Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 31 to 60 of 61

Thread: H.R.4980: Permanent No-Fly Grounding For Unvaccinated

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    LOL. Excuse me. You can't avoid the nudie scanner if you don't mind being physically raped or having your fingerprints scanned every time you travel. Seriously dude...that...that's your argument? Okay.
    I don't think a pat down is an unreasonable General Welfare security measure before boarding an aircraft. I've never been "raped" by one but maybe @cjm can elaborate on that since he opts out every time. I'm not aware of any finger scans being required of all passengers as a condition of flying. Do you have info on that?

    I was "wrong" about the nudie scanner. BUT YOU ARE WRONG AS HELL ABOUT THE BILL OF RIGHTS! Nothing in the Bill Of Rights suggests that as long as you are given some choice about how your rights are violated that they are somehow not violated.
    That's the difference I guess. I think some reasonable security measures to ensure one person can't kill 300 others with one solitary action are reasonably acceptable under General Welfare. I'm as constitutionally minded as anyone can be but never felt that was an over-reach, especially since the plane itself is private property. Yes, it has morphed from airlines providing the security service for their property over to TSA and that's bad in general because big govt but pat downs and metal detectors were happening regardless of whether it was private security or the feds doing it.

    Right to a trial by jury? Well you can either plead guilty or face a military tribunal. There you go.
    Or just decline to appear as the physical surety of the ALL CAPS NAME by filing official notice, but that's for a different thread.

    You have an "alternative" so your "rights" were not violated. The right to travel isn't even listed in the Bill Of Rights. That's why there is a 9th and 10th amendment. A refresher for you.
    Freedom of association (how can you associate if travel is restricted?) and ironically, the Commerce Clause, plus courts have always upheld that freedom of movement is a guaranteed right.

    Even some outfit named Bloomberg Law (the Bloomberg?) recognizes it.
    https://news.bloomberglaw.com/us-law...of-movement-44
    Back to the actual subject at hand. I'm sure there will be "alternatives" and "exceptions" to H.R.4980, but they will be so bad that most people will be like "I might as well just take the damn vaccine." They didn't do "alternatives" because to the rapescans because they thought that was what was needed to pass constitutional muster. They did the alternatives because they knew gullible people would say to themselves "This isn't so bad...because I have alternatives."
    No one said exercising rights would always be easy. In fact, the Founders warned that eventually it wouldn't be. .....if you can keep it......
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #32
    Two cosponsors. Richie Torres NYC and Ed Case, Hawaii. This is what enemies of the people look like.



    https://ritchietorres.house.gov/



    https://case.house.gov/
    Last edited by James_Madison_Lives; 08-23-2021 at 05:25 PM.



  4. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  5. #33
    Religious or health exemptions. Learn how to use them.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  6. #34
    I'll probably start a new thread on it but are any long-time, trustable RPF members experienced web developers who are interested in joining me to set up a site designed to support people who did no wish to be Monsanto corn? I have reserved a domain name and I think it could become a great resource for anyone seeking out a support network outside of the censored usual social media outlets. Of course, hosting would have to be carefully selected (if not server-in-the-bathroom-Hillary-style) and other considerations but it has potential to help a lot of people. Send me a pm if so.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by sparebulb View Post
    I will put that in the "Never could happen in America" file.
    Right next to "indefinite detention of US citizens designated 'edemy bombatants', without right to habeas corpus hearing; rolling back 1,000 years of moral, legal and judicial progress in Western civilization..." Vax passports for flights would be nothing by comparison. Might put a crimp on Cruz's flights out to Cancun, though.
    Last edited by ClaytonB; 08-23-2021 at 05:48 PM.
    Jer. 11:18-20. "The Kingdom of God has come upon you." -- Matthew 12:28

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I don't think a pat down is an unreasonable General Welfare security measure before boarding an aircraft. I've never been "raped" by one but maybe @cjm can elaborate on that since he opts out every time. I'm not aware of any finger scans being required of all passengers as a condition of flying. Do you have info on that?
    Rights are not subject to a "some jackass think's it's reasonable" test. You probably aren't attractive enough for some TSA agent to want to hand rape you. There have definitely been attractive women who have claimed that they seem to get picked for the pat down more often than not. Also the point about the finger scans clearly went over your head, though I don't know why. You are given a "choice."

