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Thread: The Russia-Ukraine War

  1. #601
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    NATO is at best an illusion of security, at worst an instigator of world drama (Ukraine is example of this)
    Even an illusion of security helps lowering the threat perception. I think it's good to keep an open line of communication. Even when we were at loggerheads with the Soviet Union we still kept a line of communication with them. I like to think that it could have prevented a worse outcome but there is no way to know. I think that misunderstandings can make things worse. It's hard when we have our own languages and communication isn't good but atleast we make the attempt and effort. Maybe its just an illusion but so is airport security and people feel safe getting on planes.



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  3. #602
    Lugansk.. exactly 8 years ago today

    https://t.me/UkraineHumanRightsAbuses/4999
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
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  4. #603
    Ukraine is busy staging and filming propaganda videos showing intense warfare of Ukrainian victories.....

    https://t.me/sputnik/5562
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  5. #604
    UK considers escalating the war by sending the royal navy into the Black Sea. to "prevent hyperinflation of food prices" and "starvation of the third world"

    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  6. #605
    "The unpalatable truth in Ukraine"

    The Hill article says the west needs to come to terms with the fact that there is only one way this conflict ends: Russian victory.

    https://thehill.com/opinion/internat...th-in-ukraine/
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  7. #606
    Reality of how little we gain & how much we lose waring w/ Russia is seeping in to consciousness

  8. #607
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    We made the UN because 80 million people died in a world war.
    A World war that would NOT HAPPEN if we had stayed out of WWI.

    The Treaty of Versailles Provoked World War II.

    The UN gave us Korea and Vietnam. and allowed us to invade the mid East without question.

    NATO has been a Huge problem since created..

    Arm the US People,,Disarm the US GOVT,
    Last edited by pcosmar; 06-03-2022 at 09:15 AM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  9. #608

    Is Putin winning the war ?

    Is the West just winning the battle and Putin the war ?

    To me Putin has always been someone I regarded highly in terms of Sun-Tzu behaviour and general tactics. Do I agree, not per se, do I think my personal opinion changes facts, no I'm too realistic for that...

    My question is, is the invasion of Ukraine a deliberate attempt to destroy the Western economies as the Western response is all too predictable.

    Discuss...
    "I am a bird"



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  11. #609
    I don't really know what winning means. I expect that Russia and Ukraine will end up making some kind of peace agreement that makes concessions to both sides.

    But no matter how that shakes out, the real winner will be the MIC.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  12. #610
    Putin invaded because reintegrating eastern Ukraine was a long term goal of his, the timing was right, and the US was weak.

    I don't think crushing the US economy was a primary goal. More of a happy, predictable, side effect.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  13. #611
    So my thoughts here are that there's nothing to get for Putin from Ukraine apart from misery. However, what the West is doing is destroying itself economically in response... I'm paying almost double for gas now, everything else is up 15-20% but wages are obviously not tracking that. The East still has little difficulty with Russia.

    It's quite simple, you win battles by killing more of the enemy than they kill of you. You win wars by influencing the means of production of whomever you are fighting until they no longer want to play. Unfortunately Russia is used to a lot of hardship, so they are good at this. That's how I see it. It's a meat grinder, but of a different sort.
    "I am a bird"

  14. #612
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    Is the West just winning the battle and Putin the war ?

    To me Putin has always been someone I regarded highly in terms of Sun-Tzu behaviour and general tactics. Do I agree, not per se, do I think my personal opinion changes facts, no I'm too realistic for that...

    My question is, is the invasion of Ukraine a deliberate attempt to destroy the Western economies as the Western response is all too predictable.

    Discuss...
    Henry Kissinger, no "peace dove", recently said that Ukraine will likely have to give up some territory. Crimea and the Donbass. If that's all Putin wants (and I suspect it is) then he's close to "winning." Of course the U.S. media will spin it as "Putin was stopped from taking all of Ukraine thanks to Biden's assistance."
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

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    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  15. #613
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Putin invaded because reintegrating eastern Ukraine was a long term goal of his, the timing was right, and the US was weak.

    I don't think crushing the US economy was a primary goal. More of a happy, predictable, side effect.
    You don't think the US actively pushed Ukraine to provoke Russia to attack?
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  16. #614
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    You don't think the US actively pushed Ukraine to provoke Russia to attack?
    They did certainly. The US engineered the maidan coup which is what kicked off this conflict. That's largely what I meant by the timing was right. When Russia "invaded" Crimea, it was under immediate threat of being attacked. And when he "invaded" Donbass, it had been attacked for 8 years.

    Putin definitely wanted to annex Donbass as well in 2014. At the time I don't think he thought could get away with it, and stuck with Crimea as it was more strategically important.

    Putin however has wanted to reintegrate eastern Ukraine since at least 2001. The US meddling in Ukrainian affairs gave him the opportunity to do so.
    Last edited by TheTexan; 06-03-2022 at 11:22 AM.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  17. #615
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    They did certainly. The US engineered the maidan coup which is what kicked off this conflict. That's largely what I meant by the timing was right. When Russia "invaded" Crimea, it was under immediate threat of being attacked. And when he "invaded" Donbass, it had been attacked for 8 years.

    Putin definitely wanted to annex Donbass as well in 2014. At the time I don't think he thought could get away with it, and stuck with Crimea as it was more strategically important.
    OK. Then I'm not sure that the US being weak was really an instigating factor. The US was to some extent pulling the strings.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  18. #616
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    OK. Then I'm not sure that the US being weak was really an instigating factor. The US was to some extent pulling the strings.
    The US being weak, may be why he chose to liberate Donbass now, versus 2014
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his



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  20. #617
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    They did certainly. The US engineered the maidan coup which is what kicked off this conflict. That's largely what I meant by the timing was right. When Russia "invaded" Crimea, it was under immediate threat of being attacked. And when he "invaded" Donbass, it had been attacked for 8 years.

