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Thread: Mark Levin: Drugs are not a victimless crime

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    And you talk about others being sheltered, good grief. It really does happen that you can't always just tough it out, there are methods to greatly decrease your back pain but using your own limited experience as an example of someone being weak because they have a more severe injury is asinine at best.
    My point is, you don't need weed to deal with back pain. I know a lot of people who have chronic back pain from all sorts of things including arthiritis and spinal fractures. They all get by just fine without narcotics. PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits. That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma.



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  3. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    If you're talking about Pete he's old enough to be your father and has certainly seen and done things that would terrify someone who holds your expressed beliefs and attitudes.
    How ironic. You people attack me for making assumptions about his life experiences based on his posts, and then you do the very same thing to me. Perhaps I was wrong, maybe he just has dementia.

  4. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Are you retarded or what? I said DRUGS SHOULD BE LEGAL What part of that don't you understand? Obviously you've already fried your brain.
    How have you devolved into insulting so quickly? I mean, it's funny seeing you call someone like Pcosmar sheltered. But to get anywhere in debates, you have to be open to being wrong and you can't just fling insults in place of arguments.

  5. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    My point is, you don't need weed to deal with back pain. I know a lot of people who have chronic back pain from all sorts of things including arthiritis and spinal fractures. They all get by just fine without narcotics. PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits. That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma.
    There you go pretending to be able to read other people's minds.

  6. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    My point is, you don't need weed to deal with back pain. I know a lot of people who have chronic back pain from all sorts of things including arthiritis and spinal fractures. They all get by just fine without narcotics. PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits. That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma.
    Here you go speaking for someone else......

    Why would you want to do that?

    More importantly why do you think it's your place to pass judgement on another? Especially someone your senior who should be approached with respect.

    I stopped knowing everything long before I hit 30 and started paying more attention to the wisdom of my elders, judging by your posts you're a bit older than 30, are you one of those people who fails to recognize their own ignorance as they age?

  7. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    My point is, you don't need weed to deal with back pain. I know a lot of people who have chronic back pain from all sorts of things including arthiritis and spinal fractures. They all get by just fine without narcotics. PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits. That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma.
    Possibly (really you don't know that because everyone responds differently to different drugs), and those narcotics, not only come with some rather nasty side effects, they're also a pain in ass to get. My mom has back pain. I bought her some weed because the other drugs knock her out completely. She doesn't want to sleep her life away. The weed didn't work out for her but to say people only use it medicinally to get wasted is complete bs. My mom was 82 when she smoked her first joint and had never done anything stronger than a glass of wine before her back got screwy - she drinks that for her glaucoma.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Paul View Post
    The intellectual battle for liberty can appear to be a lonely one at times. However, the numbers are not as important as the principles that we hold. Leonard Read always taught that "it's not a numbers game, but an ideological game." That's why it's important to continue to provide a principled philosophy as to what the role of government ought to be, despite the numbers that stare us in the face.
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    This intellectually stimulating conversation is the reason I keep coming here.

  8. #127
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    mistermorbidlyobtuse republicrats: "That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma."



    (...hint for republicrat dummies: i believe you'll find that many people are scared to 'get real' because of the very real and possibly severe consequences for doing so...you see, for one example, 'getting real' and admitting you enjoy imbibing in your very own home brew beer is not treated the same in law, etc., as 'getting real' and publicly admitting you enjoy blowing a joint, eating a brownie, etc., fresh from your very own lush, front-yard ganja garden...

    ...and i bet you won't admit it, but i'd bet a bundle that if there was an honest political attempt to 'legalize pot' ('legalize' is a bad term to use) you, misterx, would be one of the 'no' votes...i heartily admit to being a 'yes' vote..

    ...and btw, man oh man, wouldn't i like to publicly debate any goddamned fool republicrat drug prohibition supporter/apologist... ...but they seem to shun honest public debate...and anyone with a lick of sense knows why...
    Last edited by H. E. Panqui; 08-14-2016 at 06:19 AM.