    Edit: And here is a story where TSA agents admitted they selected attractive women for pat downs so they could feel them up. But I guess that's okay for the "general welfare."

    https://www.thesun.ie/travel/1296993...for-pat-downs/

    1) Get the rapescan.

    2) Get the pat down.

    3) Do the trusted traveller program which involves getting finger scanned.

    And here is the information about the finger scanning part of the program. I don't have to ask @cjm about it. I can just read about it from the official government website.

    At airports, program members proceed to Global Entry kiosks, present their machine-readable passport or U.S. permanent resident card, place their fingerprints on the scanner for fingerprint verification and complete a customs declaration. The kiosk issues the traveler a transaction receipt and directs the traveler to baggage claim and the exit.

    I'm sure next vaccine verification will be added to "trusted traveler."

    That's the difference I guess. I think some reasonable security measures to ensure one person can't kill 300 others with one solitary action are reasonably acceptable under General Welfare.
    Yeah, your lack of knowledge about what really happened with 9/11 and other terror attacks is the difference. The CIA purposefully let many of the hijackers in from Saudi Arabia. The "underwear bomber's" father told the U.S. government before his son got on the plane that he thought his son was a terrorist. The Obama administration had to admit before the senate that they were tracking him before he got on the plane and they let him on anyway. There was an FBI informant that built the bomb that damaged the World Trade Center in 1993. If you don't understand that then any violations of your civil liberties seems "reasonable." Hell, using your "logic" it's perfectly reasonable to bar people from flying who haven't been vaccinated because maybe the measure might save lives. So why are you playing dishonest games and pretending that the "alternatives" make the unconstitutional constitutional when you would be just as fine with a single measure that nobody could opt out of because it's "reasonable" to "save lives?"

    No one said exercising rights would always be easy. In fact, the Founders warned that eventually it wouldn't be. .....if you can keep it......
    Accepting unnecessary and unconstitutional pat downs is NOT exercising rights! You are doing the opposite of what the founders did. While the rest of us are trying to see how we can fight this latest intrusion on our rights, you are busy making excuses for the intrusion on our rights by saying "Well you can opt for a pat down and I don't think it's so bad." Most people would rather be rapescanned then patted down. They consider it more "reasonable." It certainly takes less time. Rolling over and accepting whatever new imposition the government comes up with to "save lives" when it's the same government actors that are causing the problem in the first place is not "exercising rights." It's bending over and asking if they'll use Vaseline this time.



    Freedom of association (how can you associate if travel is restricted?) and ironically, the Commerce Clause, plus courts have always upheld that freedom of movement is a guaranteed right.

    Even some outfit named Bloomberg Law (the Bloomberg?) recognizes it.
    https://news.bloomberglaw.com/us-law...of-movement-44
    Freedom of association is not spelled out in the Bill Of Rights. Question. Have you ever actually sat down and read the Bill Of Rights? The First Amendment guarantees the right of the people to peaceably assemble. You don't have to be able to fly to peaceably assemble. In fact you don't have to fly to be able to travel. Using your stupid "You still have a right as long as you have an alternative" argument, there's no reason people should have a right to fly since they can always drive. And since the creation of the "no fly" list, your right to fly has been effectively suspended because you can be put on a no fly list without due process.
    Last edited by jmdrake; 08-23-2021 at 06:58 PM.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  9. #37
    So only SUPER SPREADERS can get on airplanes... Let me think about this for a sec... Im unvaccinated? And I cant fly? With planes of ONLY SUPER SPREADERS? Yep, im good with that!

    /sarcasm

    Slightly more realistic, I now CHOOSE to NEVER FLY because they are ALL OF THEM SUPER SPREADERS.
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    There have definitely been attractive women who have claimed that they seem to get picked for the pat down more often than not.
    Al Qaeda is known to use hot attractive women to smuggle explosives.

    They have to be screened extra carefully.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Rights are not subject to a "some jackass think's it's reasonable" test. You probably aren't attractive enough for some TSA agent to want to hand rape you. There have definitely been attractive women who have claimed that they seem to get picked for the pat down more often than not. Also the point about the finger scans clearly went over your head, though I don't know why. You are given a "choice."

