How is this "storming the Capitol" and "insurrection?" Police hold doors for protesters on 1/6

[James_Madison_Lives]

This will go down as one of the greatest crimes in America, hundreds of 99% peaceful protesters being beaten and tortured for exercising their right of peaceful protest. To this day.

https://twitter.com/Shane29008046/st...08890353168385

Can someone please post this as a twitter video?

[Occam's Banana]

https://twitter.com/Shane29008046/st...08890353168385

Can someone please post this as a twitter video?

Just embed the tweet. Put the long number at the end of the URL between [TWEET] tags, like so:

[tweet]1518208890353168385[/tweet]

https://twitter.com/Shane29008046/st...08890353168385

[TheTexan]

This will go down as one of the greatest crimes in America, hundreds of 99% peaceful protesters being beaten and tortured for exercising their right of peaceful protest. To this day.

https://twitter.com/Shane29008046/st...08890353168385

Can someone please post this as a twitter video?

+rep

History's politest insurrection.

"mind if I come in, have a spot of tea ?"

[GlennwaldSnowdenAssanged]

Biggest threat to democracy!

[jmdrake]

This will go down as one of the greatest crimes in America, hundreds of 99% peaceful protesters being beaten and tortured for exercising their right of peaceful protest. To this day.

https://twitter.com/Shane29008046/st...08890353168385

Can someone please post this as a twitter video?

Because if you selectively pick and just what to cover/talk about you can find peaceful or violent BLM/antifa protesters and you can find peaceful or violent January 6th protesters. You don't have to smash windows to try to get through locked doors that were guarded by police until you threatened them with bodily harm, as happened on video on January 6th, if you're just a peaceful protester. No it wasn't an "insurrection" or the "end of democracy" but it wasn't all peaceful with police holding the door open. Propaganda, even if you think it's helpful to "your side" is still propaganda.

More video of Ashli Babbitt, and this time with an interview of the man who shot the video. You can clearly see that chairs where piled up by the door to keep anyone from coming through.



Another piece of the puzzle. Tom Fitton of Judicial Watch posted this video in SUPPORT of Babbitt, but that's based on his dishonest spin. At 5:15 in you see S.W.A.T. officers headed up the steps. They were clearly coming to relieve the officers that had just left their posts after being threatened by the crowd. Fitton's spin is "They could have been hit by the officers bullet that killed Babbitt." What? Ummmm....okay. They weren't really in the line of fire but even if they were that's a risk for EVERY time there is a police use of force. I don't see Tom Fitton do this level of "whatifism" about other police shootings.



And now Ashli Babbitt's own husband claims she climbed through the window after the police guarding the door left because she was in fear of her life. If these protesters were so freaking peaceful then why did she need, according to her widower, to climb through the window to get away from them?

[TheTexan]

More video of Ashli Babbitt, and this time with an interview of the man who shot the video. You can clearly see that chairs where piled up by the door to keep anyone from coming through.

You can also see people chilling in the background, walking around on their cell phones.

If I could prove to you, that:
1) Nearly all the congressmen had been evacuated already
2) The evacuation route was available and protected to anyone who still wanted it
3) The evacuation route was heavily fortified and there was no way for a mob to get through it
4) There were plenty of additional capitol police behind those doors to protect anyone who needed protecting

If all of the above were proven to be true, would that change anything in your mind?

[jmdrake]

You can also see people chilling in the background, walking around on their cell phones.

If I could prove to you, that:
1) Nearly all the congressmen had been evacuated already
2) The evacuation route was available and protected to anyone who still wanted it
3) The evacuation route was heavily fortified and there was no way for a mob to get through it
4) There were plenty of additional capitol police behind those doors to protect anyone who needed protecting

If all of the above were proven to be true, would that change anything in your mind?

You can also see two thugs smashing the window that Ashlii Babbitt tried to climb through. You can hear the thugs (donnay calls them "agent provocateurs"), tell the police officers "Other people have gotten hurt today. We don't want you to get hurt." According to donnay, Ashlii Babbitt was trying to get the thugs to stop and/or trying to get away from the thugs. All of the video that I have seen shows that at that moment Officer Byrd was the only one in the hallway. The other capital police officers had helped congress evacuate to the subway. The congressmen and congresswomen were still in the building and that door lead to where they were! They had not been "evacuated" to the point of there not being any possibility of anyone getting to them. We went through this all before. And yes, the route was heavily fortified and officer Byrd was part of that fortification. He was manning the barricade. The other officers left the barricade after being threatened with bodily harm and SWAT was on their way up the steps to take over. SWAT hadn't gotten in place yet. Had the officers, who left their post early stayed there until SWAT arrived, then Ashlii Babbitt wouldn't have been in fear of her life (according to donnay) and attempted to crawl through the window to escape the "agent provocateurs." Just because some of the crowd was just standing around "chilling" doesn't change the fact that there were rioters/thugs/"agent provocateurs" or whatever you want to call them openly threatening cops with bodily harm, smashing windows, attempting to get through barricades etc. Ashlii should have just stayed on the other side of the barricade and "chilled" if there wasn't any reason to be afraid. This wasn't a video game. There were no respawn points. Ashlii Babbitt made a stupid mistake and paid for it with her life. The "agent provocateurs" should be held accountable for her death. Not the guys that were just "chilling" but the guys smashing windows and threatening cops.

