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Thread: Live At Peace With All Men... Until You Can't

  1. #1

    Live At Peace With All Men... Until You Can't

    Christians, right wing folks, etc. have mostly let the left take over the culture. We've let "that" side run roughshod over our existing institutions, universities, entertainment industries, etc. These are indisputable facts. We have been and are still paying for those decades of sitting back in the corner. Now is the time to rise up and bring back righteousness in society in the bubbles that we are able to influence. Start small.

    Remember, leftists want you either "re-educated" or dead. They think we are scum of the earth as they reign above us with their self-perceived and self-diagnosed high IQs. It's time to press back for truth and light in this darkness they are spreading draped in human ego.

    Original Link: https://worldeventsandthebible.com/l...e-with-all-men


    Live At Peace With All Men

    Devotions
    Brandon T. Ward
    2 Comments

    Updated: June 29, 2022
    Published: June 29, 2022

    If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
    Romans 12:18

    “Peace”.

    It’s such an evasive word these days. The people who shout for peace the most, are typically those who want it the least. They only want peace on their terms, and they are unwilling to compromise.

    That statement truly defines our world today.

    If governments are not busy fighting amongst each other for power and wealth, the people fight among each other for their perceived ideals. While God said we should live peaceably with all men, He also said, “if it be possible”.

    Today, that’s no longer possible in many cases.

    While the world has always been filled with hostility and violence, today we see Christians continually pushed into a corner. We are told to be “tolerant,” and that we should be “unified” as a society.

    The only problem is, those buzzwords are only echoed by those who want nothing to do with God. In essence, they want us to relinquish our Christian faith and accept their sinful and perverse ways. God is an inconvenient reminder of truthfulness and morality for these people.

    Contrary to what many might think, God is very “tolerant”. Go read the Old Testament if you doubt that statement. You will read page after page of God continuing to deal with the Israelites despite their continual sin, (Nehemiah 9:9-39).

    To the dismay of some, one day, God will “unify” all people under His Government. There will be no protests, there will be no lies, and greed will not rule policy. There will not even be a “left” or “right,” (Revelation 21:24, 27).

    Instead, there will only be God’s Laws which are always right and true.

    Remember that and be encouraged by it.

    However, until then, we must live in this world. We must continue to share the Christian faith with the entire world as Jesus Christ instructed, (Mark 16:15). In fact, that task is actually the most prophetically important event you as a Christian can take part in, (Matthew 24:14).

    In order to promote our Christian faith, we must be allowed to share it with society.

    Therefore, we cannot allow evil to overcome us.

    Romans 12:21
    Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.

    There we have it.

    Do not allow the evil in the world to extinguish your Christian flame. Never allow evil to win! Instead, it’s time for Christians to overcome the great evil that has gripped our world.

    No longer can we “go along to get along”.

    If our societal neighbors do not want peace, then we are not obliged to give it to them. We are, however, obligate to always be respectful, standing strong in the Lord and promoting His Word without end. That is how we gain ground and bring more people into the faith.

    We do not back down, and we do not allow evil to reign or prosper.

    For Christians who fight and bicker with each other over their petty Biblical differences. It’s time to lay it aside and make peace with your Christian neighbors. It’s time to stand united against the wicked of the world.

    I guarantee you, they are unified in their resolve to destroy us and our faith.

    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!



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  3. #2
    Amen.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Okie RP fan View Post
    Remember, leftists want you either "re-educated" or dead.
    The way Christians approach such people should be following the example of Jesus.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    The way Christians approach such people should be following the example of Jesus.
    Yes, when Jesus walked into the Temple and whipped the vendors and threw them out of the Temple.

    Matthew 21:12-13
    King James Version

    12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,

    13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    Yes, when Jesus walked into the Temple and whipped the vendors and threw them out of the Temple.

    Matthew 21:12-13
    King James Version

    12 And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,

    13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.
    Why do you believe he whipped the vendors?
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Why do you believe he whipped the vendors?
    John 2:15
    “And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tables;”
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    The way Christians approach such people should be following the example of Jesus.
    Show them forgiveness and mercy?
    Provide the other cheek?

    What about when children become involved? Didn't Jesus tell his disciples to leave the children alone [when they sought him] and allow them to be near Him? While I won't put words in Jesus's mouth, I also can't see how Jesus is fine with these perversions aimed towards children. The last part of the article as quoted below is perhaps the best response here.

    If our societal neighbors do not want peace, then we are not obliged to give it to them. We are, however, obligate to always be respectful, standing strong in the Lord and promoting His Word without end. That is how we gain ground and bring more people into the faith.

    We do not back down, and we do not allow evil to reign or prosper.

