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Thread: NZ Cow burp tax

  1. #1

    NZ Cow burp tax

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/new-ze...urps-1.6612302

    New Zealand's government on Tuesday proposed taxing the greenhouse gases that farm animals make from burping and peeing as part of a plan to tackle climate change.

    The government said the farm levy would be a world first, and that farmers should be able to recoup the cost by charging more for climate-friendly products.

    But farmers quickly condemned the plan. Federated Farmers, the industry's main lobby group, said the plan would "rip the guts out of small town New Zealand" and see farms replaced with trees.

    Federated Farmers president Andrew Hoggard said farmers had been trying to work with the government for more than two years on an emissions reduction plan that wouldn't decrease food production.

    "Our plan was to keep farmers farming," Hoggard said. Instead, he said farmers would be selling their farms "so fast you won't even hear the dogs barking on the back of the ute (pickup truck) as they drive off."

    Opposition lawmakers from the conservative ACT Party said the plan would actually increase worldwide emissions by moving farming to other countries that were less efficient at making food.

    We're being governed ruled by a geriatric Alzheimer patient/puppet whose strings are being pulled by an elitist oligarchy who believe they can manage the world... imagine the utter maniacal, sociopathic hubris!



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  3. #2
    The government said [...] that farmers should be able to recoup the cost by charging more for climate-friendly products.
    Yeah, sure, because that's how it works - increasing your revenues is just a matter of increasing your prices.

    I don't know if these people are just really that profoundly stupid, or if they full-well know better and are expecting others to be that profoundly stupid.
    The Bastiat Collection ˇ FREE PDF ˇ FREE EPUB ˇ PAPER
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      -- The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
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  4. #3
    Federated Farmers president Andrew Hoggard said farmers had been trying to work with the government for more than two years on an emissions reduction plan that wouldn't decrease food production.
    Well, there's your problem, right there.

    Trying to "work with" thieves and robbers (instead of rejecting and fighting them) can only get you plundered.

    "In any compromise between food and poison, it is only death that can win." -- Ayn Rand

    But farmers quickly condemned the plan. Federated Farmers, the industry's main lobby group, said the plan would "rip the guts out of small town New Zealand" and see small farms replaced with trees HyperMegaGloboCorp farms.
    Fixed.

    The rise of latter-day latifundia mirrors that of the Late Roman Republic (which laid the groundwork for medieval serfdom). The Roman version of the phenomenon resulted in mass civil unrest and involved institution-breaking fights that contributed significantly to the transformation of the Roman republic into the Roman empire.

  5. #4
    Imagine being the person that gets hired to write down every time a cow burps or pees.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Yeah, sure, because that's how it works - increasing your revenues is just a matter of increasing your prices.

    I don't know if these people are just really that profoundly stupid, or if they full-well know better and are expecting others to be that profoundly stupid.
    We export very top shelf $#@!. If its carbon netural beef or lamb then that sticker is worth paying more for for a lot of people. Like nuclear free. Its dippy but its what our export customers want.
    In New Zealand:
    The Coastguard is a Charity
    Air Traffic Control is a private company run on user fees
    The DMV is a private non-profit
    Rescue helicopters and ambulances are operated by charities and are plastered with corporate logos
    The agriculture industry has zero subsidies
    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
    A tax return has 4 fields
    Business licenses aren't a thing
    Prostitution is legal
    We have a constitutional right to refuse any type of medical care

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    We export very top shelf $#@!. If its carbon netural beef or lamb then that sticker is worth paying more for for a lot of people. Like nuclear free. Its dippy but its what our export customers want.
    It doesn't matter how "top shelf" your "$#@!" is - if you increase your prices, people are going to buy less of your "$#@!" than they did before.

    Regardless of whether they are selling "top shelf $#@!" or cheap junk, sellers cannot simply increase their prices in order to increase their revenues.

    The Law of Demand is a thing. This is elementary first-week Economics 101.
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 10-11-2022 at 11:14 PM.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    It doesn't matter how "top shelf" your "$#@!" is - if you increase your prices, people are going to buy less of your "$#@!" than they did before.

    Regardless of whether they are selling "top shelf $#@!" or cheap junk, sellers cannot simply increase their prices in order to increase their revenues.

    The Law of Demand is a thing. This is elementary first-week Economics 101.
    If you are selling commodities.

    If one price is for carbon polluting beef and the other is for carbon neutral beef then their demands and supplies and prices are independent except for willingness to substitute down.

    Its called marketing 101.
    In New Zealand:
    The Coastguard is a Charity
    Air Traffic Control is a private company run on user fees
    The DMV is a private non-profit
    Rescue helicopters and ambulances are operated by charities and are plastered with corporate logos
    The agriculture industry has zero subsidies
    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
    A tax return has 4 fields
    Business licenses aren't a thing
    Prostitution is legal
    We have a constitutional right to refuse any type of medical care

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    If you are selling commodities.

    If one price is for carbon polluting beef and the other is for carbon neutral beef then their demands and supplies and prices are independent except for willingness to substitute down.