  9. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    99% of these people just want to get high. Don't be fooled by the, "oh it's for my back" excuses. If it's really all about his back pain, he could get marijuana without thc. I bet he won't do that.
    100% of these people that feel their values should be applied to anyone else are statist idiots. Don't be fooled by the "oh I care about you" bull$#@!. If it's really about his concern, he would shut the hell up and live his own life and let me live mine. I bet he can't do that.

    Either you believe in personal choice, or don't.



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  11. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    My point is, you don't need weed to deal with back pain. I know a lot of people who have chronic back pain from all sorts of things including arthiritis and spinal fractures. They all get by just fine without narcotics. PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits. That's the one thing I really hate about pot smokers. You can never just be real enough to say you want to get messed up. At least people who drink don't pretend it's for their glaucoma.
    You don't NEED a Corvette to get to work, you can drive a Prius. Ridiculous argument.

    PCO doesn't smoke to alleviate his back pain, he does it to get high. There are other drugs that work better for alleviating back pain. You don't want to hear that though because it's all about justifying your own drug habits
    You're really good at being wrong. It could be that he does it for both, I don't believe Pete ever indicated his use was for medicinal purposes only. Even doctors prescribe different gubmint approved drugs to different people because they don't work the same for everyone and virtually all those get you high also so you're just insisting on being wrong again. You literally have no idea what works for another human being, and if you are referring to MY drug habits l prefer whisky, pot doesn't agree with me.
    "The Patriarch"

  12. #130
    i found out that MARIJUANA helps with my joint pain and other 'issues' i now have thanks to father time.

    funny that i used to smoke it when i was younger to 'party' and have fun in bed.....now...i get both. Fun without pain...win win misterx..

  13. #131
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    ...one thing that really troubles me about 'anti-drug' crusaders like misterx and other republicrats is the way they heap scorn, ridicule, etc., on the real victims of this miserable gd fool 'drug war'...

    ...but not a stinking peep of scorn and ridicule from misterx and other republicrats about the twisted pigs who are truly the real criminals: ...the republicrat pig politicians, the twisted 'justice' system pigs from cops to judges to jailers, and other republicrat pigs who routinely violate other peoples' obvious unalienable rights to self-medication, ingestion, plant cultivation, etc., in the conduct of this filthy, insane 'war on drugs'....

    ...twisted. goddamned. republicrat. fools. pigs.
    Last edited by H. E. Panqui; 08-14-2016 at 12:10 PM.

  14. #132
    Does anyone think that impaired individuals are more likely to commit crime? Would a person commit a crime while impaired that they would not commit had they not been impaired?

  15. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post

    I've seen plenty in my life - lives destroyed, people killed before my very own eye balls. I suspect plenty of us here have seen more than you might imagine.

    Do as you please, of course, but I would suggest keeping it real. YMMV.
    And this..^

    I have engaged in stupidity,, and more than just once.
    My "college" is known here.

    I have worn the blood of friends,, and enemies.

    and watched folks kill themselves,, in their own ways.

    Substances are less relevant than the reasons for their use. Which is the Real Issue.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  16. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    , and if you are referring to MY drug habits l prefer whisky, pot doesn't agree with me.
    LOL

    My last run with whisky was no fun,,
    http://pcosmar.blogspot.com/2006/08/...gone-well.html

    I had not had any before that since the Hurricane Andrew hurricane party. (in which I allegedly died)
    recovery times got to be too much,, stuck with beer.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  17. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    LOL

    My last run with whisky was no fun,,
    http://pcosmar.blogspot.com/2006/08/...gone-well.html

    I had not had any before that since the Hurricane Andrew hurricane party. (in which I allegedly died)
    recovery times got to be too much,, stuck with beer.
    I like a good beer, but I like it better with a shot of good whiskey...
    "The Patriarch"

  18. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Does anyone think that impaired individuals are more likely to commit crime? Would a person commit a crime while impaired that they would not commit had they not been impaired?
    I will circle back to this, because it's the primary point Mark Levin seemed to be circling his way to, and something that deserves scrutiny.

