Help me find an upper for my AR

[GunnyFreedom]

I am looking for a somewhat unusual upper. Someone has to make one but I can't find it. Someone here may know more than I do.

First off, I have an old school civilian Colt Sporter HBAR Match. The forward take down pin is overlarge. I know an adapter is made. I may end up machining one for stability.

I am looking for a 16" barrel AR upper, but with a handgrip that ends the "standard" distance from the end, not a 14.5" grip on a 16" barrel.

I want to set my old Colt up as a knife fighter. Steel reinforced fill stock. (If possible) Reinforced bayonet lug attachment. I want to set it up as a superb melee weapon in it's own right, and THEN put a ruggedized CQB optic on it.

My first obstacle is finding a 16" barrel upper that holds a bayonet correctly. :-/

[GunnyFreedom]

@Pericles I think you may know more about this than anyone here.

[GunnyFreedom]

ANd no, I am not looking for an "extender." No contraptions. It needs to a right melee weapon, not a flappy contraption of levers and pickets.

[GunnyFreedom]

Ideally I would get the most rugged 9.5" free-float grip I can get, and cut juust enough (half inch) of a notch in the bottom to fit snug around the bayonet assembly (and if possible fix without welding). Of course it won't be free-floating anymore. This is not a 500yd rifle, the idea is to make the bayonet solid. I might even machine a forward bayonet rest to stabilize it even further.

[presence]

Triple R products lug extension - extend the butt lug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMsLDwX4jqg

tacticoool - sleeve your barrel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQNfIFyVlK4

full size grip and hang it on flash arrestor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvM5AtDXw2I

[Superfluous Man]

Can't you just get the parts separately?

Places that may have what you want at one time may not at another. But I would search for them at slickguns.com.

[GunnyFreedom]

Triple R products lug extension - extend the butt lug
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMsLDwX4jqg

I will not use an adapter. I will go without the bayonet before I will use an adapter. It is something to lose when you need it, and it is something else to break.

tacticoool - sleeve your barrel
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQNfIFyVlK4

full size grip and hang it on flash arrestor
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvM5AtDXw2I

I was looking at putting the strongest 15" quad-rail I could find and pairing it with this

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...bayonet-mount/



only the sleeve would go up to an inch before the muzzle, and the 'fake barrel' set even with the compensator?

[GunnyFreedom]

No, the Geissele barrel should protrude past the end of the compensator by 3/4 of an inch right? so even if I don't have a bayonet fixed I can whack someone in the face with the Geissele barrel and leave the rifle barrel untouched.

[pcosmar]

ANd no, I am not looking for an "extender." No contraptions. It needs to a right melee weapon, not a flappy contraption of levers and pickets.

Dissipator,, but am not sure about colt pin holes..



bottom is a dissie.

would be on my wish list

[Pericles]

@Pericles I think you may know more about this than anyone here.

The issue is that on a 16 inch barrel the end of the barrel is too far forward of the FSB for a bayonet. The solution is to get a 14.5 inch barrel, have retro rifle works add a .2 inch barrel extension ( or flash hider rear end is about the same length) and permanently attach a standard flash hider to give an ATF required 16.1 inch total length. Result looks like this:



In a similar approach, PSA and Brownells have 14.7 inch barrels with permanent standard flash hiders which do the same thing, but I kept the weapon I have all Colt (Except for the lower).

There are only 3 lengths of gas system, which will determine where the FSB is on the barrel.

[GunnyFreedom]

The issue is that on a 16 inch barrel the end of the barrel is too far forward of the FSB for a bayonet. The solution is to get a 14.5 inch barrel, have retro rifle works add a .2 inch barrel extension ( or flash hider rear end is about the same length) and permanently attach a standard flash hider to give an ATF required 16.1 inch total length. Result looks like this:

As you know, that's not a solution. I would first of all rather have the 16" barrel in any case, and extensions to make a short barrel pretend at length are even worse. But you still end up with the end of the suppressor some 3/4 down the length of the bayonet.

I am not excited at the prospect of mounting a bayonet onto a rail. That does not feel very secure to me, but at least I would have some control over where it set in relation to the barrel.

In a similar approach, PSA and Brownells have 14.7 inch barrels with permanent standard flash hiders which do the same thing, but I kept the weapon I have all Colt (Except for the lower).

There are only 3 lengths of gas system, which will determine where the FSB is on the barrel.

Then maybe I need to use a mid length gas system and mount a bayonet stud onto the barrel independent of the gas check?

[GunnyFreedom]

What I do like about the Gisselle is it could give me a surface forward of the barrel to use as a club. But in order for any of that to be practical, I'd need to find an exceptionally strong free-float sleeve to attach it to.

[RJB]

Reported.

[presence]

Geissele

how much does that thing weigh? how much does a

strongest 15" quad-rail

weigh?

You're building a sword. It would seem to me you should consider balance as greatly as you consider strength.

Its really important to be able to quickly recover from swinging your weapon in melee; the closer your gun can approach to "katana" the better you'll fare in close combat.

what about having the butt extender welded on?

[presence]

AR15EXT004 permanent <<<< has good weld on potential

AR15EXT001 quick release

DPMS MFR #: BL-LUG-L Part:ARR-044

[Pericles]

As you know, that's not a solution. I would first of all rather have the 16" barrel in any case, and extensions to make a short barrel pretend at length are even worse. But you still end up with the end of the suppressor some 3/4 down the length of the bayonet.

