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Thread: Even as Violent Crime Falls, Killing of Officers Rises

  1. #1

    Even as Violent Crime Falls, Killing of Officers Rises

    Even as Violent Crime Falls, Killing of Officers Rises
    By MICHAEL S. SCHMIDT and JOSEPH GOLDSTEIN
    Published: April 9, 2012

    WASHINGTON — As violent crime has decreased across the country, a disturbing trend has emerged: rising numbers of police officers are being killed.
    According to statistics compiled by the Federal Bureau of Investigation, 72 officers were killed by perpetrators in 2011, a 25 percent increase from the previous year and a 75 percent increase from 2008.

    The 2011 deaths were the first time that more officers were killed by suspects than car accidents, according to data compiled by the International Association of Chiefs of Police. The number was the highest in nearly two decades, excluding those who died in the Sept. 11 attacks in 2001 and the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995.

    While a majority of officers were killed in smaller cities, 13 were killed in cities of 250,000 or more. New York City lost two officers last year. On Sunday, four were wounded by a gunman in Brooklyn, bringing to eight the number of officers shot in the city since December.

    “We haven’t seen a period of this type of violence in a long time,” said Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly of the New York Police Department.

    While the F.B.I. and other law enforcement officials cannot fully explain the reasons for the rise in officer homicides, they are clear about the devastating consequences.

    “In this law enforcement job, when you pin this badge on and go out on calls, when you leave home, you ain’t got a promise that you will come back,” said Sheriff Ray Foster of Buchanan County, Va. Two of his deputies were killed in March 2011 and two wounded — one of them paralyzed — by a man with a high-powered rifle.

    “That was 80 percent of my day shift,” he said.

    After a spate of killings in early 2011, Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. asked federal authorities to work with local police departments to try to come up with solutions to the problem.

    The F.B.I., which has tracked officer deaths since 1937, paid for a study conducted by John Jay College that found that in many cases the officers were trying to arrest or stop a suspect who had previously been arrested for a violent crime.


    SNIP
    Let them keep thinking Ron Paul supporters are just a little army. Every military strategy manual in the world has examples of the bad things that happen to arrogant commanders of massive armies that underestimate the enemy. They all lose. We will win because the human heart, despite its detractors, is meant for truth and freedom.



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  3. #2
    Increase in attempted theft by government creates more interaction w/ the public?
    “One may come to the aid of another being unlawfully arrested, just as he may where one is being assaulted, molested, raped or kidnapped. Thus it is not an offense to liberate one from the unlawful custody of an officer, even though he may have submitted to such custody, without resistance.” (Adams v. State, 121 Ga. 16, 48 S.E. 910).

  4. #3
    Cops have killed more civilians than the reverse.

    Since violent crime is decreasing, it's not surprising that civilians would react with defensive force when their slave masters intrude on their property.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul
    Perhaps the most important lesson from Obamacare is that while liberty is lost incrementally, it cannot be regained incrementally. The federal leviathan continues its steady growth; sometimes boldly and sometimes quietly. Obamacare is just the latest example, but make no mistake: the statists are winning. So advocates of liberty must reject incremental approaches and fight boldly for bedrock principles.
    The epitome of libertarian populism

  5. #4
    No where does the article mention the percentage of increase in the sheer number of cops.

    Neither does it mention the change in police policy and tactics that could be a contributing factor.

    Setting forth the idea that the poor cops have it rough without looking at the whole picture is worse than slanted journalism.

    There's two sides to every coin..........

  6. #5

  7. #6
    The real issue is that the number killed is subject to statistical anomaly. Because we are dealing with a number of less than 100, jsut one more or less represents a remarkable percentage shift.
    Out of every one hundred men they send us, ten should not even be here. Eighty will do nothing but serve as targets for the enemy. Nine are real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, upon them depends our success in battle. But one, ah the one, he is a real warrior, and he will bring the others back from battle alive.

    Duty is the most sublime word in the English language. Do your duty in all things. You can not do more than your duty. You should never wish to do less than your duty.

  8. #7
    We had a local cop die here within the last year. He was responding to a call. Rushed into a house without backup. They named a road after him. His 3 daughters no longer have a dad. He was part of the special response team and I have wondered if his special training caused him to make a poor decision.
    Insanity should be defined as trusting the government to solve a problem they caused in the first place. Please do not go insane!

  9. #8
    Sure thing, and why local LEO's will be deploying tanks or "Military" equipment they have been given over the last year.