    For Christians who fight and bicker with each other over their petty Biblical differences. It’s time to lay it aside and make peace with your Christian neighbors. It’s time to stand united against the wicked of the world.

    I guarantee you, they are unified in their resolve to destroy us and our faith.
    So, I'll agree with you in that we should still be respectful, be righteous, and not so quick to judge (although I do that all of the time, especially on here towards leftist hordes who have forsaken everything). We do that until there is no where else to run to, then we need to be as unified as we can and begin pushing back nonviolently. That time was decades ago but no one took the threat seriously. The best time to start pushing back then, is now.
    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Okie RP fan View Post
    Show them forgiveness and mercy?
    Provide the other cheek?

    What about when children become involved? Didn't Jesus tell his disciples to leave the children alone [when they sought him] and allow them to be near Him? While I won't put words in Jesus's mouth, I also can't see how Jesus is fine with these perversions aimed towards children. The last part of the article as quoted below is perhaps the best response here.



    So, I'll agree with you in that we should still be respectful, be righteous, and not so quick to judge (although I do that all of the time, especially on here towards leftist hordes who have forsaken everything). We do that until there is no where else to run to, then we need to be as unified as we can and begin pushing back nonviolently. That time was decades ago but no one took the threat seriously. The best time to start pushing back then, is now.
    I think that distinction between using force to defend others and using it to defend ourselves is valid. There's a need for wisdom in knowing where to draw that line, and I won't claim to know the answer in every case.

    But I think the way of Jesus will always be the right way forward. Jesus was tempted with political power, and he refused the offer. Throughout the Gospels, we see that this response of Jesus to this temptation was not just a momentary incident when he fasted in the wilderness, but a constant prime directive of his life and mission, right up until his crucifixion, when he said himself that he could have called twelve legions of angels to his aid, and when he was mocked for how he couldn't save himself. He commanded his disciples to exercise the very same restraint, and to refuse to take up for themselves the tools of the rulers of the nations, but instead to take up their own crosses and follow him.

    This strategy of Jesus proved to be a winning strategy, not a losing one. When he allowed the powers to kill him, instead of him killing them, he beat them. He won and they lost. The power to kill is their ultimate weapon, and when they've expended that and still proven unable to gain their victims' allegiance to their cause, which is Satan's cause, they have nothing left. They totally depend on their victims fearing death. But when that fear is gone, so is their power. On the other hand, for the Christian to accept the premise that death is to be feared, and to engage the powers in their own arena and try to beat them by the very tools of Satan they themselves use, is to lose the battle the moment it begins, because to do this is to join their side on its most fundamental level. Christianity changed the world not through christendom's embrace of statism, but through a Church that grew from the seed of the blood of the martyrs.

    I think the diagnosis of the Christian right in the OP gets it backwards. They aren't guilty of sitting out the culture war too much and letting the left run roughshod over them. They are instead guilty of a positive addiction to politics, to the point that their partisan political orientation has become essential to what they see as their Christian identity. This is why they are losing the battle.

    For to this you have been called, because Christ also suffered for you, leaving you an example, so that you might follow in his steps. He committed no sin, neither was deceit found in his mouth. When he was reviled, he did not revile in return; when he suffered, he did not threaten, but continued entrusting himself to him who judges justly.
    - 1 Peter 2:21-23
    Last edited by Invisible Man; 07-22-2022 at 07:06 AM.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)



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  11. #9
    Kind of hard to live at peace with most men when some of them have a Marxist ideology and want nothing more than to see us dead.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Why do you believe he whipped the vendors?
    It was His House. He whipped them to make them move faster. OUT!
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    It was His House. He whipped them to make them move faster. OUT!
    I didn't mean what was his reason for doing it. I meant, what reason is there to believe that's what he did. None of the Gospel accounts say he whipped any people.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    I think that distinction between using force to defend others and using it to defend ourselves is valid. There's a need for wisdom in knowing where to draw that line, and I won't claim to know the answer in every case.

    But I think the way of Jesus will always be the right way forward. Jesus was tempted with political power, and he refused the offer. Throughout the Gospels, we see that this response of Jesus to this temptation was not just a momentary incident when he fasted in the wilderness, but a constant prime directive of his life and mission, right up until his crucifixion, when he said himself that he could have called twelve legions of angels to his aid, and when he was mocked for how he couldn't save himself. He commanded his disciples to exercise the very same restraint, and to refuse to take up for themselves the tools of the rulers of the nations, but instead to take up their own crosses and follow him.