    Putin definitely wanted to annex Donbass as well in 2014. At the time I don't think he thought could get away with it, and stuck with Crimea as it was more strategically important.
    I think that after 2014, Putin definitely wanted a peaceful agreement regarding DPR/LPR. In fact, DPR/LPR forces, with Russian volunteer assistance, defeated the Ukrainian army and had them encircled.

    At that point, Ukraine agreed to peace talks and the Minsk Agreement was made because their army was going to be decimated.

    After the agreement, Ukraine proceeded to ignore it and continue attacks against the people of DPR/LPR.

    And nobody in the West gave two shats about it.

  21. #618
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Henry Kissinger, no "peace dove", recently said that Ukraine will likely have to give up some territory. Crimea and the Donbass. If that's all Putin wants (and I suspect it is) then he's close to "winning." Of course the U.S. media will spin it as "Putin was stopped from taking all of Ukraine thanks to Biden's assistance."
    Yes that's pretty much exactly how it's being spinned. That Putin will have to "settle" for Eastern Ukraine only. Which of course was his only goal to begin with
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  22. #619
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    A World war that would NOT HAPPEN if we had stayed out of WWI.

    The Treaty of Versailles Provoked World War II.

    The UN gave us Korea and Vietnam. and allowed us to invade the mid East without question.

    NATO has been a Huge problem since created..

    Arm the US People,,Disarm the US GOVT,
    Korea and Vietnam weren't caused by world war 2 or the UN. It would have just been the Japanese empire expanding most likely. They would have probably conquered China if the USA didn't arm China. They were ruthless with their war. Their rapes and torture were sadistic.

  23. #620
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post
    Yes that's pretty much exactly how it's being spinned. That Putin will have to "settle" for Eastern Ukraine only. Which of course was his only goal to begin with
    His demands in December went beyond that, and included removal of all NATO troops and weapons from Poland and other countries that entered after 1997.

    I don't believe NATO will ever give in to that demand.

    But the rest of what he demanded, he may well end up with.
    There is nothing to fear from globalism, free trade and a single worldwide currency, but a globalism where free trade is competitively subsidized by each nation, a continuous trade war is dictated by the WTO, and the single currency is pure fiat, fear is justified. That type of globalism is destined to collapse into economic despair, inflationism and protectionism and managed by resurgent militant nationalism.
    Ron Paul
    Congressional Record (March 13, 2001)

  24. #621
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    His demands in December went beyond that, and included removal of all NATO troops and weapons from Poland and other countries that entered after 1997.

    I don't believe NATO will ever give in to that demand.

    But the rest of what he demanded, he may well end up with.
    He's going to demand such things but he knows as well as you or I it is not realistic.

    As far as what it will take to end the conflict in Ukraine, Putin has only ever wanted the Eastern territory, and assurances of security in those regions.

    The longer this conflict goes on, the more "assurances" may be needed.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  25. #622
    Okay, secondary question.. Do you agree the Western response to any move from Russia is predictable ?
    "I am a bird"

  26. #623
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    Okay, secondary question.. Do you agree the Western response to any move from Russia is predictable ?
    If by western response you mean giving tens of billions of dollars to weapons manufacturers, then yes.

    26:35

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  27. #624
    Neo cons didn’t get jailed or permanently removed from US foreign power structure

    They have been hell bent for war with Russkies

    & here we are



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  29. #625
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    My question is, is the invasion of Ukraine a deliberate attempt to destroy the Western economies as the Western response is all too predictable.
    Behind the scenes, Putin is the best of buddies with The Hague, London and Washington.
    This is a deliberate attempt to cause hyperinflation to implement the Great Reset, with the help of WEF young global leader Putin.

    Remember Putin coming to the Heineken House during the Winter Olympics to show his respect to prins pils or Putin's daughter living in the Netherlands (close to the Hague)?

    Of course we all have to pay, and this doesn't mean that Ukrainians are better off with Chabad buddy Putin then with WEF global leader Zelensky.
    A couple of days ago I read the news that the Kingdom of the Netherlands imports much less products from Russia but pays about the same amount of money for it...
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  30. #626
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    Okay, secondary question.. Do you agree the Western response to any move from Russia is predictable ?
    What's funny is that the West trying to pretend that the Nazis in Ukraine aren't Nazis is so ridiculously absurd, but even that part is sadly predictable.

    It comes straight out of the Clown World playbook. Putin is evil (possibly worse than Hitler aka Trump) so any means to the end are justified. Even praising literal Nazis if that's what it takes.

    (And Putin is evil, because, well, Trump)
    Last edited by TheTexan; 06-03-2022 at 01:41 PM.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Crenshaw 2024!!!!

    My pronouns are he/him/his

  31. #627
    I never had any doubt Putin would win. By win I mean completing his stated goals of securing Donbass and Crimea and destroying the neo-nazis.

  32. #628
    Control of oil/gas always 2nd biggest factor in major war.

  33. #629
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    Korea and Vietnam weren't caused by world war 2 or the UN. It would have just been the Japanese empire expanding most likely. They would have probably conquered China if the USA didn't arm China. They were ruthless with their war. Their rapes and torture were sadistic.
    So what.. That was between them,, Our Provocation is the reason Japan Attacked the US.and drew us into another World War.

    We should have stayed out of Both.

    Korea was a UN Police action as was Vietnam.

    Conflict,,not war,,, crap
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  34. #630
    Quote Originally Posted by TheTexan View Post

    (And Putin is evil, because, well, Trump)
    that is the level of discourse I encounter most.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

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