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Thread: Why Ron Paul was attacking Trump in 2015???

  1. #1

    Why Ron Paul was attacking Trump in 2015???



    9:00
    His simplified speech is this: I'm Donald Trump, I'l take care of you, i'm the boss, i tell you what to do, trust me. There is never a mention of liberty.
    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post


    9:00


    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    Because Trump is not for small government & he's NOT a conservative.
    There is no spoon.

  4. #3
    Simple, he did not yet recognize him as an enemy of the establishment. Now he does. He doesn't go out and talk about how great all of Trump's policies are, but he calls out when he is right, when he is wrong and when he is being wrongly attacked by the establishment (which is pretty much every day for the last 6+ years if you haven't noticed). He recognizes what a much better option having him in office is compared to establishment Biden.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Because Trump is not for small government & he's NOT a conservative.
    He is for small government in some areas and he is conservative on some topics. It's not a binary question.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #5
    Because after seeing Trump's long history of financial mismanagement, bankruptcies and bribing officials, Paul foresaw that Trump would think nothing of destroying our wages and savings by printing trillions and giving the booty to Pfizer, BioNTech, Moderna and J&J in exchange for getting some bribes going his way.

    Not that Paul foresaw exactly who would get the money, or that they'd use it to try to kill us all. But he clearly had faith that some corporation would be willing to give Trump a few billion out of their freshly printed trillions, for services rendered, as the country and every working person in it descended into bankruptcy.

    And you wondered why he hired an incompetent old drunk to investigate that "election", instead of someone capable of exposing the fraud. He didn't want to get reelected. He knows from long experience when to get out, and how to leave some senile idiot like Biden holding the bag.

    It's as obvious as the nose on your face. If you can't even see in hindsight what Ron Paul could see in 2015, you're the one deranged about Trump.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 06-30-2022 at 06:35 AM.
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  7. #6
    This is clearly bait, and I'll bite. Or, the OP is deluded.

    Trump never was a "small government conservative." He still isn't. What I will secede, however, is that I don't think he was friendly with the Deep State (The Swamp), which is something I believe is very real and there is plenty of evidence. His threat to "drain" the swamp, which he never did, was likely enough to trigger the various ABC agencies into a "we'll show him who's boss" mode and the rest is history, as they say. Assassinations aren't en vogue anymore for the CIA when they've figured out they can take care of these things through their other arm: the media. They did this fabulously in the 2020 election along with the hyping up covid and blaming him for it all.
    Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!

  8. #7
    Would love to hear Dr.Paul candidly discuss Trumps “drunken sailor” fiscal policy from 2016-2020

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post
    9:00

    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    Given what we now know about how dirty the Deep State really is, couldn't it be possible that both Trump and Paul are correct, just coming at the problem from different angles? Ron Paul made a heroic, lifelong attempt at calling the Deep State's bluff, literally living out the script of Mr. Smith Goes to Washington. He filibustered, he sponsored, he blocked, he voted contrary, he investigated, he did oversight, etc. He did everything a concerned citizen can lawfully do within the constraints of the System in order to oppose the corruption.

    Trump has always been pro-America and he has always been clear that he is in business to make money, which is a traditional American value. Businesses that lose money ought to go bankrupt and incompetents should be fired. Trump still believes that old-fashioned "nonsense" and, yes, being pro-American, pro-business and pro-market is a traditional (conservative) American outlook. While Ron Paul has a heart of gold, a heart of gold is not sufficient to clean out the DC Swamp because the Swamp is playing way, way outside of the law, while constraining patriots like Ron Paul to only using means within the law in order to change the System. And that's where somebody like Trump is useful. The meaning of "law" at the highest echelons of power, really is fuzzy and unclear, so you need somebody who will use that fuzziness for the good of the people, instead of using it to enslave them, as the Swamp has been doing since at least 1913. Shamelessly.

    I was not pro-Trump in 2016 (and didn't vote for him). I would still not call myself "pro-Trump" but I'm certainly not anti-Trump. And as far as I can tell, Paul's view of Trump largely tracks with my own, over time. Sure, he's got a lot of questionable policy opinions. But the purpose of the Executive was never to set policy in the first place, that's what Congress is supposed to do. The Executive is supposed to, well, execute policy. And the problem that Trump has tried to take on is that the entire apparatus of government has become corrupt to the point that it seems only a CC would be able to correct it; yet we all know what would happen if there were a CC (Dems would seize the opportunity to flood it with fake voting, fraud, etc.) So yes, extraordinary times call for extraordinary measures. Perhaps Trump still yet has some role to play in that...
    Psalm 35:7-10, Psalm 109



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Because after seeing Trump's long history of financial mismanagement, bankruptcies and bribing officials, Paul foresaw that Trump would think nothing of destroying our wages and savings by printing trillions and giving the booty to Pfizer, BioNTech, Moderna and J&J in exchange for getting some bribes going his way.