    This strategy of Jesus proved to be a winning strategy, not a losing one. When he allowed the powers to kill him, instead of him killing them, he beat them. He won and they lost. The power to kill is their ultimate weapon, and when they've expended that and still proven unable to gain their victims' allegiance to their cause, which is Satan's cause, they have nothing left. They totally depend on their victims fearing death. But when that fear is gone, so is their power. On the other hand, for the Christian to accept the premise that death is to be feared, and to engage the powers in their own arena and try to beat them by the very tools of Satan they themselves use, is to lose the battle the moment it begins, because to do this is to join their side on its most fundamental level. Christianity changed the world not through christendom's embrace of statism, but through a Church that grew from the seed of the blood of the martyrs.

    I think the diagnosis of the Christian right in the OP gets it backwards. They aren't guilty of sitting out the culture war too much and letting the left run roughshod over them. They are instead guilty of a positive addition to politics, to the point that their partisan political orientation has become essential to what they see as their Christian identity. This is why they are losing the battle.

    - 1 Peter 2:21-23
    Great post for this conversation. I was looking around for things pertaining to this conversation and came across the following, which I think deserves its own thread but I may save that for another day. My synopsis of it (so far, although there is a part two also linked below that I haven't read yet) is that Christians really have no earthly nation and are wanderers and have to figure out how get by within different parameters. Getting involved in politics is actually kinda opposite of the point in many respects, etc.
    I thought of your post when I read this yesterday. Take a read of these (at least part one); I'm curious what your thoughts are.

    https://blogs.ancientfaith.com/every...tion-part-one/

    https://blogs.ancientfaith.com/every...tion-part-two/

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Kind of hard to live at peace with most men when some of them have a Marxist ideology and want nothing more than to see us dead.
    Righto, that's the point of this thread: to discuss that point exactly.
    It brings back the old "W.W.J.D?" question.

    We also know that God is a being of wrath and vengeance when he wants to be. And the Bible says that vengeance belongs to him. I find it interesting, however, that Christians get to the point where they're running for their lives (this occurs every day in Africa and the Middle East and has been present everywhere throughout history) every day or face slaughter. The leftists in this country will get to that point eventually as they have done in the past: Christians will be seen as the biggest roadblock to them and will create narratives (as they're doing now) to have society turn and excommunicate/kill them.

    This has happened before and will likely happen again. And so I'm looking at these situations and wondering what self-defense constitutes, why can't Christians defend themselves, what's appropriate, etc.
    All while asking What Would Jesus Do?
    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!

  15. #13
    Instead of starting a new thread, I thought I'd just toss this in here because I thought it was close enough to the original conversation.

    "Be in the world, but not of it."

    “Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in them. For everything in the world — the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life — comes not from the Father but from the world. The world and its desires pass away, but whoever does the will of God lives forever” (1 John 2:15-17).
    "14 I have given them your word and the world has hated them, for they are not of the world any more than I am of the world. 15 My prayer is not that you take them out of the world but that you protect them from the evil one. 16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. 17 Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth. 18 As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world." (1 John 17:14-18)

    I think it's plain to see what this means and that most of us have not been following it. This would, technically, mean that our involvement in politics, our enjoyment of debate, etc. goes against these maxims. We are directly engaging in "of this world" things by partaking. So, how do we stop? This means we are to literally sit back, worship God while the world burns down around us with smiles on our faces, no?
    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Okie RP fan View Post
    Instead of starting a new thread, I thought I'd just toss this in here because I thought it was close enough to the original conversation.

    "Be in the world, but not of it."






    I think it's plain to see what this means and that most of us have not been following it. This would, technically, mean that our involvement in politics, our enjoyment of debate, etc. goes against these maxims. We are directly engaging in "of this world" things by partaking. So, how do we stop? This means we are to literally sit back, worship God while the world burns down around us with smiles on our faces, no?
    Be in the world but not of the world, but we are not second class citizens and if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you do not have to sit there and take it, you deck them!

    We are to defend ourselves, our loved ones and defenseless people--not physically but taking a stand. With God on our side, we are an awesome strength.

    The commandments say, thou shall do no murder. That means we are not to lie in wait and murder someone. All through, in the Bible there were warriors for God. We are to be obedient to God, not man.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    Be in the world but not of the world, but we are not second class citizens and if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you do not have to sit there and take it, you deck them!
    Jesus sat there and took it all the way up to the point of death.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Jesus sat there and took it all the way up to the point of death.
    Except for when the money changers were taking advantage of people in the temple. And when a woman was being stoned. And when someone was being persecuted for having a mental illness (being possessed, if you prefer to be literal)...

