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Thread: More News You’ve Probably Not Heard

  1. #1

    More News You’ve Probably Not Heard

    More News You’ve Probably Not Heard

    https://www.ericpetersautos.com/2022...bly-not-heard/

    By eric - August 4, 2022

    It’s hard to know what’s really going on when it’s not being reported.

    Much less explained.

    One example of this is the not-reported news – which is big news – that Honda will stop making the Goldwing motorcycle after the end of this year.

    Not because it isn’t selling. The Goldwing, Honda’s big touring bike, has been doing that since 1976 – almost 50 years ago.

    It was a hugely innovative bike that quickly became one of the most enduringly popular bikes Honda has ever offered.

    The problem is complying.

    Honda says the current bike’s iconic flat six engine can no longer be tweaked sufficiently to pass the latest slew of “emissions” standards that go into effect in Japan this fall.

    A new-design engine, probably direct-injected and with a slew of new (expensive) “technology” would be needed – and the cost of developing such cannot be justified, because the new engine, even if “compliant” for now, would probably be unable to comply with the next ratcheting-up of these “emissions” standards, certain to be imposed within the next couple of years (if not sooner). Which would not be enough time for Honda to recover its forced “investment” in an all-new engine.

    And so it is pulling the plug on its flagship bike, a model that is credited with inspiring this class of bike as well as many emulators such as the Yamaha FJR – which its manufacturer has also announced it will stop making after the end of this year, for the same reason. Other Japanese brands – including Kawasaki and Suzuki – are cancelling various models as well.

    All of the affected bikes are made in Japan, where the government has decreed that motorcycle “emissions” must be reduced by 33 percent, which sounds significant – until you dig into the numbers and discover that it is “33 percent” less than the existing “percent,” which is 0.06 grams per kilometer (g/km).

    In other words, significantly less than 1 percent total reduction. A meaningless reduction, insofar as air pollution. A reduction for reduction’s sake. And for another sake – that being the Final Solutioning of the Combustion Engine Problem.

    That problem having nothing to do with air pollution – or “climate change” – but everything to do with cording (and so herding and controlling) mobility. Honda says it plans to “electrify” its entire lineup, meaning it is being forced to as there is no market for electric motorcycles.

    Because there is no such thing.

    An electric bike is a scooter – by definition.

    It can be made to look like a motorcycle – just as a man can be made to look like a woman – but no matter how much either may look like that which they are trying to be, neither of them is or ever can be. Without an engine, without a transmission and gears to shift, levers to pull in and release, there isn’t much to do other than sit there – and while that may be riding it isn’t motorcycling.

    Electric cars may have a kind of better-appliance appeal to people who view cars as appliances, which of course they are. But people who buy motorcycles view bikes very differently. The machine matters – and a battery-powered appliance will never take the place of the machine in the hearts of bikers.

    That’s why bikes are being taken away from them via this unreported – this unexplained – “emissions” rigmarole. The average person has no idea that bikes are in the crosshairs – much less why, as it is never explained. If they hear anything at all, they hear “33 percent” – and think it’s significant and so, necessary.

    This is both tragedy and abomination. Also forewarning.

    Honda (and Yamaha and Kawasaki, et al) could move their production lines out of Japan and relocate them here, to the United States, where “emissions” standards for motorcycles aren’t yet as impossible-to-comply with as they are in Japan. This is why Harley and Indian – which are made here – haven’t cancelled their big touring and cruiser bikes . . . yet.

    But everyone knows what tomorrow will bring.

    That it is only a matter of time before the U.S. regulatory regime “catches up” – as it will be styled – with the Japanese (and Euro) “emissions” standards that have caused the cancellation of the Goldwing, FJR and other “noncompliant” models made in Japan. At which point it will no longer be feasible to make them here, either. At which point, Harley and Indian will also likely be forced to “electrify” their lineup. (The Deadwire gives us a preview of this motorcycle-less future).

    Honda, Kawasaki, et al aren’t run by stupid people. They can see where things are headed. They know that relocating production of outlawed bikes to America would only buy them a little more time – at great expense – before they are outlawed, again.

    Ergo, why bother?

    The big bikes first. Just as big engines in cars have been outlawed via regulations. Then all engines – the same as is happening to cars, so as to force electric motors into their place – in the name of insignificant reductions in “emissions” that stopped being significant decades ago, for the purpose of cording everything – and thereby tethering us.

    That’s the news, in case you haven’t heard about it yet.
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire



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  3. #2
    All of the affected bikes are made in Japan, where the government has decreed that motorcycle “emissions” must be reduced by 33 percent, which sounds significant – until you dig into the numbers and discover that it is “33 percent” less than the existing “percent,” which is 0.06 grams per kilometer (g/km).

