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Thread: Most Covid patients at Israeli hospital fully vaccinated

  1. #1

    Most Covid patients at Israeli hospital fully vaccinated

    https://www.beckershospitalreview.co...udy-finds.html

    Nearly 60% of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in Israel fully vaccinated, data shows
    Erica Carbajal - Thursday, August 19th, 2021 Print | Email
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    Of 514 patients in Israel hospitalized with COVID-19 as of Aug. 15, 59 percent were fully vaccinated, according to an Aug. 16 article from Science that cited national data tracked by Israel's largest health management organization. The figures suggest breakthrough infections may be more common than the term implies, the report suggests.

    Most of the vaccinated patients who were hospitalized, about 87 percent, were at least 60 years old.

    "This is a very clear warning sign for the rest of the world," said Ran Balicer, CIO at Clalit Health Services, Israel's largest health maintenance organization. "If it can happen here, it can probably happen anywhere," he told Science.

    The country has one of the world's highest COVID-19 vaccination levels, with about 78 percent of those ages 12 and older fully vaccinated, mostly with the Pfizer vaccine. At the same time, Israel now has one of the highest infection rates in the world, potentially a sign of waning vaccine immunity as the highly contagious delta variant spreads, Science reports.

    In response, Israel began administering booster doses to people ages 60 and older July 30. The country has since expanded booster dose eligibility to Israelis who are at least 50 years old.

    Given the large number of fully vaccinated Israelis, some breakthrough cases were expected, health officials say, and a growing body of research has shown those who are unvaccinated face far higher risks of severe illness or death from a COVID-19 infection.

    https://www.spectator.com.au/2021/08...for-australia/

    Israel has been held up as the “gold standard” of how to conduct the coronavirus vaccine rollout. It has seen approximately 70% of its population receive the jab. The Israelis have relied in the main on the Pfizer vaccine. However, recently the country’s Prime Minister, Naftali Bennett, stated that the Pfizer vaccine is ‘significantly less’ effective against the so-called Delta variant. This follows on from a statement last June by Ran Balicer, who leads an expert advisory panel for the Israeli government, in announcing that the country might end up in lockdown again. Balicer and other officials said that 90 per cent of the new cases were caused by the Delta variant.

    Now an Israeli doctor has revealed a bombshell during a television interview. In the interview on August 5 with Israel’s Chanel 13, Dr Kobi Haviv, medical director of Herzog Hospital in Jerusalem, stated that the majority of coronavirus patients in an Israeli hospital are fully vaccinated, including those with severe disease.

    Dr Haviv further specified that: “95% of the severe patients are vaccinated,” adding “85-90% of the hospitalizations are in fully vaccinated people” and the hospital is “opening more and more COVID wards.” This has led him to conclude that “the effectiveness of the vaccine is fading out.”

    Of the 72 hospitalized COVID-19 patients, 25 patients were in “critical condition”, 38 were in “moderate” condition, and 9 were in “mild” condition. There were two deaths reported at the time of the interview.

    Data from the Israeli Minister of Health released on July 22 declared that the effectiveness of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine at preventing COVID-19 has plummeted from 90 percent to only 39 percent, coinciding with the spread of the Delta variant in the country.

    All this begs a significant question as far as Australia is concerned. After National Cabinet on July 30, Prime Minister Scott Morrison announced that there will be “special rules” for people who are vaccinated because they present “less of a public health risk” However, in light of the above, why are our politicians and health officials insisting on this rhetoric, and that vaccinations are the way out of these ‘Delta’ induced lockdowns, when evidence is mounting to the contrary?

    A Covid-19 outbreak in a Massachusetts county in July primarily occurred among vaccinated people, sparking fears that a variant of the virus can impact that population more than other strains.

    Of the 469 cases detected in Barnstable County, 74 per cent occurred among the fully vaccinated, according to a new study published by the CDC on 30 July. It also emerged last month that 49 fully vaccinated people in New Jersey died of coronavirus.