    Currently, people with a dependency are more likely to commit crimes if they are denied access to that on which they are dependent. This could be drugs, alcohol, or any number of things.

    After decriminalization, I still think there is a higher chance of a drug ABUSER committing crime. Anyone who's seen someone knock-down drunk (or been that person, I guess) can attest that they are more likely to do some things while impaired, and very few of them are beneficial to society or the person who's drunk. Within that broad, vague category of drunken acts is a subset where the action is not so cute or harmless. This is the part where someone is too hammered to drive and runs over someone, or where they are too drunk to understand (or say) "no," or when assault sounds like a good idea, or showing up at an ex's and getting really upset that she's moved on... and directing that upset through your fists or a bat at the new guy... you get the idea. Things can go south. There are other drugs that really blur right from wrong, or twist reality in a pretty scary way, and all it takes is a bad trip and the borderline ability to still use a weapon to make things scary for everyone around you as well.

    The number of drug-fueled crimes would still be super low --- and definitely lower than they are now --- but people with their emotions amplified, their strength upped, or their inhibitions removed are going to be more likely to do something regrettable than the same people in their fully sober state.
    Genuine, willful, aggressive ignorance is the one sure way to tick me off. I wish I could say you were trolling. I know better, and it's just sad.



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  20. #137
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to MelissaWV again.

  21. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to MelissaWV again.
    Covered, it was a good post.
    "The Patriarch"

  22. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    How ironic. You people attack me for making assumptions about his life experiences based on his posts, and then you do the very same thing to me. Perhaps I was wrong, maybe he just has dementia.
    Oh come on,,

    I can do demented,, but usually choose otherwise.

    I did not attack you at all,, only your assumption that "people should not use" natural products for medical benefits..

    and your veiled assumption that BIG Pharma Drugs are better.
    And I disagree with that whole train of thought.

    Marijuana is a Gift from God,, with health and economic benefits beyond measure.

    The very fact that it has been prohibited must make a rational mind ask,, "Why?".
    and the answer to that is darker than greed.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  23. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Does anyone think that impaired individuals are more likely to commit crime? Would a person commit a crime while impaired that they would not commit had they not been impaired?
    'Impaired' is of course subjective..

    The guy or girl who has ingested a couple of Ludes isn't very likely to do much at all..

    But it really does't matter what one is 'likely' to do if XYandZ all occur at a given time. Like Melissa said some poor bloke who's been dumped might or might not go off on the new dude or even his ex depending on any given number of things only one of which might possibly be something he imbibed in...And that substance might or might ot be illegal...

    Pre-crime doesn't work or in the instance of break-ups they either wouldn't be permitted unless both people agreed or one person was lobotomized..Which isn't realistic either.

    All drugs serve a purpose, making some illegal and controlling others really has no effect on crime other than some people being arrested for possession or distribution.

    If all drugs were available all the time to anyone for any reason the 'likelyhood' of drugs being the cause for real crime would undoubtedly be diminished...One must weigh such things as crimes committed to obtain drugs or money now to actual crimes committed because of impairment in a fictional world.

    I contend that people being genuinely good would commit less crime if they had the option of self medicating as they choose when they choose.

  24. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Does anyone think that impaired individuals are more likely to commit crime? Would a person commit a crime while impaired that they would not commit had they not been impaired?
    I am of the opinion that people often use drugs to enable them to do what they are otherwise inhibited from.

    and the blame it on the substance of choice.

    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  25. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    I am of the opinion that people often use drugs to enable them to do what they are otherwise inhibited from.

    and the blame it on the substance of choice.
    In today's legal and moral climate this is absolutely true..

    The ol' "The Devil Made Me Do It" defense..

    Which only empowers government and her advocates, the real devils...

  26. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Marijuana is a Gift from God,, with health and economic benefits beyond measure.
    I've heard that a lot, from pot smokers, but I think if one is going to bring up God, they need to be careful not to mislead anyone.

