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Thread: "Antiracists" and "far-right" youths battle in Moscow

  1. #1

    "Antiracists" and "far-right" youths battle in Moscow

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091118/..._russia_attack

    MOSCOW – A simmering confrontation between far-right youths and ant-racist activists has erupted into Moscow's streets after the fatal shooting of an anti-racist activist known as the Bonebreaker.

    The violence stems from deep animus between two aggressive camps with starkly different visions of Russia's future — neo-Nazi skinheads who rank in the tens of thousands and militant anti-racist groups that call themselves Antifa, short for anti-fascist.

    Former punk rocker Ivan Khutorskoi, 26, provided security for meetings of antifascists. He also was known for organizing underground bare-knuckle boxing matches among them, and taking part in violent attacks on ultranationalists.

    Khutorskoi was gunned down in his apartment building on the city's outskirts Monday night. A day later, dozens of masked men pelted the headquarters of the pro-Kremlin youth group Young Russia with stones, trash and steel rods, Young Russia's leader said.

    Kremlin critics say Russia's leadership created Young Russia and similar youth organizations to keep its political opponents in check and provide support, and sometimes muscle, on the streets. Anti-racist groups claim they have close ties with the ultranationalists they call fascists or Nazis.

    Nobody was hurt in the attack late Tuesday on the office of Young Russia. But its message, delivered first with projectiles and then over the Internet, seemed clear.

    "If no one but us tries to stop Nazis and those who provide cover for them, we will act by all means necessary," blogger Anarcho Punk wrote Wednesday. Other anti-racist bloggers said the attack was retaliation for what they claimed were the group's links to Russian neo-Nazis. They "dedicated" the assault to their leader, Khutorskoi — an outsized figure and a role model among antifascists, who say he had survived three previous assassination attempts. He was shot twice in the back of the head near the door to his apartment on Moscow's eastern outskirts, police said.
    This type of thing happens over and over again throughout recent human history. I bet both sides have connections to the Russian government.
    Preventive war was an invention of Hitler. Frankly,I would not even listen to anyone seriously that talked about such a thing. ~ General Dwight D Eisenhower
    Those who know do not talk. Those who talk do not know. -Lao Tzu



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  3. #2
    socialists vs. fascists.

    Yawn.

    Where are the libertarians?

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Epic View Post
    socialists vs. fascists.

    Yawn.

    Where are the libertarians?
    It's Russia... they're probably dead for writing critical things about Putin, or emigrated.
    Preventive war was an invention of Hitler. Frankly,I would not even listen to anyone seriously that talked about such a thing. ~ General Dwight D Eisenhower
    Those who know do not talk. Those who talk do not know. -Lao Tzu

  5. #4
    to go a little off of the topic. the russian media celebratizes Putin like we do our politicians

    YouTube - Putin joins hip-hop Battle for Respect
    Preventive war was an invention of Hitler. Frankly,I would not even listen to anyone seriously that talked about such a thing. ~ General Dwight D Eisenhower
    Those who know do not talk. Those who talk do not know. -Lao Tzu

  6. #5
    Putin looks so out of his element there.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by JeNNiF00F00 View Post
    Putin looks so out of his element there.
    Kind of like that creepy, old guy hanging out at the party...

    ...who's in the KGB

    Seriously, though. I don't think Orwell could have predicted the tabloidesque celebrity worship... especially now that they're gearing this type of thing to politicians as a new form of propaganda. (obama, palin, putin, ufo-believing first lady of japan)
    Preventive war was an invention of Hitler. Frankly,I would not even listen to anyone seriously that talked about such a thing. ~ General Dwight D Eisenhower
    Those who know do not talk. Those who talk do not know. -Lao Tzu

  8. #7
    It is a replay of Germany in the 1920s.
    Out of every one hundred men they send us, ten should not even be here. Eighty will do nothing but serve as targets for the enemy. Nine are real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, upon them depends our success in battle. But one, ah the one, he is a real warrior, and he will bring the others back from battle alive.

    Duty is the most sublime word in the English language. Do your duty in all things. You can not do more than your duty. You should never wish to do less than your duty.

  9. #8
    I saw a leader of the youth anti-kremlin movement speak the other day. She was not optimistic about the future of freedom in Russia.



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  11. #9
    What happens when reality seems unreal?

    Militant "anti-racists" stirred by the murder of someone called The Bonebreaker? Seriously? A blogger called "Anarcho Punk" is starting $#@! on the Internet?

    Those ultra-anti-neo-motherfuckers and their online punk band are going to start a revolution.

  12. #10
    The "anti-racists" have grown pretty strong in the U.S. too over the last decade or so. Fortunately, many are starting to figure it out for the fraud that it is.

    You don't fight hate by perpetuating it...

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Epic View Post
    socialists vs. fascists.

    Yawn.
    You mean socialists versus socialists arguing over the best way to go about creating a one world socialist government?

  14. #12
    At this point, I wouldn't mind seeing the "far right" gain some headway in Russia. I think they would do more to strip down the remnants of the Soviet system than Russian leaders to date have. And they might make ourselves and NATO think twice about more interventions in the Balkans if they are willing to put their money where their mouth is in defense of their historical ally, Serbia.