    Across the Atlantic, early analysis from Public Health England suggests vaccinated people infected with the Delta variant may be as infectious as their unvaccinated counterparts. The PHE technical briefing indicates that that “whilst vaccination may reduce an individual’s overall risk of becoming infected, once they are infected there is limited difference in viral load between those who are vaccinated and unvaccinated.”

    What is even more concerning is that, as alerted to by the Doctors for Covid Ethics, a Freedom of Information request to the Australian drugs regulator, the Therapeutic Goods Administration that granted provisional approval to the Pfizer vaccine, confirms that it has never seen the study data.

    In other words, the TGA never saw or requested the patient data from Pfizer and simply accepted their reporting of their study as true.This means that when the head of the TGA John Skerritt said that “the safety evidence is pretty thorough” on February 6, his words would ring hollow to most Australians who have assumed, rightly or wrongly, that the TGA had actually looked at the patient data before granting any such approval. As noted by Doctors for Covid Ethics on its website, it is currently not known whether any of the major government agencies around the globe (FDA, MHRA or EMA) has independently verified, or attempted to verify, Pfizer’s data, before proceeding with provisional/emergency authorisation of Pfizer’s mRNA therapy vaccine.

    For any government, either by itself or via corporate proxy, to attempt to mandate vaccines in circumstances where there has not been adequate testing and analysis of risks as well as benefits would constitute not only a violation of the principle of informed consent (which Prime Minister Scott Morrison has stated he believes in – see this press conference as an example) — but a violation of Australia’s obligations under international law with respect to medical experimentation.

    Indeed, after National Cabinet on August 6, Scott Morrison indicated that mandatory vaccination could breach privacy laws, discrimination laws, and Australia’s policy remained that vaccines should be voluntary and free. In particular, he declared: “In our country, everyone has choices and they have choices that are supported by the rule of law and simply making the point that those choices have to be exercised, are consistent with the rule of law.”
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  3. #2

    Bombshell Study Finds Natural Immunity Superior to Vaccination

    (File this under "I told you so")

    The report:
    https://unherd.com/thepost/bombshell...o-vaccination/

    A major study conducted by Israeli researchers into natural immunity has found that immunity acquired via infection from Covid-19 is superior to immunity from the Pfizer vaccine.

    Researchers at Maccabi Healthcare and Tel Aviv University compared the outcomes of over 76,000 Israelis in three groups: the doubly vaccinated (with the Pfizer vaccine), the previously infected but unvaccinated, and the previously infected with only a single vaccine dose.

    They found that fully vaccinated but uninfected people were significantly more likely to have a “breakthrough” Covid infection than people who had previously been infected and recovered from the disease.

    “This study demonstrated that natural immunity confers longer lasting and stronger protection against infection, symptomatic disease and hospitalisation caused by the Delta variant,” the authors conclude.

    The study is only published as a preprint at this stage and has not been peer reviewed. Critics including British immunologist Andrew Croxford have pointed out potential limitations, but it has been described by infectious diseases expert Professor Francois Balloux as a “bombshell” development.

    If the findings are confirmed, the implications for global Covid policy will be profound.

    It would not undermine the importance of vaccination for more vulnerable groups in society. However it would weaken the case for vaccinating children, despite the programme being confirmed in the UK today, as they (and the people around them) would get superior future protection from contracting the disease. And it would pose a fundamental challenge to the singular emphasis on vaccine passports for travel and large events, if unvaccinated people who have already had Covid actually pose less of a risk.
    The study: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....24.21262415v1


    So, this amounts to the largest medical malpractice scheme in history. Vaccinating healthy people who had very little risk related to Covid.
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  4. #3
    If the findings are confirmed, the implications for global Covid policy will be profound.
    That's doubtful, considering global Covid policy to date has been to lie their asses off.

    If this becomes widely known, that could affect global policy. They might tell different lies.
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    That's doubtful, considering global Covid policy to date has been to lie their asses off.

    If this becomes widely known, that could affect global policy. They might tell different lies.
    Well, we have to understand what "peer-reviewed" means.

    It means, first, that the study's authors must solicit peers to take the time out of their busy days to review the data and sign their name onto it, saying that they reviewed it and found no faults with the methodology. That always takes a bit of salesmanship. Obviously, it's easier to sell ideas that confirm preconceptions than it is to sell ones that conflict with preconceptions. You immediately limit your pool of peers and the ones you do get use extra scrutiny.

