Venezuela; Guaido set to challenge military, import humanitarian aid

[angelatc]

https://news.yahoo.com/venezuela-opp...081321982.html

Venezuelan opposition leader Juan Guaido said he will defy a government ban on humanitarian aid by sending large convoys of medicine into the country with the help of neighboring nations.

Guaido explained that aid for Venezuela will include life-saving medicines that are scarce in Venezuela and will be transported by vehicles arriving at several border points, after it is shipped into "friendly ports" in neighboring countries.

[juleswin]

No matter how twitter and the western media companies tries to suppress anti imperialist info, people seem to be waking up. Top 2 comments so far

Pete J 4 hours ago
Venezuela has oil, andthe US needs cheaper oil. That's how both Repug and Dems define US interest and willing to undermine democracy anywhere for it. Oil interest and war-profiteers ready for intervene there. No surprise here.

Eclectic Mayhem 9 hours ago
Is that code for a shipment of US arms, sent to agitators in aid of a coup?

The US states is the serial rapist that is caught with a tied up, screaming lady with his dick out who wants you to believe that is time, just this time, she actually agreed to be tied up and play fantasy rape with him. Sorry neocons, at this point you have lost all credibility when it comes to interfering in the domestic affairs of other countries.

Only fools/dupes and immoral imperialists buy into your propaganda. This is the same country that is starving the people of Yemen by blockading their ports and preventing them from taking in humanitarian aid. They do not or have ever cared about the suffering of other people.

[angelatc]

No matter how twitter and the western media companies tries to suppress anti imperialist info, people seem to be waking up.

Oh look - suddenly Che is pissed about people getting free stuff. We can only assume it's because he's worried it might lead to more political support for the opposition.

Like it or not, your newest hero Maduro is literally killing his people by withholding food and medicine. That's a fact.

Like it or not, he banned all humanitarian aid. That's a fact.

And like it or not, daring to break the law by showing up with food and medicine is a promising politically winning strategy in that environment. One that your lazy communist ass has endorsed many times. In fact, that's exactly how Chavez won power - with the promise of less work and more free stuff.

Can't have that! So let's continue the absolute strawman "it's the Western imperialists coming for the oil!!!!!" chant instead of actually addressing the post.

(Psst: this will trigger you too: China has admitted to dialogue with Guaido.)

[specsaregood]

Venezuela has oil, andthe US needs cheaper oil. That's how both Repug and Dems define US interest and willing to undermine democracy anywhere for it. Oil interest and war-profiteers ready for intervene there. No surprise her

We don't really want their oil. Their oil is expensive to produce and refine, its heavy and takes special refineries. In fact, most of the refineries here have been spending money to switch their factories to refine the sweet crude tsunami coming out of the US nowadays.

[juleswin]

Oh look - suddenly Che is pissed about people getting free stuff. We can only assume it's because he's worried it might lead to more political support for the opposition.

Like it or not, your newest hero Maduro is literally killing his people by withholding food and medicine. That's a fact.

Like it or not, he banned all humanitarian aid. That's a fact.

And like it or not, daring to break the law by showing up with food and medicine is a promising politically winning strategy in that environment. One that your lazy communist ass has endorsed many times. In fact, that's exactly how Chavez won power - with the promise of less work and more free stuff.

Can't have that! So let's continue the absolute strawman "it's the Western imperialists coming for the oil!!!!!" chant instead of actually addressing the post.

(Psst: this will trigger you too: China has admitted to dialogue with Guaido.)

Some people know a little bit about Greek history. Just because someone is giving you something doesn't mean you should take it. The people of Troy suffered from that lesson so we wouldn't make that mistake again. Angeltc who just like his neocon pals couldn't give a shyte about the suffering of anyone now wants you to believe they now care. They learn nothing from the chaos they have caused in the world from their "charity" work and keep insisting that they need to do more

They didn't ban all humanitarian aid, they just banned humanitarian aid from their enemies. I don't know what leader who knows anything about history would allow such a gift. Also, Venezuela wouldn't need any aid if not for the sanction and economic warfare waged against her. Good move by Maduro, in times of external aggression, I am of the belief that citizens should put aside what differences they have and face the aggression. I will stand with you when such an attack comes to America, that is how much of a team player I am.

[juleswin]

We don't really want their oil. Their oil is expensive to produce and refine, its heavy and takes special refineries. In fact, most of the refineries here have been spending money to switch their factories to refine the sweet crude tsunami coming out of the US nowadays.

