[Disputed] Trump's so-called 'miracle' COVID treatment was tested on aborted fetal cells

[TheCount]

The experimental drug US President Donald Trump credited with beating his COVID-19 infection was tested with the help of a cell line originally derived from an aborted fetus.

The Trump administration has notably opposed medical research that uses fetal tissue from elective abortions, while knocking back numerous requests from scientists to work with it.

Last Friday, Mr Trump tweeted confirming he and First Lady Melania Trump had tested positive for COVID-19.

The president was administered Regeneron Pharmaceuticals's REGN-COV2, which is an experimental and unapproved antibody cocktail used to treat COVID-19.

Mr Trump went on to describe the treatment as a "cure" for the infection, and also said the drugs he had been given were like "miracles coming down from God".

Regeneron's antibody cocktail was, in early stages, tested on a common cell culture called HEK 293 - a line of cells originally derived from an aborted fetus in the Netherlands in 1973.

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/donald-t...om-an-abortion

[tod evans]

[devil21]

"which is an experimental and unapproved antibody cocktail"

The new name for vaccines, apparently.

Everyone likes cocktails, don't they? Bottoms up.

[Brian4Liberty]

Regeneron's antibody cocktail was, in early stages, tested on a common cell culture called HEK 293 - a line of cells originally derived from an aborted fetus in the Netherlands in 1973.

So controversial.

Sounds like a very promising treatment for COVID. Very targeted. And the process of creating the antibodies starts with rodents. Fun facts.

[phill4paul]

So controversial.

Sounds like a very promising treatment for COVID. Very targeted. And the process of creating the antibodies starts with rodents. Fun facts.

An aborted fetus from 1973. Does anyone know if this fetus was aborted because it endangered the life of the mother? Did the fetus itself have a medical condition which didn't make it viable?

[TheCount]

An aborted fetus from 1973. Does anyone know if this fetus was aborted because it endangered the life of the mother? Did the fetus itself have a medical condition which didn't make it viable?

The cells were obtained from a single, apparently healthy, legally aborted fetus under Dutch law; the identity of the parents and the reason for the abortion are unknown.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HEK_293_cells

[DiverseSegregation]

If abortions get the green light, putting the aborted fetus to good use seems like it should be fine. I would bet that if Trump says abortions are great and using the aborted fetus for medical purposes would be good, all of a sudden abortions would be evil.

[phill4paul]

the reason for the abortion are unknown.

So it may, or may not, have threatened the health of the mother. O.K.

It seems to me you are trying to paint Trump as a child-blood drinking vampyre. I know that many on the left are doing just that. Is this your conclusion as well?

[TheCount]

So it may, or may not, have threatened the health of the mother. O.K.

It seems to me you are trying to paint Trump as a child-blood drinking vampyre. I know that many on the left are doing just that. Is this your conclusion as well?

My conclusion is that, and this should be no surprise to anyone at all, rules and standards only apply to the peasant class.

[Swordsmyth]

So controversial.

Sounds like a very promising treatment for COVID. Very targeted. And the process of creating the antibodies starts with rodents. Fun facts.

This is a Fake News thread, please label it as such:

The basis for these claims was an April 2020 statement from the company behind the drug, Regeneron, which states that Regeneron “uses a wide variety of research tools and technologies to help discover and develop new therapeutics. Stem cells are one such tool.” The statement goes on to mention that “there are limited research efforts employing human-induced pluripotent stem cell lines derived from adult human cells and human embryonic stem cells that are approved for research use by the National Institutes of Health and created solely through in vitro fertilization.”
The statement, however, refers to research done by Regeneron in general, not what research was performed with the drug cocktail Trump received specifically. There is no evidence publicly available to support the claim that REGN-COV2 utilized embryonic stem cells. What’s more, a Regeneron representative told The Dispatch Fact Check that “Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

More at: https://factcheck.thedispatch.com/p/...cktail-created

[Swordsmyth]

"which is an experimental and unapproved antibody cocktail"

The new name for vaccines, apparently.

Everyone likes cocktails, don't they? Bottoms up.

Your ignorance is showing.

An aborted fetus from 1973. Does anyone know if this fetus was aborted because it endangered the life of the mother? Did the fetus itself have a medical condition which didn't make it viable?

If abortions get the green light, putting the aborted fetus to good use seems like it should be fine. I would bet that if Trump says abortions are great and using the aborted fetus for medical purposes would be good, all of a sudden abortions would be evil.

It's fake news, see post #10.

[Krugminator2]

My conclusion is that, and this should be no surprise to anyone at all, rules and standards only apply to the peasant class.