    Not that Paul foresaw exactly who would get the money, or that they'd use it to try to kill us all. But he clearly had faith that some corporation would be willing to give Trump a few billion out of their freshly printed trillions, for services rendered, as the country and every working person in it descended into bankruptcy.

    And you wondered why he hired an incompetent old drunk to investigate that "election", instead of someone capable of exposing the fraud. He didn't want to get reelected. He knows from long experience when to get out, and how to leave some senile idiot like Biden holding the bag.

    It's as obvious as the nose on your face. If you can't even see in hindsight what Ron Paul could see in 2015, you're the one deranged about Trump.
    Exactly!
    There is no spoon.

  12. #10
    The reason Trump is popular is just that. Populism. He's not the same old same old.....to disenfranchised. That doesn't make him acceptable. That could mean he just pacifies us and lulls us into believing he's actually changing the system, when in reality he was just slowing it down while making digs at the Establishment. He didn't really handle COVID on a national level any better than Biden did. I saw just as much stupid going on for the first year of COVID as I did when Biden took over. And if you believe his second term wouldn't have been marred by some economic downturn, I don't think that's intellectually honest. We were going to have issues regardless who was POTUS.
    The wisdom of Swordy:

    On bringing the troops home
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    They are coming home, all the naysayers said they would never leave Syria and then they said they were going to stay in Iraq forever..... just like Trump said.

    On fighting corruption:
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Trump had to donate the "right way" and hang out with the "right people" in order to do business in NYC and Hollyweird and in order to investigate and expose them.
    Fascism Defined

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post
    ...
    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    Quote Originally Posted by Okie RP fan View Post
    This is clearly bait, and I'll bite. Or, the OP is deluded.
    ...
    Considering that Ligant's posts have mostly been anti-Trump, it seems to be a bit of reverse psychology to inspire some anti-Trump tirades. Obviously, calling Trump a "small government conservative" is absurd. No one from any perspective makes that accusation, even a foreign troll.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    He is for small government in some areas and he is conservative on some topics. It's not a binary question.
    Donald Trump - The first non-binary President. Who knew?
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  15. #13
    I think Dr.Paul couldn’t have imagined the Military budget would expand that much with DJT

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Todd View Post
    The reason Trump is popular is just that. Populism. He's not the same old same old.....to disenfranchised. That doesn't make him acceptable. That could mean he just pacifies us and lulls us into believing he's actually changing the system, when in reality he was just slowing it down while making digs at the Establishment. He didn't really handle COVID on a national level any better than Biden did. I saw just as much stupid going on for the first year of COVID as I did when Biden took over. And if you believe his second term wouldn't have been marred by some economic downturn, I don't think that's intellectually honest. We were going to have issues regardless who was POTUS.
    Without Biden, Ukraine wouldn't have happened, and we would be energy independent. I'm not saying we aren't due for some economic issues, but Biden and the establishment is blowing them up 10x.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Because Trump is not for small government & he's NOT a conservative.
    Yep.


    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    Because after seeing Trump's long history of financial mismanagement, bankruptcies and bribing officials, Paul foresaw that Trump would think nothing of destroying our wages and savings by printing trillions and giving the booty to Pfizer, BioNTech, Moderna and J&J in exchange for getting some bribes going his way.

    Not that Paul foresaw exactly who would get the money, or that they'd use it to try to kill us all. But he clearly had faith that some corporation would be willing to give Trump a few billion out of their freshly printed trillions, for services rendered, as the country and every working person in it descended into bankruptcy.

    And you wondered why he hired an incompetent old drunk to investigate that "election", instead of someone capable of exposing the fraud. He didn't want to get reelected. He knows from long experience when to get out, and how to leave some senile idiot like Biden holding the bag.

    It's as obvious as the nose on your face. If you can't even see in hindsight what Ron Paul could see in 2015, you're the one deranged about Trump.
    Yep.


    Quote Originally Posted by vita3 View Post
    Would love to hear Dr.Paul candidly discuss Trumps “drunken sailor” fiscal policy from 2016-2020
    Yep.


    For those “patriotic” Americans who keep chanting Trump 2024 and have the memory of a gnat:

    Donald Trump On The Record


    Freedom and Liberty cannot be attained by shilling for government/politicians. What government giveth, it can/will take away. The r3VOLution Ron talks about comes from within, and practiced every day as easily as one breathes.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post


    9:00


    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    1. Trump is not and never was a small-government conservative. As an easy illustration, note that his administration ran even bigger budget deficits than Obama's did, and he not only supported (as nearly every federal officeholder on a bipartisan basis did) the 2020 stimulus bill that was probably the single largest contributor to the current inflationary crisis, but joined the pile-on of abuse against Thomas Massie for standing alone to force a House vote and oppose it.
    2. At the time this video was made, a fellow named Rand Paul was still running for president in the Republican primaries, and was rightly viewed by Ron as a vastly preferable alternative.