The Chineses don't mind it, the Russians are Ok with getting debt payment with it and the Turks and building refineries to refine it. Someone definitely wants it and if "we" don't want it, then why was John Bolton talking about getting US oil companies into the country and talking about how it would be good for the US and Venezuelan people?

Sorry but the neocons totally want their hands on that oil.

[specsaregood]

The Chineses don't mind it, the Russians are Ok with getting debt payment with it and the Turks and building refineries to refine it. Someone definitely wants it and if "we" don't want it, then why was John Bolton talking about getting US oil companies into the country and talking about how it would be good for the US and Venezuelan people?

Sorry but the neocons totally want their hands on that oil.

I don't see it. As to Bolton, that schmuck will say whatever he thinks will cause his opposition to be the most irate.

[juleswin]

I don't see it. As to Bolton, that schmuck will say whatever he thinks will cause his opposition to be the most irate.

So, is it your point that the Venezuela oil has no market value? Cos I am not seeing how a US oil company can't make money mining and selling it.

[specsaregood]

So, is it your point that the Venezuela oil has no market value? Cos I am not seeing how a US oil company can't make money mining and selling it.

I didn't say "no" market value. But when are already producing more than we consume, and have more capacity than we can even handle with our existing pipelines, and thousands of tapped and ready to go holes, then the US itself doesn't really want it or need it.

But you have a point, others may want it. And that might give us a real ulterior motive.

[juleswin]

I didn't say "no" market value. But when are already producing more than we consume, and have more capacity than we can even handle with our existing pipelines, and thousands of tapped and ready to go holes, then the US itself doesn't really want it or need it.

But you have a point, others may want it. And that might give us a real ulterior motive.

What are you talking about? its a natural resource that is in demand by everybody, just because we produce enough oil that we need to imprt it doesn't mean we have no need for surplus oil. For one, surplus goods is sold to the market, to international markets. The US defintely needs the oil or rather control of it to continue with their world domination.

You control vital natural resources such as oil and you damn well control the world. The US may not even be stealing the profit(I think they would be in this case) but just the control of it is just as important to a super power like the US as the profits.

[specsaregood]

What are you talking about? its a natural resource that is in demand by everybody, just because we produce enough oil that we need to imprt it doesn't mean we have no need for surplus oil. For one, surplus goods is sold to the market, to international markets. The US defintely needs the oil or rather control of it to continue with their world domination.

You control vital natural resources such as oil and you damn well control the world. The US may not even be stealing the profit(I think they would be in this case) but just the control of it is just as important to a super power like the US as the profits.

The quote you posted was:
"Venezuela has oil, andthe US needs cheaper oil. "
We don't need cheaper oil and we don't need their oil. Hell, their oil capacity has diminished greatly since the state took over.
Hell, we are probably in a better place keeping the current conditions in place and their production decreasing.

[angelatc]

They didn't ban all humanitarian aid, they just banned humanitarian aid from their enemies.

This is just wrong. First of all, it's wrong.

Second, if it were true, that would mean he was simultaneously screaming about US export bans while defending them for blocking imports from the US.

Commie logic is lazy.

[angelatc]

So, is it your point that the Venezuela oil has no market value? Cos I am not seeing how a US oil company can't make money mining and selling it.

It's pretty obvious that anybody except a socialist can make money mining and selling oil. Even the monarchy did not $#@! it up like Chavez and Maduro did.

[juleswin]

The quote you posted was:
"Venezuela has oil, andthe US needs cheaper oil. "
We don't need cheaper oil and we don't need their oil. Hell, their oil capacity has diminished greatly since the state took over.
Hell, we are probably in a better place keeping the current conditions in place and their production decreasing.

I stand corrected, the US doesn't necessarily need cheap oil or the oil for their own use, just control of it. I am looking now for information on google. But at one time during Chavez leadership, their national oil company was number #2 in the world and that was the time they went on a buying spree. Buying oil refineries around the world (CITCO) and giving away money like there is no tomorrow. Their production capacity did not just go down with Chavez, it went up and down.

[angelatc]

I stand corrected, the US doesn't necessarily need cheap oil or the oil for their own use, just control of it. I am looking now for information on google. But at one time during Chavez leadership, their national oil company was number #2 in the world and that was the time they went on a buying spree. Buying oil refineries around the world (CITCO) and giving away money like there is no tomorrow. Their production capacity did not just go down with Chavez, it went up and down.