[TheTexan]

You can also see two thugs smashing the window that Ashlii Babbitt tried to climb through. You can hear the thugs (donnay calls them "agent provocateurs"), tell the police officers "Other people have gotten hurt today. We don't want you to get hurt." According to donnay, Ashlii Babbitt was trying to get the thugs to stop and/or trying to get away from the thugs. All of the video that I have seen shows that at that moment Officer Byrd was the only one in the hallway. The other capital police officers had helped congress evacuate to the subway. The congressmen and congresswomen were still in the building and that door lead to where they were! They had not been "evacuated" to the point of there not being any possibility of anyone getting to them. We went through this all before. And yes, the route was heavily fortified and officer Byrd was part of that fortification. He was manning the barricade. The other officers left the barricade after being threatened with bodily harm and SWAT was on their way up the steps to take over. SWAT hadn't gotten in place yet. Had the officers, who left their post early stayed there until SWAT arrived, then Ashlii Babbitt wouldn't have been in fear of her life (according to donnay) and attempted to crawl through the window to escape the "agent provocateurs." Just because some of the crowd was just standing around "chilling" doesn't change the fact that there were rioters/thugs/"agent provocateurs" or whatever you want to call them openly threatening cops with bodily harm, smashing windows, attempting to get through barricades etc. Ashlii should have just stayed on the other side of the barricade and "chilled" if there wasn't any reason to be afraid. This wasn't a video game. There were no respawn points. Ashlii Babbitt made a stupid mistake and paid for it with her life. The "agent provocateurs" should be held accountable for her death. Not the guys that were just "chilling" but the guys smashing windows and threatening cops.

I understand that you believe that my hypothetical assumptions are false (I know several of them to be true), but I still would have appreciated an answer to the question.

then Ashlii Babbitt wouldn't have been in fear of her life

There isn't even an ounce of truth to that claim. That she was in fear for her life. The only reason that claim has even a chance in court is because the media lied so much about the violent insurrection... the claim would otherwise not hold any water at all, "hint of truth" or otherwise.

[TheTexan]

Even if someone is smashing windows, and making suggestive threats (politely) to cops....

you still have an obligation to give the person you're gonna shoot a chance to stop what they're doing.

Byrd hid behind a corner like a goddamn snake and pulled the trigger without any warning that could have been reasonably expected to have been received by Babbitt.

[TheTexan]

The other officers left the barricade after being threatened with bodily harm and SWAT was on their way up the steps to take over.

Have they testified to that? It looked like they were ordered to step aside. They stepped aside in unison, without needing to consult each other at all.

If they were gonna bail because they felt threatened, they would at minimum look at their partners and verbally or nonverbally let them know you're getting ready to bail.

What wouldn't happen, is they all decide to bail at the exact same moment - unless they were ordered to do so.

[James_Madison_Lives]

Because if you selectively pick and just what to cover/talk about you can find peaceful or violent BLM/antifa protesters and you can find peaceful or violent January 6th protesters. You don't have to smash windows to try to get through locked doors that were guarded by police until you threatened them with bodily harm, as happened on video on January 6th, if you're just a peaceful protester. No it wasn't an "insurrection" or the "end of democracy" but it wasn't all peaceful with police holding the door open. Propaganda, even if you think it's helpful to "your side" is still propaganda.

More video of Ashli Babbitt, and this time with an interview of the man who shot the video. You can clearly see that chairs where piled up by the door to keep anyone from coming through.



Another piece of the puzzle. Tom Fitton of Judicial Watch posted this video in SUPPORT of Babbitt, but that's based on his dishonest spin. At 5:15 in you see S.W.A.T. officers headed up the steps. They were clearly coming to relieve the officers that had just left their posts after being threatened by the crowd. Fitton's spin is "They could have been hit by the officers bullet that killed Babbitt." What? Ummmm....okay. They weren't really in the line of fire but even if they were that's a risk for EVERY time there is a police use of force. I don't see Tom Fitton do this level of "whatifism" about other police shootings.