    In other words, significantly less than 1 percent total reduction. A meaningless reduction, insofar as air pollution. A reduction for reduction’s sake. And for another sake – that being the Final Solutioning of the Combustion Engine Problem.
    I don't really get this part though. A meaningless reduction but significant enough to get rid of all ic bikes?
    "I am a bird"

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    I don't really get this part though. A meaningless reduction but significant enough to get rid of all ic bikes?
    .06 gram per kilometer of NOx emissions is clean air and water vapor, for all intents and purposes



    To shave off another 33 percent off that standard amounts to .0198 of a gram per kilometer or a total of .04 gram per km.

    Four one hundredths of a gram per kilometer.

    That cannot be complied with, or rather, cannot be complied with, outside of extensive re-working of the design and fuel delivery systems of the existing engines.

    Only to have the "rules" change again a few years down the road, rendering all that money you just spent to achieve compliance, useless.

    The global ruling class has declared that you and I will no longer be allowed to own or operate internal combustion engine vehicles, of any kind, period.

    This is the mechanism with which they will achieve this goal.

    ETA- Updated and corrected with requested data.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 08-05-2022 at 10:12 AM.
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

  5. #4
    Goldwing no thanks. Who would want an 800lb bike that cost over 20k? Good luck going anywhere other than pavement.
    Also for years a number of Honda's bikes have been manufactured in Thailand. My bike (Grom) was made there. The CB and Cbr series are made there as well.

    And the point that electric motorcycles aren't real motorcycles nice try. You release electric motors have more torque right?
    My Grom one of the easier bikes to stunt on makes a little less than 10HP and 8 foot pounds of torque.
    The ultimate meme bike the Turbo Hayabusa makes around 150 foot pounds of torque.
    Now get read the Verge Ts an electric motorcycle makes 737 foot pounds of torque.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Goldwing no thanks. Who would want an 800lb bike that cost over 20k? Good luck going anywhere other than pavement.
    Also for years a number of Honda's bikes have been manufactured in Thailand. My bike (Grom) was made there. The CB and Cbr series are made there as well.

    And the point that electric motorcycles aren't real motorcycles nice try. You release electric motors have more torque right?
    My Grom one of the easier bikes to stunt on makes a little less than 10HP and 8 foot pounds of torque.
    The ultimate meme bike the Turbo Hayabusa makes around 150 foot pounds of torque.
    Now get read the Verge Ts an electric motorcycle makes 737 foot pounds of torque.
    Those are fast scooters.

    You're missing the point...but "our" side is very good at that...so carry on.
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    .06 gram per kilometer of total emissions is clean air and water vapor, for all intents and purposes

    To shave off another 33 percent off that standard amounts to .0198 of a gram per kilometer or a total of .04 gram per km.

    Four one hundredths of a gram per kilometer.

    That cannot be complied with, or rather, cannot be complied with, outside of extensive re-working of the design and fuel delivery systems of the existing engines.

    Only to have the "rules" change again a few years down the road, rendering all that money you just spent to achieve compliance, useless.

    The global ruling class has declared that you and I will no longer be allowed to own or operate internal combustion engine vehicles, of any kind, period.

    This is the mechanism with which they will achieve this goal.
    Grams of what ? Can't be carbon dioxide. If the limit is 0.06g/km then no vehicle with ice would pass. If you burn one liter of diesel you will get about 2.5kg of CO2. Very roughly.
    Last edited by luctor-et-emergo; 08-05-2022 at 04:23 AM.
    "I am a bird"

  8. #7
    Suppose there are 6 adults in your house and you purchase new non-stick cookware. If metal tools, Scotchbrite, or abrasives, are never used, the cookware will last a long time. So you establish the rule, never use the green side of the sponge or metal tools with this cookware. If everyone in the house uses metal tools and the green side of the sponge except you, can you keep the cookware from getting destroyed?

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Goldwing no thanks. Who would want an 800lb bike that cost over 20k? Good luck going anywhere other than pavement.
    Also for years a number of Honda's bikes have been manufactured in Thailand. My bike (Grom) was made there. The CB and Cbr series are made there as well.

    And the point that electric motorcycles aren't real motorcycles nice try. You release electric motors have more torque right?
    My Grom one of the easier bikes to stunt on makes a little less than 10HP and 8 foot pounds of torque.
    The ultimate meme bike the Turbo Hayabusa makes around 150 foot pounds of torque.
    Now get read the Verge Ts an electric motorcycle makes 737 foot pounds of torque.
    Nuf-said man-bun.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Those are fast scooters.

    You're missing the point...but "our" side is very good at that...so carry on.
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Llw-ZPdGSms

    Can you do this with a scooter?

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    Nuf-said man-bun.
    Hey I'll take my Grom over pretty much any bike except a Supermoto.
    Grom weighs less than 230lbs. Parts are cheap, it is easy to mod, easy to pick up, and I've gotten 125 mpg when I drive conservatively. Normally I get around 100 mpg. So yeah have fun on your cruiser style bike.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    Grams of what ? Can't be carbon dioxide. If the limit is 0.06g/km then no vehicle with ice would pass. If you burn one liter of diesel you will get about 2.5kg of CO2. Very roughly.
    Oxides of nitrogen.

    My mistake, I misread it initially and thought it was all particulate/oxide emissions.

