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Thread: Left Hellbent To Defend MS-13

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Why are MS13 (US Trained Soldiers) considered animals when others are not?
    That's a great question.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.



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  3. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    That's a great question.
    I just want objectivity on this forum and will point out flawed sources or points of view at my leisure.

    Quote Originally Posted by spudea on 01/15/24
    Trump will win every single state primary by double digits.
    Quote Originally Posted by spudea on 04/20/16
    There won't be a contested convention
    Quote Originally Posted by spudea on 05/30/17
    The shooting of Gabrielle Gifford was blamed on putting a crosshair on a political map. I wonder what event we'll see justified with pictures like this.

  4. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by spudea View Post
    K?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Pinochet is the model
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Liberty preserving authoritarianism.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Enforced internal open borders was one of the worst elements of the Constitution.

  5. #64
    Hasn't anyone ever heard of innocent until proven guilty? Each person is different. We cannot group these individuals together.



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  7. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Are MS-13 members human?
    Of course.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  8. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Hasn't anyone ever heard of innocent until proven guilty?
    In a courtroom when on trial for a crime.

    Quote Originally Posted by Schifference View Post
    Each person is different. We cannot group these individuals together.
    We can when they group together and act together.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It doesn't say foreigners have a right to enter without permission.
    I can see you don't recognize the 10th amendment.
    There are no crimes against people.
    There are only crimes against the state.
    And the state will never, ever choose to hold accountable its agents, because a thing can not commit a crime against itself.

  10. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by fisharmor View Post
    I can see you don't recognize the 10th amendment.
    (Amendment 10 - Reserved Powers)

    The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.


    Article 1

    Section 9. The Migration or Importation of such Persons as any of the States now existing shall think proper to admit, shall not be prohibited by the Congress prior to the Year one thousand eight hundred and eight

    It is after 1808.

    Article 4 - The States
    Section 4 - Republican Government


    The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion;

    More at:
    Article 1 Section 9

    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  11. #69
    After looking at past weeks coverage of Fox news, curious who does a better job of defending violent groups Left or Right ?

    If this gang was better organized and better armed like tax payers funded IDF that killed over 100 humans of some races in last couple of weeks, will Left/Right shift stances about violent gangs?

  12. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    In a courtroom when on trial for a crime.


    We can when they group together and act together.
    Ollie North.





    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  13. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Ollie North.





    And your point is?
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #72
    Going to be fun to watch this episode in midterms (and 2020) come back to haunt Democrats.

    1. Trump calls MS-13 'animals'
    2. Dems get triggered and either 1. attack Trump for saying it, or 2. Defend MS-13
    3. No sane person can believe #2
    4. DJ Donald Trumpmaster D wins again.
    1. Don't lie.
    2. Don't cheat.
    3. Don't steal.
    4. Don't kill.
    5. Don't commit adultery.
    6. Don't covet what your neighbor has, especially his wife.
    7. Honor your father and mother.
    8. Remember the Sabbath and keep it Holy.
    9. Don’t use your Higher Power's name in vain, or anyone else's.
    10. Do unto others as you would have them do to you.

    "For the love of money is the root of all evil..." -- I Timothy 6:10, KJV



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  16. #73
    Trump has the ability to get the American left and the MSM to defend just about anything he speaks out against. It's quite remarkable. Remember when they were talking about how Kim Jong Un's sister was throwing "side-eye" and "shade" at Pence? Pushing the idea that she's some dignified independent yasss queen who ain't need no man? It was sickening.

    It's like a superpower he has.
    NeoReactionary. American High Tory.

    The counter-revolution will not be televised.

  17. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaleoLibertarian View Post
    Trump has the ability to get the American left and the MSM to defend just about anything he speaks out against. It's quite remarkable. Remember when they were talking about how Kim Jong Un's sister was throwing "side-eye" and "shade" at Pence? Pushing the idea that she's some dignified independent yasss queen who ain't need no man? It was sickening.

    It's like a superpower he has.
    Sun Tzu's Art of War was big with business men of his generation. It was all deception: attacking where the enemy is weak, and then making the enemy attack where you are strong. Just about every point that the left says he is weak at, is actually his strength. They say he can't handle pressure, but watch a hostile press briefing where he takes on a few advesarial people at once. That is where he actually thrives.

