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Thread: Thomas Massie may delay the bailout... Congress livid with him

  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    He isn't abusing his power, he is merely exercising it. He is demanding a roll call vote which is what needs to happen on a bill of this significance. If other members are too lazy to come back to town for the vote, that is their problem, not his.
    Exercise in power fruitlessly with possible unintended consequences is an abuse of power.



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  3. #92

    As Massie Slowly Opens the Curtain...

    Quote Originally Posted by JoshLowry View Post
    At this point, I think Rep. Massie should send a Tweet that he's not feeling suicidal, at all.
    "Then David said to the Philistine, 'You come to me with a sword, a spear, and a javelin, but I come to you in the name of Yahweh of hosts, the God of the battle lines of Israel, Whom you have reproached.'" - 1 Samuel 17:45

    "May future generations look back on our work and say that these were men and women who, in moment of great crisis, stood up to their politicians, the opinion-makers, and the Establishment, and saved their country." - Dr. Ron Paul

  4. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    No he isn't committing political suicide.

    Weeks later when we actually find out all of the details of the bill Massie will look like a prophet.
    If the majority of Americans thought like us, then Ron Paul would have been President.

  5. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    This bill isnt about whether people who are out of work during the pandemic dont oversaturate the hospitals and can pay rent because otherwise the over regulated government managed corporate monopoly on healthcare would be rationed even more and millions would die as a result of lack of healthcare because of the liberal establishment economic terrorism????
    Why, no. No, it isn't. All that crap was already done at the state and local level by local politicians responding to media-induced lemming panic.

    This bill is about pacifying the public with about $300 billion worth of freshly printed funny money while printing and passing out $5.7 trillion in corporate pork.

    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Exercise in power fruitlessly with possible unintended consequences is an abuse of power.
    Well, no, of course it isn't. Abuse of power is...

    Quote Originally Posted by dictionary.the law.com
    A misuse of power by someone in a position of authority who can use the leverage they have to oppress persons in an inferior position or to induce them to commit a wrongful act.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-27-2020 at 10:45 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  6. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by familydog View Post
    If the majority of Americans thought like us, then Ron Paul would have been President.
    Ron won re-election over and over in his district because people there understood him. Thomas can do the same.

    Running for president is different.

  7. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by sdsubball23 View Post
    I'm curious to know. What is the libertarian response to helping Americans who are in need financially during a difficult time such as this? If you guys don't support a stimulus bill such as this, what is the alternative?
    The libertarian response is charity and eliminating bureaucratic mismanagement of critical and limited supplies. Not to mention not shutting down the economy.

    Typically bailouts are to a directed few paid for by many.

    How do you bail out everyone? In other words, who pays for the bailout when everyone is being bailed out?

    I suppose that it could be feasible to wholesale the 390 million acres of land they are squandering but in reality they will just destroy the dollar, default on payment, use military might and hegemony to bully their way into staying relevant.

    But the world is not asleep and it takes just a few key areas for the realization that the emperor has no clothes.

    And then, sure as this pandemic has shown, the American people will gobble up VAT and etc. and gladly pay 60% to be considered as highly as serfs.

    Or they won’t. And in which case this pandemic will look like a free lunch.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump



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  9. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Why, no. No, it isn't. All that crap was already done at the state and local level by local politicians responding to media-induced lemming panic.

    This bill is about pacifying the public with about $300 billion worth of freshly printed funny money while printing and passing out $5.7 trillion in corporate pork.
    Are these corporations that employ ghosts? im sick and tired of this argument. This isnt the government picking winners we are all losers to the liberal establishment economic terrorists because they are using suicide bomb tactics.

  10. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    So vote for Biden?
    That would be even funnier than Trump’s presidency.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump

  11. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Are these corporations that employ ghosts? im sick and tired of this argument. This isnt the government picking winners we are all losers to the liberal establishment economic terrorists because they are using suicide bomb tactics.
    Do these corporations sell to ghosts? I'm sick and tired of people claiming apologetics like this are arguments. The government is still picking winners and losers. We, the People can only pick the winning companies when we're allowed to keep and spend the wealth we create.

    What's wrong? You afraid free people won't maintain a military larger and more expensive than all other militaries combined?
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-27-2020 at 10:53 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  12. #100
    Probably not a smart move by GOPA wing leadership:

    Trump calls for ousting GOP congressman from party ahead of coronavirus relief vote

    Rep. Thomas Massie has signaled that he could hold up House passage of the stimulus measure.

    Rep. Thomas Massie. | J. Scott Applewhite/AP Photo
    By QUINT FORGEY
    03/27/2020

    President Donald Trump on Friday called for ousting from the Republican Party a GOP congressman who has signaled that he could hold up an impending House vote on the Senate's $2 trillion coronavirus emergency relief package.
    "Looks like a third rate Grandstander named @RepThomasMassie, a Congressman from, unfortunately, a truly GREAT State, Kentucky, wants to vote against the new Save Our Workers Bill in Congress," Trump wrote on Twitter.

    https://www.politico.com/news/2020/0...us-vote-151523

  13. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord View Post
    Ron won re-election over and over in his district because people there understood him. Thomas can do the same.

    Running for president is different.
    Ron Paul also retired before Trump came into office. Mark Sanford's principled got him booted out of office once he got the ire of Trump. Let's not forget that Ron Paul brought home the pork to his constituents even though he voted against the bills.

  14. #102

    Argument Settled

    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Do these corporations sell to ghosts? The government is still picking winners and losers. We, the People can only pick the winning companies when we're allowed to keep the wealth we create.
    That ends the discussion. Anyone who attempts to challenge that should seriously rethink why he or she is a member of these forums.
    "Then David said to the Philistine, 'You come to me with a sword, a spear, and a javelin, but I come to you in the name of Yahweh of hosts, the God of the battle lines of Israel, Whom you have reproached.'" - 1 Samuel 17:45

    "May future generations look back on our work and say that these were men and women who, in moment of great crisis, stood up to their politicians, the opinion-makers, and the Establishment, and saved their country." - Dr. Ron Paul

  15. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by familydog View Post
    Ron Paul also retired before Trump came into office. Mark Sanford's principled got him booted out of office once he got the ire of Trump. Let's not forget that Ron Paul brought home the pork to his constituents even though he voted against the bills.
    Sanford didn't have Rand in his corner and many congressmen. I think if Trump tried to oust Thomas it will back fire. We'll see.

  16. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Why, no. No, it isn't. All that crap was already done at the state and local level by local politicians responding to media-induced lemming panic.

    This bill is about pacifying the public with about $300 billion worth of freshly printed funny money while printing and passing out $5.7 trillion in corporate pork.



    Well, no, of course it isn't. Abuse of power is...
    Why not take a figure of speech that has broad ambiguity in a language built on literal bastardization and claim that you can define it. I have just as much claim to this living language as you do so I am taking this back. Abuse of power in this context is abusing power not the legal definition. Abusing power is doing something that you have the power to do that has no actionable consequence on the consequence that may result in unintended consequences



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  18. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Warlord View Post
    Sanford didn't have Rand in his corner and many congressmen. I think if Trump tried to oust Thomas it will back fire. We'll see.
    Yes, we'll see.

  19. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Why not take a figure of speech that has broad ambiguity in a language built on literal bastardization and claim that you can define it. I have just as much claim to this living language as you do so I am taking this back. Abuse of power in this context is abusing power not the legal definition. Abusing power is doing something that you have the power to do that has no actionable consequence on the consequence that may result in unintended consequences
    No. It isn't. That's too far a stretch from what it ever meant before.

    It's the same thing as progressives redefining "local control of schools" as "opposition to education". It's pure propaganda.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  20. #107

    Great time for a Money Bomb! Stand with Massie!

    Strike while the iron is hot! Isn't that why they say?
    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...B-NOW!-3-27-20

  21. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Do these corporations sell to ghosts? I'm sick and tired of people claiming apologetics like this are arguments. The government is still picking winners and losers. We, the People can only pick the winning companies when we're allowed to keep and spend the wealth we create.

    What's wrong? You afraid free people won't maintain a military larger and more expensive than all other militaries combined?
    You must not work in the private sector. Most companies do business with other companies but most importantly help people pay rent. Small businesses and self employment disappeared when technologies allowed for global markets that pay peoples rents through better utilization of labor that results in less poverty. Most people would be out of work and productive labor would be taken over by foreign markets if corporations failed because people let the liberal medical industrial complex economic terrorists effectively rob them.

  22. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    At what human cost is it worth if the delay has unintended consequences and does not win any hearts ands minds to our cause. I would argue this is pointless and could delay medication or healthcare in a time of need.
    so basically throw the entire Constitution and the American republic into the toilet, because the media has made us afraid of a bug that is barely worse than the common cold? Yikes, comrade.

  23. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    You must not work in the private sector. Most companies do business with other companies...
    So what? And how does that factoid lead you to such a startlingly misleading conclusion?

    Let people keep their money and the winners will be companies that serve the people, or help other companies serve the people. Let government steal all the money and dole it out, and the only survivors--corporate or human--will be those who lick jackboots.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  24. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by sdsubball23 View Post
    I'm curious to know. What is the libertarian response to helping Americans who are in need financially during a difficult time such as this? If you guys don't support a stimulus bill such as this, what is the alternative?
    Modern Libertarians are mostly just weirdo baby killing democrats so they probably think they are getting more liberty by the govt shutting businesses against the will of the people and are in full support of whatever Pelosi says.