    The OP is behind a paywall, but the chart is posted at EP Autos article.

    Regardless, .04 gram per km is non-compliable with existing technology, especially when you consider that NOx emissions are directly relatable to compression ratios.

    The higher the compression, the better the performance and economy, but it also increases oxide production in the burn process.

    This was how they killed off the diesel engine.

    No internal combustion engine will function without compression.
    Last edited by Anti Federalist; 08-05-2022 at 10:38 AM.
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Hey I'll take my Grom over pretty much any bike except a Supermoto.
    Grom weighs less than 230lbs. Parts are cheap, it is easy to mod, easy to pick up, and I've gotten 125 mpg when I drive conservatively. Normally I get around 100 mpg. So yeah have fun on your cruiser style bike.
    You remind me of a Fudd in this discussion.

    A Fudd, an Elmer Fudd to be precise, is a type of gun owner that, while appearing to be in favor of gun rights and so on, in actuality enjoys laughing up his sleeve, enjoys a bit of Schadenfreude, as he watches government ban other people's guns that he has always disapproved of and not cared for very much.

    You short sightedness will be the undoing of all us.

    One of the ways Honda can build a Grom that actually works is by building a small engine with a 10 to 1 compression ratio.

    As I noted above, NOx emissions are what is killing the Goldwings and Vulcans.

    Increasing compression ratios increase NOx emissions.

    This year it's my Vulcan.

    Next year it's your Grom.
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire

  15. #13
    To be honest, I'm not that worried about the anti-IC agenda, especially at the fringes like motorcycles and weed-eaters. They've been trying to replace gas weed-eaters with electric for many decades. There are a few weirdos who drag an extension cord around their lawn, trying not to cut it and electrocute themselves while weed-eating... but it's a pointless exercise in self-punishment. They can push the Teslagenda all they way, but you won't see the swarms of mosquito-droning leaf-blowers converting to electric any time soon. Let's see... how about we replace 8 ounces of gasoline with an 80-pound battery pack that only lasts half as long as the gas and requires several hours to recharge, versus a few seconds to refill. Nope. The Davos climate mafia will keep whinging but they'll keep flying their petroleum-fueled limousines around to climate conferences (on petroleum-fueled jets) at luxury hotels on spacious grounds that are carefully trimmed and blown with petroleum-powered equipment. ZZzzz...

    The reason that the anti-IC agenda doesn't work is that when the tyrant issues dictates that are directly against the immediate self-interests of the mass of the public, and generate no real benefit for the tyrant or his minions, people will just start to ignore the dictates and even the enforcers will fail to enforce them. Yes, it's dangerous, because the wrath of the tyrant can come down on any one citizen caught "breaking the law", and when the entire weight of the tyrant is behind the whip, it is a terrible thing. But the world is full of all kinds of terrible risks, just as bad. You could get a terrible cancer. You could have a horrible debilitating accident, etc. So, the tyrant's threats never really rise above that level when he is issuing mad dictates. Sure, in the case where he and his minions are truly benefiting, they can use the real resources harvested by their dictates to chase down any non-compliants, grind them to powder and make an example of them. But issuing a diktat that everyone shall now crab-walk everywhere they go... that's how you get ignored and, if you press the issue, deposed. I'm not even talking about a righteous revolution, I mean plain-old, knife-in-the-back treachery, assassination and removal. The rats know when it's time to turn on the alpha.
    Last edited by ClaytonB; 08-05-2022 at 11:02 AM.
    Psalm 35:7-10, Psalm 109

  16. #14
    I only lack the Funds. (not a new condition)

    http://www.brutusmotorcycle.com/brutusV9.html




    http://www.brutusmotorcycle.com/brutus2cafe.html


    Nice Scooters.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oxides of nitrogen.

    My mistake, I misread it initially and thought it was all particulate/oxide emissions.

    The OP is behind a paywall, but the chart is posted at EP Autos article.

    Regardless, .04 gram per km is non-compliable with existing technology, especially when you consider that NOx emissions are directly relatable to compression ratios.

    The higher the compression, the better the performance and economy, but it also increases oxide production in the burn process.

    This was how they killed off the diesel engine.

    No internal combustion engine will function without compression.
    I'm still driving diesel... But what about catalytic converters ?
    Some of the newest Diesel engines are so clean..

    IDK, it's sad, is what it is.
    "I am a bird"

  18. #16
    Perspective..
    You can fight against the inevitable,, or adapt.

    https://blog.damon.com/futuristic-electric-motorcycles/

    I would rather build one on the KISS principle.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    I'm still driving diesel... But what about catalytic converters ?
    Some of the newest Diesel engines are so clean..

    IDK, it's sad, is what it is.
    My VW diesel, guilty of the horrible crime of "cheating" on emissions testing, gave off less emissions of all pollutants than the Jeep Grand Cherokee gas engine SUV I replaced it with.

    But they killed it because VW managed to fudge NOx emissions of 3 tenths of a percent (3.4 vs 3.7) without having to use a DEF system
    "Truly, whoever can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities." - Voltaire



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