Results 1 to 21 of 21

Thread: Indentured Servitude to the State

  1. #1

    Indentured Servitude to the State

    Awesome! Instead of losing their homes (and being thrown into debtors prison), now seniors on fixed incomes can pay their rent, erm, property tax by working it off.

    Isn't this government great? They will "let" seniors work off their "debt" to "society" instead of forcibly seizing their homes. Who said the government didn't have compassion?

    http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5i...PzqKgD8TOK2500

    NY Town Lets Seniors Work to Pay Taxes
    By JIM FITZGERALD – 2 days ago
    GREENBURGH, N.Y. (AP) — Audrey Davison lives alone, gets a $620 Social Security check each month and worries about the sharply rising taxes on her four-bedroom house. Davison, 76, raised her family there and after 43 years, she really doesn't want to leave Greenburgh.
    Greenburgh doesn't want her to leave, either.
    The town is pushing a program that would let seniors work part-time, for $7 an hour, to help pay off some of their property taxes.
    "People shouldn't have to sell their house, move away to a place with less taxes, leave behind their family and friends," said Town Supervisor Paul Feiner.
    He envisions retired doctors mentoring schoolchildren, retired accountants helping with the town's finances, retired lawyers offering their services for a discount. But there are plenty of less-skilled jobs that need doing, he said.
    "It's not like we're going to see grandma running the snowplow," he said. "There are lots of things people can do for the town and it wouldn't cost us that much to pay them."
    "Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it." - Henry David Thoreau



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #2
    It's just getting started.

  4. #3

    New York Town Lets Senior Pay Off Property Tax Bill With Cheap Labor

    http://www.foxnews.com/story/2007/12...eap-labor.html

    December 25, 2007

    GREENBURGH, N.Y. – Audrey Davison lives alone, gets a $620 Social Security check each month and worries about the sharply rising taxes on her four-bedroom house. Davison, 76, raised her family there and after 43 years, she really doesn't want to leave Greenburgh.

    Greenburgh doesn't want her to leave, either.

    The town is pushing a program that would let seniors work part-time, for $7 an hour, to help pay off some of their property taxes.

    "People shouldn't have to sell their house, move away to a place with less taxes, leave behind their family and friends," said Town Supervisor Paul Feiner.

    He envisions retired doctors mentoring schoolchildren, retired accountants helping with the town's finances, retired lawyers offering their services for a discount. But there are plenty of less-skilled jobs that need doing, he said.

    "It's not like we're going to see grandma running the snowplow," he said. "There are lots of things people can do for the town and it wouldn't cost us that much to pay them."

    The proposal has caused a stir in Greenburgh, a town of 90,000 in Westchester County, which has the nation's third-highest homeowner property taxes. The plan would be unusual if not unique in New York, but similar programs are considered successes in Colorado, Massachusetts, South Carolina and elsewhere.

    Davison, who suffers from arthritis and sciatica and needs a walker to get around on her bad days, said she pays about $12,000 a year in property taxes -- perhaps $2,000 to the town -- and has already taken out a reverse mortgage to pay her bills.

    Talking to Feiner last week at the town senior center, she said, "I would work as long as it was a job where I could sit."

    "You could be a receptionist!" Feiner said. "You could greet people right here, when they come in."

    "That I would love," Davison said.

    Scott Parkin, spokesman for the National Council on Aging, said the program sounded interesting, as long as it wasn't limited to menial work. "It's certainly in line with what we stand for, keeping seniors involved in work or volunteering as a part of healthy aging," he said.

    Boulder County, Colo., pioneered a tax workoff program in 1986 for residents over 60 and now has about 250 applicants for the fewer than 100 openings, said spokeswoman Barbara Halpin. The work done by the seniors includes landscaping, gathering climate data, clipping newspapers and staffing the courthouse information booth.

    "Taxes aren't that high out here, so even at $7 an hour people can burn off their county taxes pretty quickly," Halpin said. She added that many stay in the program as volunteers after paying off their taxes.

    In Concord, Mass., Maria Casey of the personnel department said about 10 seniors get $8.50 an hour to work at research, data entry and groundskeeping. The program, started in 1999, "allows seniors to be able to work and be involved in the community, and the town benefits by their work," she said.

    Feiner is suggesting creating about 25 slots for seniors and letting them work off $500 or so a year. His proposal faces some obstacles. If the wages earned are to be tax-free and directly credited to the property tax bill, the state Legislature would have to approve. In addition, unions would have to be convinced that the program is no threat to their members' job security.

    Feiner is hoping for at least a pilot program next year.

    Eventually, he said, he would like to see the county and the local school districts adopt similar plans.

    "If we got seniors working for the schools, there might be a more intergenerational feeling there," he said. "It might be easier to pass the school budgets."

    Janet Goodman, a retired teacher and travel agent who was leading a knitting class at a Greenburgh community center, said paying the bills at her town house in Hartsdale, one of Greenburgh's seven villages, is "a constant struggle." She said she would gladly take part in a tax workoff program "as long as the work is interesting."

    "You have to be creative," she said.

  5. #4
    4 bedrooms? Could she not rent a room or two to help raise the taxes? She could probably do a b&b on the weekends and make enough to pay taxes, depending how close she is to points of interest and the train station.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    4 bedrooms? Could she not rent a room or two to help raise the taxes? She could probably do a b&b on the weekends and make enough to pay taxes, depending how close she is to points of interest and the train station.
    You sound like Bernie Sanders.

  7. #6
    Not so much. Bernie would expect her to volunteer for government. She has a lot of house there. She should not have to expend labor for the government in order to pay taxes. She can earn the money another way. What I suggested is doing what she wants with her own property if she really does not want to move. Payback stinks. She probably voted for some of the very things that make her taxes so high.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    She has a lot of house there.
    How much is too much?