    Edit: And here is a story where TSA agents admitted they selected attractive women for pat downs so they could feel them up. But I guess that's okay for the "general welfare."
    Jer. 11:18-20. "The Kingdom of God has come upon you." -- Matthew 12:28

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by DamianTV View Post

    Slightly more realistic, I now CHOOSE to NEVER FLY because they are ALL OF THEM SUPER SPREADERS.
    A closed space with recycled air,, and Various Protein Spike Shedding passengers in close proximity.

    Less Glamorous than it seems.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



  13. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Did it ever occur to you that getting you to sign up for the trusted traveller program was the plan all along? "Oh goody! I circumvented the system....by giving them exactly what they wanted."
    If you're suggesting that I thought I was outwitting them, I assure that's not true. Like all government encroachment, there's a damned if you do, damned if you don't element to all of this. I chose the least of several evils. No "goody" from me.


    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I don't think a pat down is an unreasonable General Welfare security measure before boarding an aircraft. I've never been "raped" by one but maybe @cjm can elaborate on that since he opts out every time. I'm not aware of any finger scans being required of all passengers as a condition of flying. Do you have info on that?
    I have TSA pre-check, so no pat-downs unless I get flagged (very rare) and no finger scans. If I get a pat down, it doesn't seem like much to me, but I grew up playing contact sports and don't get worked up if someone touches my leg. I understand others would have a different opinion. I've been patted down by police on the street and concert security at shows and those have been more thorough. It's an annoyance when it happens, but with the pre-check, it almost never happens. Maybe once or twice a year.
    .

    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    ...And here is the information about the finger scanning part of the program. I don't have to ask @cjm about it. I can just read about it from the official government website.

    At airports, program members proceed to Global Entry kiosks, present their machine-readable passport or U.S. permanent resident card, place their fingerprints on the scanner for fingerprint verification and complete a customs declaration. The kiosk issues the traveler a transaction receipt and directs the traveler to baggage claim and the exit.
    Global Entry is a different program. I don't know anything about that, I just have TSA pre-check. Global Entry lines seem to get processed ahead of pre-check. I only provide a boarding pass and a government ID when I board, same as genpop. I just get to keep my shoes, belt, and jacket on, get a metal detector instead of the porno-scanner, and that's about it.

    As for finger "scans," I did have to submit a fingerprint or five on the initial application -- I don't recall if it was just a thumb or all fingers from one hand. I know many will see that as "privacy rape" but fedgov already has prints of all ten of my fingers. I didn't provide them anything they didn't already have.

    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    I'm sure next vaccine verification will be added to "trusted traveler."
    Masks are enough for me. I can't sit there for hours with a mask on, so I'll probably never fly again. And I'll never take the jab, so that'll restrict work opportunities going forward.


    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    A closed space with recycled air,, and Various Protein Spike Shedding passengers in close proximity.

    Less Glamorous than it seems.
    No kidding. When people hear about some of the places I've been, they think it's a glamorous life. But these are all work trips and most are not fun (which is why we call it "work"). Even if the work itself is ok, you're still burning time in airports and on planes with strangers while your kids are growing up and your friends are playing basketball or meeting up for happy hour. You expose yourself to the flu/cold every year. Silver lining -- my nutritional renaissance started because of this lifestyle. I've been mega-dosing C and taking other supplements for years prior to the 'rona. But yeah, I'm not interested in exposing myself the the jab shedders either.
    “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want and deserve to get it good and hard.”

    H.L. Mencken

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by cjm View Post
    If you're suggesting that I thought I was outwitting them, I assure that's not true. Like all government encroachment, there's a damned if you do, damned if you don't element to all of this. I chose the least of several evils. No "goody" from me.
    Okay. As you know the lesser of evils is still evil. For me the lesser of evils is the rapescans. My point is that the fact that you get to choose your lesser evil and I get to choose my lesser evil doesn't mean this isn't an encroachment on the right to travel. This "You can't fly unless you are vaccinated" mandate is no much more of a restriction then what's already been allowed. If we are going to stop it, it has to be stopped now. We can't count on the Courts to rule this law unconstitutional. I don't know how much clearer I can be on the subject.