I don't get your nihilistic posts at all. After years of posting on here and reading your posts, I have no idea what your views are on any issues. I do know you like to post even the most innocuous negative coverage as if they are scandals against Trump.

Even if this is true (which apparently it isn't), who cares? Is this supposed to be anything? This is not any type of news at all. It isn't scandalous. It isn't anything.

[Anti Federalist]

I don't get your nihilistic posts at all. After years of posting on here and reading your posts, I have no idea what your views are on any issues. I do know you like to post even the most innocuous negative coverage as if they are scandals against Trump.

Even if this is true (which apparently it isn't), who cares? Is this supposed to be anything? This is not any type of news at all. It isn't scandalous. It isn't anything.

He's trying to stir up anger against Trump for being a hypocrite.

"Orange Man says he's pro life, but look look, seeee, he used fetal stem cells from abortions to save his own miserable life!!!"

"Orange Man BAD!"

When the fact is, as has been pointed out in this thread:

“Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

E-D trolls the forum in the same manner, posting stories over and over that show Trump acting in a positive manner toward or in the interests of blacks.

These posts are designed to inflame and anger an imaginary racist, nationalist base of Trump's, that he seems to think is lurking here on RPF in great numbers.

[TheCount]

This is a Fake News thread, please label it as such:

Weasel words.

According to Regeneron, it and many other labs employ 293T cells to manufacture virus “pseudoparticles,” which are virus-like structures that contain the “spike” protein of the deadly coronavirus. It needs those to test how well different antibodies will neutralize the virus.

The two antibodies Regeneron eventually put forward as an experimental treatment, which may have saved Trump’s life, would have been selected using exactly such tests. Because the 293T cells were acquired so long ago, and have lived so long in the laboratory, they are no longer thought of as involving abortion politics.

“It’s how you want to parse it,” says Alexandra Bowie, a Regeneron spokesperson. “But the 293T cell lines available today are not considered fetal tissue, and we did not otherwise use fetal tissue.”

https://www.technologyreview.com/202...m-an-abortion/

293T is a man-made mutation of the original HEK 293 fetal cell line.



So they didn't use any fetal tissue so long as you don't count the fetal tissue that they used.

[RonZeplin]

Donnell loves the Dead Baby Parts vax cocktails.

[Swordsmyth]

Weasel words.



https://www.technologyreview.com/202...m-an-abortion/

293T is a man-made mutation of the original HEK 293 fetal cell line.



So they didn't use any fetal tissue so long as you don't count the fetal tissue that they used.

There is a weasel around here alright.
The article you quoted asserts that "The two antibodies Regeneron eventually put forward as an experimental treatment, which may have saved Trump’s life, would have been selected using exactly such tests." but we only have their assertion that that is the case.

Meanwhile we have been told that they didn't use ANY stem cells:
“Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

So the quibble over whether 293T cells are not considered fetal tissue is irrelevant because they didn't use them.

[Swordsmyth]

He's trying to stir up anger against Trump for being a hypocrite.

"Orange Man says he's pro life, but look look, seeee, he used fetal stem cells from abortions to save his own miserable life!!!"

"Orange Man BAD!"

When the fact is, as has been pointed out in this thread:

“Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

E-D trolls the forum in the same manner, posting stories over and over that show Trump acting in a positive manner toward or in the interests of blacks.

These posts are designed to inflame and anger an imaginary racist, nationalist base of Trump's, that he seems to think is lurking here on RPF in great numbers.

And it wouldn't be Trump's fault if the company had somehow made use of stem cell lines that originated in an abortion for some of the testing involved, he doesn't control the company.

And if no new children were killed I fail to see what the outrage would be anyway.


But as I have just pointed out to the OP: NO STEM CELLS were used AT ALL.

[TheCount]

I don't get your nihilistic posts at all. After years of posting on here and reading your posts, I have no idea what your views are on any issues. I do know you like to post even the most innocuous negative coverage as if they are scandals against Trump.

Even if this is true (which apparently it isn't), who cares? Is this supposed to be anything? This is not any type of news at all. It isn't scandalous. It isn't anything.

This, in particular, is related to my ongoing amusement regarding the unwavering support of supposed evangelicals for a serial adulterer who has nothing but contempt for their values.

[devil21]

This is a Fake News thread, please label it as such:

The basis for these claims was an April 2020 statement from the company behind the drug, Regeneron, which states that Regeneron “uses a wide variety of research tools and technologies to help discover and develop new therapeutics. Stem cells are one such tool.” The statement goes on to mention that “there are limited research efforts employing human-induced pluripotent stem cell lines derived from adult human cells and human embryonic stem cells that are approved for research use by the National Institutes of Health and created solely through in vitro fertilization.”
The statement, however, refers to research done by Regeneron in general, not what research was performed with the drug cocktail Trump received specifically. There is no evidence publicly available to support the claim that REGN-COV2 utilized embryonic stem cells. What’s more, a Regeneron representative told The Dispatch Fact Check that “Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

More at: https://factcheck.thedispatch.com/p/...cktail-created

Website looks totes legit and not like someone created it in a few minutes. Bonus points for DC registration.

[XNavyNuke]

Also disputed is whether Orange Man was once given antibiotics which were derived from earlier research in Penicillin. It is well established that early work in Penicillin was done on Guatemalan prisoners. All subsequent works derived from bad seed is verboten. That's how science works. Its settled.

XNN

[Anti Federalist]

This, in particular, is related to my ongoing amusement regarding the unwavering support of supposed evangelicals for a serial adulterer who has nothing but contempt for their values.

I can't speak for Christian evangelicals, but the fact that Trump was a reprobate is not really of concern to me.

Of course a billionaire playboy is going to bang hot broads.

In this day and age, we should all be happy that it is women he appreciates.

It could have been little boys, or dogs or dead people...no perversion is off the table anymore...love is love, bigots, celebrate me.

[phill4paul]

My conclusion is that, and this should be no surprise to anyone at all, rules and standards only apply to the peasant class.

And that is no answer.

[phill4paul]

I can't speak for Christian evangelicals, but the fact that Trump was a reprobate is not really of concern to me.

Of course a billionaire playboy is going to bang hot broads.

In this day and age, we should all be happy that it is women he appreciates.

It could have been little boys, or dogs or dead people...no perversion is off the table anymore...love is love, bigots, celebrate me.

And there ya have it.

[TheCount]

There is a weasel around here alright.
The article you quoted asserts that "The two antibodies Regeneron eventually put forward as an experimental treatment, which may have saved Trump’s life, would have been selected using exactly such tests." but we only have their assertion that that is the case.

Meanwhile we have been told that they didn't use ANY stem cells:
“Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 program did not involve use of human stem cells, embryonic stem cells or fetal tissue.”

So the quibble over whether 293T cells are not considered fetal tissue is irrelevant because they didn't use them.

Maybe you missed the direct quote from the company spokesperson:

“It’s how you want to parse it,” says Alexandra Bowie, a Regeneron spokesperson. “But the 293T cell lines available today are not considered fetal tissue, and we did not otherwise use fetal tissue.”

Again, it invalidates what you're saying because they're redefining fetal tissue as not fetal tissue.

[Swordsmyth]

Website looks totes legit and not like someone created it in a few minutes. Bonus points for DC registration.

Maybe you missed the direct quote from the company spokesperson:




Again, it invalidates what you're saying because they're redefining fetal tissue as not fetal tissue.

(notice how he wants you to ignore the word "human" and only talks about the word "fetal"?)
Try harder.



Nevertheless, a statement from David Prentice, Ph.D., and Tara Sander Lee, Ph.D., of the Charlotte Lozier Institute (CLI), the research arm of the pro-life Susan B. Anthony List, addresses what they refer to as “uninformed commentary … stating that President Trump has received a medication created with the use of human embryonic stem cells.”

The CLI scholars state:

CLI has reviewed the published information and our conclusion is straightforward: The president was not given any medicines to treat COVID-19 that involved the destruction of human life. No human embryonic stem cells or human fetal tissue were used to produce the treatments President Trump received–period.

Prentice and Sander Lee present “the facts”:

The Regeneron therapy given to the president was made in Velocimmune humanized mice, a novel platform that uses genetically modified mouse embryonic stem (ES) cells to generate antibodies described here and here. Development of Regeneron’s antibody cocktail is detailed in the journal Science, describing how they identified their antibodies made from Velocimmune mice and blood from recovered patients previously infected with SARS-CoV-2. The final antibody pair used in the REGN-COV2 therapy cocktail was then produced in Chinese hamster ovary (CHO) cells. Results from Regeneron’s REGN-COV2 clinical trials to treat COVID-19 patients are reported here.

The CLI scholars say embryonic stem cells from mice have been key in the development of alternatives to fetal tissue:

Mouse embryonic stem cells and genetic modifications to make such mice date back to 1981, have been extensively studied, and were instrumental in the discovery of induced pluripotent stem (iPS) cells, another fully ethical alternative to fetal material, as discussed in this Nature review. iPSCs are much easier to use than human embryonic stem cells, more flexible in their uses, and are not ethically controversial. No one has ever advocated against using mouse embryonic stem cells for development of therapies – only against destruction of human lives.