    All these LEO's need to do is follow the law, and maybe they wont themselves dead by armed citizens.

    Not everyone is a sheep for Govt.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    As violent crime has decreased across the country
    So can we at least agree that we need to slash the number of police officers? Violent crime is down and cop killing is up. It sounds to me like a failed policy. But I imagine you feel the opposite.. more police officers to protect police officers.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    <<<20 paragraphs of cop loving and soldier sniffing>>>
    Rarely does one see failure, so hard, in nature...




    The “War on Cops” That Wasn’t. And Still Isn’t.

    Saturday, April 7th, 2012

    http://www.theagitator.com/2012/04/0...nd-still-isnt/

    You might remember that about this time last year, media outlets, police groups, even Attorney General Eric Holder were up in arms over an alleged “war on cops” taking place all across the fruited plains. In April of last year, on-the-job officer deaths were up 20 percent from the same point in 2010. The media went nuts, pointing an accusatory finger at anti-government rhetoric, a “don’t tread on me” mentality, anti-cop Internet sites, and gun ownership.

    But some wise folks (ahem) didn’t buy into the hype. On-the-job cop deaths had been falling for 20 years. Those numbers couldn’t keep dropping forever. And the claims of some sort of surge in violent anti-cop, anti-government anger were belied by the fact that non-fatal assaults on police officers were also dropping.

    In retrospect, those of us who were skeptical of the hysterical headlines look to have been correct. While January and February of last year saw a few unusual mass shootings of multiple police officers, those months appear to have been anomalies. Police deaths in the remaining months of 2011 were mostly on par with prior years.

    So what about this year? Police officer deaths are down 48 percent from last year. Firearms deaths specifically are down 58 percent. And as the watchdog blog Clark County Criminal Cops points out, a significant number of the firearms deaths were actually cops who were shot by other cops.

    The police watchdog websites are still out there. The Tea Party and “Don’t Tread on Me” patriot movements are still going strong. You also now have the Occupy movements, which foment a lot of anti-police sentiment (in many cases, justifiably). Gun owners certainly haven’t been melting down their weapons en masse.

    And yet officer fatalities and violence against police officers have nosedived. In fact, if the current pace keeps up, we’ll actually hit an all-time low in police fatalities this year. And these are just the raw numbers. They aren’t percentages of the total police force (which has been growing), or police deaths in comparison to deaths in the larger population.

    All worth keeping in mind should the numbers slightly tick up again—as any statistics pulled from a large population of people are bound to do from time to time—and the media and police groups again start placing blame, and calling for us to grant the police more powers, less oversight, and bigger guns.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 04-10-2012 at 08:35 PM.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by John F Kennedy III View Post
    *popcorn*
    Post 10.

    /thread

  14. #12
    Anyone ever see this movie?


    (Freakanomics on Crime Rate)
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  15. #13
    I'm thinking to get the Sheriff of my County a complimentary 1 year membership in http://www.cspoa.org/, paid for by me, with a nice letter and what not.

    Might be worth a $120 investment, and as I am in real life an upstanding citizen with zero criminal background or record it really has no downside either.

    'cept for the $120, but that's not a huge amount and maybe it will get the Sheriff more awake and aware than he is now.
    Ron Paul: He irritates more idiots in fewer words than any American politician ever.

    NO MORE LIARS! Ron Paul 2012

  16. #14
    http://www.nleomf.org/facts/officer-fatalities-data/


    Law Enforcement Officer Fatalities
    Preliminary 2012 Numbers
    April 10, 2012

    2012
    2011 % Change
    Total Fatalities 31 59 -47%
    Firearms-related 11 26 -58%
    Traffic-related 12 19 -37%
    Other Causes 8 14 -43%

    Please note: These numbers reflect total officer fatalities comparing April 10, 2012 to April 10, 2011.

  17. #15
    In b4 an edit.



    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    Even as Violent Crime Falls, Killing of Officers Rises
    By MICHAEL S. SCHMIDT and JOSEPH GOLDSTEIN
    Published: April 9, 2012

    WASHINGTON — As violent crime has decreased across the country, a disturbing trend has emerged: rising numbers of police officers are being killed.
    According to statistics compiled by the Federal Bureau of Investigation, 72 officers were killed by perpetrators in 2011, a 25 percent increase from the previous year and a 75 percent increase from 2008.