    Intoxication (not just getting drunk, but getting high from any mind-altering drug) is not only a sin, but it's actually one of the biggest and most effective spiritual traps out there. I have zero doubt about that, I've seen it with my own eyes, many, many times.

    Marijuana may be a blessing for people who really need it, for pain or other medical reasons, but not for recreational use... the scriptures are very clear that God wants us to be sober, clear-minded, and as Christians (this is not aimed at the nonbelievers here) different than everyone else, set apart, sanctified....not like we were in our old life, before we came to Christ.

    For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry. They are surprised that you do not join them in their reckless, wild living, and they heap abuse on you. But they will have to give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.

    1 Peter 4:3-5


    I could post a ton more scriptures on how we are to be different than this world... sober, clean, set apart, spiritually mature - not relying on crutches like drugs, but relying on God.

    I'm not saying that all this applies to you, but your statement "Marijuana is a Gift from God" could easily be misunderstood, so I just felt that clarification was needed.
    “I have no doubt that it is a part of the destiny of the human race, in its gradual improvement, to leave off eating animals, as surely as the savage tribes have left off eating each other.”

    ― Henry David Thoreau

  27. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    'Impaired' is of course subjective..

    The guy or girl who has ingested a couple of Ludes isn't very likely to do much at all..
    You sho' got dat right. 1977, my friends Tom and Roxanne throw a party at their place just off Hollywood Blvd. Al Stewart shows up with his manager. I arrived with my friend Kevin, already under some influence. Al's manager may have been gay... whatever, he took a shine to me and offered me a lude. OK, said I. Down the hatch. The only things I clearly recall of the remainder of that night was turning the light on in Roxanne's closet to find Al Stewart getting, erm... "busy" with the knock-out bombshell with whom he had arrived. I excused myself, turn off the light and exited. The only other part I recalled was the fabulously gorgeous young miss who said "you look like you need a kiss" and planted one on me before I was able to consent. I can still taste her and it still makes me happy.

    Short of that, the night was pretty much a blur. Methaqualone is a hypnotic and I was very hypnotized that night.

    Then there was the night my coworkers Spero and Jerry attempted to go roller skating on ludes...

    But it really does't matter what one is 'likely' to do if XYandZ all occur at a given time. Like Melissa said some poor bloke who's been dumped might or might not go off on the new dude or even his ex depending on any given number of things only one of which might possibly be something he imbibed in...And that substance might or might ot be illegal...
    Yes - once again the what-if method of hand-wringing is so often used to deny the rights of men. "We deny your right to keep and bear arms!" "Why?" "What if you shoot someone?"

    Pre-crime doesn't work or in the instance of break-ups they either wouldn't be permitted unless both people agreed or one person was lobotomized..Which isn't realistic either.
    When was the last time government gave a fart about being realistic or just? Their univeral response to any "why?" question is "because $#@! YOU".

    All drugs serve a purpose, making some illegal and controlling others really has no effect on crime other than some people being arrested for possession or distribution.
    I don't suppose you really meant that. It has a profound effect on crime: it jacks the rates and mean severity through the roof.

    If all drugs were available all the time to anyone for any reason the 'likelyhood' of drugs being the cause for real crime would undoubtedly be diminished...One must weigh such things as crimes committed to obtain drugs or money now to actual crimes committed because of impairment in a fictional world.
    I'd bet money I do not have that drug-related crime would be nearly eliminated.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.



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  29. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Does anyone think that impaired individuals are more likely to commit crime?
    On the average, no. I'm inclined to think they would commit less, assuming the free availability of the poisons of their choosing. Of course, this also assumes appropriate treatment of criminals who commit their crimes while impaired. In some cases I would deem intoxication a possible aggravating factor. I would never deem being high as a crime in itself. An ATP in the cockpit of a 757, blitzed on orange barrels would likely have to answer for his poor judgment. How Danke gets away with it weekly is a mystery to me.