    I have TSA pre-check, so no pat-downs unless I get flagged (very rare) and no finger scans. If I get a pat down, it doesn't seem like much to me, but I grew up playing contact sports and don't get worked up if someone touches my leg. I understand others would have a different opinion. I've been patted down by police on the street and concert security at shows and those have been more thorough. It's an annoyance when it happens, but with the pre-check, it almost never happens. Maybe once or twice a year.
    You're male right? (I'm guessing because you said contact sports but women do play rugby and some are now playing tackle football). In that case this doesn't apply to you.

    https://www.thesun.ie/travel/1296993...for-pat-downs/

    The funny thing with rights is that their violation is never even handed.

    Global Entry is a different program. I don't know anything about that, I just have TSA pre-check. Global Entry lines seem to get processed ahead of pre-check. I only provide a boarding pass and a government ID when I board, same as genpop. I just get to keep my shoes, belt, and jacket on, get a metal detector instead of the porno-scanner, and that's about it.

    As for finger "scans," I did have to submit a fingerprint or five on the initial application -- I don't recall if it was just a thumb or all fingers from one hand. I know many will see that as "privacy rape" but fedgov already has prints of all ten of my fingers. I didn't provide them anything they didn't already have.
    The feds have a lot of people's DNA too. That doesn't mean I'm fine with them getting more. But DNA samples for travel will probably be coming eventually.

    Masks are enough for me. I can't sit there for hours with a mask on, so I'll probably never fly again. And I'll never take the jab, so that'll restrict work opportunities going forward.
    I hear ya! I had to take the flu shot last year for a short term job at a hospital. That same hospital just a few months before let me do a similar job with the flu jab. I think they were gearing up to do a COVID vaccine mandate and someone pointed out to them that if they didn't do a flu shot mandate first that would look suspicous.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I don't think a pat down is an unreasonable General Welfare security measure before boarding an aircraft.
    Wait...wut?

    You're the fellow who tells me all the time that I'm failing at liberty because I won't ride around with homemade paper plates on my car to avoid registration.

    But physically putting hands on me, including my genitals, as a condition to travel, is perfectly OK?
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21
    I don't think a pat down is an unreasonable General Welfare security measure before boarding an aircraft.
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Wait...wut?

    You're the fellow who tells me all the time that I'm failing at liberty because I won't ride around with homemade paper plates on my car to avoid registration.

    But physically putting hands on me, including my genitals, as a condition to travel, is perfectly OK?
    I just did a wut yikes too :-O
    ____________

    An Agorist Primer ~ Samuel Edward Konkin III (free PDF download)

    The End of All Evil ~ Jeremy Locke (free PDF download)

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Okay. As you know the lesser of evils is still evil. For me the lesser of evils is the rapescans. My point is that the fact that you get to choose your lesser evil and I get to choose my lesser evil doesn't mean this isn't an encroachment on the right to travel. This "You can't fly unless you are vaccinated" mandate is no much more of a restriction then what's already been allowed. If we are going to stop it, it has to be stopped now. We can't count on the Courts to rule this law unconstitutional. I don't know how much clearer I can be on the subject.
    Not disagreeing with you, just addressing the idea that I might be happy (the "goody" comment) with the situation. I'm not. Just making the best of a crappy situation. That's why I referred to it as a racket.

    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    You're male right? ...
    Correct, I don't fit any profile that pervs want to fondle. They want me out of there just as fast as I do. Funny thing is, I was more put off by the indignity of taking off my shoes than the pat down. I paid the 85 FRNs or whatever it was just to keep my shoes on and go through a metal detector instead of the cancer box.

    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    The feds have a lot of people's DNA too. That doesn't mean I'm fine with them getting more. But DNA samples for travel will probably be coming eventually.
    I was only "fine" with the prints because that was the lesser of evils. I don't celebrate any of this, I'm just trying to add personal first-hand experience to the conversation since some elements of the air travel programs seem to be unclear.


    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    I hear ya! I had to take the flu shot last year for a short term job at a hospital. That same hospital just a few months before let me do a similar job with the flu jab. I think they were gearing up to do a COVID vaccine mandate and someone pointed out to them that if they didn't do a flu shot mandate first that would look suspicous.
    My annual flu shot is a Jaegermeister. My covid shots are the same. Just got my second covid shot last week. I'm not a regular Jaeger guy, just one or two at the start of cold/flu season to kill the germs and provide more protection than the kill shots.
    “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want and deserve to get it good and hard.”

