Damn these Trumpcuckers are persistent.
Listen. Our despise of Hillary will NEVER be a justification to vote for Trump. Get that through your heads!
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
You don't know that. There is no way of knowing that. Trump has flipped on all sorts of major issues. No reason to believe he wouldn't flip on this one too.Originally Posted by ProBlue33
So that just leaves a rude idiot.
Fearmongering won't work either.
“I don’t think that there will be any curtailing of Donald Trump as president,” he said. "He controls the media, he controls the sentiment [and] he controls everybody. He’s the one who will resort to executive orders more so than [President] Obama ever used them." - Ron Paul
And what follows when the government takes away the "protection or recognition of those rights?" One follows the other. And as I've said...
If you think the State might take away your "gun rights" then you have already lost them. I don't give two $#@!s over what a SCrOTUS has to say about guns. I don't care what my state laws have to say about guns. I own them. I carry them. If they want them they can come get them.
If there were more like you, brother, it wouldn't even be an issue.
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to phil4paul again."
Chris
"Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon
"...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/22/us...ters.html?_r=0
Donald Trump Embraces Wider Use of Stop-and-Frisk by Police
http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/21/politi...top-and-frisk/
Trump touts stop-and-frisk
He is calling for street level gun control,, and Growing the Police State.
and you are Pro Blue..
I am not.. Police should not exist in a free society. They are unnecessary and a detriment to communities.
Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
Ron Paul 2004
Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
It's all about Freedom
Tell your man Trump that I'll vote for him if he gets his buddies to print me up a few million bucks. Short of that, he can rot in hell.
There is. There is you and many others. Many I know personally and many more spread throughout America. I have to work for a living. I cannot spend 24/7 fighting for the "rights" the government chooses to allow me. Honestly. I've quit paying Federal and State income tax over 6 yrs. ago. I don't keep track anymore. It doesn't matter to me. I'm done with it. Life is not an RPG where I feel a need to throw myself against the Boss Mob until I am victorious, knowing full well that I'm paying to play for the highs and lows that go with the game. I'm just cancelling my subscription.
So you're prepared to go toe to toe with a militarized A.T.F. when push comes to shove? The SCOTUS is viewed as god-sanctioned by just about every idiot with a badge in this country, think about that when you waste your vote on Gary Johnson, who probably couldn't get elected governor of New Mexico again if he tried.
ON. THE. NOSE.
There is no spoon.
Hitlery & Trump are both wasted votes IMHPOV.
There is no spoon.
No you haven't.
Today I can go down to Bass Pro or log on to armslist and buy an AR, AK, or AUG and 30 round mags to go with it. I can throw them in the truck and ride around with them. I can take them to the range or to the farm to shoot. I can stick them in the safe and never worry about being a felon for having them. The Supreme Court can change that with the a few strokes on a keyboard by some 24 year old clerk from Harvard Law.
That is reality. Shouting down people that state this truth doesn't help you. Going on demented off med negative rep crusades against us doesn't help you. The only thing that can help you is Donald J Trump.
ROLL TIDE ROLL!!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
He's a veritable Messiah, I'm telling you!
Give me a frickin' break.
Chris
"Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon
"...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul
As is Johnson, but of them all, Trump may prove to be worth wasting one's vote on should one choose to waste it, since every vote is technically a waste.
Or some intern lawyer in the Executive branch can change it. Trump wants to have a list of people who can't buy guns. How is that not gun control? Even worse, it's not a law, there's no oversight - judicial or otherwise, and it would be the executive branch that would create the list in the first place.
Wait wait, I know, but we won't be on that list, right? Only they will be on that list. Well that's the same goddamned thing that they told us about the PATRIOT Act, and we all know how that turned out.
I think I just threw up in my mouth.
And RICO. And civil asset forfeiture. And...
Chris
"Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon
"...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul
And that really sums up the state of the 2016 election.Trump may prove to be worth wasting one's vote on should one choose to waste it, since every vote is technically a waste.
Et cognoscetis veritatem et veritas liberabit vos
Same here.
There is no spoon.
Wash it down with some water; you'll be alright.
Last I heard, DJT backed the same thing the NRA backed in regards to the no-fly list, a 72 hour period for the government to prove their case against said individual in front of a judge. That's a far cry from outright gun bans and the overturning of Heller and or McDonald. If you like your gun rights, Donald Trump is the best candidate in the race.
ROLL TIDE ROLL!!!
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
I am going to make two hyperbolic statements.
1)If your a white Christian born in America with solid mental health, gun ownership will never be a problem under Trump.
2)But if your brown Muslim from Syria, with sketchy mental health, and not a citizen then yes getting a gun under Trump will be a problem.
