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For the record, this was an aside.
However, you're gonna have to do better than an Obama WH website citation to prove to me that a president cannot de facto declassify records a la carte, which frankly makes sense in your convoluted statist paradigm. Why couldn't/shouldn't a president have final authority to de/classify state secrets? One could conceive of myriad situations in which it makes sense for a head of state to declassify state secrets...
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
Can you please quote me saying anything indicating I had a statist paradigm?
At no point in this conversation has anybody suggested that a president doesn't have that authority. The question is whether or not it is a fact that Trump had actually declassified all of the classified documents that he had at his house. If he had not declassified them when he was president, then it's not something he would still have the authority to do at a later point when he no longer is.
Last edited by Invisible Man; 08-16-2022 at 07:10 PM.
Ron PaulThere is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)
You asked me why the two cases were treated differently, and I gave you my best answer. You didn't ask what the differences in the crimes were. To opine on that I'd need to review what HRC actually did and research the statutes that HRC allegedly violated, something I don't have time to do right now.
Please understand, I'm no fan of HRC; she's despicable.
We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
Erwin N. Griswold
Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
Anonymous
Interesting case from Tucker's monologue of Douglas Mackey. Arrested for being a far-right twitter troll lol. Facing ten years in prison for a tweet
Last edited by TheTexan; 08-16-2022 at 07:15 PM.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11
We have it well documented that his cabinet members (who had to be approved by the Senate) thwarted him at every turn on issues far less sensitive than the Clintons.
To even suggest that the "independent" DoJ would have prosecuted her on his orders is a joke.
The entire swamp has to be drained and he is making lots of progress on that already.
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
That Southern DC Senator Trump appointed as first Attorney General was a real go getter on DC Crime
Oh wait, no he wasn’t!
Hoodwinked again & again
Jeff Sessions!
Served 20 years as Senator before Trump hired him to clean up DC
Hoodwinked
Not sure if this has been posted, but here is the official Warrant. I haven't read it yet, but it doesn't look good that some of the boxes were labeled TOP SECRET.
https://www.npr.org/2022/08/12/11172...ar-a-lago-home
Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
Ron Paul 2004
Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
It's all about Freedom
Maybe Trump could name Mitt Romney as his clean up the swamp Attorney General if elected again.
Not exactly the GO-GETTER PROSECUTER 20 year Senator JEff Session was, but will surely get results!!!!
Jimmy has been my ride-to-work-entertainment in the car these past few weeks.
T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men
"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato
We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me
Originally Posted by Philhelm
Even those not requiring Senate (McConnell) consent required FBI (Swamp) consent as this comment from another site demonstrates:
The only exception is the military.There’s a great (but long) article at CTH that explains the importance to the un-elected cabal (aka invisible government) of controlling the FBI.
Other than the obvious favoritism of RATS and persecution of MAGA, the FBI is in charge of all security clearances.
This gives them the power, over time, to fully populate almost every agency with their puppets.
Many of President Trump’s nominees were blocked in this fashion; but this has been going on a long time.
The article also pinpoints a key victory of the invisible government in setting up “Intelligence agencies” as a 4th branch of government was the Patriot Act ... orchestrated largely by Dick Cheney in the aftermath of a certain VERY LARGE FALSE FLAG.
https://theconservativetreehouse.com...the-documents/
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
Robert Heinlein
Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler
Groucho Marx
I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.
Linus, from the Peanuts comic
You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith
Alexis de Torqueville
Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it
A Zero Hedge comment
This sounds like one of those stories where the content 'pretty much' doesn't match the headline.
https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...panetta-2022-8
Former CIA director says Trump ally's claim that he could instantly declassify documents is 'pretty much BS'
Aug 16, 2022
The former CIA director dismissed a claim by a Donald Trump ally that the former president had the power to instantly declassify government documents, calling it "pretty much BS."
Leon Panetta, who served as the defense secretary and CIA Director under the Obama administration, told CNN's Jake Tapper on Monday that there is a process for declassifying confidential government information and requires other agencies to sign off on it.
"If presidents want to declassify, they have to follow that process which basically requires that it be referred to the agencies that are responsible for classifying that material," Panetta told CNN. "They have something to say as to whether or not that material should be declassified."
"So there is nothing that I'm aware of that indicates that a formal step was taken by this president to, in fact, declassify anything. Right now, this is pretty much BS," he added.
Panetta's comments came after Kash Patel, a former Pentagon official under Trump, claimed that Trump had declassified all the documents he took to Mar-a-Lago.
Patel told Fox News' "Sunday Morning Futures" that, as president, Trump had the power to "literally stand over a set of documents and say, 'These are now declassified,'" as can be seen in a clip shared by Mediaite.
"This is a key fact that most Americans are missing: President Trump, as a sitting president, is a unilateral authority for declassification," Patel said.
FBI agents seized about 20 boxes from Trump's Mar-a-Lago residence in Florida during their raid last week, including 11 sets of marked top-secret documents that were designated to remain only in a secure government facility.
Trump previously argued that while he was president, he had a "standing order that documents removed from the Oval Office taken to the residence were deemed to be declassified," according to a statement read out on Fox News on Friday.
