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  1. #1

    Paul supporters 'freak out' town clerk

    http://www.concordmonitor.com/apps/p...12/1043/NEWS01

    We as supporters of Ron Paul need to remember to keep our cool. These are real people that are being hurt by us jumping to conclusions and making rash accusations.

    We need to make sure that we build a positive reputation as Ron Paul supporters.

    Please, no more conspiracy theories without solid proof.

    Paul supporters 'freak out' town clerk
    Vote-counting flub draws ire, threats

    By RAY DUCKLER
    Monitor staff
    January 12. 2008 12:20AM

    Jennifer Call's eyes searched the office for nothing in particular. Her arms waved and her fear spilled out.

    "This is where I grew up," Sutton's town clerk said yesterday. "This is my hometown, this is where my family is, and all of sudden, my name is being splashed across the internet as this horrible person. And the frightening part is, I don't know these people and they don't know me."

    Call wants the nationwide army of boisterous Ron Paul supporters, believers in more conspiracy theories than Oliver Stone, to know that she's committed no crime.

    Not treason, as the dozens of phone callers screamed. Not fraud, as the dozens of e-mails charged. Nothing.

    Human error, by someone unknown, caused Call's office to claim Paul received zero votes from the town during Tuesday's first-in-the-nation primary.

    Paul actually got a whopping 31 votes.

    Out of 920 cast.

    Launch an investigation. Alert the media.

    The mistake was corrected early the next morning, but that hardly mattered. The Paul machine, upon reading the number in print, quickly went into counteroffensive mode.

    This is luck at its worst. Screw up Rudy Giuliani's vote total. Or John McCain's. Or John Edwards's. Or Bill Richardson's.

    But never, ever get anything wrong when it comes to Paul and his voting tally. If you do, fans who shouted from the rooftops through the primary season will track you down and chew you out.

    "Most of the these people are not rational," Call said.

    Call, 35, arrived at the Pillsbury Memorial Hall Tuesday morning at 7 for the start of a marathon day. About a dozen or so staffers coordinated the effort, guiding voters, counting votes, rechecking totals.

    Paul's 31 votes got lost in the shuffle, lost in translation between moderator Greg Hill's voice and Call's pen.

    The slot next to Paul's name on the original return sheet said 31, but a space on Call's return, next to Paul's name, remained blank.

    "He's (Gill) reading off his results, I'm writing them down on the return," Call said. "I don't know why it was blank. I don't know if he skipped over it or if someone interrupted him to repeat the last name and it got skipped, or maybe I missed it. It was that simple."

    No it wasn't.

    Call was met by town officials the next morning at 9:30. They told her the mistake had been rectified. Call, her jacket still on, was confused.

    "What are you talking about?" she asked.

    She was told someone had come in and said he'd voted for Paul. The voter noticed the "0" in the local newspaper and wanted an explanation. When he got it, he left, satisfied.

    Call phoned the Secretary of State's office and re-faxed the form, the one with a circled "31" next to Paul's name. Just to make sure.

    Then it hit, like one of those snowstorms last month. Call got a call from someone named Bob. No last name. She remembers the man identifying himself as a reporter for the Associated Press, looking for the story on voter fraud.

    She said she'd fetch the details, then call him back, thinking the media would need a strict timeline and every tidbit available.

    "I'm thinking he's legitimate," Call said. "I call Bob back and it's a fax machine. I called AP and asked for Bob. They told me a reporter would have given a last name."

    Others in the office received calls and e-mails. But Call was the name out front, the town clerk as well as the tax collector. She was labeled the brains behind the plot. She had the biggest target on her back.

    The assault picked up after lunch. Paul supporters phoning Call claimed to be from the media. Others just yelled, saying she had committed treason, fraud. One person said she should be shot. She received as many as 40 calls that day.

    "One person said he was on a nationally syndicated radio station," Call said, "and he has given out my phone number and they need to call the town of Sutton to find out why there's voter fraud."

    The voices came from everywhere. California. Ohio. Florida. Michigan. Very few were from New Hampshire.

    A man from Texas e-mailed that he was "contacting, by certified mail, the Attorney General of New Hampshire . . . and requesting a complete investigation and prosecution of any and all parties involved."

    A police dispatcher in New London said yesterday she'd received inquiries about the clerk's office phone.

    Call got a handful of calls that night at home, refusing to pick up whenever an out-of-state number appeared on her screen.

    She got about five more the next day in her office. She tried to get work done. She called the Massachusetts company that makes the licenses for dog owners in her area. The guy had heard of her.

    "Wow," the man said. "This is the second time this week I've seen your name."

    "Where?" Call asked.

    "I've gotten a dozen e-mails about how you've destroyed the New Hampshire primary."

    "Why?"

    "We make voting machines."

    "The problem is," Call said yesterday, "we don't use voting machines."

