally trying to be omissive, but you just quoted the 1987 resignation letter.

You know he ran again as a Republican for president in 2008? Then again in 2012? At some point he also gave advice on running with the party that you think will give you the best chance to win, that it really didn't matter which party you run in.

Now, does that mean Ron believes that the Republican leadership/establishment has the best interests of the party's platform at heart? I would wager to say with what he's seen and suffered, absolutely not.

But clearly he saw some value in reaching out to a pool of voters that generally (meaning not 100%, but not 0% either) agree with him on limiting the size and scope of government.

I have one plea to the members of this forum: that we start putting value in being strategic as we are philosophic, heck, even a 45% strategic/55% philosophic split. Some of us would like liberty in our own lifetimes, or at the very least, some progress along the path that our children might pick up the torch and press on with. Sure, it's great to be right all the time, but even better to be right and have some semblance of a plan to win.

Edit: Was trying to find out where I heard that, it wasn't Ron Paul but one of his colleagues that he was quoting 'run in the party where you think you can win':

[tfurrh]

I'm sure you're not intentionally trying to be omissive, but you just quoted the 1987 resignation letter.

You know he ran again as a Republican in 2008? Then again in 2012? At some point he also gave advice on running with the party that you think will give you the best chance to win, that it really didn't matter which party you run in.

Now, does that mean he believes that the Republican leadership/establishment has the best interests of the party's platform at heart? I would wager to say with what he's seen and suffered, absolutely not.

But clearly he saw some value in reaching out to a pool of voters that generally (meaning not 100%, but not 0% either) agree with him on limiting the size and scope of government.

I didn't know that....thank you. Now I truly see that Amash is the Anti Ron Paul Christ.

[juleswin]

He’s teaching libertarians how to lose
https://spectator.us/justin-amash-anti-ron-paul/

I think populism is what Amash was lacking. Other than being wrong, the impeachment of Trump was not popular. So here comes Justin Amash promoting this very unpopular stance and him believing that something good would have come from it. I was still sort of a liberal during the 2008 campaign and listening to Ron Paul mix his libertarian policies with populist ones is what sold me to his message. Amash just picked the worst issue to make a stance on and it seems like he is going to pay dearly for it.

[nobody's_hero]

I didn't know that....thank you. Now I truly see that Amash is the Anti Ron Paul Christ.

To be fair, he's going overboard with the sub-title. I could point out a critical flaw but it would piss off a lot of (L)ibertarians here, especially since the Libertarian party was around before Amash started any teaching lessons.

[Cleaner44]

After Ron Paul quit the Republican party in 1985, he came back to it years later. When he returned to Congress as a Republican in 1996, it was because he saw that the best path forward was through the GOP and not the Libertarian party.

In 2007 Dr. Paul and his campaign asked libertarians like myself to join the GOP. While I was reluctant to do this, I realized he was older and wiser and it made sense.

I think it is quite obvious that the Libertarian party will not be able to compete with the Republican and Democrat parties.

I also think that in the last 12 years, we have seen the GOP move away from the neocon persuasion and more toward libertarian positions.

As flawed as the GOP is, it is the best path forward. My view is that we should continue the effort that was started in 2007 and do our best to promote liberty through the GOP. That makes a ton more sense that aligning with the Democratic Socialist party. There is no other viable choice.

Amash has lost his way and I wish him well in his future endeavors. He apparently still needs to learn what Ron Paul did from 1985 to 1995.

[devil21]

At this rate, Justin will be a political household name. I hope he keeps it up. I definitely sense a larger plan here. What it is remains to be seen but name recognition is 75% of electoral politics and he's getting that in spades, with the help of the Trumpkins.

[nikcers]

At this rate, Justin will be a political household name. I hope he keeps it up. I definitely sense a larger plan here. What it is remains to be seen but name recognition is 75% of electoral politics and he's getting that in spades, with the help of the Trumpkins.

The anti establishment politician is always going to get press, the left media and Bill Kristol have given him more press and elevation than all of the Trump people combined.

