Biden to Visit Tulsa to Remember Race Massacre 100 Years Ago

[jmdrake]

Here’s the actual machine gun being transported by the national guard.





And here’s a dramatization of a machine gunner. So who is this guy supposed to be? Machine Gun Kelly as a white supremacist? Or am I right to suggest that a lot of violence was actually committed by the government?

I'm not sure why you think the terms "government" and "white supremacist" are mutually exclusive, especially in the 1920s. I've scene newspaper clippings from that era where the KKK meetings were covered on the front page of the Birmingham News as a local football game would be covered today and documents showing all of the major politicians of the time were klan members. I doubt it was that different in Oklahoma.

This pic below is from a 2019 TV show called The Watchmen. It recreated the events of the Tulsa riot. I wouldn’t be surprised if some people see the plane in this fictional account and say that’s what granny remembered.

I'm not sure if you're being serious or trolling. I'm guessing you're trolling. Back in the 1970s the GAP band song "You dropped the bomb on me" was about the Tulsa massacre. That was way before the Watchman comic was ever written, let along the crappy TV show. So the stories of the plane inspired that scene from the show and not the other way around.

[devil21]

Hey look, everybody. The Red Baron’s ghost visited America to haunt Tulsa! Someone shoulda told that guy World War I end three years earlier!


























Here’s the actual machine gun being transported by the national guard.
























And here’s a dramatization of a machine gunner. So who is this guy supposed to be? Machine Gun Kelly as a white supremacist? Or am I right to suggest that a lot of violence was actually committed by the government?







































This pic below is from a 2019 TV show called The Watchmen. It recreated the events of the Tulsa riot. I wouldn’t be surprised if some people see the plane in this fictional account and say that’s what granny remembered.

Well $#@!, if "Hollywood" (holly wood being the material that druids used to make magic wands for spell casting) aired a story about it 2019 then it's totes true, for sure.

[TheTexan]

Same thing happened with the holocaust. 50 years later some people found a few photographs of dead jews and all of a sudden its "millions of jews died omg!"

Probably like 3 people died in this "massacre", if it happened at all.

[acptulsa]

I'm not sure if you're being serious or trolling. I'm guessing you're trolling.

He's clearly trying to disrupt, deny and deflate this topic. What does his own signature call that sort of behavior?

[jmdrake]

Well $#@!, if "Hollywood" (holly wood being the material that druids used to make magic wands for spell casting) aired a story about it 2019 then it's totes true, for sure.

Ah. Mel Gibson did a story about the American Revolution (the Patriot) and William Wallace (Braveheart) and so the must be myths. Actually there are parts of both of those movies that are probably false and not witnesses left alive. For the Tulsa massacre there are still witnesses who can testify to what happened. Don't believe Hollywood. Believe them.

[jmdrake]

Of course he is. It's been 100 years. Blacks have every opportunity to better themselves in this country today. Those who haven't never will and the democrats bank on that to keep them down with cradle to grave entitlements.

As if that was the last time this happened.

https://www.vanderbilt.edu/political...ng-paper-1.pdf

[jmdrake]

Reparations.

The typical argument against reparations is "Everybody's dead." Well...this time everybody isn't. Regardless, Trump had a pretty good reparations plan. I guess I was right all along when I said he's really a democrat.

[devil21]

Ah. Mel Gibson did a story about the American Revolution (the Patriot) and William Wallace (Braveheart) and so the must be myths. Actually there are parts of both of those movies that are probably false and not witnesses left alive. For the Tulsa massacre there are still witnesses who can testify to what happened. Don't believe Hollywood. Believe them.

Biplanes dropping bombs on a Tulsa neighborhood is a bit too fantastical for me to buy, especially since I've come to accept that Hollywood exists mostly to seed social engineering narratives or rewrite history or both in combination. The rest of the story I can generally accept but planes dropping bombs.....naaaa, can't do it.

[jmdrake]

Biplanes dropping bombs on a Tulsa neighborhood is a bit too fantastical for me to buy, especially since I've come to accept that Hollywood exists mostly to seed social engineering narratives or rewrite history or both in combination. The rest of the story I can generally accept but planes dropping bombs.....naaaa, can't do it.

