Didn't catch the beginning of it
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Didn't catch the beginning of it
T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men
"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato
We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me
Originally Posted by Philhelm
FLIP THOSE FLAGS, THE NATION IS IN DISTRESS!
why I should worship the state (who apparently is the only party that can possess guns without question).
The state's only purpose is to kill and control. Why do you worship it? - Sola_Fide
Baptiste said.
At which point will Americans realize that creating an unaccountable institution that is able to pass its liability on to tax-payers is immoral and attracts sociopaths?
So yeah I know a lot of folks are gonna be turned off by this considering Marjorie Taylor Greene and Tim, for whatever reasons, but I'm under the impression that MTG might have a Congress-crush on Massie. She credits him for being an inspiration for her when she first arrived in Congress.
I realize it is 2 hours long, but there's a lot of good stuff in here.
Talk of secession,
does the right to keep and bear arms extend to nuclear weapons?,
did you know there is a penalty box on the House floor for congress critters that misbehave? (I'm sort of being hyperbolic, but that's what Massie calls it, lol. it was supposed to be an isolation room for Congressmen who are feeling sick but still want to show up to vote, but that rarely happens, even when they aren't sick)
Did you know that Massie and Marjorie Taylor Greene both have racked up over $100,000 in Capitol hill mask fines?
"and much, much more!" lol
Last edited by nobody's_hero; 02-09-2022 at 11:21 PM.
T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men
"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato
We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me
Originally Posted by Philhelm
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Extended Part 1:
Massie invented a solar powered chicken coup mover that moved the coup every so often, but was disappointed when the battery died a year later and had to be replaced. So he hooked up some capacitors to the solar panel instead, and was able to move it an inch every hour.
They talk about vaccine horror stories, then get sidetracked by Seamus when MTG brought up that Galileo was put on house arrest by the Catholic church for his beliefs. Seamus is Catholic and had to correct part of her story and that took forever so they finally had to cut him off so they could show the video I posted in this thread:
First Woke Comedian To Get a Genuine Laugh From Audience
Not the way she was hoping for.
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...-From-Audience
More vax bashing on all sides.
One of the things Massie discussed, which he talked about in the main segment, was how the vaccine testing actually showed negative efficacy for those who had already been infected with Covid. He called them up (CDC, I think?), assumed it was a typo, and they got their top scientists and they called him "Eagle Eye Massie" and promised to get it fixed.. Never got fixed. He has it all on tape, is considering releasing them to the public. They've already been written about, so it's not new information that would be available, this happened over a year ago.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Extended Part 2:
Discussion of Epipen comes up, which gets a person out of anaphylactic shock and still costs $400. Massie says that the patent on the original formulation expired a while back, so they had to create a new formulation. He says that the reason a competitor can't come out and make a cheap version of the old formula is because it would need to be FDA approved.
Tim makes an ingenious suggestion of selling epipens with the old formula that say "For use on animals. Not for human consumption."
Thomas Massie replies "([LOUD WHISPER] THAT'S THE SOLUTION FOR EVERYTHING!!!!! Think about it, you just put it on your raw milk, For Pets Only. Not for human consumption."
Tim says he has seen raw milk that is being sold for pets around where he lives, but was clearly being purchased for human consumption, so apparently this is already being done. That's some good entrepreneurial spirit.
I guess Tim got ahead of Thomas, because Thomas said it costs $.25 for a dose of horse epinephrine. A horse is bigger than a human, so less than $.10 for a human would be my guess. Plus a syringe for $1.50.
We are really getting $#@!ed.
Did you know the CEO of Pfizer is a veterinarian?? And they make fun of us for using horse paste??
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
Great discussion and highly recommended. Just ignore the incorrect historical takes by Tim and Massie.
MTG has the right idea on national divorce
Tim seems to be resisting the idea.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
I was actually really impressed with her response; when Ian (I think?) asked, "how to do solve it?", she IMMEDIATELY piped up and said, "NATIONAL DIVORCE!"
Tim is constantly on about how there is no way for that to happen with out violence, but she even responded to that well by pointing out that it could be handled as easily via negotiation.
As an aside, and I'm blanking on where I read/heard this recently (may have been here), but this is a dead-end argument against national divorce - if a husband is threatening to kill a wife who's considering leaving him, that's an even better argument on behalf of leaving him! You don't stay in a relationship that is predicated on the initiation of violence!
I've been fairly impressed with her during both of her appearances on the show.
I suspect that a lot of people (including Tim) who play the "but civil war" card aren't a big fan of secession regardless of whether or not war would be necessary.
With that said, you're right, it doesn't even matter. What needs to be done, needs to be done. To do less, is cowardly.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
Yeah, I don't really get the timidity regarding civil war. And I get that this sounds incredibly casual. But we're talking about human freedom here. These are not "light and transient" causes... Of course all other means must be explored before the lives of millions are disrupted and upended. But the dissolution of the union should not only be on the table but should have been for over 100 years now. I'm personally of a view that what is in place is an effort to subvert human freedom on a global scale, and literally the ONLY way to disrupt that motive is the utter destruction of everything they have erected toward that end, which is to stay every state on the planet worth mentioning.
But I digress...
That said, I was particularly impressed with her comment about people assuming that the US will just always continue as-is, geographically. Typically you don't get that kind of depth of thought (and I realize that's not particularly deep, but impressively so for a politico) amongst Republicans. R's tend to believe that the geographic USA! must always remain the geographic USA!
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)
- "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
-- The Law (p. 54)- "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
-- Government (p. 99)- "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
-- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)- "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
-- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)· tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·
For me, I would have no problem with secession at this point, given the alternative we are steering ever-more rapidly towards, but I don't subscribe to the notion that it will not be without violence. It's just that I think that's somewhat Pollyanna-thinking. If the sentiment was evenly mutual, perhaps it would be peaceful, but I just don't see one side deciding to leave and the other being like "sure, bye." Personally if the left ever decided to leave, I would help them pack their bags, and enacting violence to keep them in the union would be as absurd as it would be unethical.Originally Posted by TheTexan
It's not an argument against succession or an attempt to dissuade people from it, more like, "okay, just prepare yourself mentally for the reality of what is likely to happen."
I also think that if America historically had been a little (ok, a lot) more vigilant in maintaining a republican form of government—where basically the only things the federal government does is deliver mail and debate whether or not to go to war—we would be much better off, and there would not be much ponderance of secession these days.
also @dannno thanks for the cliff notes on the member's only portion
Last edited by nobody's_hero; 02-10-2022 at 11:32 AM.
T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men
"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato
We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me
Originally Posted by Philhelm
I'm slightly more optimistic. I have no doubt that they will be calling for war. But there is a big difference between calling for war, and actually going to war.
I don't think they're willing to pay that price.
But I am.
The best thing we can do, each of us, is to get enough weapons, ammo, food, and supplies, to make sure that if war does break out, it won't be a fair fight.
With supply lines mostly coming from China these days, its important to have double of what you think you might need. Fuel, comms, batteries, etc.
If they understand that we are ready, willing, and prepared to go to war - perhaps we won't have to.
Last edited by TheTexan; 02-10-2022 at 11:36 AM.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
Seconded on @dannno providing notes on the member's section...
To clarify, I'm perfectly fine if secession turns violent, merely from a personal perspective. I'm single, I'm debt-free, I've gone Galt. I really don't have anything to lose. I'm aging and not much of an asset anymore, but I'm willing to sacrifice what I DO have to posterity. And while I sympathize with those who do have something to lose today, I'm more concerned about how the cost increases everyday we fail to act.
There were a couple of cringey moments but to miss watching the rest of it based on that, would be throwing the baby out with the bathwater. And I'm glad that when they disagreed on an issue, they picked up talking about the next issue like it was nothing.
There were 50,000+ people watching at some moments while it was live.
My mother actually was the one who let me know the interview was happening, as I don't watch as much of this stuff as she does.. She was watching Timcast on her phone, walked into the room and said, "who is this?" Holding up the phone. "I always liked him but I don't know who he is."
And I was like, "Oh yeah, Thomas Massie —wait, is that live?" LOL.
T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men
"One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato
We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me
Originally Posted by Philhelm
Ron PaulThere is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)
I think Tim's view on national divorce is that it is certainly preferable to civil war. He always talks about how we are approaching "hot" civil war, and how we are already in a 5th generation civil war. I think he thought national divorce was a good idea, until somebody explained to him that it would also inevitably lead to violent conflict, as it did in the first Civil War with Fort Sumter. I think the south wanted to keep some military stuff they had there, and the north said they couldn't? I don't know the full history, but apparently the south was in the process of divorcing from the north and had been for some time, but then there was a dispute about what belonged to who. So not much different from a real divorce, when say the husband and wife both agree to a divorce, then the wife takes the house and the kids and the husband is like wtf.
I think Tim would be all for it, if it could be done relatively peacefully.
I also think that pretty much everybody, even here, would prefer if the left would wake tf up, realize they've been lied to, and at minimum support an increase in state's rights and a significant decrease in federal powers, even if they want to keep some leftist policies in their states. That would be preferable to a national divorce, but the odds seem low. That was also discussed.
Also interesting was Tim out-2nd amendmenting Massie
Last edited by dannno; 02-10-2022 at 11:58 AM.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
They're willing to have someone else do it for them certainly.
But will these pink haired millennials get off their couch to shed their own blood? I don't think so.
They'll be begging for mercy the first night they have to sleep on dirt or concrete with nothing to support their head but their pack.
On the flip side of that, I could easily imagine MJT, Massie, or anyone on this forum, sleeping in dirt for months at a time without complaint.
Resources and resilience is how wars are won and lost.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
My understanding of the fort situation is quite different from Tim's.
My understanding is that the North was escalating the situation and the South was forced into a position where they had to take the forts or risk losing the war before it had even started.
( and the forts belonged to the south anyway, this idea that they belonged to the "Federal Government" is horse$#@!. )
Last edited by TheTexan; 02-10-2022 at 12:07 PM.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
Whether it is "evenly mutual" or not, their "sentiment" is completely irrelevant. The only thing that really matters is whether they have both the will and the wherewithal to successfully enforce their sentiment (whatever it may be), despite the costs of doing so.
The old-school, hard-line communists had plenty of sentiment against perestroika and the subsequent dissolution of the Soviet Union, but it happened anyway (and was remarkably peaceful). Merely having a sentiment (no matter how ardent that sentiment may be) and actually being willing and able to pay the costs necessary to secure the object of that sentiment are entirely different things.
Abraham Lincoln, for example, was both willing and able to pay those costs (which included his own life, as it turned out).
On the other hand - and for whatever reasons - Yanayev and the other members of the Gang of Eight were not.
If it comes to the test, I suspect there will be more of Yanayev & Co. than of Lincoln in our present-day sentimental unionists.
Definitely not. But they're not the ones calling the shots, nor the ones who really have anything at stake in keeping all of the nuclear missile silos and other strategic items on American soil under the control of the regime in DC.
Also, the federal government is deep in debt, and has every intention of continuing to rack up deficits for the foreseeable future. It depends on future earnings from tax payers from all 50 states in order to make payments on those debts and keep borrowing. The holders of those debts won't be tolerant of that loss of value in the debts they hold. And so, neither will the US politicians who work for them.
Ron PaulThere is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)
"Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
"Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
"Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
Proponent of real science.
The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.
I think Tim's understanding might be the same as yours, it is my understanding that is lacking and didn't want to get too specific. I wasn't saying who was right or wrong, just that there was a disagreement over what military bases/equipment belonged to who.
Tim's description of what might happen was something along the lines of that maybe Nevada has a bunch of nukes, and they end up going with the Red states, and then the blue states come in and say, "Hey, those aren't your nukes... we are taking them."
Last edited by dannno; 02-10-2022 at 12:49 PM.
"He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
"dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
"You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
"When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q
"Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul
"Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."
No offense intended to our millennial members, but I don't know that they have the fortitude to endure the hardship that comes with deprivation.
Speaking as a Gen-X'er, though I've at times become frustrated with some of the political views of our group, I CAN say that we have endured a lot of BULLSH!T in our lives, and have a certain level of resiliency that makes us well-adapted to dealing with pushing through hard times.
If we're going to go through this, we better get about it before the last generation passes that is willing to deal with it.
- Kim KardashianIt's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!
My pronouns are he/him/his
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