    I really have no idea how intelligent Trump is but he is probably the sharpest and most quick witted politician I have ever seen.
    ...

  18. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    And your point is?
    MS13 is American Made.

    Both teams,, but the 'R"s had lead on this.

    To pretend that these are immigrants and not political tools,,Soldiers,,Mercenaries,,,, is disingenuous.

    These are Ollie Norths guys,,,,
    Last edited by pcosmar; 05-19-2018 at 06:41 PM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  19. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    MS13 is American Made.

    Both teams,, but the 'R"s had lead on this.

    To pretend that these are immigrants and not political tools,,Soldiers,,Mercenaries,,,, is disingenuous.
    It doesn't matter as long as you recognize they are bad and we should get rid of them and not let anymore in.
    The left is defending them, I am not and DJTvsg is not.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  20. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It doesn't matter as long as you recognize they are bad and we should get rid of them and not let anymore in.
    The left is defending them, I am not and DJTvsg is not.
    I'm not defending them,, only defining them correctly. They are US Veterans.. show some respect

    They were purpose built,, and are fulfilling their purpose.

    They Grow the Police State
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  21. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    I'm not defending them,
    I never said you were.

    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    , only defining them correctly. They are US Veterans.. show some respect

    They were purpose built,, and are fulfilling their purpose.

    They Grow the Police State
    They are foreign barbarians that need to be removed and kept out, the fact that they partially owe their existence to some of our traitors doesn't change that and is irrelevant to this thread.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  22. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I never said you were.



    They are foreign barbarians that need to be removed and kept out, the fact that they partially owe their existence to some of our traitors doesn't change that and is irrelevant to this thread.
    Get rid of the creators and handlers.. and the problem will evaporate.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  23. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Get rid of the creators and handlers.. and the problem will evaporate.
    Not if it has taken root.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  25. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Not if it has taken root.
    That's what they say about us.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  26. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    Few can differentiate these nuances, its hyper-propagandizing out-of-content sound bite bumper sticker publication.
    God bless democracy

  27. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Jamesiv1 View Post
    Going to be fun to watch this episode in midterms (and 2020) come back to haunt Democrats.

    1. Trump calls MS-13 'animals'
    2. Dems get triggered and either 1. attack Trump for saying it, or 2. Defend MS-13
    3. No sane person can believe #2
    4. DJ Donald Trumpmaster D wins again.
    It's time Mr. Trump learned how to have some class. So far, despite all of Mr. Trump's efforts, it looks like King Ralph with Johny Goodman.

  28. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    God bless democracy
    No way you know what he's talking about.

  29. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    God bless democracy
    I guess.

    We're being governed ruled by a geriatric Alzheimer patient/puppet whose strings are being pulled by an elitist oligarchy who believe they can manage the world... imagine the utter maniacal, sociopathic hubris!

  30. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    I guess.
    Thread winner.

  31. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Are MS-13 members human?
    an·i·mal
    ˈanəməl/
    noun
    noun: animal; plural noun: animals

    1.
    a living organism that feeds on organic matter, typically having specialized sense organs and nervous system and able to respond rapidly to stimuli.
    "animals such as spiders"
    a living organism other than a human being.
    "are humans superior to animals, or just different?"
    synonyms: creature, beast, living thing; More
    informalcritter, beastie;
    wildlife, fauna
    "endangered animals"
    a mammal, as opposed to a bird, reptile, fish, or insect.
    "the snowfall seemed to have chased all birds, animals, and men indoors"
    a person whose behavior is regarded as devoid of human attributes or civilizing influences, especially someone who is very cruel, violent, or repulsive.
    "those men have to be animals—what they did to that boy was savage"
    synonyms: brute, beast, monster, devil, demon, fiend; More

    informalswine, bastard, pig
    "the man was an animal"
    a particular type of person or thing.
    Ahem.

    I frankly don't care so much about politics anymore. Thugs gonna thug, and all that. And I don't know what the FULL context of the "animal" comment was... what he was talking about in general, etc. But TAKEN IN A VACUUM, the hyperventilating over Trump rather CLEARLY referring to MS-13 members specifically as "animals" is some goofy a$$ $hit in my book. Go read an article about what these fckers do to people once. "Animal" is GENEROUS. Regardless of where they came from or who "created" them. I don't know, and I really don't care anymore. These people are scum. Subhuman.