I'm curious as to why. You don't think such planes existed 100 years ago? (They did). You don't think explosives were readily available? (They were). You don't think that white racists would use explosives against black people? (They did. Just watch the documentary "Four Little Girls" about the bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham Alabama). There is no logical reason for you to call biplanes bombing neighborhoods "fanciful." I mean sure. It's a free country. You can believe or disbelieve whatever you wish. There's just no logical reasoning that I can think of for your position. And this was something that came by way of eyewitness testimony and not some Hollywood imagination. By contrast the scene in the Mel Gibson movie The Patriot where the evil British locked all the civilians in a church and then burned them alive for no good reason other than a plot point was totally made up. So was the scene in Braveheart of the king taking new brides to have sex with them as his right as king. Totally made up. No historical references or eyewitness testimony. Conservative social engineering?

[devil21]

I'm curious as to why. You don't think such planes existed 100 years ago? (They did). You don't think explosives were readily available? (They were). You don't think that white racists would use explosives against black people? (They did. Just watch the documentary "Four Little Girls" about the bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham Alabama). There is no logical reason for you to call biplanes bombing neighborhoods "fanciful." I mean sure. It's a free country. You can believe or disbelieve whatever you wish. There's just no logical reasoning that I can think of for your position. And this was something that came by way of eyewitness testimony and not some Hollywood imagination. By contrast the scene in the Mel Gibson movie The Patriot where the evil British locked all the civilians in a church and then burned them alive for no good reason other than a plot point was totally made up. So was the scene in Braveheart of the king taking new brides to have sex with them as his right as king. Totally made up. No historical references or eyewitness testimony. Conservative social engineering?

I said fantastical, not fanciful. Similar meanings but not quite the same. Any way.

I don't disagree that the capability was there nor that people have done really terrible things to each other throughout history. This bombing story however strikes me as an intentional exaggeration (or at least a misremembering taken farther than it should....85 year old's memories of events are shown to be questionable throughout history also) to invoke a stronger reaction than otherwise would be possible. That is why I find it a tad convenient that Hollywood just happened to put out a documentary about the event prior to it being suddenly injected into the msm. Are there pictures of the area of literally leveled homes and businesses? They don't have to look like Dresden but I need more than Hollywood (known liar) representations, an 85 year old's testimony (wouldn't stand up in court) and some cartoons, sorry, especially in this age of rampant disinfo. The plane bombing aspect just pegs my BS meter and my BS meter is pretty damn calibrated.

[Ender]

I said fantastical, not fanciful. Similar meanings but not quite the same. Any way.

I don't disagree that the capability was there nor that people have done really terrible things to each other throughout history. This bombing story however strikes me as an intentional exaggeration (or at least a misremembering taken farther than it should....85 year old's memories of events are shown to be questionable throughout history also) to invoke a stronger reaction than otherwise would be possible. That is why I find it a tad convenient that Hollywood just happened to put out a documentary about the event prior to it being suddenly injected into the msm. Are there pictures of the area of literally leveled homes and businesses? They don't have to look like Dresden but I need more than Hollywood (known liar) representations, an 85 year old's testimony (wouldn't stand up in court) and some cartoons, sorry, especially in this age of rampant disinfo. The plane bombing aspect just pegs my BS meter and my BS meter is pretty damn calibrated.

Your BS meter may be a bit off on this- most people have no idea of real history that has been covered up for political reasons.

Most have never heard of the 1942 Lee Street Riot, which has been sunk into oblivion, because- you know......

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog...eet-race-riot/


And, yes, I consider you mucho sharp & one of my fav posters.

[jmdrake]

I said fantastical, not fanciful. Similar meanings but not quite the same. Any way.

I don't disagree that the capability was there nor that people have done really terrible things to each other throughout history. This bombing story however strikes me as an intentional exaggeration (or at least a misremembering taken farther than it should....85 year old's memories of events are shown to be questionable throughout history also) to invoke a stronger reaction than otherwise would be possible. That is why I find it a tad convenient that Hollywood just happened to put out a documentary about the event prior to it being suddenly injected into the msm. Are there pictures of the area of literally leveled homes and businesses? They don't have to look like Dresden but I need more than Hollywood (known liar) representations, an 85 year old's testimony (wouldn't stand up in court) and some cartoons, sorry, especially in this age of rampant disinfo. The plane bombing aspect just pegs my BS meter and my BS meter is pretty damn calibrated.