[pcosmar]

To be fair, he's going overboard with the sub-title. I could point out a critical flaw but it would piss off a lot of (L)ibertarians here, especially since the Libertarian party was around before Amash started any teaching lessons.

I am not a Party Flaggot.

I could care less at this point.. The Republican Party and VOTERS elected a lifelong Democrat.. Who initially jokeed about the idea and then went FULL Clown and Bought the Republican Election..

and I met several Oregon Democrats that were voting FOR him. (Could not stand Hillary)

Both McCain and Hillary are behind the growth or the "alt -right',, and even imported Ukrainian Nazis to Train (proud skinheads and others)

so get off the partisan and divisive bull$#@! you are being fed by Q

[nikcers]

I am not a Party Flaggot.

I could care less at this point.. The Republican Party and VOTERS elected a lifelong Democrat.. Who initially jokeed about the idea and then went FULL Clown and Bought the Republican Election..

and I met several Oregon Democrats that were voting FOR him. (Could not stand Hillary)

Both McCain and Hillary are behind the growth or the "alt -right',, and even imported Ukrainian Nazis to Train (proud skinheads and others)

so get off the partisan and divisive bull$#@! you are being fed by Q

Woke politics and woke capitalism and the me2 movement means that they can get you to do whatever they want. They are attacking us from all angles and you cant take a position without it being one of theirs. The only true independent people are the ones who can't be bought, and they are hated by all sides of this firing squad.

[nobody's_hero]

I am not a Party Flaggot.

I could care less at this point.. The Republican Party and VOTERS elected a lifelong Democrat.. Who initially jokeed about the idea and then went FULL Clown and Bought the Republican Election..

and I met several Oregon Democrats that were voting FOR him. (Could not stand Hillary)

Both McCain and Hillary are behind the growth or the "alt -right',, and even imported Ukrainian Nazis to Train (proud skinheads and others)

so get off the partisan and divisive bull$#@! you are being fed by Q

Can you prove to me that the libertarians have a plan to actually win? Been around since 1971 and they're just waiting for the right moment to win an election, perhaps?

I'm not sorry what I say stings your senses. I'm glad it irritates; I just wish that anger could be harnessed and put towards some sort of—I don't know—motivation. You guys seem to think there's some sort of easy button to press and everyone just gets pissed off at the world, joins your cause, and you start slamming political opponents to the side as you blaze a trail to victory. Well, give me about a minute or so to microwave the popcorn.

It took Ron Paul from 1987 to 1996 to realize that 3rd parties were a dead-end. Most of us have been on these forums for at least that long. For those who can put down emotion and pick up reasoning skills, realize that he saved us a lot of time and frustration by coming to that conclusion. I know it's easy to get discouraged and want to throw in the towel at the first sign of trouble, but continuing to splinter off into smaller and smaller politically incompetent groups is ABSOLUTELY NOT going to get you any changes, politically.

[kahless]

Bull$#@!..

Read Ron Paul's Letter of Resignation..
because of the Reagan years.

there is nothing Republican about the Republican Party..

They just Elected a Lifetime Democrat who Bought the "R" Ticket on a whim.

seriously

unbunch your panties

fyi - "He’s teaching libertarians how to lose", was the subtitle from the article, not my quote. No difference though since I agree with the author. I would add what is implied that you cannot change the country out of office or from a fringe out of power party. Ron understood this and worked with the party, Rand understands this as well.

[tfurrh]

It took Ron Paul from 1987 to 1996 to realize that 3rd parties were a dead-end.

And we can't let Amash have time to figure it out without burning him to a crisp so that he never wants to return?

It's a good thing all of us conservatives weren't on Twitter back in the 80s to call RP a total loser.

[pcosmar]

Can you prove to me that the libertarians have a plan to actually win?

"win"what exactly??

and I have no idea what a political party is thinking. (can a "party" think?).. I do NOT Belong to any Political Parties..

I prefer a better variety of drunks.