Like we showed you in at least 2 other threads, production went down after Chavez fired all the actual oil workers and replaced them with his cronies.

[juleswin]

It's pretty obvious that anybody except a socialist can make money mining and selling oil. Even the (Hardcore socialist) monarchy did not $#@! it up like Chavez and Maduro did.

Wait a minute, wasn't it just yesterday that you were on this forum arguing how hardcore socialist Saudi Arabia is a failed country but, now you are using that hardcore socialist country to attack another midling socialist country just so you can defend your neocon buddies. Only god knows the argument you will be making come tomorrow.

And when I say hardcore, i am talking about free education, healthcare, mortgage assistance program like you cannot imagine, housing aid, food aid, childcare benefits etc etc. Policies that would make Bernie and AOC blush.

[specsaregood]

I stand corrected, the US doesn't necessarily need cheap oil or the oil for their own use, just control of it. I am looking now for information on google. But at one time during Chavez leadership, their national oil company was number #2 in the world and that was the time they went on a buying spree. Buying oil refineries around the world (CITCO) and giving away money like there is no tomorrow. Their production capacity did not just go down with Chavez, it went up and down.

It started going down when he expropriated the oil companies assets. The companies he had courted to come in and invest in building up the capacity. In 2007.

[juleswin]

It started going down when he expropriated the oil companies assets. The companies he had courted to come in and invest in building up the capacity. In 2007.

Not true, look at the graph of their oil production since 2000. It only dipped in 2002-2003 during the oil strikes when Chavez fired all experts and put in his people. It didn't actually dip until around 2015 during the first Obama sanctions coincidence?



https://tradingeconomics.com/venezue...oil-production

Unless u have some other evidence to show me, your information is just wrong

[angelatc]

Not true, look at the graph of their oil production since 2000. It only dipped in 2002-2003 during the oil strikes when Chavez fired all experts and put in his people. It didn't actually dip until around 2015 during the first Obama sanctions coincidence?



https://tradingeconomics.com/venezue...oil-production

Unless u have some other evidence to show me, your information is just wrong

To be technical, it's been in a decline since 1998. Because commies suck at producing anything. They are parasites.

If I remember, I'll super impose this over a chart of oil prices. Commies hate this one small trick!!!

[juleswin]

To be technical, it's been in a decline since 1998. Because commies suck at producing anything. They are parasites.

If I remember, I'll super impose this over a chart of oil prices. Commies hate this one small trick!!!

And when it went down in the 80s, I am sure that was also the commies. The way I look at it, if it was just the commies taking over, we would have seen a steady decline from when they took over in the charts. Makes you wonder what would have happened if the US didn't start economic war on the country.

I see you still haven't address the 2002 coup attempt, why is that? Do u not have an answer for it? Btw, CIA or not, the same people trying to get him out now were trying to get him out back then.

[specsaregood]

Unless u have some other evidence to show me, your information is just wrong

It didn't happen immediately. It went down as expertise left and further investments didn't occur.
Here is some good reading on the subject: https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier...-oil-industry/

There were many pundits that predicted this exact chain of events a decade ago.

[juleswin]

It didn't happen immediately. It went down as expertise left and further investments didn't occur.
Here is some good reading on the subject: https://www.forbes.com/sites/rrapier...-oil-industry/

There were many pundits that predicted this exact chain of events a decade ago.

Well, that not what you said. It seems like it took sanctions from the US for it to really take a hit in its oil output, before then its was maintaining what seems to be its average level. Remember, the old workers were fired in 2003/2004. So it took the new guys over a decade to screw up and that just happened coincide with sanction?

Not buying it.

[angelatc]

Makes you wonder what would have happened if the US didn't start economic war on the country.

.

COMMIE SCUM:WE ARE NOT GOING TO ALLOW ANYONE TO IMPORT ANYTHING

ALSO COMMIE SCUM: WE ARE DYING BECAUSE THE US WILL NOT SELL US ANYTHING

Answer the question, Commie Scum. The Mission Statement says the rights of the people are being infringed upon because they're not allowed to engage is free trade.

Why aren't you supporting the right of the people to trade freely?

Commie scum sucker?

[specsaregood]

Well, that not what you said. It seems like it took sanctions from the US for it to really take a hit in its oil output, before then its was maintaining what seems to be its average level. Remember, the old workers were fired in 2003/2004. So it took the new guys over a decade to screw up and that just happened coincide with sanction?

