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Thread: Afghanistan & China

  1. #1

    Afghanistan & China

    I think we can expect the proxy war with China to ramp up over the years. Also development of the One Road/Belt initiative. Then, there is Kashmir.

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...?ocid=msedgntp

    As the United States withdraws its forces from Afghanistan, China is not hesitating to move in. Earlier this week, nine Taliban leaders accepted Beijing's invitation and met in Tianjin with Chinese foreign minister Wang Yi. One of those leaders was the group's co-founder, Mullah Abdul Ghani Baradar. Wang told his visitors that China expects the Taliban to play an important role in the "process of peaceful reconciliation and reconstruction in Afghanistan" and described the group as a "pivotal political and military force" in the country.

    It appears to be only a matter of time before China recognizes the Talban's de facto control of the country even as Washington remains formally committed to supporting the Kabul government.

    Although he urged his Afghan visitors not to allow their country to serve as a staging area for the East Turkestan Islamic Movement that seeks independence for Xinjiang, true to China's longstanding policy, Wang avoided any reference to the state of Afghanistan's internal affairs. As Taliban spokesman Mohammed Naeem put it, no doubt gleefully, "China ... said they will not interfere in Afghanistan's issues."

    In other words, unlike the United States and its Western allies, China has every intention to remain silent regarding the Taliban's brutal treatment of women and the Hazara minority, as well as those Afghans who worked closely with America and its allies. Subsequent to the meeting, a Chinese spokesman contrasted his nation's policies with those of the United States, again stating that "China has throughout adhered to non-interference in Afghanistan's internal affairs," as opposed to the "failure of U.S. policy towards Afghanistan."



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  3. #2
    Will the graveyard of empires claim another victim?
    Or will the ChiComs collapse on their own before it can?
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  4. #3
    Ther are reports suggesting that "Afghan exit" policy could morph into expansion of conflict.. China is being encourged to step in, NATO is planning to setup training camps in Turkey, Russia is carrying out military exercises in staes bordering Afghanistan and US is preparing for military exercises near border of Russia. Russia has called well-funded Afghan gummit hypocritial for not negotiating with the Taliban.

    Hopefully regional/global payers or some deep neocons are not planning to instigate civil war there along the "Iraqi freedom", Syria Freedom models by way of proxy wars. Peaceful solution through an inclusive Afghan gov is probably the best option.

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Ther are reports suggesting that "Afghan exit" policy could morph into expansion of conflict.. China is being encourged to step in, NATO is planning to setup training camps in Turkey, Russia is carrying out military exercises in staes bordering Afghanistan and US is preparing for military exercises near border of Russia. Russia has called well-funded Afghan gummit hypocritial for not negotiating with the Taliban.

    Hopefully regional/global payers or some deep neocons are not planning to instigate civil war there along the "Iraqi freedom", Syria Freedom models by way of proxy wars. Peaceful solution through an inclusive Afghan gov is probably the best option.
    I don't see Russia or US going back. Publicly that is, unless its under a guise of humanitarian aide or we leave behind some stooge spies. Even the UN is getting hit.
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...cid=uxbndlbing
    I suspect China will exploit Afghanistan for mineral resources to support its tech, which is a battle for AI between the West and China.
    https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/...-elements.html
    https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/...ghanistan.html
    Officially known as the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, Afghanistan is a country in Asia. The landlocked country has an area of about 252,000 square miles and a population of about 31 million people. Several things drive the economy of Afghanistan such as the natural resources of the country. These natural resources include things like coal, copper, natural gas, petroleum, gold, lithium, uranium, gold, rare earth elements, and arable land.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    I don't see Russia or US going back. Publicly that is, unless its under a guise of humanitarian aide or we leave behind some stooge spies. Even the UN is getting hit.
    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...cid=uxbndlbing
    I suspect China will exploit Afghanistan for mineral resources to support its tech, which is a battle for AI between the West and China.
    https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/...-elements.html
    https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/...ghanistan.html
    Officially known as the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, Afghanistan is a country in Asia. The landlocked country has an area of about 252,000 square miles and a population of about 31 million people. Several things drive the economy of Afghanistan such as the natural resources of the country. These natural resources include things like coal, copper, natural gas, petroleum, gold, lithium, uranium, gold, rare earth elements, and arable land.
    Evidently nobody in the world believes these belong to the Afghan people.