[tfurrh]

I have one plea to the members of this forum: that we start putting value in being strategic as we are philosophic, heck, even a 45% strategic/55% philosophic split. Some of us would like liberty in our own lifetimes, or at the very least, some progress along the path that our children might pick up the torch and press on with. Sure, it's great to be right all the time, but even better to be right and have some semblance of a plan to win.

Ex 1. Trump says the govt is shut down until I get wall in budget. A month later Trump approves budget with no wall funds.

Ex 2. Trump says I'm leaving Syria asap. Retracts/qualifies statement, and 6 months later still in Syria

Ex. 3 Trump campaigns on Afgh/Iraq being mistakes. Appoints John Bolton...

I could go on, but these are examples of Trump's 45% pragmatism 55% idealism, and the majority of everyone here (maybe not Swordsmyth) has been pissed when he's done it.

Ex 4. Iran downs drone, Trump does not retaliate with force even though it was advised.

Trump possibly went 100% idealism with that. Everyone loved it.

[pcosmar]

Rand understands this as well.

Rand likes Drones for Police,, and Million Dollar Hoaxes for Israel.

I could care less what he thinks. he lost my confidence years ago.

[nikcers]

Rand likes Drones for Police,, and Million Dollar Hoaxes for Israel.

I could care less what he thinks. he lost my confidence years ago.

You don't have to care if you don't want to, just know that he cares. He could make a lot better money and have less people shooting at him and breaking his ribs if he wasn't trying to protect your rights.

[pcosmar]

You don't have to care if you don't want to, just know that he cares. He could make a lot better money and have less people shooting at him and breaking his ribs if he wasn't trying to protect your rights.

PHUCK YOU

He has done nothing to secure or RETURN my Rights.

and I could care less how much "money" he makes... I have more Respect for an Honest Whore.
She at least Earns it.

[nikcers]

PHUCK YOU

He has done nothing to secure or RETURN my Rights.

and I could care less how much "money" he makes... I have more Respect for an Honest Whore.
She at least Earns it.

No one person can return your rights, it takes the power of ideas and majority to take anything back.

[nobody's_hero]

PHUCK YOU

He has done nothing to secure or RETURN my Rights.

and I could care less how much "money" he makes... I have more Respect for an Honest Whore.
She at least Earns it.

I believe I haven't touched the neg rep button in years.

*blows the dust off*

Click.

[nikcers]

I believe I haven't touched the neg rep button in years.

*blows the dust off*

Click.

In defensee of Pc, the strategy of nonviolent direct action when you actually think about it is completely insane.

[nobody's_hero]

In defensee of Pc, the strategy of nonviolent direct action when you actually think about is completely insane.

His strategy is one of passive-aggressive inaction and b*tching about everything, which when you actually think about it is completely useless.

There's only two ways we're getting freedom back in this country. I seriously doubt that if anyone can't be bothered to at least attempt the one we're trying now, then there's no way in hell they're gonna be willing to try the second.

[nikcers]

His strategy is one of passive-aggressive inaction and b*tching about everything, which when you actually think about it is completely useless.

I was talking about Rand. LOL. You think sane people do stuff that gets them shot at and their ribs broken?

[nobody's_hero]

I was talking about Rand. LOL. You think sane people do stuff that gets them shot at and their ribs broken?

I know, but if you think Rand was insane for that, then there is no word left to describe the guy who attacked him. Then again sanity is a completely subjective term these days.

[fcreature]

PHUCK YOU

He has done nothing to secure or RETURN my Rights.

and I could care less how much "money" he makes... I have more Respect for an Honest Whore.
She at least Earns it.

I wonder if the remaining 48,731 posts you've made over the years are of equally stellar value as this one.

[nikcers]

I know, but if you think Rand was insane for that, then there is no word left to describe the guy who attacked him. Then again sanity is a completely subjective term these days.

The guy that attacked him was being controlled. They try to control us all because they get off on it.

[nikcers]

Lots of people like to be controlled, the thought of being in control of your own destiny is frightening. You are only free when you give up all hope.