But there is no evidence he followed procedure to do so.
According to The New York Times, "original classification authorities" in federal departments and agencies have the power to classify and declassify information.
While presidents can declassify documents without having to go to other government authorities for approval, this is very rare, The Times reported.
Representatives for Trump did not immediately respond to Insider's request for comment.
"They [agencies] have something to say"
"There is a process"
Sounds like that process is typically followed so that Presidents have some guidance when they are declassifying, but it's all an optional step they can take to ensure the agencies have the chance to let them know if they are releasing something that could potentially be harmful, in their opinion.
The Times and Panetta are trying to make people think that this procedure is required using weasel words like "pretty much" and "rarely".
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Have to give the ringmasters credit, America is talking about this rather than "our side" Ukraine, shelling Nuclear Power Plant.
HOCUS POCUS BITCHES
So, let's declassify something and not tell anyone. Let's keep the fact that it's no longer secret a secret. I can't tell you if it's classified or not because whether it's classified is more classified than it is.
What possible purpose could that serve but entrapment? That, or getting Chinese spies off the hook. Oh, I like this spy for China, so I'll say that hasn't been secret since I was president. But that one never gave me abribeChristmas present so the fact that the secrets they gave to China aren't secret will remain my little secret.
After all, nothing says Fiscal Responsibility like having thousands of federal employees guarding something they might as well email to Alex Jones.
It's asinine.
The Propaganda Unit
FBI Unit Leading Mar-a-Lago Probe Earlier Ran Discredited Trump-Russia Investigation
https://www.realclearinvestigations....ax_848582.html
Former federal prosecutor and Trump administration official Kash Patel said the FBI may have a personal interest – and a potential conflict – in seizing the records stored by Trump.
He noted that Trump in October 2020 authorized the declassification of all the investigative records generated from the FBI's Crossfire Hurricane as well as the Clinton email investigation, codenamed "Midyear Exam," and he said that the FBI may have confiscated some of those records in its raid, ensuring they won't be made public. In addition, he said, the agency may be digging for other documents to try to justify, retroactively, their questionable, politically-tinged 2016 opening of the Trump-Russia "collusion" case, which came up embarrassingly short on evidence.
"Tragically, the same FBI characters that were involved in Russiagate are the same counterintel guys running this ‘national security investigation' against Trump," said Patel, who deposed Crossfire Hurricane team members as a former House Intelligence Committee investigator.
Patel noted that the Horowitz report indicated FBI analyst Auten hid exculpatory information about Trump's adviser Page from other investigators and the FISA court, which should be more than enough to keep him at arm's length from other investigations involving Trump.
"And to top it all off, this guy admits [to Horowitz's investigators] he's unrepentant about his role in making up the biggest hoax in election history, and Wray still lets him be a supervisor at the FBI," he said. "It's just insane."
Director Testifies Before Senate Judiciary Committee (over 3 hours long, and says nothing)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxPj5yPkXnc&t=9128s
Last edited by Mach; 08-18-2022 at 11:31 AM.
FJB
That's what you get for promising to drain the swamp, and then going all swampy. He could have released stuff like that. He promised to release stuff like that. Instead, what? He wanted to set up his own blackmail network? He had his chance to cut the puppet strings and put the marionettes in jail, but instead he tried to grab the strings so they'd dance to his tune?He noted that Trump in October 2020 authorized the declassification of all the investigative records generated from the FBI's Crossfire Hurricane as well as the Clinton email investigation, codenamed "Midyear Exam," and he said that the FBI may have confiscated some of those records in its raid, ensuring they won't be made public.
The untouchable Alpha Very Stable Genius overreached, and failed. Not a selling point. Someone who couldn't foresee this move isn't even a competent checkers player.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Ron PaulThere is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)
Oh? So every department with classified materials sent someone to help him pack?
They knew what was carted out was declassified, but they knew not what was carried out. Therefore, they didn't know any of the things I suggested they just might need to know. Einstein.
You're not even trying to think this through. You're just grasping at excuses for your golden calf.
The Constitution gives supreme power to the President since the President is the commander in chief of the military. Classification of documents is related to national security, which is a function of the military.
The President’s authority to classify and control access to information bearing on the national security flows from the Constitution and does not depend upon a legislative grant of authority.
Although I expect to be able to provide the advance notice contemplated by section 8009 in most
situations as a matter of comity, situations may arise in which I must act promptly while protecting
certain extraordinarily sensitive national security information. In these situations, I will treat these
sections in a manner consistent with my constitutional authorities, including as Commander in
Chief.
Statement by President Donald J. Trump on Signing H.R. 244 into Law (May 5, 2017)
https://sgp.fas.org/crs/secrecy/RS21900.pdfThe Supreme Court has never directly addressed the extent to which Congress may constrain the executive branch’s power in this area. Citing the President’s constitutional role as Commanderin-Chief, the Supreme Court has repeatedly stated in dicta that “[the President’s] authority to classify and control access to information bearing on national security ... flows primarily from
this Constitutional investment of power in the President and exists quite apart from any explicit
congressional grant.”
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
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