  7. #6
    sigh ... The stage for the proxy war with China is set.

    https://www.usnews.com/news/world-re...ing-us-threats

    China Preparing to Recognize Taliban if Kabul Falls: Sources
    The move comes at the expense of the U.S., which has held up the Taliban’s international legitimacy as its remaining source of leverage while the militant group storms across Afghanistan.

    China is prepared to recognize the Taliban as the legitimate ruler of Afghanistan if it succeeds in toppling the Western-backed government in Kabul, U.S. News has learned, a prospect that undercuts the Biden administration's remaining source of leverage over the insurgent network as it continues its startling campaign to regain control.

  8. #7
    The U.S. is reneging on its plan to withdraw. It is announced today that 3,000 fresh ground troops are being sent back.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowball View Post
    The U.S. is reneging on its plan to withdraw. It is announced today that 3,000 fresh ground troops are being sent back.
    To extract the embassy staff.


    But the Taliban is outlawing the Wuhan Flu Frankenshot rather than using the ChiCom version.
    This is not going to go the way China thinks it will go.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  11. #9

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Yea seems highly improbable.

    Following stunning developments might be just coincidence but China could be one of the first ones to accept Taliban government if they managed to form some reasonable political regime:

    http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...=1#post7053282
    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...-fall-of-kabul

    Beyond clear public signals from Beijing that it was cozying up to the Taliban, U.S. News and World Report said on Thursday it had learned that “China is prepared to recognize the Taliban as the legitimate ruler of Afghanistan" and that “new Chinese military and intelligence assessments of the realities on the ground in Afghanistan have prompted leaders in the Chinese Communist Party to prepare to formalize their relationship with the insurgent network.”

    State Department spokesman Ned Price was asked about the Taliban-China meetings in early August, and he also said the interests of the U.S. and China were aligned and that the U.S. welcomed China’s role.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...-fall-of-kabul

    Beyond clear public signals from Beijing that it was cozying up to the Taliban, U.S. News and World Report said on Thursday it had learned that “China is prepared to recognize the Taliban as the legitimate ruler of Afghanistan" and that “new Chinese military and intelligence assessments of the realities on the ground in Afghanistan have prompted leaders in the Chinese Communist Party to prepare to formalize their relationship with the insurgent network.”

    State Department spokesman Ned Price was asked about the Taliban-China meetings in early August, and he also said the interests of the U.S. and China were aligned and that the U.S. welcomed China’s role.
    China will be the next victim of the graveyard of empires.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    China will be the next victim of the graveyard of empires.
    How so? They are simply having diplomatic relations with Afghanistan.
    China shares a border with Afghanistan they have more of a right to be there that we ever did. Why should China have an isolationist attitutude towards Afghanistan?

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    How so? They are simply having diplomatic relations with Afghanistan.
    China shares a border with Afghanistan they have more of a right to be there that we ever did. Why should China have an isolationist attitutude towards Afghanistan?
    China is just as predatory as the west or more.
    They will not stick to just diplomatic relations and they will destroy themselves. (unless one of their other problems destroys them first)
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #14
    ...
    Last edited by Swordsmyth; 08-17-2021 at 09:37 PM.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    China is just as predatory as the west or more.
    They will not stick to just diplomatic relations and they will destroy themselves. (unless one of their other problems destroys them first)
    Purely speculative arguement. Do you have any facts to back your statement up?

  18. #16
    I think that all countries that border Afghanistan will build up their military presence along their borders.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Purely speculative arguement. Do you have any facts to back your statement up?
    All of their Belt and Road contracts that the natives end up regretting.
    Their occupation of Tibet.
    Their border fights with India.
    The South China Sea.

