How to Stop Illegal Immigration Without a Wall

[Ender]

Because liberty is just too hard!

Seriously. Liberty solves these problems, but no... we want more and more restrictions.

Exactly.

No entitlements, let the free market alone & let owners hire whom they dang well want.

Saves money & lets Freedom reign, but we can't have that now can we? Gotta have all the hate BS going on so politicians can control everyone's Blue Pill mind.

[Stratovarious]

As has already been stated, the politicians don't want the issue to go away. It's a very valuable tool for them, just like racial relations to the race pimps.

Here here......
From women's rights, lbgt , race, income tiers, regional ticks', without these , the people would
be bored enough to start looking at the core issues; Government tyranny, corruption , collusion ,
theft, and all the little Oathbreakers from law enforcement up through scotus right to the Oval Office*.
*not so much this term but the previous 5 or 6 for sure.

[Cleaner44]

I thought this thread was going to be about landmines.

Disappointed.

I support sharks with laser beams in the Rio Grande river. Of course we will need to add a bunch of salt to the river. Maybe Piranhas or Alligators with laser beams.

[Swordsmyth]

If immigration weren't illegal there would be no illegal immigration.

The way people like the author of the OP use the word "illegal" is sophistry. They're against immigration, period, not just illegal immigration.

It's about limited immigration, we have a right and a need to limit it.

[Swordsmyth]

I’m not that worried about illegal immigrants. It’s always been my position that the problem is the welfare state- giving free medical and schooling, and all the other benefits that our liberal state gives out drives up the incentive to come here and do nothing.

But I can’t hate on someone willing to leave their homes to come here and perform hard work to better support their families. I have much bigger problems with the enormous tax burden created by the welfare state as a whole.

Most Mexicans I’ve met and worked with are top notch humans.

I’m not talking about hoards of people in caravans in highly politicized mass immigration events.

The problem is that they vote to steal my rights and money, I'm all for ending the incentives but our economy itself is the biggest incentive and it will continue to be until they vote in enough communists to destroy it, if we ended the incentives that would temporarily improve our economy and increase that incentive.

[Superfluous Man]

Still chasing symptoms.

Regardless of topic, any solutions presented should begin with shrinking fedgov. Immigration, healthcare, taxes, foreign policy, economy, environment, education, housing, and on and on it goes.

Instead of adding additional gov intrusion into the problem, ask what the gov has done to incentivize the problem. In the case of the OP, employers are in a no-win situation with minimum wage laws and high taxes, regulations, influencing their hiring practices, as well as a decreased unskilled labor pool due to the welfare state. IMO, the immigration issue as related to hiring low wage workers is a symptom of an already overly intrusive federal gov't. If the employers are skirting the immigration laws due to other burdens, get rid of the burdens to allow them to hire without resorting to the gray market.

+rep

[DamianTV]

Exactly.

No entitlements, let the free market alone & let owners hire whom they dang well want.

Saves money & lets Freedom reign, but we can't have that now can we? Gotta have all the hate BS going on so politicians can control everyone's Blue Pill mind.

Agree, and question...

So, the desire to build a wall only treats the Symptom. Cause of that is so many people from very poor countries want to come here. Is that desire to come here another Symptom, or is that the real cause? They arent coming here for Freedom, they seem to be coming because they want to escape Poverty. But, what caused that Poverty there? If the US had remained on a Gold Standard, not just with Nixon, but all the way back to 1913 when the Federal Reserve Bank (and IRS) were formed, it basically enabled transfer of wealth with inflation, interest, fractional reserve lending, war, installing Dictators, etc, which caused the value of our money to go down, but quantity to go up, however, in the now poor countries, they just could not keep up with our money printing.

Perhaps the deeper solution is Honest Money, which would have prevented the Poverty that caused the desire for Immigration to begin with?

We know we do NOT have a Free Market. Companies like Facebook and Google and even Walmart survive because of Govt Subsidies and Payouts, which incentivizes and rewards despicable and unlivable pay. Govt subsidizes Walmart with Food Stamps and Welfare. So the poor both here and in poorer countries are getting ruined by Dishonest Govt intervention? Im not saying your wrong, just trying to figure out why we dont have a Free Market and all these demands for Entitlements...

[Swordsmyth]

Agree, and question...

So, the desire to build a wall only treats the Symptom. Cause of that is so many people from very poor countries want to come here. Is that desire to come here another Symptom, or is that the real cause? They arent coming here for Freedom, they seem to be coming because they want to escape Poverty. But, what caused that Poverty there? If the US had remained on a Gold Standard, not just with Nixon, but all the way back to 1913 when the Federal Reserve Bank (and IRS) were formed, it basically enabled transfer of wealth with inflation, interest, fractional reserve lending, war, installing Dictators, etc, which caused the value of our money to go down, but quantity to go up, however, in the now poor countries, they just could not keep up with our money printing.