    Just because He suffered injustice doesn't mean He just sat and let it happen to others.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 10-03-2022 at 09:57 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Jesus sat there and took it all the way up to the point of death.
    That is correct. Jesus took the stripes and we got the healing.

    1 Peter 2:24
    King James Version

    24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

    That was his whole purpose to come in to the world, as a flesh man, to die on the cross for our sins, not his. Herod and Pilate found not fault with Jesus.

    Another example is just like Pilate asking Jesus if he was the "King of the Jews," and Jesus said that is what Pilate and his accusers said, not Jesus.

    And Pilate asked him, saying, "Art thou the King of the Jews? And he answered him and said, Thou sayest it." Luke 23:13
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    That is correct. Jesus took the stripes and we got the healing.
    When Jesus did the opposite of what you said in post #15, would you say that he did the right thing, or the wrong thing?
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Just because He suffered injustice doesn't mean He just sat and let it happen to others.
    But he did just sit and let it happen to himself.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    When Jesus did the opposite of what you said in post #15, would you say that he did the right thing, or the wrong thing?
    He did the right thing because his crucifixion had to happen to give the ultimate blood sacrifice for all of us.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    He did the right thing because his crucifixion had to happen to give the ultimate blood sacrifice for all of us.
    And is it not the case that he also provided an example for us to follow, and that he commands his disciples to take up their crosses and follow him?
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    And is it not the case that he also provided an example for us to follow, and that he commands his disciples to take up their crosses and follow him?
    Jesus is an example, to that point. However, if you say Jesus didn't get angry at the criminals using his Father's house to cheat and swindle people, you are incorrect in you understanding.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    Jesus is an example, to that point. However, if you say Jesus didn't get angry at the criminals using his Father's house to cheat and swindle people, you are incorrect in you understanding.
    I'm not sure where you even get that. That bears no resemblance to anything I've said.

    But earlier you said, "if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you do not have to sit there and take it, you deck them!"

    And then you conceded that Jesus did the very opposite of what you said. He did sit there and take it.

    And now you say that in doing that he provided an example we are supposed to follow.

    The logical conclusion from that would be,
    "if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you should not deck them, you should sit there and take it, like Jesus did."
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    I'm not sure where you even get that. That bears no resemblance to anything I've said.

    But earlier you said, "if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you do not have to sit there and take it, you deck them!"

    And then you conceded that Jesus did the very opposite of what you said. He did sit there and take it.

    And now you say that in doing that he provided an example we are supposed to follow.

    The logical conclusion from that would be,
    "if someone comes up and punches you in the face, you should not deck them, you should sit there and take it, like Jesus did."
    What you are not understanding is that Jesus took it because he knew what had to be done for salvation. As I said Herod and Pilate believed he did nothing wrong, they were right. However, during the time he walked in on the money changers, he was angered by the sheer disrespect they had for his Father's house and defended it by getting them out by force.

    Jesus also spoke in parables because not everyone understood what he was saying, including his disciples. However, if you study God's WORD, it becomes easier to understand.

    II Timothy 2:15

    Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.


    ETA:
    Oh, and when Jesus comes back again, he will not be, like before, He will be a warrior with a rod of Iron to beat the head of Satan. So, on that note, Jesus is far from a Passivist as some people may think.
    Last edited by donnay; 10-03-2022 at 06:46 PM.
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    Why do you believe he whipped the vendors?
    To Drive them OUT.

    If it is possible
    on your part, live at peace with everyone.

    If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.(KJV)

    I learned my Faith in a Violent place,,and understand this verse.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by donnay View Post
    What you are not understanding is that Jesus took it because he knew what had to be done for salvation.
    I do understand that. But that wasn’t the only reason. You said yourself that it was example for us to follow. Do you not believe that?

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    To Drive them OUT..
    I wasn’t asking what you think his reason was for whipping them. I asked you what your reason is for believing he whipped people. The text doesn’t say he did that.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    I do understand that. But that wasn’t the only reason. You said yourself that it was example for us to follow. Do you not believe that?
    Once again I'm left wondering if you have a point, and whether you're ever going to get to it.

    Jesus said turn the other cheek. You do realize that He wasn't saying, let someone murder you, right? You do realize that if someone murders you, you can't turn anything but stiff and stinky, right?
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We believe our lying eyes...

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    I do understand that. But that wasn’t the only reason. You said yourself that it was example for us to follow. Do you not believe that?
    What was the other reason you think he took the persecution he did?
    “The spirits of darkness are now among us. We have to be on guard so that we may realize what is happening when we encounter them and gain a real idea of where they are to be found. The most dangerous thing you can do in the immediate future will be to give yourself up unconsciously to the influences which are definitely present.” ~ Rudolf Steiner

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