    If you make it past that point and you find several peers that confirm your data and methodology, then you then have to take it to a peer-review board. They can easily find fault in your data, your methodology, your peer-review process, hell, even your punctuation. It takes a dedicated researcher to continue to fight an unfriendly peer-review board. But, if you make it that far, you can now call your study "peer-reviewed".

    But even then, most studies are ignored if they conflict with preconceptions.


    Having said all that, this is an observational study based on accessible data. Provided they did the math right, it'll be hard to deny the data sources. This may actually make it through. And if so, it's really a bombshell. It'll totally undermine the crap they're trying to pull on our children!
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  6. #5
    If you had a 99% fully-vaccinated rate for a population group it wouldn't be at all surprising that most cases of infection would be among the fully vaccinated. So Israel has a 78% fully vaccinated rate but only 59% of those hospitalized were fully vaccinated, and of that group 87% were at least 60. Those stats hardly prove that the vaccine is ineffective.

    Shouldn't the real comparison be between the percentage of fully vaccinated people who get infected vs. the percentage of nonvaccinated people who get infected (even assuming you could even get such data -- a mild infection probably wouldn't be tested or reported)?

    Going further, it's my understanding that getting the vaccine doesn't mean you won't get infected; but it means your chances of getting very sick or dying is greatly reduced (e.g., the quote in the OP "a growing body of research has shown those who are unvaccinated face far higher risks of severe illness or death from a COVID-19 infection.")

    How about a comparison of the percentage of vaccinated people who die or get seriously ill vs. the percentage of unvaccinated folks who do? You could even create sub-groups by age -- e.g., over-60 vaccinated vs. over 60 unvaccinated.

    As the man said, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    If you had a 99% fully-vaccinated rate for a population group it wouldn't be at all surprising that most cases of infection would be among the fully vaccinated. So Israel has a 78% fully vaccinated rate but only 59% of those hospitalized were fully vaccinated, and of that group 87% were at least 60. Those stats hardly prove that the vaccine is ineffective.

    Shouldn't the real comparison be between the percentage of fully vaccinated people who get infected vs. the percentage of nonvaccinated people who get infected (even assuming you could even get such data -- a mild infection probably wouldn't be tested or reported)?

    Going further, it's my understanding that getting the vaccine doesn't mean you won't get infected; but it means your chances of getting very sick or dying is greatly reduced (e.g., the quote in the OP "a growing body of research has shown those who are unvaccinated face far higher risks of severe illness or death from a COVID-19 infection.")

    How about a comparison of the percentage of vaccinated people who die or get seriously ill vs. the percentage of unvaccinated folks who do? You could even create sub-groups by age -- e.g., over-60 vaccinated vs. over 60 unvaccinated.

    As the man said, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
    How about reading the study I posted?
    "And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat

    "It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire

  8. #7
    Actually 78% only represents the adults. Since the vaccine is not available for children the total percentage is closer to 60%. Either way those are abysmal efficacy numbers. Furthermore these are hospitalizations which means the vaccine isn't providing significant protection against severe illness either.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    If you had a 99% fully-vaccinated rate for a population group it wouldn't be at all surprising that most cases of infection would be among the fully vaccinated. So Israel has a 78% fully vaccinated rate but only 59% of those hospitalized were fully vaccinated, and of that group 87% were at least 60. Those stats hardly prove that the vaccine is ineffective.

    Shouldn't the real comparison be between the percentage of fully vaccinated people who get infected vs. the percentage of nonvaccinated people who get infected (even assuming you could even get such data -- a mild infection probably wouldn't be tested or reported)?

    Going further, it's my understanding that getting the vaccine doesn't mean you won't get infected; but it means your chances of getting very sick or dying is greatly reduced (e.g., the quote in the OP "a growing body of research has shown those who are unvaccinated face far higher risks of severe illness or death from a COVID-19 infection.")

    How about a comparison of the percentage of vaccinated people who die or get seriously ill vs. the percentage of unvaccinated folks who do? You could even create sub-groups by age -- e.g., over-60 vaccinated vs. over 60 unvaccinated.

    As the man said, there are lies, damn lies, and statistics.
    Last edited by jmdrake; 08-27-2021 at 04:54 PM.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    How about reading the study I posted?
    The study you cited didn't address the efficacy of the vaccine to reduce the chances of death or serious illness (vs. being unvaccinated and not having been previously infected) or to reduce the chance of infection in the first instance (nor was this its purpose).
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Furthermore these are hospitalizations which means the vaccine isn't providing significant protection against severe illness either.
    Is't it true that a vast majority of hospitalized COVID patients in the U.S. are unvaccinated?
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    The study you cited didn't address the efficacy of the vaccine to reduce the chances of death or serious illness (vs. being unvaccinated and not having been previously infected) or to reduce the chance of infection in the first instance (nor was this its purpose).
    A thing does not have to directly address a subject to shed light on it. To suggest otherwise is an amazingly illogical cession to authority.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Is't it true that a vast majority of hospitalized COVID patients in the U.S. are unvaccinated?
    It is not. The MSM says so. The evidence says otherwise, and the evidence is less quixotic.
    Last edited by acptulsa; 08-28-2021 at 08:45 AM.
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Is't it true that a vast majority of hospitalized COVID patients in the U.S. are unvaccinated?
    No. That is a blatant lie being pushed by many officials and the media.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
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    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    Well, we have to understand what "peer-reviewed" means.

    It means, first, that the study's authors must solicit peers to take the time out of their busy days to review the data and sign their name onto it, saying that they reviewed it and found no faults with the methodology. That always takes a bit of salesmanship. Obviously, it's easier to sell ideas that confirm preconceptions than it is to sell ones that conflict with preconceptions. You immediately limit your pool of peers and the ones you do get use extra scrutiny.

    If you make it past that point and you find several peers that confirm your data and methodology, then you then have to take it to a peer-review board. They can easily find fault in your data, your methodology, your peer-review process, hell, even your punctuation. It takes a dedicated researcher to continue to fight an unfriendly peer-review board. But, if you make it that far, you can now call your study "peer-reviewed".

    But even then, most studies are ignored if they conflict with preconceptions.


    Having said all that, this is an observational study based on accessible data. Provided they did the math right, it'll be hard to deny the data sources. This may actually make it through. And if so, it's really a bombshell. It'll totally undermine the crap they're trying to pull on our children!
    The doctors that have been studying Ivermectin have claimed that the medical journals are operating like Twitter at this point. A study can be peer-reviewed, pass a board review, then the higher ups at the journals just censor and refuse to publish.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    No. That is a blatant lie being pushed by many officials and the media.
    Do you have a credible source to back this up?
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by acptulsa View Post
    The evidence says otherwise, and the evidence is less quixotic.
    What evidence?
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Do you have a credible source to back this up?
    LOL. What source would you like to believe? I've seen it in real life, with many vaccinated people getting fairly bad cases or being hospitalized. One vaccinated person I had met may have died from it. But there are plenty of sources for it. Even the mainstream media has Doctors that admit it. Fauci has probably said it. They contradict themselves constantly. Do you trust government sources? "There's only 2% inflation."

    Do you trust the SF Chronicle and the CDC?

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7031e2.htm

    A report released Friday analyzes a July outbreak in Barnstable County, Mass., where 74%, or 346, of the 469 new cases were “breakthroughs,” meaning they affected people who were fully vaccinated.
    ...
    https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/...y-16352677.php
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Is't it true that a vast majority of hospitalized COVID patients in the U.S. are unvaccinated?
    Maybe for now. They are forcing the virus to mutate into worse forms with their vax, instead of letting it run it's course naturally.



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  20. #17
    The stories totally contradict everything "they' have been telling us, common sense wins again!


    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021...ection-parties

    Having SARS-CoV-2 once confers much greater immunity than a vaccine—but no infection parties, please

    The natural immune protection that develops after a SARS-CoV-2 infection offers considerably more of a shield against the Delta variant of the pandemic coronavirus than two doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, according to a large Israeli study that some scientists wish came with a “Don’t try this at home” label. The newly released data show people who once had a SARS-CoV-2 infection were much less likely than never-infected, vaccinated people to get Delta, develop symptoms from it, or become hospitalized with serious COVID-19.
    The study, conducted in one of the most highly COVID-19–vaccinated countries in the world (80%), examined medical records of tens of thousands of Israelis, charting their infections, symptoms, and hospitalizations between 1 June and 14 August, when the Delta variant predominated in Israel. It’s the largest real-world observational study so far to compare natural and vaccine-induced immunity to SARS-CoV-2, according to its leaders.

    They also vaccinated early, so it's simple, their vaccinations wore out sooner, too, call the vaccinations, cycles, they give it to you and it boosts your immune system, then it comes back down to normal range, then another vaccination etc.. etc....
    Last edited by Mach; 08-28-2021 at 06:09 PM.
    If the stampman tells you to kiss his ass, shall he get away with it and live? Don't let your courage cool, or a few bullies scare you. We've nothing to fear but slavery. Love your liberty, and fight for it like men who know its value. Once lost it will never, never be regained.
    -Hugh Ledlie, 1774.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    LOL. What source would you like to believe? I've seen it in real life, with many vaccinated people getting fairly bad cases or being hospitalized. One vaccinated person I had met may have died from it. But there are plenty of sources for it. Even the mainstream media has Doctors that admit it. Fauci has probably said it. They contradict themselves constantly. Do you trust government sources? "There's only 2% inflation."

    Do you trust the SF Chronicle and the CDC?

    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7031e2.htm
    So you're taking one day in one county and extrapolating that to the entire country? Well, two can play that game. Here's a report about New York for May 3-July 25, dealing with a much larger sample.

    A total of 1,271 new COVID-19 hospitalizations (0.17 per 100,000 person-days) occurred among fully vaccinated adults, compared with 7,308 (2.03 per 100,000 person-days) among unvaccinated adults... In this study, current COVID-19 vaccines were highly effective against hospitalization (VE >90%) for fully vaccinated New York residents, even during a period during which prevalence of the Delta variant increased from <2% to >80% in the U.S. region that includes New York, societal public health restrictions eased,§§ and adult full-vaccine coverage in New York neared 65%.
    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/...cid=mm7034e1_w
    A report about Los Angeles for May 1-July 25:

    On July 25, the SARS-CoV-2 infection rate among unvaccinated persons was 4.9 times and the hospitalization rate was 29.2 times the rates among fully vaccinated persons.
    https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/...cid=mm7034e5_w
    https://stacks.cdc.gov/view/cdc/109087
    A report from the State of Washington:

    • 92.7% of COVID-19 cases from February 1, 2021 - August 16, 2021 were not fully vaccinated.

    • 94.1% of COVID-19 cases from February 1, 2021 - August 09, 2021 who were hospitalized were
    not fully vaccinated.

    • 92.4% of COVID-19 cases from February 1, 2021 - July 26, 2021 who died from COVID-19 were
    not fully vaccinated.
    https://www.doh.wa.gov/Portals/1/Doc...Vaccinated.pdf
    We have long had death and taxes as the two standards of inevitability. But there are those who believe that death is the preferable of the two. "At least," as one man said, "there's one advantage about death; it doesn't get worse every time Congress meets."
    Erwin N. Griswold

    Taxes: Of life's two certainties, the only one for which you can get an automatic extension.
    Anonymous

  22. #19
    In Washington state, the "vaccinated" are pretty much pretty much assumed to not have the Rona. The counties even shut down their test centers. If you state that you had the jab, the PCR cycle rates are reduced. At the same time, they aren't really testing the jabbed outside of a few locations. The county test centers are closed. At hospitals, they don't test those with the jab. The coroner doesn't state that the Rona killed a jabbed person with two gunshot wounds to the head. That's going to heavily skew the numbers.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    Is't it true that a vast majority of hospitalized COVID patients in the U.S. are unvaccinated?
    Delta took hold in Israel before it took hold in the U.S. And then there's the question of which vaccines are being used. Pfizer and Moderna are garbage when it comes to the variants but better when it comes to the original. Johnson and Johnson seems to work better against the variants. And Israel is more highly vaccinated. Has the U.S. even reached 50%?
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Sonny Tufts View Post
    So you're taking one day in one county and extrapolating that to the entire country? Well, two can play that game. Here's a report about New York for May 3-July 25, dealing with a much larger sample.



    A report about Los Angeles for May 1-July 25:



    A report from the State of Washington:
    Dude, back in May - June, the Delta variant was not prominent in the U.S. Delta wasn't in all 50 states until June 1st.

    See: https://www.newsweek.com/first-us-co...mutate-1617871

    All of the vaccines have been shown effective against the original strain. But the mRNA vaccines are not very effective against the variants.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Dude, back in May - June, the Delta variant was not prominent in the U.S. Delta wasn't in all 50 states until June 1st.

    See: https://www.newsweek.com/first-us-co...mutate-1617871

    All of the vaccines have been shown effective against the original strain. But the mRNA vaccines are not very effective against the variants.
    If more vaccinated people are getting sick, I suspect the mRNA vaccines are the variant.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    If more vaccinated people are getting sick, I suspect the mRNA vaccines are the variant.
    Hmmmm.....let's evaluate as best we can. In Israel about 78% of people over 12 have been vaccinated. No vaccine is available for people 12 and under. So the total vaccination rate is about 60%. All things being equal, if the vaccine were sugar water I'd expect 60% of the hospitalizations to have been vaccinated. Of course all things aren't equal. Early on it was rare for a child to be hospitalized with COVID. But that seems to be different for the Delta variant. Also there are different vaccines out there. The mRNA vaccines appear to be garbage against Delta, but Johnson and Johnson is apparently better at Delta. So...how many cases of the original strain are still floating around? I don't know. How many Johnson and Johnson vaccinations were given? I don't know. I do know that Pfizer was the vast majority of the shots given in Israel but some Johnson and Johnson shots were given. If I were to bet the issue is that the mRNA vaccines, which honed only on the spike protein, are having a problem because the variants have mutated the spike protein. But natural immunity looks at the entire virus as a whole. So does the J & J.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  27. #24
    Most Covid patients at Israeli hospital fully vaccinated

    Nearly 60% of hospitalized COVID-19 patients in Israel fully vaccinated, data shows

    Of 514 patients in Israel hospitalized with COVID-19 as of Aug. 15, 59 percent were fully vaccinated [...]
    Oh, wait ...

    https://twitter.com/NTarnopolsky/sta...72367719411718
    https://i.imgur.com/BwU46s8.png

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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptUSA View Post
    (File this under "I told you so")

    The report:
    https://unherd.com/thepost/bombshell...o-vaccination/



    The study: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....24.21262415v1


    So, this amounts to the largest medical malpractice scheme in history. Vaccinating healthy people who had very little risk related to Covid.

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021...ection-parties
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  30. #26
    Mind blown

    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Oh, wait ...

    https://twitter.com/NTarnopolsky/sta...72367719411718

  31. #27
    Ooops that means everyone needs to get a vaccine...
    Quote Originally Posted by Revelation 18:23
    And the light of a lamp will shine in you no more, and the voice of bridegroom and bride will be heard in you no more, for your merchants were the great ones of the earth, and all nations were deceived by your sorcery.

  32. #28
    Presented without further comment:

    (Well, okay, one comment: LOL. SMH.)

    (Or does that count as two comments? )

    https://twitter.com/Jerusalem_Post/s...10698139922433

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Presented without further comment:

    (Well, okay, one comment: LOL. SMH.)

    (Or does that count as two comments? )

    https://twitter.com/Jerusalem_Post/s...10698139922433
    The JP headline is pathetic.
    "Experts" believe there will be no long term side effects to the mRNA vaxs.. EXPERTS Right.... Its not like they were wrong before... Or could be shills. Look at how they are ignoring the main issues of these vaxs.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Oh, wait ...

    https://twitter.com/NTarnopolsky/sta...72367719411718
    https://twitter.com/FreedomIsrael_/s...82637108863005

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