    Spark of divinity my a$$. These pigs are the spawn of the devil.

  32. #88
    https://www.vox.com/2018/5/18/173687...grants-illegal

    Trump’s defenders immediately claimed the media was getting the story wrong — that Trump had been answering a question about MS-13, so he clearly meant only that violent MS-13 gang members were “criminals.”

    Both of those characterizations were wrong.

    This is a pasted selection from the transcript sent out by the White House Press Office after the roundtable Wednesday:

    SHERIFF (Margaret) MIMS (Fresno County, CA): Now ICE is the only law enforcement agency that cannot use our databases to find the bad guys. They cannot come in and talk to people in our jail, unless they reach a certain threshold. They can’t do all kinds of things that other law enforcement agencies can do. And it’s really put us in a very bad position.

    THE PRESIDENT: It’s a disgrace. Okay? It’s a disgrace.

    SHERIFF MIMS: It’s a disgrace.

    THE PRESIDENT: And we’re suing on that, and we’re working hard, and I think it will all come together, because people want it to come together. It’s so ridiculous. The concept that we’re even talking about is ridiculous. We’ll take care of it, Margaret. We’ll win.

    SHERIFF MIMS: Thank you. There could be an MS-13 member I know about — if they don’t reach a certain threshold, I cannot tell ICE about it.

    THE PRESIDENT: We have people coming into the country, or trying to come in — and we’re stopping a lot of them — but we’re taking people out of the country. You wouldn’t believe how bad these people are. These aren’t people. These are animals. And we’re taking them out of the country at a level and at a rate that’s never happened before. And because of the weak laws, they come in fast, we get them, we release them, we get them again, we bring them out. It’s crazy.
    This context makes a few things clear.

    First of all, Trump was not asked a question about MS-13. He was not asked a question at all. He was commiserating with Sheriff Mims about the restrictions that the California “sanctuary” law puts on the ability of local law enforcement officers to make decisions about when someone should be flagged to ICE.

    Second of all, the context in which MS-13 was mentioned was itself very specific: someone identified by the sheriff’s department as a “known” gang member but who doesn’t meet the “threshold” of being charged with or convicted of a serious crime.

    Third, Trump’s response to Mims’s comment wasn’t actually a response to the point she was making. It wasn’t about people in local jails in the US. He first referred to people “trying to come in” to the country and then to people who are being “taken out of the country.” He then launched into a complaint about bad US laws that allow people to reenter the country repeatedly — something that also has nothing to do with the complaint Mims was making.

    In context, Trump’s “animals” comment was simply part of a riff; something at best tangentially related to the conversation that he and Mims had been having up to that point.

    That riff may well have been inspired by Mims’s reference to MS-13 in her previous remark. At the same time, though, Trump manifestly wasn’t talking about the same people Mims was talking about: MS-13 members in American jails without serious criminal records.

    The president often does this. His comments in unscripted settings often fail to follow any obvious train of thought; he often goes off on tangents and rehashes old riffs; he often fails to demonstrate an understanding of the actual policies being discussed. This is why “what did he mean” is so often an open question. But because he’s the president of the United States, ambiguous statements can’t be left ambiguous — they’re going to acquire whatever meaning people can make from them, based on their existing understanding of what kind of person the president is.
    The people making this argument weren’t primarily Democratic politicians. But after a day or so of the animals debate, Republicans had shifted to the idea that they had jiujitsued liberals into defending MS-13, and that that would help them in November. This, too, is a fixture of dialogue in the age of Trump: even people who wouldn’t defend his statements on the merits believe that they create an advantageous political situation for his party by inspiring the other side to do something politically counterproductive.
    More at link.
    Last edited by Zippyjuan; 05-20-2018 at 01:45 PM.



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  34. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    Are MS-13 members human?


    Da Big C don't apply to "all humans," Wonka. You jive?

    Who do it apply to? Wan' try? Tree guesses. Shoot um ah me, bro.

  35. #90
    lol at our resident socialists making excuses. Vox, really?
    Pfizer Macht Frei!

    Openly Straight Man, Danke, Awarded Top Rated Influencer. Community Standards Enforcer.


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