Perhaps the deeper solution is Honest Money, which would have prevented the Poverty that caused the desire for Immigration to begin with?

We know we do NOT have a Free Market. Companies like Facebook and Google and even Walmart survive because of Govt Subsidies and Payouts, which incentivizes and rewards despicable and unlivable pay. Govt subsidizes Walmart with Food Stamps and Welfare. So the poor both here and in poorer countries are getting ruined by Dishonest Govt intervention? Im not saying your wrong, just trying to figure out why we dont have a Free Market and all these demands for Entitlements...

And we must treat the symptoms until we can deal with the cause or we will die before we can deal with the cause.

I believe that we would still have a problem because we would be so much better off if we had sound money and free markets while other countries would still be poor because of socialism but we can figure that out after we stop the bleeding and then cure the cause.

[Stratovarious]

I’m not that worried about illegal immigrants. It’s always been my position that the problem is the welfare state- giving free medical and schooling, and all the other benefits that our liberal state gives out drives up the incentive to come here and do nothing.

But I can’t hate on someone willing to leave their homes to come here and perform hard work to better support their families. I have much bigger problems with the enormous tax burden created by the welfare state as a whole.

Most Mexicans I’ve met and worked with are top notch humans.

I’m not talking about hoards of people in caravans in highly politicized mass immigration events.

- You should be my frien' , ms 13 , rapists, drunks, diseased, felons, murders, terrorists.
It's not just Mexicans for breakfast anymore, we have god knows what coming across that
border.
You love Mexicans, well so do I , probably had more friends and co workers than you over
the years, that isn't the issue.
Streamline immigration on a merit basis, sounds fair to me, but in today's climate, we need
ZERO illegals , zero illegals of any origin, especially the unveted' that have no respect for
our culture nor our laws. If an immigrant can't pledge allegiance to our country, love us,
obey our laws , speak our language , we don't need him.
This is not France, we owe the world nothing, we don't have to be the next Britain, Sweden , Germany.

[Superfluous Man]

Exactly.

No entitlements, let the free market alone & let owners hire whom they dang well want.

Saves money & lets Freedom reign, but we can't have that now can we? Gotta have all the hate BS going on so politicians can control everyone's Blue Pill mind.

The problem the immigration restrictionists have with this solution is that it would result in more immigrants coming here, rather than fewer. The explanation that eliminating benefits would eliminate a major incentive to come here just isn't true.

And at the end of the day, more immigrants coming here is what the immigration restrictionists really oppose.

[Swordsmyth]

The problem the immigration restrictionists have with this solution is that it would result in more immigrants coming here, rather than fewer. The explanation that eliminating benefits would eliminate a major incentive to come here just isn't true.

And at the end of the day, more immigrants coming here is what the immigration restrictionists really oppose.

Imagine that.

We don't want to be turned into a communist country by allowing millions of communists to come her and vote for communism.

You seem to not mind becoming a communist country, maybe that is even your goal...................

[James_Madison_Lives]

The problem the immigration restrictionists have with this solution is that it would result in more immigrants coming here, rather than fewer. The explanation that eliminating benefits would eliminate a major incentive to come here just isn't true.

And at the end of the day, more immigrants coming here is what the immigration restrictionists really oppose.

If you put employers of illegals in jail and stopped government benefits for illegals with young anchor babies they would head back over the border in droves. Trump should be talking about reversing the problem, not just slowing it down which is all theater.

[Superfluous Man]

If you put employers of illegals in jail

And this is the key.

If people are really serious about immigration restriction, and they actually know anything about the issue, they are bound to end up supporting morally indefensible laws that violate all of our rights like this.

[Stratovarious]

If you put employers of illegals in jail and stopped government benefits for illegals with young anchor babies they would head back over the border in droves. Trump should be talking about reversing the problem, not just slowing it down which is all theater.

Unfortunately James , while I agree and have written this a million times: cut all incentives etc etc etc, this is
not the full package, ms13 , felons, diseased, terrorists, murderers, drug dealers, will come in, they don't need the kinds of incentives
that we can 'cut' , they have other incentives.

[Stratovarious]

Imagine that.

We don't want to be turned into a communist country by allowing millions of communists to come her and vote for communism.

You seem to not mind becoming a communist country, maybe that is even your goal...................

If any immigrant is not bowled over in love with out culture and laws, this is the last place they need to be.

[Superfluous Man]

Unfortunately James , while I agree and have written this a million times: cut all incentives etc etc etc, this is
not the full package, ms13 , felons, diseased, terrorists, murderers, drug dealers, will come in, they don't need the kinds of incentives
that we can 'cut' , they have other incentives.

That's why he had to include the jailing of employers who hire them. That's actually the most powerful tool of those he listed.

[Stratovarious]

That's why he had to include the jailing of employers who hire them. That's actually the most powerful tool of those he listed.

I've said that at least a million times, its a good tool, its not enough.