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Thread: The "Giuliani Moment"

  1. #1

    The "Giuliani Moment"

    The ‘Giuliani Moment’
    {Ron Paul | 17 May 2017}

    Ron Paul vs. Rudy Giuliani
    {Charles Johnson | 16 May 2007}

    Best moment of the 2nd GOP debate.

    The Republican Party Debate, South Carolina, May 15th, 2007

    MR. GOLER: Congressman Paul, I believe you are the only man on the stage who opposes the war in Iraq, who would bring the troops home as quickly as — almost immediately, sir. Are you out of step with your party? Is your party out of step with the rest of the world? If either of those is the case, why are you seeking its nomination?

    REP. PAUL: Well, I think the party has lost its way, because the conservative wing of the Republican Party always advocated a noninterventionist foreign policy.

    Senator Robert Taft didn’t even want to be in NATO. George Bush won the election in the year 2000 campaigning on a humble foreign policy — no nation-building, no policing of the world. Republicans were elected to end the Korean War. The Republicans were elected to end the Vietnam War. There’s a strong tradition of being anti-war in the Republican party. It is the constitutional position. It is the advice of the Founders to follow a non-interventionist foreign policy, stay out of entangling alliances, be friends with countries, negotiate and talk with them and trade with them.

    Just think of the tremendous improvement — relationships with Vietnam. We lost 60,000 men. We came home in defeat. Now we go over there and invest in Vietnam. So there’s a lot of merit to the advice of the Founders and following the Constitution.

    And my argument is that we shouldn’t go to war so carelessly. (Bell rings.) When we do, the wars don’t end.

    MR. GOLER: Congressman, you don’t think that changed with the 9/11 attacks, sir?

    REP. PAUL: What changed?

    MR. GOLER: The non-interventionist policies.

    REP. PAUL: No. Non-intervention was a major contributing factor. Have you ever read the reasons they attacked us? They attack us because we’ve been over there; we’ve been bombing Iraq for 10 years. We’ve been in the Middle East — I think Reagan was right.

    We don’t understand the irrationality of Middle Eastern politics. So right now we’re building an embassy in Iraq that’s bigger than the Vatican. We’re building 14 permanent bases. What would we say here if China was doing this in our country or in the Gulf of Mexico? We would be objecting. We need to look at what we do from the perspective of what would happen if somebody else did it to us. (Applause.)

    MR. GOLER: Are you suggesting we invited the 9/11 attack, sir?

    REP. PAUL: I’m suggesting that we listen to the people who attacked us and the reason they did it, and they are delighted that we’re over there because Osama bin Laden has said, “I am glad you’re over on our sand because we can target you so much easier.” They have already now since that time — (bell rings) — have killed 3,400 of our men, and I don’t think it was necessary.

    MR. GIULIANI: Wendell, may I comment on that? That’s really an extraordinary statement. That’s an extraordinary statement, as someone who lived through the attack of September 11, that we invited the attack because we were attacking Iraq. I don’t think I’ve heard that before, and I’ve heard some pretty absurd explanations for September 11th. (Applause, cheers.)

    And I would ask the congressman to withdraw that comment and tell us that he didn’t really mean that. (Applause.)

    MR. GOLER: Congressman?

    REP. PAUL: I believe very sincerely that the CIA is correct when they teach and talk about blowback. When we went into Iran in 1953 and installed the shah, yes, there was blowback. A reaction to that was the taking of our hostages and that persists. And if we ignore that, we ignore that at our own risk. If we think that we can do what we want around the world and not incite hatred, then we have a problem.

    They don’t come here to attack us because we’re rich and we’re free. They come and they attack us because we’re over there. I mean, what would we think if we were — if other foreign countries were doing that to us?
    The Bastiat Collection · FREE PDF · FREE EPUB · PAPER
    Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)

    • "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law."
      -- The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
      -- Government (p. 99)
    • "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
      -- Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)
    • "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
      -- Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)

    · tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·

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  3. #2
    The ‘Giuliani Moment’ 10 Years On: What Does It Mean Today?
    {Daniel McAdams | 17 May 2017}

    Ron Paul shocked the GOP at the May 15, 2007 South Carolina presidential debate. Our foreign policy of interventionism is the reason people overseas are angry with us and would like to attack us — and why they attacked us on 9/11. Frontrunner Rudy Giuliani exploded at Paul, demanding he take back his words. Paul stood firm. People expected it to be the end of the Paul candidacy, but a funny thing happened: the post-debate polls began to favor him. It was the beginning of the end of Giuliani…and the beginning of the beginning of Ron Paul’s worldwide peace movement. In today’s Liberty Report, Dr. Paul tells us how he felt at the time…and what can be done to continue the momentum:

    The 'Giuliani Moment' 10 Years On: What Does It Mean Today?
    {RonPaulLibertyReport | 17 May 2017}

    Ten years ago this week, at a South Carolina GOP debate, Rep. Ron Paul dared challenge the cherished shibboleth that "they attack us because we are rich and free." No, it is our foreign policy that provokes hatred and inspires attacks like 9/11, he dared say. Ten years after "the Moment" we are still growing. Your tax-deductible donation to the Ron Paul Institute -- -- will help us continue and expand Ron Paul's historic mission!

  4. #3
    We've come a long way since then, a strong liberty politician in the house, senate, and for a brief 4 years, the white house
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  5. #4
    Somebody should send this to Ghouliani on Twitter so we can try to get a response from him.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    We've come a long way since then, a strong liberty politician in the house, senate, and for a brief 4 years, the white house
    My favorite Trump / Giuliani moment.

    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  7. #6
    Man I remember the excitement of those days
    "Nobody wins in a Dairy Challenge" ~ Kenny Rogers, RIP

    "When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken, or cease to be honest." ~ anonymous

    “The fate of all mankind I see
    Is in the hands of fools” ~ King Crimson

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by sam1952 View Post
    Man I remember the excitement of those days
    Me too... It was amazing. Compare that excitement to all the bizarre stuff going on today like zee/zir pronouns and kids getting festering holes drilled where their dicks used to be.

    I've given money to two Presidential candidates - Ross Perot and Ron Paul. I actually did some phone bank volunteering for Perot's campaign in 1992. Talking to people across the country that had the exact same kind of excitement we had for Ron Paul. It changed my entire worldview.

    Ross was a hoot, and they made fun of him the same way they did Ron Paul.... But he didn't give a damn. He was a 5'2" country boy, self-made billionaire, and he was going to drain the goddamn swamp. But they threatened his children, showed up at his daughter's wedding even, and that took him down.

    Live, laugh and love the ones you're with. That's where I'm at these days.

    May the charts be with you.

    Last edited by Intrepid; 05-17-2024 at 02:49 AM.

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