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“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
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Dr. Fauci reminds me of Dr Frankenstein little dried up man licking his chops and wringing his hands.
He suffers from Little Man Syndrome when he stands next to the President.Originally Posted by Working Poor
If anyone has followed this little man. they would see that this little man talks out of both sides of his big mouth. When a democrat was in office this little man played down things like; H1N1, and should not be trusted because this little man has massive ties to Big pHARMa and the Gates Foundation and this little man loves Hillary.
“The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner
You doomers aren't even thinking in terms of globalist economics. Who do you think bleeds when our consumer culture boycotts consumerism? The second strongest economy isn't going to do great and take over the world if they lose their biggest customer. This is more than just America here over 151 countries are affected. Do we really have to write the rules of a national pandemic with blood? What do you think our economy would of done it our healthcare system crashed which was 1/6 of our economy??
Whoever thinks this virus is a hoax and a nothingburger obviously does not work on the front lines or live in areas with high prevalence. I am seeing these patients coming in extremely sick and have colleagues on ventilators. Pronouncing multiple patients daily in the ED. The hospitals around me have entire floors filled with Covid patients on oxygen and struggling to hang on.
Is it not as crazy in other parts of the nation? Of course. It hasn’t hit them yet. When and if it does at the intensity it is hitting the hot spots right now, everyone here will likely know of someone who has been hospitalized for it or has died of it. I personally know several already who have.
Is Dr. Fauci duplicitous? Maybe. Is the media instilling panic and fear? Sure, they always do. Is this virus serious and deadly? Oh hell yes.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
Hi, would you mind providing a bit more detail about where you are, how many other places around you etc.. There is a lot of stories like yours that just lack details that would help in realizing what you are saying. I also have some anecdotal things that make a strong case in the other direction.
I know 3 people who were test positive and have since recovered. These were early cases before national. Around Feb. 15th these 3 people attended a funeral with about 40 people from the family. around half of them got flu like symptoms. All ages, all with varying degree of health. No one died, 2 went to the hospital.
I am not revealing personal info.
I will say I am in the NY metro area. My hospital has seventy Covid intubated patients spanned out within the hospital in makeshift ICUs. The majority of admitted patients are Covid patients on oxygen. People dying at record pace (It is most definitely the number one cause of death in my area right now). Many die in the ER waiting days for an inpatient bed. We are sending patients home with oxygen saturation that are 92% and only admitting those who have lower sats. Staff is getting sick, some extremely so. All elective cases have been cancelled and we are resorting to surgical specialists/medical students managing icu medical patients. We’ve changed policies on who can get on a vent because of lack of equipment/support staff. All former restrictions have been abandoned (licensures/hospital privileges) and anyone willing to work is given a mask and caring for patients. There are freezers getting filled with the deceased. Everyone working is going to have some form of PSTD when this is over.
Are people recovering? Sure, the majority are not getting as sick. No one has immunity to this novel virus and most will be able to form antibodies in time before the cytokines storm hits. But when that happens, it is near 85% mortality rate. So it is a numbers game. The vast numbers have overwhelmed the resources available. Flattening the curve is essential. It buys time for treatments to be found and importantly, helps lower the volume of sick patients at any given time. When that critical threshold is reached, mortality skyrockets like you see in Italy and Spain. Even those who have unrelated sicknesses die because of the dirth of medical resources. So the mortality rate of the run of the mill bacterial pneumonia or urosepsis or chf etc goes up as well.
The anecdotes people will have is dependent on the community outbreak they are in and their own personal exposure. So someone living in the sticks with low prevalence of the disease can see this as not serious. Or have known a couple of people who got it and recovered. But pray it stays that way, because if it happens like it has happened in Italy, Spain, France, NY, NJ and now more growing numbers of cities, many many people will die.
I don’t want to fear monger. I’m just laying out what I see, what I know, and what I believe will happen if this continues unchecked. Be happy that your local ERs and hospital are quiet and they seem over supplies and over staffed. Because if it hits in earnest, you will need everything you have to keep people alive.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
TER:
In your hospital have any of these admitted been treated with hydroxychloroquine/Azithromycin and/or Ivermectin?
“Civilizations die from suicide, not by murder.” - Arnold Toynbee
I have seen seasoned ER docs break down in full blown panic attacks and in tears, and these are strong people who have more fortitude than the average person. Staff members are quitting mid shift. Colleagues on ventilators and worsening daily.
No one, I repeat no one I know, including those gray haired doctors who have been working for over 40 years, have ever seen or thought they would see something like this. No one working in the medical field in those current hot spots would downplay this or say it is being overblown or a hoax. Only those who are comfortably sitting at home, in areas where it has not yet hit to that extreme, would suggest such a thing. I hope and pray it stays that way for them. But all I and my colleagues would ask is, do your part to flatten the curve, not only for the protection of many thousands of lives, but for your own sakes so that your own community doesn’t get hit so bad. Yes the economy is suffering, and there are consequences. But no one I know living in the hotspots is as worried about that. They are just hoping no one else they know gets sick or dies from this.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
Yes, they are. At first, before the FDA gave the okay, it was given only to the sickest and didn’t show much improvement probably because it was given so late. Now, pending availability of the medicine (which is a big issue), is it routinely being given much earlier in the course. I hope and pray it helps. Still not 100%clear it has at our site.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
...
Last edited by Jenard Butler; 04-05-2020 at 11:31 AM.
Do you think you would take whatever vaccine comes out for it even if it has tracking capabilities?
I am not one to easily take a vaccine. My children do not get the flu vaccine every year. I have to at work because it is mandated and I have little choice.
With regards to a Covid vaccine, it all depends on what is going on at that time. If there seems to be more understanding of this disease and better treatment options, I may opt out (unless it become mandatory for my job). If I get sick and recover, I wouldn’t. If it continues to demonstrate little therapy options and significant mortality rate, and the vaccine is shown to be safe and effective, I may be more inclined to voluntarily take it. Too early to tell for me, personally.
As for tracking capabilities, I’m not sure what you are referring to.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
I have read over and over that a CV19 vaccine will have some kind of nano chip in it and some kind of something that makes it glow if a near infrared light is held over the vaccine site.
Here is a link to an article on this
https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...en-vaccinated/
Oh hell no I won’t take it
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
New England Journal of Medicine:
March 26, 2020
https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMe2002387On the basis of a case definition requiring a diagnosis of pneumonia, the currently reported case fatality rate is approximately 2%.4 In another article in the Journal, Guan et al.5 report mortality of 1.4% among 1099 patients with laboratory-confirmed Covid-19; these patients had a wide spectrum of disease severity. If one assumes that the number of asymptomatic or minimally symptomatic cases is several times as high as the number of reported cases, the case fatality rate may be considerably less than 1%. This suggests that the overall clinical consequences of Covid-19 may ultimately be more akin to those of a severe seasonal influenza (which has a case fatality rate of approximately 0.1%) or a pandemic influenza (similar to those in 1957 and 1968) rather than a disease similar to SARS or MERS, which have had case fatality rates of 9 to 10% and 36%, respectively.2
This is exactly what I've been saying here for weeks.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
That goes against the data we have now. This made sense before NY increased testing. I have seen figures where they say 9/10 people that they test don't have it. I really hope I'm wrong but I believe it hasn't spread to most people. When people talk about all the asymptomatic people it's the people who haven't had the virus long enough to have the symptoms but spread it or have an immune response that makes their symptoms mild but they can still spread it.
How does that go against the data they have now? The point is not that there are symptomatic people who test and don't have it, because they have something else, the point is there are plenty of asymptomatic and symptomatic people who don't get tested.
If you are able to capture that number, and add it to the total number of cases, then you divide the number of deaths by that number, you would probably get something much closer to .1% which is the same as the seasonal flu.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
This goes with the Chinese data that most officials don't trust.
No it doesn't. They have always been calculating the death rate based on the number of confirmed cases vs. the number of deaths which is a helpful number, but it is completely inaccurate and is not the true fatality rate. That is the fatality rate based on the number of confirmed cases.
There are a lot of people who are asymptomatic or have symptoms and don't get tested. We don't know what that number is. The figures you gave me from New York don't tell us what that number is. But those people need to be added to the number of confirmed cases, then you divide the number of deaths by that number, and you will get a number much closer to .1% fatality rate.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
No there are not that's chicom propaganda. Their testing is inaccurate and they are puposely misdiagnosing patients
What the $#@! are you talking about? This has NOTHING to do with China. This has to do with math and logic and science.
The number of confirmed cases is a small percentage of the number of total cases that we don't know about because they don't get tested.
The fatality rate of the flu is about 0.1%, and that is based on a prediction of how many people don't get tested who get it, added to the number of confirmed cases, and then dividing the number of deaths by that number.
The media has been comparing that number to the number of confirmed cases of Corona virus, then taking the number of deaths and dividing it by that number. They are comparing apples and oranges.
All the article pointed out was exactly what I've been saying, that you need to figure out the total number of asymptomatic people and people with symptoms that don't get tested in order to figure out what the true fatality rate is. And we don't know that number. You sure as $#@! don't know that number because you aren't even smart enough to understand what I'm saying here in a very basic break down. But we do know that it brings the true fatality rate much closer to the flu. It could even be lower, or higher, we just don't know. But definitely much closer.
Last edited by dannno; 04-05-2020 at 02:11 PM.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
The problem is that it is a novel virus. No one has encountered it before. So even if the final case fatality rate is closer to the flu (which so far it looks to be worse than the flu), the problem is that because there is no herd immunity to it, it is spreading like a wildfire and causing many who contract it to get sick and a high percentage, very sick. This cannot be compared to the a bad flu season because much of the population has some immunity to the flu and thereby it naturally mitigates the spread and virulence. No flu season in recent memory has done anything close to this. The Spanish flu was extremely bad, but you must also factor in that at that time there was little in terms of effective supportive treatments or antibiotics to help with super infections. The Spanish flu now would look like the H1N1 pandemic of 2009. Yes it was bad, but nothing like this.
Last edited by TER; 04-05-2020 at 02:14 PM.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
It has everything to do with China. That's where the virus was created. The asymptomatic bull$#@! is their bull$#@! testing. They are testing people positive when they are not positive.
Ok, what about Rand Paul? As far as I know he is asymptomatic.
From what I've heard, young people especially under 20 are largely asymptomatic or have extremely mild symptoms. Most younger people are still having extremely mild symptoms. That is both here and in China.
Even if asymptomatic doesn't exist, mild symptoms for young people still exist, and a lot of them aren't getting tested.
Additionally, testing has not been available for everyone until very recently, so that is another barrier to getting everybody who has it tested.
If you were smart enough to realize that what you are trying to convince me is that nearly 100% of the people with covid-19 get tested and test positive, then you wouldn't be trying to make the argument you are making.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
I can tell you that the numbers infected in the US is significantly higher than what is being recorded due to the lack of testing up until recently. Even now, we are not testing patients suspected with mild symptoms, as the tests are limited and the treatment up until now has been the same. I would guess half the patients I see and I suspect don’t get tested because they do not fit criteria. As we get more tests, this should change and then we can get more accurate data.
+'These things I command you, that you love one another.' - Jesus Christ
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