    She went home and locked her doors. She called her mother in North Carolina. She cried. The calls kept coming. She unhooked her answering machine and requested an unlisted number.

    "I was drained emotionally and physically," Call said. "That's when I really started to freak out. Thursday it hit me, that most of these people are not rational. That's when I became scared."

    It's calmer now. The calls and e-mails had stopped as of yesterday afternoon. Call had the day off, but she went into her office to retrieve some paperwork.

    She's hurt and nervous, but she's got a job.

    "I've got a school board meeting Saturday," Call said. "I've got to be ready."



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  3. #2
    We did it for the lulz.

    .. I know I shouldn't find this funny, but I do. And I'm sorry for this, but one could swear we were the new internet hate machine after this article.
    tu ne cede malis

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Krippy View Post
    We did it for the lulz.

    .. I know I shouldn't find this funny, but I do. And I'm sorry for this, but one could swear we were the new internet hate machine after this article.
    I think we are. :|

  5. #4
    good thing NH is over. That is damn bad press.

  6. #5

  7. #6
    Absolute bull. There was something bogus that happened with NH. Something VERY bogus. People need to realise that they'd better not get vote counts wrong on ANYONE or they will be punished. Votes should be counted 10x if necessary. Vote counts are too important to accept "It was an honest mistake" as an answer.

    She deserved what she got if it was her fault.
    Last edited by Joe3113; 01-13-2008 at 04:13 AM.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Curlz31 View Post
    Absolute bull. There was something bogus that happened with NH. Something VERY bogus. People need to realise that they'd better not get vote counts wrong on ANYONE or they will be punished. Votes should be counted 10x if necessary. Vote counts are too important to accept "It was an honest mistake" as an answer.

    She deserved what she got if it was her fault.
    But we don't know if it was her fault.

    This is an example of guilty until proven innocent. She shouldn't be punished and harassed because of the suspicion of wrongdoing on her part.

    We can't let negative emotion take control and throw logical reasoning out the window. Remember what we are fighting for! Habeas Corpus is one of them.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by tikwanleap View Post
    But we don't know if it was her fault.

    This is an example of guilty until proven innocent. She shouldn't be punished and harassed because of the suspicion of wrongdoing on her part.

    We can't let negative emotion take control and throw logical reasoning out the window. Remember what we are fighting for! Habeas Corpus is one of them.
    The article clearly says she made the mistake.

    I think people should call, state their names and be adults in expressing their concern. Acting childish and/or threatening isn't helpful but this is what society has become. Short-sighted, immature, inarticulate people are everywhere you look now... manners? Eh.

    Having said that... she made a mistake in a process that cannot have any mistakes.. and isn't supposed to. They are supposed to rectify the votes of each candidate with the total number voting. What she did, mistake or not, was absolutely unacceptable. Unacceptable. She needs to understand that.

    I'm sure it's a big surprise to them that the citizens are really watching this time?
    Proud $2300 member
    (now working on husbands $2300)



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  11. #9

    proof some ARE crazy

    Quote Originally Posted by deedles View Post
    The article clearly says she made the mistake.
    NO! Quite clearly the article identifies "unknown" as the culprit.

    Anyone reading ronpaulforums can be certain of one thing. Some Ron Paul supporters are bleepin crazy.

    Read the posts above mine. Some of those posting before me either have a tenuous grasp on reality or simply do not care about right vs wrong.

    The harassment described in the article is typical of many whackjobs who call themselves supporters of Ron Paul. Again, just read the posts above mine and ask yourself: Want to have all those people on the jury deciding on your fate? Or, is it possible some of them are far too crazy to be entrusted with jury duty?

    NUTJOBS UNITE seems to be their rallying cry.

    It's wrong to avoid the obvious...the obvious is that harassment as described in the article was perpetrated by nutjobs who consider themselves to be Ron Paul supporters; and also, it's an unavoidable fact that some Ron Paul supporters are whacked out, way around the bend, certifiably nuts.
    Last edited by John P Slevin; 01-13-2008 at 10:37 AM.

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by John P Slevin View Post
    NO! Quite clearly the article identifies "unknown" as the culprit.

    Anyone reading ronpaulforums can be certain of one thing. Some Ron Paul supporters are bleepin crazy.

    Read the posts above mine. Some of those posting before me either have a tenuous grasp on reality or simply do not care about right vs wrong.

    The harassment described in the article is typical of many whackjobs who call themselves supporters of Ron Paul. Again, just read the posts above mine and ask yourself: Want to have all those people on the jury deciding on your fate? Or, is it possible some of them are far too crazy to be entrusted with jury duty?

    NUTJOBS UNITE seems to be their rallying cry.

    It's wrong to avoid the obvious...the obvious is that harassment as described in the article was perpetrated by nutjobs who consider themselves to be Ron Paul supporters; and also, it's an unavoidable fact that some Ron Paul supporters are whacked out, way around the bend, certifiably nuts.
    Lol..... Want to know something funny? The majority of people out there can be classified as "Nut jobs"

    Just look at all the irrational people who believe in god or creationism.. ....... Nuff said

    Hey now im not dissing anyones Religious beliefs im just pointing out that EVERYONE can be termed a "Nut job" by anyone else.. And it is true.. We as humans are not known to be rational in all cases.

    Take note my post a few back where i said i think what happend to this woman was wrong .. (Even IF it was justified) No one should be treated like this.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Curlz31 View Post
    Absolute bull. There was something bogus that happened with NH. Something VERY bogus. People need to realise that they'd better not get vote counts wrong on ANYONE or they will be punished. Votes should be counted 10x if necessary. Vote counts are too important to accept "It was an honest mistake" as an answer.

    She deserved what she got if it was her fault.
    Agreed. This isn't a god damned beauty pageant. It's not a "minor" mistake with the stakes we're talking about. Sorry, it's just not "bad luck" that Paul was the only canidate experiencing these "issues". I have very little sympathy for so-called "victims" in these positions. It's sort of like an air traffic controller simply shrugging their shoulders and saying "oops" if they almost crash two planes. Take responsibility for the weight of your positions and suck it up. If you're innocent, you're innocent but don't play dumb and naive thinking that this isn't a huge deal. The freedom and future of this country is riding on this election. Period.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Curlz31 View Post
    Absolute bull. There was something bogus that happened with NH. Something VERY bogus. People need to realise that they'd better not get vote counts wrong on ANYONE or they will be punished. Votes should be counted 10x if necessary. Vote counts are too important to accept "It was an honest mistake" as an answer.

    She deserved what she got if it was her fault.
    This type of talk is what hurts the movement! It's the price we pay for drawing from the uper fringes of society.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Curlz31 View Post
    Absolute bull. There was something bogus that happened with NH. Something VERY bogus. People need to realise that they'd better not get vote counts wrong on ANYONE or they will be punished.


    That ... is why you fail.

    Human beings make mistakes - deal with it. And nobody appointed you Official Punisher Of Mistakes in the election system.
    Quote Originally Posted by Uncle Emanuel Watkins View Post
    A fart is change. Our founding fathers did a lot more than just fart.

  16. #14
    ....
    Last edited by Nicketas; 02-07-2008 at 05:32 PM.
    (Disclaimer: The opinions expressed in the post above do not accurately reflect the political views of its author or affiliates. I hereby rescind the contents of any and all posts made on this forum under this user account. My political views have changed, are now private, and no longer represent the views of any particular political candidate.)

  17. #15
    good post tikwanleap.
    ^^ my 2 devaluated cents

  18. #16
    i have a feeling it was some of the people that have been posting in the 'new hampshire primaries' subforum lately... that place has become vote fraud / conspiracy theory central

    this is terrible, i feel bad for the woman



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  20. #17
    I feel bad for the lady...would like to reach out and let her know that I accept her explanation that it was simple human error and that not all RP supporters are so emotional that they would go out of their way to call her on the phone...but that would probably freak her out more...

    Now comes the thought - was it really RP supporters that called her?? Perhaps a dirty trip opportunity?? in any case, I feel bad for the lady....

  21. #18
    A little rationality and maturity doesn't hurt when dealing with people, though,
    who knows how many times wild things are done in Ron's name by other campaign supporters just to make him/us look bad?

    I put NOTHING past the competition in trying to smear Ron AND us.

    Maybe some of us should pretend to be supporting other candidates and do the same thing.

  22. #19
    Count the votes correctly next time.

    "Opps" doesn't cut it.
    Last edited by FrankRep; 01-13-2008 at 10:34 AM.
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  23. #20

    Some Sympathy, But Not Much

    Admittedly, the woman is being hit rather hard with criticism, but it makes me wonder when people thought that human error during a federal election was an okay, or even, penalty free thing to happen.

  24. #21
    Let's go after RAY DUCKLER next! (the author of that article)

    j/k

    Bah! When you have a Grassroots movement this strong... these things will happen.
    Last edited by dkim68; 01-13-2008 at 04:39 AM.

  25. #22

    A little perspective.

    I agree whole-heartedly with the responders who have pointed out that:

    1) Childish, immature, or histrionic reactions to this or any other provocation by THEM is counterproductive.
    2) Some of the worst offenders could very well be agents provocateur so I don't think we should be too quick to apologize for their behavior, although a disavowal of such behavior in general is appropriate.

    and

    3) "I made an honest mistake" is NOT an acceptable answer.

    I am a physician. If I make an "honest mistake" that costs a patient his life or limb, I am not absolved merely by good intentions. There is such a thing as due diligence, regardless of one's position of responsibility. Maybe Mrs. Call needs to reconsider her attitude about how important the right to vote is for each and every voter. Maybe it is time for every one in the business of recording and tallying the vote to treat it as a sacred responsibility and not as just another job.
    Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.C. S. Lewis

  26. #23
    I feel sorry for her... but town clerk IS a position of great responsibility and trust, and I find it dismaying that she seems to think she's just some flunky.

  27. #24
    And we bitch about the ineptitude of the official campaign? How about the PR ineptitude of the grassroots? Throwing snowballs, making harrassing phone calls, threatening journalists, shouting conspiracy theories at Bill Clinton...Yeah, all in good fun until Ron Paul loses the election.



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  29. #25
    pffft i am dismayed at how quickly some people here are willing to turn on our own supporters! Do you guys believe all the MSM hype about paul supporters being irrational crazies??

    I have to say this. Grow some ballz guys.

    If you have some sympathy to go around, spread it to the poor people in Iraq dying under an illegal occupation! Spread it to those Americans in jail for refusing to pay an unconstitutional income tax!

    But this woman, who could quite possibly be involved in voter fraud, who we do not know if she's telling the truth got some phone calls saying what she has done is treason and your all ready to jump to her aid and condemn your fellow revolutionaries who are fighting so hard for freedom.

    Get your priorities straight yo
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  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by ST0PandL00K View Post
    pffft i am dismayed at how quickly some people here are willing to turn on our own supporters! Do you guys believe all the MSM hype about paul supporters being irrational crazies??

    I have to say this. Grow some ballz guys.

    If you have some sympathy to go around, spread it to the poor people in Iraq dying under an illegal occupation! Spread it to those Americans in jail for refusing to pay an unconstitutional income tax!

    But this woman, who could quite possibly be involved in voter fraud, who we do not know if she's telling the truth got some phone calls saying what she has done is treason and your all ready to jump to her aid and condemn your fellow revolutionaries who are fighting so hard for freedom.

    Get your priorities straight yo
    I agree, when it comes to important matters such as this there is no room for mistakes. Most of you need to realize it is going to take a little shaking up of the system to set these people straight. The government needs to be affraid of the public.
    Look at all the angles. Think for yourself.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by ST0PandL00K View Post
    pffft i am dismayed at how quickly some people here are willing to turn on our own supporters! Do you guys believe all the MSM hype about paul supporters being irrational crazies??

    I have to say this. Grow some ballz guys.

    If you have some sympathy to go around, spread it to the poor people in Iraq dying under an illegal occupation! Spread it to those Americans in jail for refusing to pay an unconstitutional income tax!

    But this woman, who could quite possibly be involved in voter fraud, who we do not know if she's telling the truth got some phone calls saying what she has done is treason and your all ready to jump to her aid and condemn your fellow revolutionaries who are fighting so hard for freedom.

    Get your priorities straight yo
    Totally agree. Does anyone in any government position, from president to town clerk, get held responsible for "mistakes" anymore? no because it wasn't a mistake and this is just a sob story piece that the MSM are trying to put out. Why don't they focus on what she did instead. Shouldn't that be the real story. You can tell this is all staged by the outcome which is that WE get demonized for standing up for our rights and a fair election and the establishment come out looking like the victim. Please stop playing into thier spin. This is THE fight of our lives here.

    United we stand. Divided we fall.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Arramond View Post
    Totally agree. Does anyone in any government position, from president to town clerk, get held responsible for "mistakes" anymore? no because it wasn't a mistake and this is just a sob story piece that the MSM are trying to put out. Why don't they focus on what she did instead. Shouldn't that be the real story. You can tell this is all staged by the outcome which is that WE get demonized for standing up for our rights and a fair election and the establishment come out looking like the victim. Please stop playing into thier spin. This is THE fight of our lives here.

    United we stand. Divided we fall.
    Exactly. You guys didnt expect a piece like this to come out regardless?
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  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by ST0PandL00K View Post
    pffft i am dismayed at how quickly some people here are willing to turn on our own supporters! Do you guys believe all the MSM hype about paul supporters being irrational crazies??

    I have to say this. Grow some ballz guys.
    Agreed. I'm already having to deal with some "I'm a better RP supporter than you are" childishness from people. Why are some supporters in this ridiculous pick-and-choose mode of who they want participating in their Revolution? It's not a cool kids club. It's America as a whole banding together for a cause. White supremacists and 9/11 truthers included. I really don't give a sh!t who's involved. We need everybody on-board for this to happen.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by NYgs23 View Post
    And we bitch about the ineptitude of the official campaign? How about the PR ineptitude of the grassroots? Throwing snowballs, making harrassing phone calls, threatening journalists, shouting conspiracy theories at Bill Clinton...Yeah, all in good fun until Ron Paul loses the election.
    Like that would be why he'd lose. After everything we've seen up to now from the MSM etc.
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