    She probably voted for some of the very things that make her taxes so high.
    You are probably making this up.

  9. #8
    Did you even read the OP?

    The woman has more house than she can afford to pay taxes on. The presumption was that there be a program so people can work for government to pay off their taxes.

    She has lived there for 43 years. She probably voted during that time. Now her taxes are too high. She probably voted for some of the people and programs making life so expensive there.

    The idea that she should be forced to work for government is just absurd. She has choices. She can have whatever size house she wants, but she has to have a sustainable life. It sounds as if it isn't sustainable at this point with her disabilities and reverse mortgage, etc, and she should consider what she can do to earn her tax money. Or maybe downsize to a life she can afford. She can't afford to keep doing what she's doing.
    Last edited by euphemia; 07-06-2017 at 12:09 PM.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi



  10. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  11. #9
    We aren't 76, but we are rapidly moving toward this phase of life. We are not going to saddle our kids with a house and stuff they can't turn over quickly when we go. We live small, keep it simple, and pay our way.
    #NashvilleStrong

    “I’m a doctor. That’s a baby.”~~~Dr. Manny Sethi

  12. #10
    Property taxes are EVIL.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Property taxes are EVIL.
    Yes, they are....

    "To take away wrongfully from another and for one man to advance his own interest by the disadvantage of another man is more contrary to nature than death, than poverty, than pain, than any other evil." - Locke
    Last edited by phill4paul; 07-06-2017 at 01:55 PM.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Property taxes are EVIL.
    Not according to @euphemia. You just have to work with the government to find a way to pay your fair share. Maybe downsizing a bit. Largesse is definitely not encouraged.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    Not according to @euphemia. You just have to work with the government to find a way to pay your fair share. Maybe downsizing a bit. Largesse is definitely not encouraged.
    Not to mention that the government probably won't let you do what @euphemia suggested, Zoning etc.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Yes, they are....

    "To take away wrongfully from another and for one man to advance his own interest by the disadvantage of another man is more contrary to nature than death, than poverty, than pain, than any other evil." - Locke
    We don't own the property we paid for... merely renters, surfs... as if we didn't pay enough in taxes... just another form of theft.

    Don't need a weather man to know which way the wind blows

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by shakey1 View Post
    We don't own the property we paid for... merely renters, surfs... as if we didn't pay enough in taxes... just another form of theft.
    Absolutely. American citizens may hold "fee simple" properties. The word "fee" derives from the word "fief" and is associated with feudal landholdings. To have true "life, liberty and property" one must hold an allodial title. Allodial titles are not granted in the U.S.

  18. #16
    Just today I was browsing through some farm / ranch land for sale in texas and NM. One listing caught my eye ... hundreds of acres of property, house on it, and total yearly tax of around $2500. Compare that to the summer tax bill that just came in for this house and it's shockingly cheaper (The large ranch that is)
    “…let us teach them that all who draw breath are of equal worth, and that those who seek to press heel upon the throat of liberty, will fall to the cry of FREEDOM!!!” – Spartacus, War of the Damned

    BTC: 1AFbCLYU3G1dkbsSJnk3spWeEwpqYVC2Pq



  19. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    4 bedrooms? Could she not rent a room or two to help raise the taxes? She could probably do a b&b on the weekends and make enough to pay taxes, depending how close she is to points of interest and the train station.
    The solution is to eliminate property taxes, the worst kind of tax we have in America. This is literally worse than Marxism.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    The solution is to eliminate property taxes, the worst kind of tax we have in America. This is literally worse than Marxism.
    but then gentrification would be impossible.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    Did you even read the OP?

    The woman has more house than she can afford to pay taxes on. The presumption was that there be a program so people can work for government to pay off their taxes.

    She has lived there for 43 years. She probably voted during that time. Now her taxes are too high. She probably voted for some of the people and programs making life so expensive there.

    The idea that she should be forced to work for government is just absurd. She has choices. She can have whatever size house she wants, but she has to have a sustainable life. It sounds as if it isn't sustainable at this point with her disabilities and reverse mortgage, etc, and she should consider what she can do to earn her tax money. Or maybe downsize to a life she can afford. She can't afford to keep doing what she's doing.
    Property taxes are based on a superficial assessment of the value of your property. The only person who can decide the value of your property is the owner of the property.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    Property taxes are based on a superficial assessment of the value of your property. The only person who can decide the value of your property is the owner of the property.
    People have a tendency to cheat. We can not let them decide the price. It is the invisible hand of the market and the printing presses of the federal reserve that establish a fair price. This also why the honest people form a government and make sure nobody cheats.

  24. #21
    I don't understand how people put up with high property taxes to be honest. I'm pretty sure the founding fathers would have gouged King George's eyes out with bayonets if he wanted the equivelant of 13k a year for property tax.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."



Similar Threads

  1. PA-Foreign indentured servants walk off the job at Hershey factory.
    By Anti Federalist in forum U.S. Political News
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 08-20-2011, 03:25 PM
  2. Jake Towne “13th Amendment is for Indentured Servitude”
    By Tangoland in forum Jake Towne Forum 2010
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 06-14-2010, 12:04 PM
  3. Student Loans are the New Indentured Servitude
    By bobbyw24 in forum Economy & Markets
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 10-13-2009, 09:12 PM
  4. Obama's Mandatory Indentured Servitude
    By RonPaulFanInGA in forum Grassroots Central
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-20-2009, 01:43 AM
  5. Involuntary Servitude
    By stizmatic in forum U.S. Political News
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 10-25-2007, 10:36 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •