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Thread: [Disputed] Merck's COVID PILL Molnupiravir, 'Cuts Hospitalzation, Death In Half''

  1. #1

    Post [Disputed] Merck's COVID PILL Molnupiravir, 'Cuts Hospitalzation, Death In Half''

    It's MSM/White House sourced report on the so called 'covid pill' from big pharma Co. Merck:




    Fri, Oct 1 2021 Updated An Hour Ago
    Chloe Taylor
    Key Points


    • A phase 3 trial of Merck and Ridgeback Biotherapeutics’ oral antiviral treatment molnupiravir showed it reduced the risk of hospitalization or death by around 50% in Covid patients.
    • Merck plans to seek emergency use authorization in the U.S. and submit marketing applications to other global drug regulators.
    • If authorized by regulatory bodies, molnupiravir could be the first oral antiviral medicine for Covid.
    • “The company, when they briefed us last night, had mentioned that they will be submitting their data to the FDA imminently,” White House chief medical advisor Dr. Anthony Fauci said at a Covid briefing Friday.


    cnbc.com/2021/10/01/merck-to-seek-emergency-authorization-for-oral-covid-19-treatment.html



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  3. #2
    So is this pill "treatment" of symptoms or some kind of oral vax?

    When is it given? Prophylactically or upon diagnosis?

    Big claims/ little information.

  4. #3
    I wonder if its mechanism has something to do with the uptake of zinc or inhibiting replication like horse paste.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by sparebulb View Post
    I wonder if its mechanism has something to do with the uptake of zinc or inhibiting replication like horse paste.
    BUT OF COURSE
    FLIP THOSE FLAGS, THE NATION IS IN DISTRESS!


    why I should worship the state (who apparently is the only party that can possess guns without question).
    The state's only purpose is to kill and control. Why do you worship it? - Sola_Fide

    Baptiste said.
    At which point will Americans realize that creating an unaccountable institution that is able to pass its liability on to tax-payers is immoral and attracts sociopaths?

  6. #5
    From what I have read so far it's just an antiviral. If I understand it correctly, it's something I would take if I had covid. There is nothing they could do to get me to take the vax or the monoclonal antibodies.

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    From what I have read so far it's just an antiviral. If I understand it correctly, it's something I would take if I had covid. There is nothing they could do to get me to take the vax or the monoclonal antibodies.
    The big question is if this is declared an effective treatment, does that nullify the emergency use authorization for the jabs?

    Under section 564 of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (FD&C Act), when the Secretary of HHS declares that an emergency use authorization is appropriate, FDA may authorize unapproved medical products or unapproved uses of approved medical products to be used in an emergency to diagnose, treat, or prevent serious or life-threatening diseases or conditions caused by CBRN threat agents when certain criteria are met, including there are no adequate, approved, and available alternatives.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    The big question is if this is declared an effective treatment, does that nullify the emergency use authorization for the jabs?
    You assume the feds follow their own rules anymore, they don't.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    You assume the feds follow their own rules anymore, they don't.
    Anymore?
    never did.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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  11. #9
    Two Indian drugmakers to end trials of generic Merck pill for moderate COVID-19

    Two Indian drugmakers have requested permission to end late-stage trials of their generic versions of Merck & Co's (MRK.N) promising experimental oral antiviral drug molnupiravir to treat moderate COVID-19, a week after Merck said its own trial had succeeded for mild-to-moderate patients.

    Merck earlier this year suspended its own development of molnupiravir as a treatment for hospitalized COVID-19 patients since many of them have reached a phase of the disease that is too late for an antiviral drug to provide much help.
    ...
    A source with the Drug Controller General of India said the pill has not shown "significant efficacy" against moderate COVID-19, though it was having success against mild cases.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #10
    The following isn't really about molnupiravir, but it does get mentioned: "Manufacturing cost for molnupiravir, according to a report from researchers with the Harvard School of Public Health, is around $17.74 for a 5-day course of treatment.
    Merck just signed a contract with the federal government to sell 1.7 million treatment courses for the government to distribute to infected people for … wait for it … $712.00 each."


    It is really about the 1980 Bayh-Dole act, and the plans to the delete the “march-in Authority” that could be used to protect the taxpayer against the money hungry big pharma, though the following amendment to the law.
    (7) Clarify § 401.6 to include a provision that march-in rights shall not be exercised by an agency exclusively on the basis of business decisions of a contractor regarding the pricing of commercial goods and services arising from the practical application of the invention.
    .
    Americans are uniquely in the world... in being robbed by big pharma:
    For 17 of the 20 top-selling drugs worldwide, drugmakers made more money from U.S. sales than from sales to all other countries in the rest of the world combined.
    For 11 of the 20 top-selling drugs worldwide, U.S. sales revenue was double or more the revenue for sales in the rest of the world.
    https://hartmannreport.com/p/the-new...a-scam-exposed
    (https://archive.is/nscwm)
    Do NOT ever read my posts. Google and Yahoo wouldn’t block them without a very good reason: Google-censors-the-world/page3

    The Order of the Garter rules the world: Order of the Garter and the Carolingian dynasty

  13. #11
    Molnupiravir was developed for the treatment of Influenza. According to whistleblower complaint Molnupiravir has mutagenic properties and may change your DNA. Now, Molnupiravir has been repurposed for COVID-19. Merck has entered into agreements with Indian manufacturers and has also announced $5 million of donations to enter into Indian market. Here is all you need to know about Merck’s Covid pill Molnupiravir.

    Molnupiravir was developed for Influenza

    Molnupiravir (development codes MK-4482 and EIDD-2801) is an experimental antiviral drug which is orally active and was developed for the treatment of influenza.

    It is a prodrug of the synthetic nucleoside derivative N4-hydroxycytidine, and exerts its antiviral action through introduction of copying errors during viral RNA replication.

    The drug was developed at Emory University by the university’s drug innovation company, Drug Innovation Ventures at Emory (DRIVE).

    It was then acquired by Miami-based company Ridgeback Biotherapeutics, who later partnered with Merck & Co. to develop the drug further.

    Molnupiravir may change your DNA

    In April 2020, Rick Bright, who was removed as head of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA) before the approval of the drug, submitted a whistleblower complaint asserting that Ridgeback pressured BARDA to provide funding to manufacture EIDD-2801 despite Bright’s concerns that similar drugs in its class have mutagenic properties.

    A previous company, Pharmasset, that had investigated the Molnupiravir’s active ingredient had abandoned it over similar concerns.

    In genetics, a mutagen is a physical or chemical agent that permanently changes genetic material, usually DNA, in an organism and thus increases the frequency of mutations above the natural background level.

    As many mutations can cause cancer, such mutagens are therefore carcinogens, although not all necessarily are. All mutagens have characteristic mutational signatures with some chemicals becoming mutagenic through cellular processes.

    3/5 one concern that it introduces virus mutations or potential mutagenic probably means it won’t be recommended in pregnancy. I seem to remember my good colleague @RickABright had a concern about this drug when he was at BARDA so maybe he can comment. Also important to remember
    — Prof Peter Hotez MD PhD (@PeterHotez) October 1, 2021

    These claims were denied by George Painter, CEO of DRIVE, noting that toxicity studies on Molnupiravir had been carried out and data provided to regulators in the US and UK, who permitted safety studies in humans to move forward in the spring of 2020.

    At that time, DRIVE and Ridgeback Biotherapeutics stated they planned future safety studies in animals.

    More at: https://greatgameindia.com/merck-cov...-molnupiravir/
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

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    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
    ...Merck just signed a contract with the federal government to sell 1.7 million treatment courses for the government to distribute to infected people for … wait for it … $712.00 each."...
    Heads should roll over this. And the US media will continue to push this drug.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
    The following isn't really about molnupiravir, but it does get mentioned: "Manufacturing cost for molnupiravir, according to a report from researchers with the Harvard School of Public Health, is around $17.74 for a 5-day course of treatment.
    Merck just signed a contract with the federal government to sell 1.7 million treatment courses for the government to distribute to infected people for … wait for it … $712.00 each."
    ...
    And even worse, the estimates for the sustainable generic price would drop even more due to increased scale and improved processes (optimization of molnupiravir synthesis) over time.

    The US government has already ordered 1.7 million treatment courses, at about $700/patient. This price is equal to about 35 times the estimated sustainable generic price using current market prices for the active ingredient (API) observed in our analysis. Assuming optimization of molnupiravir synthesis, and a resulting drop in API cost, the US price would be equal to about 161 times the estimated sustainable generic price.
    ...
    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/me..._infection.pdf
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  16. #14
    If the "vaccine" doesn't kill you, perhaps these pills will.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    From what I have read so far it's just an antiviral. If I understand it correctly, it's something I would take if I had covid. There is nothing they could do to get me to take the vax or the monoclonal antibodies.
    A drug that intentionally causes genetic mutations. What could possibly go wrong?

    “introduction of copying errors during viral RNA replication.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Molnupiravir was developed for the treatment of Influenza. According to whistleblower complaint Molnupiravir has mutagenic properties and may change your DNA. Now, Molnupiravir has been repurposed for COVID-19. Merck has entered into agreements with Indian manufacturers and has also announced $5 million of donations to enter into Indian market. Here is all you need to know about Merck’s Covid pill Molnupiravir.

    Molnupiravir was developed for Influenza

    Molnupiravir (development codes MK-4482 and EIDD-2801) is an experimental antiviral drug which is orally active and was developed for the treatment of influenza.

    It is a prodrug of the synthetic nucleoside derivative N4-hydroxycytidine, and exerts its antiviral action through introduction of copying errors during viral RNA replication.

    The drug was developed at Emory University by the university’s drug innovation company, Drug Innovation Ventures at Emory (DRIVE).

    It was then acquired by Miami-based company Ridgeback Biotherapeutics, who later partnered with Merck & Co. to develop the drug further.

    Molnupiravir may change your DNA

    In April 2020, Rick Bright, who was removed as head of the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority (BARDA) before the approval of the drug, submitted a whistleblower complaint asserting that Ridgeback pressured BARDA to provide funding to manufacture EIDD-2801 despite Bright’s concerns that similar drugs in its class have mutagenic properties.

    A previous company, Pharmasset, that had investigated the Molnupiravir’s active ingredient had abandoned it over similar concerns.

    In genetics, a mutagen is a physical or chemical agent that permanently changes genetic material, usually DNA, in an organism and thus increases the frequency of mutations above the natural background level.

    As many mutations can cause cancer, such mutagens are therefore carcinogens, although not all necessarily are. All mutagens have characteristic mutational signatures with some chemicals becoming mutagenic through cellular processes.

    3/5 one concern that it introduces virus mutations or potential mutagenic probably means it won’t be recommended in pregnancy. I seem to remember my good colleague @RickABright had a concern about this drug when he was at BARDA so maybe he can comment. Also important to remember
    — Prof Peter Hotez MD PhD (@PeterHotez) October 1, 2021

    These claims were denied by George Painter, CEO of DRIVE, noting that toxicity studies on Molnupiravir had been carried out and data provided to regulators in the US and UK, who permitted safety studies in humans to move forward in the spring of 2020.

    At that time, DRIVE and Ridgeback Biotherapeutics stated they planned future safety studies in animals.

    More at: https://greatgameindia.com/merck-cov...-molnupiravir/
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Firestarter View Post
    The following isn't really about molnupiravir, but it does get mentioned: "Manufacturing cost for molnupiravir, according to a report from researchers with the Harvard School of Public Health, is around $17.74 for a 5-day course of treatment.
    Merck just signed a contract with the federal government to sell 1.7 million treatment courses for the government to distribute to infected people for … wait for it … $712.00 each."

    EM.
    Wow, that would be stunning Pandemic Profiteering...



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  20. #17
    Molnupiravir, a SARS-CoV-2 antiviral drug, is mutagenic in cells
    14 October 2021 by Vincent Racaniello

    Molnupiravir might be the first highly effective antiviral drug given emergency use authorization for treatment of COVID-19. Should we be concerned about the results of a recent study which show that the drug is mutagenic in cells?

    Molnupiravir is an orally available pro-drug of the nucleoside analog N4-hydroxycytidine (NHC). The latter is a nucleoside analogue which is incorporated into RNA by the viral RNA-dependent RNA polymerase (pictured above). Once incorporated into RNA, NHC is recognized as either C or U by the RNA polymerase. As a consequence, many mutations are introduced into the viral genome, causing lethal mutagenesis and inhibition of infectivity. NHC has been previously shown to have broad-spectrum anti-RNA virus activity and blocks transmission of influenza virus in a guinea pig model of infection. It has been shown to block SARS-CoV-2 transmission in ferrets and results of a phase 2/3 clinical trial look promising, leading to a request for emergency use authorization.

    N4-hydroxycytidine could be metabolized by the host to produce the 2’-deoxyribonucleotide form, which could be incorporated into cellular DNA and lead to mutagenesis. To test this hypothesis, a mutagenesis assay was used in Chinese hamster ovary cells (CHO-K1). These cells have one copy of the gene encoding the enzyme hypoxanthine phosphoribosyltransferase (HPRT), which makes the cells sensitive to the base analog 6-thioguanine (6-TG). If NHC were mutagenic, changes in the HPRT gene would allow cells to survive in the presence of 6-TG.

    Cells were exposed to NHC for 32 days and assayed for sensitivity to 6-TG. The drug conferred 6-TG resistance in a dose-dependent manner. Two other antivirals that are base analogs, ribavirin and favipiravir, displayed either no or modest mutagenic activity in this assay. Sequence analysis of HPRT mRNA revealed the presence of base changes.

    Molnupiravir is a far more active coronavirus antiviral than favipiravir and ribavirin, yet NHC has the distinct ability of causing mutations in cell DNA. The concern is that such mutations could lead to cancer or birth defects in a developing fetus. Whether or not Molnupiravir might cause cancer in humans is not known. However Merck, the developer of Molnupiravir, is required to carry out a series of gene toxicity studies before phase I testing of the compound in humans. Included is the Ames test, which uses bacteria to assess mutagenic activity of a compound. Bacteria do have the enzyme which can convert NHC to the DNA form. The results of these safety studies will not be published until after the drug receives EUA, but presumably nothing was observed that would preclude clinical trials.
    ...
    https://www.virology.ws/2021/10/14/m...nic-for-cells/
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    EM.
    Wow, that would be stunning Pandemic Profiteering...
    Surprised?
    Did you think the Shots were really "Free"?
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Molnupiravir is a far more active coronavirus antiviral than favipiravir and ribavirin, yet NHC has the distinct ability of causing mutations in cell DNA. The concern is that such mutations could lead to cancer or birth defects in a developing fetus.
    Is it strange that I think it's likely that these not-properly tested mRNA COVID vaccines could cause "mutations in cell DNA"?
    Or am I just paranoid to even suggest?

    That's besides the possibility of autoimmune disorder (the immune system attacking the cells that are producing the spike protein).
    Do NOT ever read my posts. Google and Yahoo wouldn’t block them without a very good reason: Google-censors-the-world/page3

    The Order of the Garter rules the world: Order of the Garter and the Carolingian dynasty

  23. #20
    Merck And Ridgeback: U.S. Government To Buy 1.4 Mln Addl Courses Of Molnupiravir After FDA Approval

    (RTTNews) - Biopharmaceutical major Merck & Co., Inc. (MRK) and Florida-based Ridgeback Biotherapeutics announced Tuesday that the U. S. government will purchase a total of 1.4 million additional courses of molnupiravir, if authorized, for approximately $1 billion.

    The government will exercise two of its options for the purchase if molnupiravir, an investigational oral antiviral medicine for the treatment of mild-to-moderate COVID-19 in at risk adults, is granted Emergency Use Authorization or EUA or approval by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration.

    With these exercised options, the government has now committed to purchase a total of around 3.1 million courses of molnupiravir, for approximately $2.2 billion, between authorization and early 2022.
    ...
    More: https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/merc...avir-after-fda
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  24. #21
    How did this drug rise to prominence as a COVID treatment? Follow the money:

    That’s where Holman came in. Her story is unusual for biotech. She’d worked in finance for more than 15 years, developing experience with the health-care industry before deciding she wanted to get into drug development for diseases with few existing treatment options. Her husband, Wayne, is a doctor and former health-care specialist at a division of Steven Cohen’s SAC Capital Advisors. Wayne’s hedge fund, Ridgeback Capital (an homage to the family dog, a Rhodesian Ridgeback named Coco), invested in major drug companies such as BioMarin Pharmaceutical Inc. and Celgene Corp. before he co-founded Ridgeback Biotherapeutics with Wendy in 2015. She became the biotech’s CEO and face.

    Ridgeback Bio is best known for developing an approved Ebola treatment, Ebanga, which had its own wild journey. The centers where it was tested in Congo got caught up in violence and burned down during trials, as dedicated staffers saved patient records. (Holman has lately been working out how to transport the drug to parts of the country experiencing renewed outbreaks.) Her interest in molnupiravir stemmed from wanting to find new Ebola treatments.

    As soon as she and Painter realized the urgency of the Covid crisis, they redirected their molnupiravir research toward SARS-CoV-2.
    ...
    Her quest for more capacity made Merck a natural fit. The deal the companies struck last May involved a direct payment to Ridgeback for the drug and an agreement for a share of the profits if it’s approved. Ridgeback also kept a hand in development, running some trials seeking to further the research while Merck handled the large-scale ones. “The reason to partner with Merck,” she says, was to “make sure that there was enough drug around for the world.”

    Merck could use a big win. In recent years it’s grown heavily dependent on a single cancer drug and a declining diabetes franchise.
    ...
    More: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...-against-covid
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #22
    This March, researchers working out of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill presented a study of the drug’s main ingredient at the same infectious disease conference where Ridgeback presented its data. The UNC researchers said, based on their assays, that molnupiravir’s use should be limited to those likely to get the greatest benefits, “due to the unknown long term risks associated with systemic exposure to a DNA mutagen.”
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/featu...-against-covid
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  26. #23
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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