Not buying it.

Ok, instead of "it started going down", I should have said, "The process that caused it to go down started in 2007". congrats.

[angelatc]

Well, that not what you said. It seems like it took sanctions from the US for it to really take a hit in its oil output, before then its was maintaining what seems to be its average level. Remember, the old workers were fired in 2003/2004. So it took the new guys over a decade to screw up and that just happened coincide with sanction?

Not buying it.

Thanks for asking. It's so refreshing to meet someone so willing to admit that they're in serious denial about everything they want so desperately to believe.



But they couldn't deliver because socialists can't produce anything except dissent:



And here's an interesting chart about that invisible economic war that exists in the Commie Scum mind. My God - those poor people. We are buying more of their oil than the rest of the world. And it isn't enough, because the socialists will never be satiated. Up until last week, we were buying 41% of their oil.

[angelatc]

Ok, instead of "it started going down", I should have said, "The process that caused it to go down started in 2007". congrats.

He can bitch all he wants to, but production has never achieved it's pre-Chavez levels.

[juleswin]

Thanks for asking. It's so refreshing to meet someone so willing to admit that they're in serious denial about everything they want so desperately to believe.



But they couldn't deliver because socialists can't produce anything except dissent:



And here's an interesting chart about that invisible economic war that exists in the Commie Scum mind. My God - those poor people. We are buying more of their oil than the rest of the world. And it isn't enough, because the socialists will never be satiated. Up until last week, we were buying 41% of their oil.

That is a one weird looking production graph. Before 2000, it looks very stable but for some reason, after that we start to see a lot of up and down in very short intervals. Makes me wonder if its not being manipulated or if the data changed after that. Where did u get your graph from?

I have to commend you for staying this long, I was expecting you to run from the discussion by now. Normally your kind don't last too long in a debate with someone who not afraid to challenge them. You are more devout in your ideology than I had expected.

[Swordsmyth]

I have to commend you for staying this long, I was expecting you to run from the discussion by now. Normally your kind don't last too long in a debate with someone who not afraid to challenge them. You are more devout in your ideology than I had expected.

Your kind does rely on people getting tired of refuting your lies, unfortunately for you most people can tell who is right even when you get the last word.

[angelatc]

That is a one weird looking production graph. Before 2000, it looks very stable but for some reason, after that we start to see a lot of up and down in very short intervals. Makes me wonder if its not being manipulated or if the data changed after that. Where did u get your graph from?

I have to commend you for staying this long, I was expecting you to run from the discussion by now. Normally your kind don't last too long in a debate with someone who not afraid to challenge them. You are more devout in your ideology than I had expected.

My ideology being the truth, you mean.

http://crudeoilpeak.info/venezuela-peak

Since you brought up the possibility of the numbers being manipulated, I'll post this one that I originally omitted because it's somewhat dated. It certainly indicates the numbers are being manipulated, but as usual it's the commie scum spreading lies.

Since 2002/03 (the strike where everybody got fired), nobody else seems to report that Venezuela was producing as much oil as Venezuela was claiming to produce. But it's all an American plot to blah blah blah the blah blah blah...

[juleswin]

My ideology being the truth, you mean.

http://crudeoilpeak.info/venezuela-peak

Since you brought up the possibility of the numbers being manipulated, I'll post this one that I originally omitted because it's somewhat dated. It certainly indicates the numbers are being manipulated, but as usual it's the commie scum spreading lies.

Since 2002/03 (the strike where everybody got fired), nobody else seems to report that Venezuela was producing as much oil as Venezuela was claiming to produce. But it's all an American plot to blah blah blah the blah blah blah...

Yea, those spikes in that last graph you posted threw me off. Its like they are using different data collecting methods after 2000. Now, it looks like this is getting to be the battling of the dueling data and I am not sure who to believe anymore. You believe the data from the govt of the mixed economy country is wrong and I think its possible but I also think it is also possible that the western connected insitituion could easily be lying about Venezuela.

See, I am not as dogmatic and bone headed as you are. All this is besides the point cos we are giving the US govt who has openly talked about taking over countries and jacking their natural resources the benefit of the doubt. They have lost all credibility when it comes to meddling in the internal affairs of other countries. So, even if it was revealed tomorrow that Maduro is Hitler, American and its allies should still back off. Yep, @Swordsmyth Maduro doesn't have to be a saint for me to support his fight against the imperialist powers.