    There would always be exceptions, of course. But consider the factors in favor of non-criminal behavior: you can get high all you like, using whatever substance you prefer, so long as you do not bring harm to others. If you harm others, your inebriation might serve to aggravate the charges made against you, thereby giving a judge reason to augment your sentence in the event you are convicted. There's your carrot and stick. Get high, behave yourself, and live to get high another day on the one hand. Get high, commit a crime, go to prison for an extended vacation with a whole host of large and very lonely men.

    As stupid as the average man is today, I contend it is only so because he is allowed to get away with his idiocy. Put painful consequences in his path and most will tread with mindful care. The others? Nothing you could have done would have likely brought them around to sense and decency, and so off the prison with them.

    Would a person commit a crime while impaired that they would not commit had they not been impaired?
    Sometimes yes, other times no. Not sure what you are driving at here in terms of relevancy.
    Last edited by osan; 08-14-2016 at 02:39 PM.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.

  30. #146
    Where is this free drug of choice coming from?

    I would venture to say that functioning addicts that can financially support their habit are not likely to commit crime trying to acquire drugs. I would also think that low life ghetto addicts would steal from anyone including friends and family to get their fix.

    I don't hear many good upbeat stories about the grandfather that was an alcoholic. Most times when people speak of an addict it is less than possitive.

    If a family member allocates too much of the family income toward their drug of choice or any habit for that matter would that not be considered harm?

  31. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Where is this free drug of choice coming from?
    In the perfect fictitious world government would not be involved even in something like grandpaw's booze.

    Gramps wouldn't be able to blow even a portion of his retirement on tax/regulation free booze (or dope) without literally killing himself so the only complaint that could be waged is the attitude or behavior he exhibited.

    The hoodrats........If they actually bothered you $20.00 worth of pure Fentanyl would have any three of 'em in the coroners van and happy to be there...

  32. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    LOL

    My last run with whisky was no fun,,
    http://pcosmar.blogspot.com/2006/08/...gone-well.html

    I had not had any before that since the Hurricane Andrew hurricane party. (in which I allegedly died)
    recovery times got to be too much,, stuck with beer.
    If you don't flatline at least once, you're not having a good time.

  33. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by lilymc View Post
    I've heard that a lot, from pot smokers, but I think if one is going to bring up God, they need to be careful not to mislead anyone.

    Intoxication (not just getting drunk, but getting high from any mind-altering drug) is not only a sin, but it's actually one of the biggest and most effective spiritual traps out there. I have zero doubt about that, I've seen it with my own eyes, many, many times.

    Marijuana may be a blessing for people who really need it, for pain or other medical reasons, but not for recreational use... the scriptures are very clear that God wants us to be sober, clear-minded, and as Christians (this is not aimed at the nonbelievers here) different than everyone else, set apart, sanctified....not like we were in our old life, before we came to Christ.

    For you have spent enough time in the past doing what pagans choose to do—living in debauchery, lust, drunkenness, orgies, carousing and detestable idolatry. They are surprised that you do not join them in their reckless, wild living, and they heap abuse on you. But they will have to give account to him who is ready to judge the living and the dead.

    1 Peter 4:3-5


    I could post a ton more scriptures on how we are to be different than this world... sober, clean, set apart, spiritually mature - not relying on crutches like drugs, but relying on God.

    I'm not saying that all this applies to you, but your statement "Marijuana is a Gift from God" could easily be misunderstood, so I just felt that clarification was needed.
    Your Bible reeks of marijuana:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=w0bH6Z_OSp8

  34. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by John F Kennedy III View Post
    If you don't flatline at least once, you're not having a good time.
    I guess we have a different understanding of "good time", then... :P
    Quote Originally Posted by Torchbearer
    what works can never be discussed online. there is only one language the government understands, and until the people start speaking it by the magazine full... things will remain the same.
    Hear/buy my music here "government is the enemy of liberty"-RP Support me on Patreon here Ephesians 6:12

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