    H.L. Mencken

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Wait...wut?

    You're the fellow who tells me all the time that I'm failing at liberty because I won't ride around with homemade paper plates on my car to avoid registration.

    But physically putting hands on me, including my genitals, as a condition to travel, is perfectly OK?
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    I just did a wut yikes too :-O
    Gotta pick your battles sometimes. The main difference being that the car is your property, the plane is not.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Gotta pick your battles sometimes. The main difference being that the car is your property, the plane is not.
    It is Tax Dollars, where the .gov is supposed to abide by and uphold the Bill of Rights.

    If private charter wanted to search me on condition of ticket sale/boarding, that is a different matter.
    ____________

    An Agorist Primer ~ Samuel Edward Konkin III (free PDF download)

    The End of All Evil ~ Jeremy Locke (free PDF download)

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Gotta pick your battles sometimes. The main difference being that the car is your property, the plane is not.
    Depends.

    What has happened is that govt has interfered with the natural interactions between people. Lets take a plane since it is the topic. Instead of a mega corporation that has 1000 planes and 100k employees (just making up numbers), its one guy with one plane. What ever the owner of that plane and his passenger agree on, that establishes precedent. Govt now interferes with that natural relationship.

    It wont stop at planes.

    - First, its the No Fly list
    - Then its the No Gun Ownership list (which is next)
    - Then its the No Ground Travel list
    - Then its the No Work list
    - Then its the No Buy list
    - Then its the No Spend list (you do not own your own money)
    - Then its the DO NOT FEED list
    - Then its the DO NOT ALLOW TO LIVE list.

    We are at No Fly. Our next step after No Fly is that a proposed (not yet law) bill will take anyone on the No Fly list and put them on No Gun Ownership list. Thats what they really want. Then they can ramp this $#@! up to 11 as fast as they want and there will be NO stopping them.

    Australia is already at DO NOT FEED list. Thats right, it is already ILLEGAL in Australia to FEED an Anti Vaxxer.

    For those of you that think they will ever relax from this Lockdown without an out right CIVIL WAR, think again. They are NEVER lifting the boot off your face.

    "Now, imagine a boot stomping on the face of humanity. Forever."
    1776 > 1984

    The FAILURE of the United States Government to operate and maintain an
    Honest Money System , which frees the ordinary man from the clutches of the money manipulators, is the single largest contributing factor to the World's current Economic Crisis.

    The Elimination of Privacy is the Architecture of Genocide

    Belief, Money, and Violence are the three ways all people are controlled

    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Our central bank is not privately owned.



  22. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  23. #49
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!

    Short Income Tax Video

    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Wait...wut?

    You're the fellow who tells me all the time that I'm failing at liberty because I won't ride around with homemade paper plates on my car to avoid registration.

    But physically putting hands on me, including my genitals, as a condition to travel, is perfectly OK?
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Anti Federalist again.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    It is Tax Dollars, where the .gov is supposed to abide by and uphold the Bill of Rights.

    If private charter wanted to search me on condition of ticket sale/boarding, that is a different matter.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to PAF again.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  26. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Gotta pick your battles sometimes. The main difference being that the car is your property, the plane is not.
    Sorry, but calling this "picking your battles" is a cop out. There is zero risk to writing/calling your congressperson and saying "Vote hell no on HR 4980" and/or saying "vote hell yes on Rand Paul's proposal to end the TSA." To @Anti Federalist's point, if you drive around with made up tags on your car you risk being pulled over and having an encounter with officer friendly that might not go your way. And technically the airport is your property because your tax dollars paid for it. The truly private airfields have no TSA requirement.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Gotta pick your battles sometimes. The main difference being that the car is your property, the plane is not.
    If I was in a rental car, I would still have what passes for basic rights, including not to be frisked and searched without probable cause.

    And yes, you do have to pick your battles.

    I choose not to be harassed and arrested and impounded every time I drive off my property.

    For 15 years I fought a running battle with IRS, including getting arrested, until I had little kids and realized that having cops drag daddy off to prison on regular basis for not paying Uncle Sucker his blood money would not be good for them.