And now Ashli Babbitt's own husband claims she climbed through the window after the police guarding the door left because she was in fear of her life. If these protesters were so freaking peaceful then why did she need, according to her widower, to climb through the window to get away from them?

Anitifa instigating protesters

[jmdrake]

Anitifa instigating protesters

Both sides blame the other for infiltrating their protests. Non argument.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/68CG6iNAuqI

[jmdrake]

Have they testified to that? It looked like they were ordered to step aside. They stepped aside in unison, without needing to consult each other at all.

If they were gonna bail because they felt threatened, they would at minimum look at their partners and verbally or nonverbally let them know you're getting ready to bail.

What wouldn't happen, is they all decide to bail at the exact same moment - unless they were ordered to do so.

Have they testified to what? It's in the video. We already talked about this months before. You cannot dispute the fact that one of the protesters said to the cops "Other people have been hurt today. We don't want to see you hurt. Please step aside." That was a veiled threat. Now as to your point about the orders, yeah. I agree that's most likely what happened. One of the officers got a message through on his radio about what was going on (or maybe Byrd made the call), the officers at the door were told they could leave because SWAT was coming up the steps, and so they left. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make is.

[TheTexan]

Have they testified to what? It's in the video. We already talked about this months before. You cannot dispute the fact that one of the protesters said to the cops "Other people have been hurt today. We don't want to see you hurt. Please step aside." That was a veiled threat. Now as to your point about the orders, yeah. I agree that's most likely what happened. One of the officers got a message through on his radio about what was going on (or maybe Byrd made the call), the officers at the door were told they could leave because SWAT was coming up the steps, and so they left. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make is.

My point is, it's not accurate to claim they left because they were in fear for their life.

[jmdrake]

My point is, it's not accurate to claim they left because they were in fear for their life.

Here's what I actually said:

The other officers left the barricade after being threatened with bodily harm and SWAT was on their way up the steps to take over.

Notice I didn't say they left because they were in real fear for their lives. You interpreted that because it's obvious from the facts that you can't dispute that they probably were concerned for their safety. But I never made any statement about what was actually going through their heads. Tell me this. Why do you think these officers were being replaced with SWAT officers carrying assault rifles and wearing body armour?

[TheTexan]

Here's what I actually said:

The other officers left the barricade after being threatened with bodily harm and SWAT was on their way up the steps to take over.

Notice I didn't say they left because they were in real fear for their lives. You interpreted that because it's obvious from the facts that you can't dispute that they probably were concerned for their safety. But I never made any statement about what was actually going through their heads. Tell me this. Why do you think these officers were being replaced with SWAT officers carrying assault rifles and wearing body armour?

No need to act all uppity, you know its what you were (and still are) implying. If it's not what youre implying it's certainly what you are trying to suggest.

SWAT being sent doesn't mean a damn thing, but curious where you got that info from? That 1) SWAT was being sent up, and 2) that's why they stepped aside

And no, they didn't seem very concerned for their safety. I wouldn't have been in that situation. Even with the very polite "veiled threat". These are capitol police. They are expected to be able to handle themselves in these situations. There was no immediate threat to them and they were 100% safe. That could have changed (as things do) but at the time, they were safe.

[jmdrake]

No need to act all uppity, you know its what you were (and still are) implying. If it's not what youre implying it's certainly what you are trying to suggest.

If I can imply something simply by stating the facts then my implication is reasonable. It doesn't matter if you get testimony about what they were actually thinking at the moment. Maybe they weren't scared but someone else monitoring the situation via closed circuit camera thought it was too volatile. Maybe Byrd on one of the other cops that were on the other side of the barricade before they left Byrd by himself called in SWAT. All of this goes to the fact that there was a dangerous situation and someone thought 3 cops with sidearms weren't enough and that they needed to be replaced with SWAT.

SWAT being sent doesn't mean a damn thing, but curious where you got that info from? That 1) SWAT was being sent up, and 2) that's why they stepped aside

LOL. 1) It clearly DOES mean a "damn thing" and you know it because you inferred something from that fact. 2) I got SWAT being sent up BECAUSE THAT'S ON THE FREAKING VIDEO and 3) What other reason do you think they would abandoned a barricade other than they were being replaced by someone else? Come on dude. I know you like being sarcastic and funny and all, but this is a serious conversation.