“And finally, the anti-viral medicine remdesivir and the anti-inflammatory corticosteroid dexamethasone, also given to the president to treat COVID-19, are chemicals—no cells of any kind were used to produce these medicines,” CLI states.
“These facts reinforce this truth: ethical treatments are saving lives every day–including the president of the United States,” the CLI officials observe.


In June 2019, the Trump administration announced it would no longer provide taxpayer funding for research in its programs that uses human fetal tissue derived from the body parts of aborted babies.
In addition to ending research at National Institutes of Health (NIH) with fetal tissue from elective abortions, HHS said the agency will also be applying a rigorous review protocol as it considers funding for research outside of its department.
Pro-life leaders in many fields have studied the issue and agree fetal tissue is not necessary to develop clinical treatments and, in fact, has not contributed to the cure of any disease.
CLI’s Prentice said at the time the Trump administration’s announcement showed NIH is invested in research methods that have already been proven:

Adult stem cells, iPS cells, organoids, humanized mice constructed using postnatally sourced cells and improved non-human cell lines—just to name a few. All of these have been used in the production of treatments, vaccines and medicines currently on the market; the key is that our government will now invest in effective research methods that do not rely on the destruction of human life.

In August, the Trump admin’s new Human Fetal Tissue Research Ethics Advisory Board reviewed requests made to the National Institutes of Health (NIH) for fed funded fetal tissue research
The Board recommended denying most of these requests.
full report �� https://t.co/LsFdfzztrW pic.twitter.com/vuRG7sur1m
— Charlotte Lozier Institute (@LozierInstitute) October 8, 2020

Dr. Donna Harrison, executive director of the American Association of Pro-Life Ob-Gyns, also applauded ending taxpayer funds to the abortion industry.
“The protection and care of human life by physicians and researchers must exist at all stages of life from conception to natural death,” she said, adding the Trump administration’s decision “is another clear example of the administration’s consistent protection of human life, regardless of location or age.”
“The Trump Administration has taken this important step toward stopping the barbaric practice of using the body parts of aborted babies for research,” Rep. Chris Smith (R-NJ) said. “Not only is the practice unethical, it is ineffective: fetal tissue, including fetal organs like liver and thymus, have not produced a single clinical treatment.”
Similarly, pro-life leader Kristan Hawkins, president of Students for Life of America, said at the time the announcement was another demonstration of the Trump administration’s vision of “restoring a Culture of Life to our government.”
“We’ve known for quite a while that Planned Parenthood in particular had created a macabre subculture, trafficking in infant body parts,” she said. “Ending this practice is ethically, scientifically, and morally right, especially as we’ve learned that fetal remains are not needed for research.”

More at: https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...-fetal-tissue/




And now we can all see who the weasels are.

[TheCount]

And now we can all see who the weasels are.

Yes, you. Weaseling out of the truth as always.


This page that Breitbart references says that no human fetal cells are used to produce the drug. But no one is claiming that, they're claiming that they were used to test it.

(notice how he wants you to ignore the word "human" and only talks about the word "fetal"?)

Are you now claiming that the HEK 293T cells are somehow not human? That's awfully dark of you.


Leave the children alone.

[Danke]

Seems legit.

[DiverseSegregation]

Yes, you. Weaseling out of the truth as always.


This page that Breitbart references says that no human fetal cells are used to produce the drug. But no one is claiming that, they're claiming that they were used to test it.




Are you now claiming that the HEK 293T cells are somehow not human? That's awfully dark of you.


Leave the children alone.

Should it be tested?

[TheCount]

Should it be tested?

Yes, of course.



Should I ignore the fact that Trump opposes the use of human fetal tissue for medical purposes, except apparently when it's for Trump's medical purposes?

[Badnon Wissenshaftler]

Even if this were true, I'm inclined to say "so what?".

Firstly, let's, for the sake of argument, call abortion "murder". I'm not saying it is, but let's just say that for now.

Suppose a man is murdered and is an organ donor. Maybe his organs are transplanted into people, saving their lives. Maybe his genetics are unusual, and a cell line is derived from his cells, and research is conducted that, over time, yields a medication that also saves lives, or advances medical science in some way.

By using that medication, or even by doing that research, is anyone advocating murder? Does anyone who comes back from the brink using this medication say "You know, murder really gets a bad rap. We should be murdering people left and right!"? Of course not.

Same for abortion, I should think. Especially for HEK 293.

Now, I also want to be clear with this: Probably everyone involved in modern cell biology has used the HEK 293 line in their work. It's one of the most ubiquitous cells lines out there. I've used them. There are probably many people here who have benefited in some way from research that made use of these cells. To single this out in the case of Trump's cocktail is absolutely frivolous!