    Its called marketing 101.
    You talk about the willingness to substitute down like it's a minor matter, of little consequence. It'll be interesting to see if the market concurs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...



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  11. #9
    One could almost come to the conclusion that the goal isn't less emissions... it's less food.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    If you are selling commodities.

    If one price is for carbon polluting beef and the other is for carbon neutral beef then their demands and supplies and prices are independent except for willingness to substitute down.

    Its called marketing 101.
    So increasing sellers' expenses (for example, by the imposition of new farm levies) can be simply and easily offset just by making more-expensive-to-produce goods - and then marketing them under the rubric of "climate friendliness" or "carbon neutrality" or whatnot and demanding higher prices for them (i.e.., "charging more for climate-friendly products") ...

    LOL OK

    So why weren't those sellers doing that all along, before the imposition of those new levies?

    After all, if you are correct, then doing so ought necessarily to have netted them even greater profits (or at least more revenue) than they would otherwise have made.

    IOW: If "farmers should be able to recoup the cost [of the levies] by charging more for climate-friendly products" - and if this is merely a matter of "marketing 101" - then why the hell weren't they just doing that to begin with (before the levies) and pocketing the difference?

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    If you are selling commodities.

    If one price is for carbon polluting beef and the other is for carbon neutral beef then their demands and supplies and prices are independent except for willingness to substitute down.

    Its called marketing 101.
    Personally, I'm willing to pay a premium for any beef that was raised with an intention of wrecking the atmosphere as much as possible.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  14. #12
    So who benefits from the tax?

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    You talk about the willingness to substitute down like it's a minor matter, of little consequence. It'll be interesting to see if the market concurs.
    Especially since one of the purposes of this kind of nonsense is to eliminate those down-substitutes in the first place.

    If you can't lower expenses or prices for your goods, then force the other guy to increase his.

    (HyperMegaGloboCorp will certainly appreciate your assistance in eliminating their marginal competitors.)

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    So who benefits from the tax?
    Big cricket, or the cricket industrial complex
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    So who benefits from the tax?
    (1) the State
    (2) (1a) HyperMegaGloboCorp

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Especially since one of the purposes of this kind of nonsense is to eliminate those down-substitutes in the first place.

    If you can't lower expenses or prices for your goods, then force the other guy to increase his.

    (HyperMegaGloboCorp will certainly appreciate your assistance in eliminating their marginal competitors.)
    Nixon's hyper-regulation regime certainly did for Ford and GM what even bribing the hell out of the MIC and their government stooges (anyone remember Charlie Wilson and Robert McNamara?) couldn't. It killed AMC, damn near killed Chrysler (did marginalize it right out of Australia, Europe, Africa and South America), and forced Fiat, Peugeot, Renault, Citröen, all British Leyland products but their trucks, and several others right out of the U.S. market.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 10-12-2022 at 09:58 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Nixon's hyper-regulation regime certainly did for Ford and GM what even bribing the hell out of the MIC and their government stooges (anyone remember Charlie Wilson and Robert McNamara?) couldn't. It killed AMC, damn near killed Chrysler (did marginalize it right out of Australia, Europe, Africa and South America), and forced Fiat, Peugeot, Renault, Citröen, all British Leyland products but their trucks, and several others right out of the U.S. market.
    Farmers in NZ are the least regulated and entirely unsubsidized. The regulations that exist tend to be pretty clean and simple. Its why our farms are so competitive.

    Whereas in the American regime importing sugar is illegal so you gotta make all your $#@! out of corn? And pay tax to give to the corn farmers on top of that?
    In New Zealand:
    The Coastguard is a Charity
    Air Traffic Control is a private company run on user fees
    The DMV is a private non-profit
    Rescue helicopters and ambulances are operated by charities and are plastered with corporate logos
    The agriculture industry has zero subsidies
    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
    A tax return has 4 fields
    Business licenses aren't a thing
    Prostitution is legal
    We have a constitutional right to refuse any type of medical care

  21. #18
    Do overweight obese humans have more waste than those of normal weight? Do they also require and consume more resources therefore also contributing more than others?

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Imagine being the person that gets hired to write down every time a cow burps or pees.
    Probably use remote monitoring.
    https://www.innovationnewsnetwork.co...and%20location.

    Get used to it. First its cows, then its humans.

    We're being governed ruled by a geriatric Alzheimer patient/puppet whose strings are being pulled by an elitist oligarchy who believe they can manage the world... imagine the utter maniacal, sociopathic hubris!

  23. #20
    The government said [...] that farmers should be able to recoup the cost by charging more for climate-friendly products.
    No word yet on how consumers "should be able to recoup the cost".

    Meanwhile, in completely unrelated news:

    https://twitter.com/backtolife_2023/...52153483472896

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    (1) the State
    (2) (1a) HyperMegaGloboCorp
    Maybe the state should find a better way to rob people.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    Maybe the state should find a better way to rob people.
    What better way to rob people, than in the name of "climate change"?
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    What better way to rob people, than in the name of "climate change"?
    But it's so obvious.



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