    The 2011 deaths were the first time that more officers were killed by suspects than car accidents, according to data compiled by the International Association of Chiefs of Police. The number was the highest in nearly two decades, excluding those who died in the Sept. 11 attacks in 2001 and the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995.

    While a majority of officers were killed in smaller cities, 13 were killed in cities of 250,000 or more. New York City lost two officers last year. On Sunday, four were wounded by a gunman in Brooklyn, bringing to eight the number of officers shot in the city since December.

    “We haven’t seen a period of this type of violence in a long time,” said Commissioner Raymond W. Kelly of the New York Police Department.

    While the F.B.I. and other law enforcement officials cannot fully explain the reasons for the rise in officer homicides, they are clear about the devastating consequences.

    “In this law enforcement job, when you pin this badge on and go out on calls, when you leave home, you ain’t got a promise that you will come back,” said Sheriff Ray Foster of Buchanan County, Va. Two of his deputies were killed in March 2011 and two wounded — one of them paralyzed — by a man with a high-powered rifle.

    “That was 80 percent of my day shift,” he said.

    After a spate of killings in early 2011, Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. asked federal authorities to work with local police departments to try to come up with solutions to the problem.

    The F.B.I., which has tracked officer deaths since 1937, paid for a study conducted by John Jay College that found that in many cases the officers were trying to arrest or stop a suspect who had previously been arrested for a violent crime.


    SNIP

  18. #16
    o really......
    Last edited by QuickZ06; 04-10-2012 at 08:51 PM.
    "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness"



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  20. #17
    Yeah, violent crime. Thankfully, we have the War on Drugs to create a bunch of non-violent criminals to keep the jails full. Anybody want to ballpark an estimate for the percentage of cops that are killed while responding to drug-related crimes?
    Knowledge will forever govern ignorance; and a people who mean to be their own governors must arm themselves with the power which knowledge gives. -James Madison

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by James Madison View Post
    Yeah, violent crime. Thankfully, we have the War on Drugs to create a bunch of non-violent criminals to keep the jails full. Anybody want to ballpark an estimate for the percentage of cops that are killed while responding to drug-related crimes?
    My guess is greater than 90%.....

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Rarely does one see failure, so hard, in nature...




    The “War on Cops” That Wasn’t. And Still Isn’t.

    Saturday, April 7th, 2012

    http://www.theagitator.com/2012/04/0...nd-still-isnt/

    You might remember that about this time last year, media outlets, police groups, even Attorney General Eric Holder were up in arms over an alleged “war on cops” taking place all across the fruited plains. In April of last year, on-the-job officer deaths were up 20 percent from the same point in 2010. The media went nuts, pointing an accusatory finger at anti-government rhetoric, a “don’t tread on me” mentality, anti-cop Internet sites, and gun ownership.

    But some wise folks (ahem) didn’t buy into the hype. On-the-job cop deaths had been falling for 20 years. Those numbers couldn’t keep dropping forever. And the claims of some sort of surge in violent anti-cop, anti-government anger were belied by the fact that non-fatal assaults on police officers were also dropping.

    In retrospect, those of us who were skeptical of the hysterical headlines look to have been correct. While January and February of last year saw a few unusual mass shootings of multiple police officers, those months appear to have been anomalies. Police deaths in the remaining months of 2011 were mostly on par with prior years.

    So what about this year? Police officer deaths are down 48 percent from last year. Firearms deaths specifically are down 58 percent. And as the watchdog blog Clark County Criminal Cops points out, a significant number of the firearms deaths were actually cops who were shot by other cops.

    The police watchdog websites are still out there. The Tea Party and “Don’t Tread on Me” patriot movements are still going strong. You also now have the Occupy movements, which foment a lot of anti-police sentiment (in many cases, justifiably). Gun owners certainly haven’t been melting down their weapons en masse.

    And yet officer fatalities and violence against police officers have nosedived. In fact, if the current pace keeps up, we’ll actually hit an all-time low in police fatalities this year. And these are just the raw numbers. They aren’t percentages of the total police force (which has been growing), or police deaths in comparison to deaths in the larger population.

    All worth keeping in mind should the numbers slightly tick up again—as any statistics pulled from a large population of people are bound to do from time to time—and the media and police groups again start placing blame, and calling for us to grant the police more powers, less oversight, and bigger guns.

    Radley is amazing.

  23. #20
    Every time I read an article like that in the original post, I think of a line from a Talib Kweli song:

    "Kurt Loder asked me what I'd say to a dead cop's wife
    Cops kill my people every day, that's life."

    And it isn't an "anti-cop" thing. It's a fact. Some cops will die. More cops will kill other people. It's just how society is today, and probably how it will always be. Knowing that, it's hard not to feel cynical when we're hit with this hero-worship for agents of the state.
    Last edited by KingNothing; 04-11-2012 at 05:52 AM.

  24. #21
    They are trying to make the case for more gun regulations.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by LibertyEagle View Post
    They are trying to make the case for more gun regulations.
    During all the years we had tighter regulations in this country, all cops did was push for more regulations under the assumption of increased public safety: and now we can say with certainty that those regulations led to high violent crime rates.

    Since cops still push for tight regulations, despite the pretty clear fact that such regulations lead to increased violent deaths of non-cops, I'm not real sure why I should be all that concerned about dead cops that may or may not result from loose regulation of guns.


    You want to act like we don't matter, coppers? Don't act so surprised when you get the same treatment from us.
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    During all the years we had tighter regulations in this country, all cops did was push for more regulations under the assumption of increased public safety: and now we can say with certainty that those regulations led to high violent crime rates.

    Since cops still push for tight regulations, despite the pretty clear fact that such regulations lead to increased violent deaths of non-cops, I'm not real sure why I should be all that concerned about dead cops that may or may not result from loose regulation of guns.


    You want to act like we don't matter, coppers? Don't act so surprised when you get the same treatment from us.
    I agree with you. But, that doesn't change my statement.
    ================
    Open Borders: A Libertarian Reappraisal or why only dumbasses and cultural marxists are for it.

    Cultural Marxism: The Corruption of America

    The Property Basis of Rights

  27. #24
    Being part of the criminal gang known as "the police" is nowhere near one of the most dangerous jobs. If they are concerned about officer safety, I've got an easy fix for them, stop enforcing victimless "crimes."



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by WilliamC View Post
    I'm thinking to get the Sheriff of my County a complimentary 1 year membership in http://www.cspoa.org/, paid for by me, with a nice letter and what not.

    Might be worth a $120 investment, and as I am in real life an upstanding citizen with zero criminal background or record it really has no downside either.

    'cept for the $120, but that's not a huge amount and maybe it will get the Sheriff more awake and aware than he is now.
    I support this group, and think your idea is a good one.
    Let them keep thinking Ron Paul supporters are just a little army. Every military strategy manual in the world has examples of the bad things that happen to arrogant commanders of massive armies that underestimate the enemy. They all lose. We will win because the human heart, despite its detractors, is meant for truth and freedom.

  30. #26
    Did it occur to any one that these officers are getting between citizens and violent criminals more often, and this is a potential reason for the increase in LE deaths ?
    Let them keep thinking Ron Paul supporters are just a little army. Every military strategy manual in the world has examples of the bad things that happen to arrogant commanders of massive armies that underestimate the enemy. They all lose. We will win because the human heart, despite its detractors, is meant for truth and freedom.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    Did it occur to any one that these officers are getting between citizens and violent criminals more often, and this is a potential reason for the increase in LE deaths ?
    Just like on TV.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    Did it occur to any one that these officers are getting between citizens and violent criminals more often, and this is a potential reason for the increase in LE deaths ?
    What increase in LE deaths?

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by azxd View Post
    Did it occur to any one that these officers are getting between citizens and violent criminals more often, and this is a potential reason for the increase in LE deaths ?
    http://blog.odmp.org/

    Fairfax, Va.- March 2012 experienced a 77% drop in law enforcement line of duty deaths compared to March 2011. So far in 2012, there have been only 25 law enforcement deaths nationwide, putting this year on track to be one of the safest years in law enforcement since the 1940s. Compared to the same time period in 2011, 2012 has seen 29 fewer law enforcement officers killed in the line of duty; a reduction of over 50%.

    As in February, the two main contributors to these drastically low numbers are the near absence of vehicular deaths and gunfire deaths, and no single incidents in which multiple line of duty deaths occurred.

    Detailed information about each law enforcement fatality can be obtained on the Officer Down Memorial Page at http://www.ODMP.org

  34. #30
    The Circular Firing Squad Circle Jerk, when a heavily armed thugscrum invades a Mundane's hovel:

    According to the National Law Enforcement Officer’s Memorial Fund’s web page, officer deaths by firearms are down 57% from this time last year, and about a third of those fatalities were the result of cops killing other cops.
    http://clarkcountycriminalcops.wordp...w-enforcement/

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