  25. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    so basically throw the entire Constitution and the American republic into the toilet, because the media has made us afraid of a bug that is barely worse than the common cold? Yikes, comrade.
    At what point would you disregard it was my question. Your argument implies that Massie can stop the bill or win hearts and minds. Your argument is an emotional liberal argument.



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  27. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Exercise in power fruitlessly
    Except that gaining a roll call vote is fruitful, not fruitless.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  28. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    At what point would you disregard it was my question. Your argument implies that Massie can stop the bill or win hearts and minds. Your argument is an emotional liberal argument.
    Libtards are playing with people's emotions by downplaying a disease which is killing one fifteenth as many victims as the flu and by defending the Constitution?. In what parallel universe?

    Did you make a mistake quoting Gunny? Shouldn't you have addressed that to your straw man?

    Are we letting a desire for making quick responses lead us to posting quantity over quality?

    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Except that gaining a roll call vote is fruitful, not fruitless.
    Unless one is a warmongering bootlicker who considers accountability in government to be fruity.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 03-27-2020 at 11:17 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  29. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Libtards are playing with people's emotions by downplaying a disease which is killing one fifteenth as many victims as the flu and by defending the Constitution?. In what parallel universe?

    Did you make a mistake quoting Gunny? Shouldn't you have addressed that to youe straw man?
    If foreign countries can buy up critical infrastructure because we let the medical industrial complex crash their business is great for national security - maybe Huawei can provide services to everyone because that's a good idea

  30. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by GunnyFreedom View Post
    so basically throw the entire Constitution and the American republic into the toilet, because the media has made us afraid of a bug that is barely worse than the common cold? Yikes, comrade.
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    If foreign countries can buy up critical infrastructure because we let the medical industrial complex crash their business is great for national security. Maybe Huawei can provide services to everyone because that's a good idea
    Filling hospital beds to overflowing with sick people is going to lead the health care industry to the kind of cash crisis that enables hostile takeovers?

    Can you demonstrate how that might work? Or is this just desperate, manipulative button-pushing?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  31. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Filling hospital beds to overflowing with sick people is going to lead the health care industry to the kind of cash crisis that enables hostile takeovers?

    Can you demonstrate how that might work? Or is this just desperate, manipulative button-pushing?
    Supplies and demand and price fixing. Most medical workers are over worked and under paid. They dont get hazard pay and they are the ones the most at risk. People die every day due to the fact that we have a rationing system and the numbers are astronomical and not counted. People dying from mistakes and malpractice or given bad medicine or lack of medicine so they can prop up the systems costs by basically being legal drug dealers.

  32. #118
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    What bums me out about things like this is that the main thing acomplished is the alienanation of libertarians from the mass of Republicans. The GOP is our best ally, for better or for worse. Choosing to create this battle won't change the outcome. It will burn bridges. I am not saying that Massie isn't right. I am saying this will be a net negative for his political power and influence.

    Emotion > Logic
    Citizen of Arizona
    @cleaner4d4

    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  33. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    At what point would you disregard it was my question.
    After the United States has gone extinct.

    Your argument implies that Massie can stop the bill or win hearts and minds. Your argument is an emotional liberal argument.
    My argument implies nothing of the kind. And you trying to call me a liberal is mind-bendingly ridiculous. That is a propaganda technique that was used extensively against Ron Paul in 2008 and 2012.

    The fact is that there is a lot more than just pork barrel spending in this thing. There are Pelosi agenda items that will completely transform this nation towards a socialist paradigm. When VoterID is banned nationwide, same day registration is required, and ballot harvesting is permitted, we will end up with Democrat supermajorities in both chambers and as President and it will be these Republicans and fearmongers that did it.

    GET THEM ON THE RECORD, and six month from now when everyone starts discovering the pure Marxist communist crap that was passed into law in this thing and start scrambling to undo it before their terms are up Massie will look like the hero he is, and some of these idiots will get fired.

    This coronavirus is as virulent as the common cold and as deadly as the common flu. There is nothing about it to justify this insane response. This whole thing is the Media gone batshyt crazy and we are going to literally destroy the American republic because of a basically normal seasonal bug?

    My God man, if we are supposed to be willing to turn this country into the Soviet Union because of a bad seasonal cold, is there ANYTHING we are supposed to stand for at all?

  34. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    What bums me out about things like this is that the main thing acomplished is the alienanation of libertarians from the mass of Republicans. The GOP is our best ally, for better or for worse. Choosing to create this battle won't change the outcome. It will burn bridges. I am not saying that Massie isn't right. I am saying this will be a net negative for his political power and influence.

    Emotion > Logic
    He is getting tons of support and donations. He is top of DRUDGE: http://www.drudgereport.com/

    If he was just another go along get along congressman he wouldn't get that attention.

    He is taking a stand, for you & me.



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