    We really can't expect a libertarian miracle in country such as Russia, which has no history of any such thing. Hell, by Russian standards, even Putin is progress. He's a fairly benevolent dictator compared to others like the Tsars and Stalin. The closest Russia ever came to anything approaching our standard of freedom was in the early stages of the revolution--the territory between Constitutional monarchy and the Provisional Government of Kerensky.

    The best you can do with Russia is hope for the best and stay out of their backyard when a more nationalist movement does come to power. They are going to be out for some revenge against nations like Georgia that have been propped up by NATO and the EU.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Epic View Post
    Where are the libertarians?
    libertarians.ru - Russian Libertarian Party
    libertarium.ru - another good site in russian
    It is a replay of Germany in the 1920s.
    I don't think so unlike germany we will have oil for 30-40 years and while zionists control our oil industry it's good for them to keep this country more or less stable.

  16. #14
    The violence stems from deep animus between two aggressive camps with starkly different visions of Russia's future — neo-Nazi skinheads who rank in the tens of thousands and militant anti-racist groups that call themselves Antifa, short for anti-fascist.

    'Antifa' came from Russia, LOL
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    'Antifa' came from Russia, LOL
    Or Soros just started them there first.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    'Antifa' came from Russia, LOL
    Because it couldn't have been a CIA operation that worked so well the Agency brought it home and used it on us.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Because it couldn't have been a CIA operation that worked so well the Agency brought it home and used it on us.
    How does that contradict what I said? Either way it still started in Russia. It could have been Soros, the CIA or some combination.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    How does that contradict what I said?
    LOL

    And I suppose all the communist groups the KGB used to dream up in Moscow and set up here were homegrown U.S.A. originals, and couldn't possibly be considered to have originated in the Soviet Union.

    You want to obfuscate like a lawyer so bad. And that's how you do it. So bad.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.

  22. #19
    Looks like the whole world is about to blow.

    Thank God. The status quo is threadbare.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    Looks like the whole world is about to blow.

    Thank God. The status quo is threadbare.
    This thread is old, this is not happening in Russia right now.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    LOL

    And I suppose all the communist groups the KGB used to dream up in Moscow and set up here were homegrown U.S.A. originals, and couldn't possibly be considered to have originated in the Soviet Union.

    You want to obfuscate like a lawyer so bad. And that's how you do it. So bad.
    I'm not obfuscating at all. Antifa started in Russia, apparently. I didn't say who was responsible for starting it, I just named a geographic location because that flips the left's narrative about Trump and Russia on it's head a bit.

    Your sole job seems to be to obfuscate my posts and try and prove them wrong for some reason.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    I'm not obfuscating at all. Antifa started in Russia, apparently. I didn't say who was responsible for starting it, I just named a geographic location because that flips the left's narrative about Trump and Russia on it's head a bit.

    Your sole job seems to be to obfuscate my posts and try and prove them wrong for some reason.
    You admit to ignoring whatever facts or conventional use of language is inconvenient to your hobby of saying anything that might confound leftists, and which might seem to defend Trump from all criticism deserved or not, and I'm the one engaging in obfuscation?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only want the freedoms that will undermine the nation and lead to the destruction of liberty.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You admit to ignoring whatever facts or conventional use of language is inconvenient to your hobby of saying anything that might confound leftists, and which might seem to defend Trump from all criticism deserved or not, and I'm the one engaging in obfuscation?
    Uh, dude, under the leftists narrative the US and George Soros are not participating in some grand conspiracy to start anti-fascist anti-racist movements for the benefit of the global elite.. You know why??? Because that means THEY would admitting to participating in some grand conspiracy to start anti-fascist anti-racist movements for the benefit of the global elite!!!

    All I did was say that Antifa started in Russia, a geographic location.. Leftists are obsessed with anything Russia, so to let them know the roots of their organization are in Russia is a little bit comical. Nothing wrong with that.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  27. #24
    Maybe Bernie Sanders sowed the seeds for Russian Antifa during his honeymoon trip there, in 1988?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only show up to attack Trump when he is wrong
    Make America the Land of the Free & the Home of the Brave again



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    This thread is old, this is not happening in Russia right now.
    And yet...
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.

  30. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    This thread is old, this is not happening in Russia right now.
    It happens all the time. There are some awesome brawl videos from Ukraine and Russia on live leak. Kind of a national past-time for some.

  31. #27
    Supposedly the Kremlin backs both sides (or has in the past) to make people unsure of what's actually going on

    https://youtu.be/-fny99f8amM?t=2h16m15s

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    And yet...



    There is nothing new under the sun.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by milgram View Post
    Supposedly the Kremlin backs both sides (or has in the past) to make people unsure of what's actually going on
    What do you think the Game-masters in the Fusion Centers are up to?
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  34. #30
    One can but wonder whether this more recent wave of insanity, including the "trans-<X>" phenomena, the out-of-nowhere rise of "Antifa", etc., is just another poke pursuant to massaging the wad of humanity in a new perceptual direction, or are we witnessing initiation of some end-game?.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.

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