    I could go on and on.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    All of their Belt and Road contracts that the natives end up regretting.
    Their occupation of Tibet.
    Their border fights with India.
    The South China Sea.

    I could go on and on.
    Belt and Road: not a military I cursion.
    Occupation of Tibet: taking down a theocracy that had judicial mutilation.
    Border fights with India: why is this automatically China's fault?
    South China: protection of territorial waters.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Belt and Road: not a military I cursion.
    Occupation of Tibet: taking down a theocracy that had judicial mutilation.
    Border fights with India: why is this automatically China's fault?
    South China: protection of territorial waters.
    LOL
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    Belt and Road: not a military I cursion.
    Occupation of Tibet: taking down a theocracy that had judicial mutilation.
    Border fights with India: why is this automatically China's fault?
    South China: protection of territorial waters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    LOL
    @mtr1979 Ron Paul had a great episode a week or so ago on the LibertyReport… what America can’t or doesn’t want to compete with, it simply conquers. I would never want to live in China, but it seems they are more capitalistic than the current USSofA… Swordy here would sooner instigate something at risk of starting another war, he doesn’t believe in or support true Free Markets.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    LOL
    I fail to find the humor in my statement.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    @mtr1979 Ron Paul had a great episode a week or so ago on the LibertyReport… what America can’t or doesn’t want to compete with, it simply conquers. I would never want to live in China, but it seems they are more capitalistic than the current USSofA…
    LOL
    You are either very gullible or working for them.
    There is no free market in China, it is all a false front for the party and the military.

    And they are about to drop the charade:
    President Xi Calls For “Redistribution Of Wealth”

    https://www.zububrothers.com/2021/08/18/president-xi-calls-for-redistribution-of-wealth-to-help-expand-the-middle-class/


    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Swordy here would sooner instigate something at risk of starting another war, he doesn’t believe in or support true Free Markets.
    You keep telling that lie as an excuse to collaborate no matter how often I tell you we don't need a war to stop them.
    Just stop collaborating and watch them collapse.

    Quote Originally Posted by mtr1979 View Post
    I fail to find the humor in my statement.
    Your cheap Chinese spin is so bad it is laughable.
    But it is not uncommon for the person making a fool of themselves to not see it.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    LOL
    You are either very gullible or working for them.
    There is no free market in China, it is all a false front for the party and the military.
    Here’s what I do know. Under repuG statists like you:

    Nixon took us off the gold standard.
    Bush Sr declared a New World Order.
    Bush W - TSA and other 3 letter Fed agencies.
    Trump - funded Gates initiatives and private companies, OWS, nationalized healthcare, more tax payer dough to planned parenthood than even Obummer, highest debt of all presidents in history combined.

    Closet-fascist-lib, comes to mind. You don’t know the first thing about liberty, and reject everything Ron Paul stands for.

    LOL all you want. This country ended up the way that it is because of libs and people just like you.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Your cheap Chinese spin is so bad it is laughable. But it is not uncommon for the person making a fool of themselves to not see it.
    There it is finally the ad hominem that took longer than ecpected.
    What started this you think China will fall victim to the graveyard of empires. I disagree with you I don't think China is that stupid. I could be wrong and in a few years you can say I told you so, but at this point in time let's just agree to disagree.
    Last edited by mtr1979; 08-21-2021 at 02:13 AM.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Here’s what I do know. Under repuG statists like you:

    Nixon took us off the gold standard.
    Bush Sr declared a New World Order.
    Bush W - TSA and other 3 letter Fed agencies.
    Trump - funded Gates initiatives and private companies, OWS, nationalized healthcare, more tax payer dough to planned parenthood than even Obummer, highest debt of all presidents in history combined.

    Closet-fascist-lib, comes to mind. You don’t know the first thing about liberty, and reject everything Ron Paul stands for.

    LOL all you want. This country ended up the way that it is because of libs and people just like you.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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