And no, they didn't seem very concerned for their safety. I wouldn't have been in that situation. Even with the very polite "veiled threat". These are capitol police. They are expected to be able to handle themselves in these situations. There was no immediate threat to them and they were 100% safe. That could have changed (as things do) but at the time, they were safe.

Again, YOU INTERPRETED THAT FROM THE FACTS! I JUST GAVE YOU THE FACTS! And again, it's clear FROM THE FACTS THAT YOU CAN'T DENY that somebody felt SWAT was needed in that situation. I don't think any veiled threat is ever "polite." "Excuse me ma'am. I'm really horny. I'd hate to have to force you to have sex with me. Would you please take off your close and spread your legs?" Part of good police work is having the correct show of force so you don't HAVE to use force. Three police officers with side arms don't look as intimidating as three armored SWAT officers with assault rifles. Now, you keep wondering what was in the officers mind. WHAT THE HELL WAS GOING ON IN ASHLI BABBITTS MIND? Seriously. What the hell? The title of this thread is "How is storming the Capitol an insurrection? Police hold doors open." Well THOSE DOORS THAT ASHLII BABBITT CRAWLED THROUGH THE SMASHED WINDOW OF WERE NOT BEING HELD OPEN! They were locked shut. Three police were standing guard. There were chairs stacked up behind the doors so the doors couldn't be forced open. There is an image from earlier with multiple cops on Byrd's side of those doors with guns drawn before they left Byrd by himself. Clearly someone had made a decision that, no matter what, nobody was getting through THOSE doors. An analogy would be if you allowed someone into your home but made it clear that under no circumstances they were to go into your bedroom, which was closed and locked, and they kicked the door in anyway. These not so peaceful protesters smashed the windows in those doors and Ashlii Babbitt, for whatever stupid reason, decided to climb through. Why don't we get to the bottom of HER behavior? Her windower thinks she was trying to get to safety. I agree with you that he's full of crap. But why did this military veteran not understand that just because police might have held the door for her earlier in the day, that she was not invited to go through THOSE doors?

[TheTexan]

If I can imply something simply by stating the facts then my implication is reasonable. It doesn't matter if you get testimony about what they were actually thinking at the moment. Maybe they weren't scared but someone else monitoring the situation via closed circuit camera thought it was too volatile. Maybe Byrd on one of the other cops that were on the other side of the barricade before they left Byrd by himself called in SWAT. All of this goes to the fact that there was a dangerous situation and someone thought 3 cops with sidearms weren't enough and that they needed to be replaced with SWAT.



LOL. 1) It clearly DOES mean a "damn thing" and you know it because you inferred something from that fact. 2) I got SWAT being sent up BECAUSE THAT'S ON THE FREAKING VIDEO and 3) What other reason do you think they would abandoned a barricade other than they were being replaced by someone else? Come on dude. I know you like being sarcastic and funny and all, but this is a serious conversation.



Again, YOU INTERPRETED THAT FROM THE FACTS! I JUST GAVE YOU THE FACTS! And again, it's clear FROM THE FACTS THAT YOU CAN'T DENY that somebody felt SWAT was needed in that situation. I don't think any veiled threat is ever "polite." "Excuse me ma'am. I'm really horny. I'd hate to have to force you to have sex with me. Would you please take off your close and spread your legs?" Part of good police work is having the correct show of force so you don't HAVE to use force. Three police officers with side arms don't look as intimidating as three armored SWAT officers with assault rifles. Now, you keep wondering what was in the officers mind. WHAT THE HELL WAS GOING ON IN ASHLI BABBITTS MIND? Seriously. What the hell? The title of this thread is "How is storming the Capitol an insurrection? Police hold doors open." Well THOSE DOORS THAT ASHLII BABBITT CRAWLED THROUGH THE SMASHED WINDOW OF WERE NOT BEING HELD OPEN! They were locked shut. Three police were standing guard. There were chairs stacked up behind the doors so the doors couldn't be forced open. There is an image from earlier with multiple cops on Byrd's side of those doors with guns drawn before they left Byrd by himself. Clearly someone had made a decision that, no matter what, nobody was getting through THOSE doors. An analogy would be if you allowed someone into your home but made it clear that under no circumstances they were to go into your bedroom, which was closed and locked, and they kicked the door in anyway. These not so peaceful protesters smashed the windows in those doors and Ashlii Babbitt, for whatever stupid reason, decided to climb through. Why don't we get to the bottom of HER behavior? Her windower thinks she was trying to get to safety. I agree with you that he's full of crap. But why did this military veteran not understand that just because police might have held the door for her earlier in the day, that she was not invited to go through THOSE doors?

TLDR.