Et cognoscetis veritatem et veritas liberabit vos
Trump, 3 DAYS AGO:
“[Police officers are] proactive, and if they see a person possibly with a gun or they think they have a gun, they will see the person and they’ll look and they’ll take the gun away. They’ll stop, they’ll frisk and they’ll take the gun away, and they won’t have anything to shoot with.”Trump had praised the practice -- which a federal judge ruled in New York in 2013 was unconstitutional, and unlawfully targeted blacks and Latinos, although it was not banned outright -- in similar terms at the town hall Wednesday night.
"One of the things I'd do ... is I would do stop-and-frisk. I think you have to. We did it in New York, it worked incredibly well and you have to be proactive and, you know, you really help people sort of change their mind automatically," Trump said in response to an audience member's question.
Trump has previously touted stop-and-frisk policies, but his full-throated endorsement of it Wednesday -- in which he called for its widespread implementation -- came as Trump pressed forward with his pitch to African-American voters, appearing at a predominantly black church alongside several of his prominent black surrogates.
NYC STOP-AND-FRISK WAS DEEMED UNCONSTITUTIONAL AND CRIME HAS GONE DOWN SINCE IT WAS CANCELLED.
There is no spoon.
The origins of gun control in America resulted from fear of black gun ownership during the civil rights era. Exactly the sort of policies that you're proposing evolved into outright bans.
Can you point out any examples in American history where policies aimed at depriving a particular type of Americans of a right did not then lead to the loss of that right for all Americans?
@TheCount
You understand what a hyperbole is, right?
Et cognoscetis veritatem et veritas liberabit vos
To repeat, no government can take our rights away. But most governments do not honor or recognize basic human rights, and free countries that stop doing so no longer function as free countries. You can preen "let them come and try to take them" all you want. Tell that to the Australians, 30% of whose gun owners lost their guns when draconian laws, sold as "common sense gun control" led to them being taken from them in the '90's.
Tell that to most people in most countries, whose governments never protected their right to gun ownership to begin with. Yes, they will always have gun rights, but yes, the state came and took their guns anyway. I want our country to remain free, as demonstrated by the nation defending the gun rights of its people, not the nothing burger of "knowing I have gun rights," while having no access to guns, in an unfree state. I want a something burger, not liberty that is all hat and preening, but no cattle.
Last edited by Peace&Freedom; 09-25-2016 at 09:30 PM.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
Translation: Cap is straw-manning again. I'm voting LP/Johnson, while knowing he does not have any realistic shot of winning. The topic is neither Hillary or Trump, but the ISSUE that a gun control interpretation of the 2nd amendment is about to be christened by the Supreme Court, depending on who the next Justice is. That is not fear-mongering, that is just the news.
Despising Trump does not change the facts. The fact is, the difference on this issue IS consequential, even if you despise both major candidates. It's not "justifying" voting for a certain candidate to simply point out what's about to happen, if that candidate does not win. Just don't complain afterwards---got that through your heads?
Last edited by Peace&Freedom; 09-25-2016 at 09:30 PM.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
It's not hyperbole when what you're saying is exactly what has been proposed by Trump and his surrogates.
yes
"Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it."
James Madison
"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." - Samuel Adams
Μολὼν λάβε
Dum Spiro, Pugno
Tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito
No government recognizes basic human rights. No country remains "free" for very long. My "preening" might be different from others. I do it daily and will not stop. What you "want" is for your political faction to give you lip service to the gun rights that you have, but abide on a ruling telling what is this and what is that. I'm not the dude. I don't abide. I go about my day.
You described the opposite of what I want, in order to promote a straw man that is the opposite of what I said. I don't want lip service, and my faction is the Founding Fathers, whose intent was to have a government that actually recognizes the rights we innately have, and could be actually countered if it did not. Is it too much to expect to enjoy the rights we already have, AND expect the explicit acknowledgement of them in a country's Constitution to be upheld, or redress to be available if it does not? It's a both-and, not either-or.
If the SC comes up with an unconstitutional ruling on guns or other rights, what I "want" is for the decision to be overturned, AND for Congress to remove the Court's jurisdiction if it's not, AND for the states to secede if the Courts or Congress won't restore recognition, AND for the People to stand up for their gun rights in any event. That's NOT "abiding," despite your mis-description. Blowing off institutional safeguards that affirm your liberties is not a good thing, as we need as many checks against state overreach as possible. Resisting seeing the checks eroded is part and parcel of a "I don't abide" mindset.
Just saying, as a practical matter, without such formal remedies, allowing the Court to get stacked such that it vacates the 2nd amendment will lead to massive restriction of gun ownership and access. The personal remedy of "from my cold dead hands" may NOT be enough to retain it, as it has shown to be not enough in most countries. The state will NOT let you go about your day, no matter what dude you are.
-----Peace & Freedom, John Clifton-----
Blog: https://electclifton.wordpress.com/2...back-backlash/
Remain free? When is the last time it was free? Before the Whiskey Rebellion?
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