I am not excited at the prospect of mounting a bayonet onto a rail. That does not feel very secure to me, but at least I would have some control over where it set in relation to the barrel.



Then maybe I need to use a mid length gas system and mount a bayonet stud onto the barrel independent of the gas check?

What you are hoping to find is a 16 inch barrel with a mid length gas system. I don't know if such a beast exists. If you knew somebody competent - it would be barrel blank, hope he gets the gas port dimensions right - and you might get close You will end up with a weapon that is nowhere near a military grade bit of equipment.

Having said that, Colt is supposed to be hitting the civilian market with some mid length stuff that might get close to what you want.

[fedupinmo]

What you are hoping to find is a 16 inch barrel with a mid length gas system. I don't know if such a beast exists. If you knew somebody competent - it would be barrel blank, hope he gets the gas port dimensions right - and you might get close You will end up with a weapon that is nowhere near a military grade bit of equipment.

Having said that, Colt is supposed to be hitting the civilian market with some mid length stuff that might get close to what you want.

Palmetto State Armory makes dozens of variations of 16 inch mid length gas barreled uppers. You can get one from the cheapest chromoly all the way up to an FN stamp premium double chrome-lined cold hammer-forged Barrel. Their mid-length are my favorites so far, shoot great, with very little recoil.

[presence]

Why not have something custom built and put it on the stock location?

old stock MN M91 can be had for $30, bring that to local metal shop, chop chop tack tack weld weld... hocus pocus custom coolness

[fedupinmo]

Why not have something custom built and put it on the stock location?

old stock MN M91 can be had for $30, bring that to local metal shop, chop chop tack tack weld weld... hocus pocus custom coolness

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPQM4h-UZtc

[presence]

dat swing

lolol

[Athan]

What you are hoping to find is a 16 inch barrel with a mid length gas system. I don't know if such a beast exists. If you knew somebody competent - it would be barrel blank, hope he gets the gas port dimensions right - and you might get close You will end up with a weapon that is nowhere near a military grade bit of equipment.

Having said that, Colt is supposed to be hitting the civilian market with some mid length stuff that might get close to what you want.

I agree. You are looking at custom work there. Maybe having someone cut up/trim mid-length parts for free float handguards. I have no idea why you have to have it carbine length when a mid-length is ideal and is good for mounting a bayonet. I mean one of the things you are confusing me with is you are going to not have it for long range precision use, but still go with a free float barrel. Lots of awkward decisions that can be avoided by simply moving up to a mid-length and non-free float which is something I have for the same reason you want it.

You clearly know what you want... but the question is "why this particular set up?" It doesn't really exist. Bayonets initially were for long rifles to act as a spear. So that's why you will see bayonet lugs mostly on rifle length and mid-length It would be like me going AR pistol for CQC but still asking for free float and mount a bayonet. I mean it can be done, but I'm going to drop a lot of money for custom work and make the people doing that work wonder what the $#@! I am doing. You don't get carbines if you want to mount bayonets.

[pcosmar]

I am looking for a somewhat unusual upper.



My first obstacle is finding a 16" barrel upper that holds a bayonet correctly. :-/

Me too/
But Might I make another suggestion. after thinking about your whole proposition.

In close quarters combat there is nothing better than a shotgun.

Set up a Combat Shotgun w/bayonet and save the rifle for open area and distance.

[osan]

I am looking for a somewhat unusual upper. Someone has to make one but I can't find it. Someone here may know more than I do.

First off, I have an old school civilian Colt Sporter HBAR Match. The forward take down pin is overlarge. I know an adapter is made. I may end up machining one for stability.

I am looking for a 16" barrel AR upper, but with a handgrip that ends the "standard" distance from the end, not a 14.5" grip on a 16" barrel.

I want to set my old Colt up as a knife fighter. Steel reinforced fill stock. (If possible) Reinforced bayonet lug attachment. I want to set it up as a superb melee weapon in it's own right, and THEN put a ruggedized CQB optic on it.

My first obstacle is finding a 16" barrel upper that holds a bayonet correctly. :-/

Have you checker with POF? Perhaps the best ARs on the planet.

Also, if you want a melee weapon, why not build an AR pistol and put a SIG arm-brace on it? I have a very fine 80% lower as a pistol with the brace and an upper in 338 Spectre. It's lobbing a 250 gr. slug downrange at 1200fps. It is VERY effectively suppressed and hits like a freight train with superb accuracy and precision. It is ideal for enclosed operations and CQB. Under 100 yards you do not need particularly flat shooting. You need punch, and 338 Spectre hits worlds harder than 5.56.

[osan]

Ideally I would get the most rugged 9.5" free-float grip I can get, and cut juust enough (half inch) of a notch in the bottom to fit snug around the bayonet assembly (and if possible fix without welding). Of course it won't be free-floating anymore. This is not a 500yd rifle, the idea is to make the bayonet solid. I might even machine a forward bayonet rest to stabilize it even further.

As for bayonet mount, why not use a standard front sight/gas block, lop off the sight, drill and tap two holes, cut a piece of Picatinny rail and mount it to the block. This allows you to mount a folding front sight while retaining the bayonet lug.

As for short forearms, take a long one and lop it. If the anodizing is important, take it to an anodizer and have the bright metal made black.