    We all make those choices, I'd just gently suggest to you that, just because somebody made a different choice about what hill to die on, doesn't necessarily now make them a statist toolbag.

    I have a great deal of respect for those who do, like you, or those who are still fighting the IRS.

    As things in my life are winding down, and nothing much to look forward to, my hill is now these ever-$#@!ing vaccines.

    That is the line that will not be crossed.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 08-24-2021 at 07:47 PM.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Sorry, but calling this "picking your battles" is a cop out. There is zero risk to writing/calling your congressperson and saying "Vote hell no on HR 4980" and/or saying "vote hell yes on Rand Paul's proposal to end the TSA." To @Anti Federalist's point, if you drive around with made up tags on your car you risk being pulled over and having an encounter with officer friendly that might not go your way. And technically the airport is your property because your tax dollars paid for it. The truly private airfields have no TSA requirement.
    Just and correct.

    You could make the case that the airlines are ours as well, seeing how many billions we've paid to bail them out over the years.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  29. #55
    I will travel by balloon
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  30. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by cjm View Post
    Global Entry is a different program. I don't know anything about that, I just have TSA pre-check.
    Global Entry is pre check but for customs and immigration.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.



  31. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    That was a great video. Thanks for posting. +rep.
    “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want and deserve to get it good and hard.”

    H.L. Mencken

  33. #58
    Ah, sorry sir. Your last booster was 25 weeks ago. You cannot get on the plane. There's a vax station in terminal C, if you hurry you might be able to get a booster and get back before we close boarding.

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnCifelli1 View Post
    Ah, sorry sir. Your last booster was 25 weeks ago. You cannot get on the plane. There's a vax station in terminal C, if you hurry you might be able to get a booster and get back before we close boarding.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    If I was in a rental car, I would still have what passes for basic rights, including not to be frisked and searched without probable cause.

    And yes, you do have to pick your battles.

    I choose not to be harassed and arrested and impounded every time I drive off my property.
    Do you make it a habit to dismiss things you haven't even tried? As I've said in other threads, I get various flavors of LEOs directly behind me in multiple states and countless jurisdictions. One has stopped me and I made his little piece of paper disappear out of the court system days later (no arrest, no car impoundment, he just tossed the paper through the window and drove off). How? Because they're enforcing color-of-law commercial regulations, not laws. They can't enforce commercial regulations against property they have no legal jurisdiction over. And they know it. And if they tried and took it too far, they're violating one of THE most severe federal statutes in existence. TITLE 18 U.S.C. SECTION 242 - DEPRAVATION OF RIGHTS UNDER COLOR-OF-LAW.

    Fwiw, it could probably be argued that even pat downs in airports violate this extreme statute in light of the right to movement/travel, but since the property being used is not yours, the use can be subject to reasonable measures to ensure the security of the property.

    Rights are individual, not collective (see my sig...its from the Protocols). What you do or don't do to exercise them is up to you. I just don't think a pat down to use property that isn't mine is some giant overreach. I'm in the physical security measure business (physical measures not big bro junk) so maybe my perspective of reasonable measures to ensure safety of life and personal property is different than others and isn't automatically a violation of rights...

    Everyone's points about airline bailouts are valid and I don't have an answer to that. It's a sign of how far society has let things go by NOT exercising individual rights. Use em or they'll be forgotten or ignored eventually, no matter what that exercise may be. I think we can all agree on that, at least.
    Last edited by devil21; 08-26-2021 at 03:29 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast


Similar Threads

  1. Earthing aka Grounding
    By Swordsmyth in forum Personal Health & Well-Being
    Replies: 161
    Last Post: 07-09-2020, 06:42 PM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-26-2020, 01:47 PM
  3. Grounding appears to benefit over-ripened fruit
    By JoshLowry in forum Personal Health & Well-Being
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 05-17-2019, 10:42 AM
  4. Canadian Court Overturns Child's Grounding
    By Mesogen in forum U.S. Political News
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 06-19-2008, 06:18 PM
  5. Court Quashes Dad's Grounding of 12-year Old Daughter [QUEBEC]
    By crazyfingers in forum U.S. Political News
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-19-2008, 12:18 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •