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Thread: Anyone else find it really odd being on the same side as Lindsey Graham?

  1. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Much worse now- The cancelling of the Iranian Deal is the big clue to where Trump really stands.
    Not really, O'Bummer and Hitlery just had different targets in mind than Iran.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    I am also surprised for the support of Kavanaugh on this forum. He was a major player in getting the Patriot Act signed into law. That should be a YUGE clue as to where he stands on liberty.

    And, no, I do not believe any of the sexual abuse accusations.

    I also don't believe in the left/right paradigm that is being pushed. Anyone who's familiar with Ron Paul & supports freedom can recognize this artificial ruse.
    Nobody I have seen would choose Kavanaugh but he is an improvement over Kennedy and the sex attacks launched against him are not only blatantly false and unjust but they are designed to create a precedent that WILL be used against anyone we would choose if they ever do get chosen.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
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  3. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    We have bigger deficits, more wars, more spying, and more cop violence than at any previous time, and you are telling us we are better off?
    I didn't say we were better off, Trump hasn't been able to accomplish much yet but he is trying to turn things around.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  5. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    In my lifetime, Republicans have been responsible for just as much, if not more, heinous gun control laws as/than have Democrats. The idea that Republicans protect the 2nd better than Dems is demonstrably false.
    RINOs aren't real Republicans and the Deomncrats have gotten much worse recently, if there were less Demoncrats in office the RINOS wouldn't be able to betray us on so many things.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  6. #154
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I didn't say we were better off, Trump hasn't been able to accomplish much yet but he is trying to turn things around.
    You said our situation with Trump is "better than what we have had". How is the largest deficit in history "better" than past, smaller deficits? If Trump really were "trying to turn things around", he wouldn't be approving all this spending. He just signed an $854 billion spending bill yesterday. How is a $777 billion dollar increase in military defense, as Trump has proposed, good for any American, outside of the MIC?

  7. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    You said our situation with Trump is "better than what we have had". How is the largest deficit in history "better" than past, smaller deficits? If Trump really were "trying to turn things around", he wouldn't be approving all this spending. He just signed an $854 billion spending bill yesterday. How is a $777 billion dollar increase in military defense, as Trump has proposed, good for any American, outside of the MIC?
    The "what we have" that I referred to was Trump not the situation and spending hasn't been his strong point so far but he has done many other things that are beginning to turn things around.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  8. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Much worse now- The cancelling of the Iranian Deal is the big clue to where Trump really stands.

    I am also surprised for the support of Kavanaugh on this forum. He was a major player in getting the Patriot Act signed into law. That should be a YUGE clue as to where he stands on liberty.

    And, no, I do not believe any of the sexual abuse accusations.

    I also don't believe in the left/right paradigm that is being pushed. Anyone who's familiar with Ron Paul & supports freedom can recognize this artificial ruse.
    Pffft...the US and Iran have been rattling sabres at each other since before I was born.

    One guy's scared and the other is glad of it.

    The canceling of the Iran deal will mean nothing in the great grand warp and woof of things.

    And I'm not on a Kavanaugh bandwagon...seems like there could have been a dozen better choices.

  9. #157
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    In my lifetime, Republicans have been responsible for just as much, if not more, heinous gun control laws as/than have Democrats. The idea that Republicans protect the 2nd better than Dems is demonstrably false.
    The very worst gun control acts were passed and signed by democrat majorities in both houses and the president.

    NFA in 1934.

    GCA in 1968 (and I was alive for that)

    In 1986 the banning of handguns at the federal level was on the table, guns were banned outright in many cities, and CCW was almost unknown.

    In almost every single case noted below, it was a GOP state government that moved this forward.


  10. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    The canceling of the Iran deal will mean nothing in the great grand warp and woof of things.
    Unless you think they are going to make a new deal with us I don't see how cancelling the Iran deal means nothing. The Iran deal was the reason why Trump said he would run 3rd party if Ron Paul was the Republican nominee in 2012, the Iran deal has to be a pretty big deal if Trump would run 3rd party just to stop Ron Paul.

  11. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Unless you think they are going to make a new deal with us I don't see how cancelling the Iran deal means nothing. The Iran deal was the reason why Trump said he would run 3rd party if Ron Paul was the Republican nominee in 2012, the Iran deal has to be a pretty big deal if Trump would run 3rd party just to stop Ron Paul.
    Because I have come to understand this man's "Drunken Monkey" style, if still not able to predict it.

    What he says he's going to do, what he prepares to do, what he actually does and what he says he did are liable to be all over the map, utterly disconnected from each other.

    Bottom line: he's not taking the country to war with Iran. But the ayatollahs in Iran don't know that...they don't know what the $#@! he's going to do. In the end, that's just what's going to happen, a new deal will be signed, and it wouldn't surprise me if it was a better deal, at least for us. Oil prices are going up, and Iran wants to get in on that while they can...they're not going to $#@! that up.

    Others mocked it a 4D chess and so on, and maybe that mockery is deserved, since I don't think that much forethought goes into it.

    The fact of the matter is, in today's world, a straight arrow like Ron, or even this Kavanaugh fellow, gets crucified.

    If you're not spending every second of every day ducking, bobbing and weaving like a cross between Joe Lewis, Muhammad Ali and a five dollar Bangkok whore, you will get your clocked cleaned by the Bolshevik and Jacobin leftists.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 09-30-2018 at 12:20 AM.

  12. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by kahless View Post
    I never thought I would see the day that it would be possible this would happen. Not only his comments at the hearing but rather how these lunatic rabid feminists were heckling him after the hearing.

    If it came down to taking sides against the lunatic left or Lindsey Graham, the man whom I hated his big government Neo-Conservatism, foreign policy interventionism and Cuckservatism, no doubt it would be him. That is how bad things have become in such a short period of time.

    One wonders with the news media and hearings being such a huge scam, is there something else greater going on here for the purpose of lining us up on sides accordingly or has the left over played their hand so far they are ultimately destroying themselves?

    That is not to say there isn't something to be said for people having reasons to keep quiet for all these years after a violent event(s) and reasons years later they are forced to come forward. But this does not seem like that at all and rather a massive con job than anything else.

    I, too, felt like I'd entered the Twilight Zone with some rude violence when I came to know Graham had done something that was actually heading toward that which I would characterize as "correct".

    That said, I read of his virtuoso performance before the committee. I got to see it the other day at a friend's house and can only say "MEH". He said nominally good things, but his performance was as cardboard. It was absurdly transparent in his delivery that it was nothing better than a man spewing words in which he did not believe. The outrage was so forced as to be laughable. If the mean American accepted this as genuine, then we're in worse shape than even I had suspected. The whole thing was a joke.

    But now ask yourself this: what circumstance has arisen in Graham's political reality, or looms therein, that would drive this career scoundrel to do a 180 in so artlessly transparent a fashion?

    What, indeed. Anyone have ideas?
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.



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  14. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Please friends... Lest you forget. They are all on the same side. Kavanaugh, Graham, Feinstein, all of them.

    I know you watched a show today and it had big, huge government ratings. But this was sweeps week to get you ginned up for the month-long run into the off-year election.

    This was a show. The two factions of the government party putting on a show for fundraising and to fight over the power they have over you. If you view this charade as a show, you won't "take a side". Ron Paul woke you up - don't fall back asleep. It's easy to get caught up in the show - it's entertaining and gives you much to talk about around the water cooler. But it's a show. Do you really think the Democrats believe this woman?? That they were sitting in the presence of a attempted rapist? I didn't watch the whole show, but did any of them call him despicable or a liar?? Or did they just want to delay things? Do you really think a Republican cares if he committed some act in high school?! Hell, they've all done worse.

    It's a play fight over the power to control you. Every creature in that room wants that power. This ratings game is just another tool to get it. R vs D fundraising event.
    Much as I wish I could accuse you of being a douche-0-holic for posting this, alas, I cannot.

    As usual, we're being played.
    freedomisobvious.blogspot.com

    There is only one correct way: freedom. All other solutions are non-solutions.

    It appears that artificial intelligence is at least slightly superior to natural stupidity.

    Our words make us the ghosts that we are.

    Convincing the world he didn't exist was the Devil's second greatest trick; the first was convincing us that God didn't exist.

  15. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    what circumstance has arisen in Graham's political reality, or looms therein, that would drive this career scoundrel to do a 180 in so artlessly transparent a fashion?

    What, indeed. Anyone have ideas?
    My best guess is the death of McCain, shortly after McCain announced he had cancer Graham said something about AIPAC having too much influence and he has been making a few correct decisions regarding Russiagate etc. as well, as some have pointed out he may be looking to make new alliances but I suspect McCain had blackmail on him as well.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #163
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    My best guess is the death of McCain, shortly after McCain announced he had cancer Graham said something about AIPAC having too much influence and he has been making a few correct decisions regarding Russiagate etc. as well, as some have pointed out he may be looking to make new alliances but I suspect McCain had blackmail on him as well.
    LOL can we just refer to everything in political discourse that happens after McCain dies as the result of McCain dying? Like if we go to war and topple Assad can we blame McCain, because that would be funny.

  17. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    LOL can we just refer to everything in political discourse that happens after McCain dies as the result of McCain dying? Like if we go to war and topple Assad can we blame McCain, because that would be funny.
    Do you deny that Graham had a special relationship with McCain?
    Do you deny that Graham's behavior has changed since McCain announced his cancer and then died?
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Do you deny that Graham had a special relationship with McCain?
    Do you deny that Graham's behavior has changed since McCain announced his cancer and then died?
    I deny all knowledge of their special relationship

  19. #166
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    LOL can we just refer to everything in political discourse that happens after McCain dies as the result of McCain dying? Like if we go to war and topple Assad can we blame McCain, because that would be funny.
    Maybe the Pope should declare August 26, 2018 to henceforth be known as the "A.M." period. We're done with A.D. It's "Anno McCain" now.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing."-Ron Paul

    "We have set them on the hobby-horse of an idea about the absorption of individuality by the symbolic unit of COLLECTIVISM. They have never yet and they never will have the sense to reflect that this hobby-horse is a manifest violation of the most important law of nature, which has established from the very creation of the world one unit unlike another and precisely for the purpose of instituting individuality."- A Quote From Some Old Book

  20. #167
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump

  21. #168
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump



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  23. #169
    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post

    Two words: Donald Trump.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  24. #170
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Two words: Donald Trump.
    His cozying up to Trump is a real concern. He is the last person you want to have in Trump's ear. It was only a short while ago he called for a hot war against Russia. The hot war statements alone were so irresponsible that it should have resulted in hearings questioning his competence to remain in office.

    It is a real concern when the news media lavishes someone like Graham with praise when he gets something right for a change. Since where does this go next? It runs the risk of normalizing him and normalizing his more wacky policies and statements.

  25. #171
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    RINOs aren't real Republicans and the Deomncrats have gotten much worse recently, if there were less Demoncrats in office the RINOS wouldn't be able to betray us on so many things.
    The GOP controls the House, the Senate, and the Oval Office, and you are blaming the Democrats for Republicans betraying the American people? How many fewer Democrats would there need to be in order for Republicans to not betray us? Come on, Swordsmyth! That is a lame excuse.

  26. #172
    Supporting Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Brother, maybe I'm being naive, but I want to think that Trump IS the "something different".

    In 2016 I did not think that, but after a couple years and closely watching all of this, I've come to think that maybe, just maybe, he is.

    I know this for a fact: he has all the right enemies.
    It is strange to me that we have anyone here that can't see the difference between normal (2 sides of the same coin) politics and what is happening now. The normal statist machine loves Clinton/Bush politicians and they fear Trump politics. This is not a game of theater that TPTB control, it is genuine fear. They can't control Trump and that scares the crap out of them.

    The game has changed.
    Citizen of Arizona
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    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  27. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    I don't like Lindsey Graham at all. I do appreciate that he actually spoke the truth in public about the state of politics in America, which is extremely rarely. We all know how dishonest politicians are, but for one 5 minute span, Graham said the truth out loud for everyone to her. It isn't often that you will see a U.S. Senator do that.

    Citizen of Arizona
    @cleaner4d4

    I am a libertarian. I am advocating everyone enjoy maximum freedom on both personal and economic issues as long as they do not bring violence unto others.

  28. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Cleaner44 View Post
    I don't like Lindsey Graham at all. I do appreciate that he actually spoke the truth in public about the state of politics in America, which is extremely rarely. We all know how dishonest politicians are, but for one 5 minute span, Graham said the truth out loud for everyone to her. It isn't often that you will see a U.S. Senator do that.

    The most unethical sham of his career in politics? That is quite clearly bs.

    Wasn't he one of the chief liars who led the United States into immoral wars around the world?

    It is hard to get past that sensationalized bit.
    “The nationalist not only does not disapprove of atrocities committed by his own side, but he has a remarkable capacity for not even hearing about them.” --George Orwell

    Quote Originally Posted by AuH20 View Post
    In terms of a full spectrum candidate, Rand is leaps and bounds above Trump. I'm not disputing that.
    Who else in public life has called for a pre-emptive strike on North Korea?--Donald Trump

  29. #175
    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    The GOP controls the House, the Senate, and the Oval Office, and you are blaming the Democrats for Republicans betraying the American people? How many fewer Democrats would there need to be in order for Republicans to not betray us? Come on, Swordsmyth! That is a lame excuse.
    When the bad gun bills get passed who votes for them? All the Demoncrats and enough RINOs to make a majority, if there weren't enough Demoncrats to be the basis of a majority with the RINOs the bills wouldn't pass, what is lame is you pretending that all or most Republicans are at fault when bad bills get passed by all the Demoncrats + a minority of Republicans.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  30. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by kcchiefs6465 View Post
    Nobody started liking him, apparently you aren't very smart.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  32. #177
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    When the bad gun bills get passed who votes for them? All the Demoncrats and enough RINOs to make a majority, if there weren't enough Demoncrats to be the basis of a majority with the RINOs the bills wouldn't pass, what is lame is you pretending that all or most Republicans are at fault when bad bills get passed by all the Demoncrats + a minority of Republicans.
    But you're not a single-issue voter, are you? For example, when the vote for the "Patriot" Act was held in the House, 66 Democrats and 1 Independent voted no, but only 3 Republicans voted no. It was a clean sweep for Republicans in the Senate, every single one of whom voted for the Spy Programs. One of the worst bills in American history, and one which cost taxpayers billions of dollars, and it was the Republicans who nearly unanimously supported it.

  33. #178
    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    But you're not a single-issue voter, are you? For example, when the vote for the "Patriot" Act was held in the House, 66 Democrats and 1 Independent voted no, but only 3 Republicans voted no. It was a clean sweep for Republicans in the Senate, every single one of whom voted for the Spy Programs. One of the worst bills in American history, and one which cost taxpayers billions of dollars, and it was the Republicans who nearly unanimously supported it.
    This started as a discussion of gun laws but since you want to broaden the scope I will, I am not a single issue voter but there are far more issues where the Demoncrats are always wrong and the Republicans tend to be right than the other way around and it has been getting worse in recent years, just look at the Demoncrats embrace of the intelligence agencies now, even on the issues where more Ds tend to be right than Rs they are in the way of the libertarians who are right on the same issues and more, if the Demoncrats were severely diminished the people who care about the few issues they are right about would vote libertarian and we would be much better off in a country divided between Republicans and libertarians.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  34. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    This started as a discussion of gun laws
    This actually started out as a discussion of Lindsey Graham's comments at the Kavanaugh hearing, and devolved into you (again) asserting that the Republicans are better than the Democrats. Aside from a few liberty-leaning Republicans, the Republicans are actually worse than the Democrats on many issues.

    if the Demoncrats were severely diminished the people who care about the few issues they are right about would vote libertarian
    And the same could be said about Republicans. The two-party duopoly prevents a third party from ever gaining a good foothold.

    You've made almost 22,000 posts in a little less than 2.5 years. That works out to about 25 posts per day, without breaks on the weekends. Is this... is this your job?

  35. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    This actually started out as a discussion of Lindsey Graham's comments at the Kavanaugh hearing, and devolved into you (again) asserting that the Republicans are better than the Democrats.
    They are.

    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    Aside from a few liberty-leaning Republicans, the Republicans are actually worse than the Democrats on many issues.
    Not many.



    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    And the same could be said about Republicans. The two-party duopoly prevents a third party from ever gaining a good foothold.
    True but a libertarian/Demoncrat country would be worse than a libertarian/Republican country.

    Quote Originally Posted by RJ Liberty View Post
    You've made almost 22,000 posts in a little less than 2.5 years. That works out to about 25 posts per day, without breaks on the weekends. Is this... is this your job?
    No, just a a hobby I fit in between other things.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

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