    While President Trump was a loose cannon without principles, integrity, or any consistent belief in liberty, it is true that he was genuinely not a part of the establishment and did turn out to be less-bad to have in office from a libertarian perspective than the likes of someone like Biden, ergo the fact that Dr. Paul has softened his tone toward Trump somewhat over the past few years.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post


    9:00


    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    1. Trump is not and never was a small-government conservative. As an easy illustration, note that his administration ran even bigger budget deficits than Obama's did, and he not only supported (as nearly every federal officeholder on a bipartisan basis did) the 2020 stimulus legislation that was probably the single largest contributor to the current inflationary crisis, but joined the pile-on of abuse against Thomas Massie for standing alone to force the House to vote on it and for opposing it.
    2. At the time this video was made, a fellow named Rand Paul was still running for president in the Republican primaries, and was rightly viewed by Ron as a vastly preferable alternative.

    While President Trump was a loose cannon without principles, integrity, or any consistent belief in liberty, it is true that he was genuinely not a part of the establishment and did turn out to be less-bad to have in office from a libertarian perspective than the likes of someone like Biden, ergo the fact that Dr. Paul has softened his tone toward Trump somewhat over the past few years.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by MaxPower View Post
    ...it is true that he was genuinely not a part of the establishment and did turn out to be less-bad to have in office from a libertarian perspective than the likes of someone like Biden, ergo the fact that Dr. Paul has softened his tone toward Trump somewhat over the past few years.
    It is clearly true that he was part of the Establishment, or he would never have received the publicity blitz he got in 2015-2016. Whether he was cheated on 2020 because they no longer trusted him, or just because they wanted leftists to stop calling their poison jabs "Trumpcines" and take them willingly and religiously is a matter open to debate. But Trump was still clearly a tool, or he'd have mounted more serious opposition to the stolen election than Rudy 9iu11iani.

    Ron Paul softened his rhetoric because Trump no longer mattered, and you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    It is clearly true that he was part of the Establishment, or he would never have received the publicity blitz he got in 2015-2016. Whether he was cheated on 2020 because they no longer trusted him, or just because they wanted leftists to stop calling their poison jabs "Trumpcines" and take them willingly and religiously is a matter open to debate. But Trump was still clearly a tool, or he'd have mounted more serious opposition to the stolen election than Rudy 9iu11iani.

    Ron Paul softened his rhetoric because Trump no longer mattered, and you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.
    I felt from the beginning, during his run with Hitlery, that he was clearly establishment because of all the media blitz. It seemed he was in it from the beginning or the elites knew him perfectly & how to boil up his brattiness.
    There is no spoon.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    I felt from the beginning, during his run with Hitlery, that he was clearly establishment because of all the media blitz. It seemed he was in it from the beginning or the elites knew him perfectly & how to boil up his brattiness.
    He could have fired Fauci instead of tweeting about it. And to the idiots that say "Fauci had civil servant immunity" but that didn't mean he had to be on Trump's task force. He tweeted AGAINST the governor of Georgia opening up early. He pushed "Operation Warp Speed" which allowed mRNA vaccines to go forward without sufficient testing. Plus he stumped for red flag laws and a new assault weapons ban. I know you know all this. Just putting it out there for posterity.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  24. #21
    "Massie, a libertarian-leaning conservative who has often clashed with his party’s leadership, said he has no plans to leave the Republican Party, despite Trump calling for him to be thrown out of the GOP."

  25. #22
    Rather than build the dumb wall and incessantly push for even more dumb wall, in which he had no issue using eminent domain, or trampling over environmental concerns, he should have taken all the Democrat governors that were openly defying ICE to court on Federal charges. He said he would do it. Nothing. There is at least 200 examples of how Trump was not a very good president, and yes, he was corrupt.

    Still, he is better than the Democrats, and he did do some good things (SCOTUS, for one), and he was better than every Republican candidate for POTUS since Reagan with only the possible exception of Bob Dole. What can we do? This is what Rand recognized also. We supported Ron and Rand, but most Americans are not like us.
    "For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy ... Its preparations are concealed, not published. Its mistakes are buried not headlined. Its dissenters are silenced, not praised. No expenditure is questioned, no rumor is printed, no secret is revealed." - J.F.K.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by ligant View Post
    Why the $#@! is Ron attacking small government conservative like Trump???
    Sarcasm?
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    He could have fired Fauci instead of tweeting about it. And to the idiots that say "Fauci had civil servant immunity" but that didn't mean he had to be on Trump's task force. He tweeted AGAINST the governor of Georgia opening up early. He pushed "Operation Warp Speed" which allowed mRNA vaccines to go forward without sufficient testing. Plus he stumped for red flag laws and a new assault weapons ban. I know you know all this. Just putting it out there for posterity.
    Agree 1000%, PLUS he still wants the vax named after him.
    There is no spoon.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Agree 1000%, PLUS he still wants the vax named after him.
    If the Dems had any forethought they'd let him do that so when the chickens finally come home to roost he'd take the fall.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  30. #26
    Maybe because Donald Trump is a con-man and a buffoon? (albeit a (((successful))) one)

  31. #27
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers



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