Yeah... that seems like a difficult (actually impossible) thing to "misremember." But let's go with that. Do you think the rest of the story is BS then? Seriously, I find this "Well I don't think a plane was used to bomb a city to BS" argument completely banal. It's not even the most important part of the story.

And Hollywood didn't put out a "documentary" about the event. An episode of a superhero TV show, that didn't get great ratings anyway, isn't a "documentary." There have been quite a few documentaries on the Tulsa massacre that are decades old, so your whole premise is inaccurate. And there's something about the 100 year anniversary of an event that causes the event to get greater public awareness.

But I will ask you this question one more time because I didn't see a straight answer. Why do you think it fantastical that people who had access to airplanes and a willingness to use explosives in racial terrorism might actually put those two things together? Is it simply because that wasn't an everyday occurrence? Here's another "fantastical" (your words) story. Not long after the Civil War, some racists angry at the outcome of an election used a cannon against a black militia who were trying to defend the actual election winners. Is that "fantastical" to you too? If someone decides to use that story in a script in the future will you discount the eyewitnesses (all dead now) just because Hollywood?

[jmdrake]

Your BS meter may be a bit off on this- most people have no idea of real history that has been covered up for political reasons.

Most have never heard of the 1942 Lee Street Riot, which has been sunk into oblivion, because- you know......

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog...eet-race-riot/


And, yes, I consider you mucho sharp & one of my fav posters.

Wow! I had never heard of that one myself. Thank you for sharing it.

[TheTexan]

Your BS meter may be a bit off on this- most people have no idea of real history that has been covered up for political reasons.

Most have never heard of the 1942 Lee Street Riot, which has been sunk into oblivion, because- you know......

https://www.lewrockwell.com/lrc-blog...eet-race-riot/


And, yes, I consider you mucho sharp & one of my fav posters.

Most people have also never heard of the Dallas 1923 massacre.

Because it didn't happen until I started writing a book on it.

[RJB]

Most people have also never heard of the Dallas 1923 massacre.

Because it didn't happen until I started writing a book on it.

I believe that involved the first nuclear weapon used against a civilian population, if my imagination is correct.

[TheTexan]

Ah. Mel Gibson did a story about the American Revolution (the Patriot) and William Wallace (Braveheart) and so the must be myths. Actually there are parts of both of those movies that are probably false and not witnesses left alive. For the Tulsa massacre there are still witnesses who can testify to what happened. Don't believe Hollywood. Believe them.

Her testimony means literally zero to me. First, she was 6 years old when it happened. Second, it was 100 years ago, it is proven that memories drift significantly over time. Third, she's 107 years old. Fourth, she probably has an agenda, just like anyone else. Fifth, why testify now, and not 50+ years ago?

Maybe she did testify back 50+ years ago. Tell me I'm wrong.

Otherwise her testimony is absolutely useless, especially on a politically charged issue such as this where she has a clear agenda ($$)

[TheTexan]

I believe that involved the first nuclear weapon used against a civilian population, if my imagination is correct.

Yes, and reparations will need to be made.

I accept cash, check, & credit.

[jmdrake]

Her testimony means literally zero to me. First, she was 6 years old when it happened. Second, it was 100 years ago, it is proven that memories drift significantly over time. Third, she's 107 years old. Fourth, she probably has an agenda, just like anyone else. Fifth, why testify now, and not 50+ years ago?

Maybe she did testify back 50+ years ago. Tell me I'm wrong.

Otherwise her testimony is absolutely useless, especially on a politically charged issue such as this where she has a clear agenda ($$)

I suppose you believe the revolutionary war never happened either. Must just be made up for money.

[TheTexan]

I suppose you believe the revolutionary war never happened either. Must just be made up for money.

I trust evidence that is entered into public record at or near the time of the event. Pretty much most (if not all?) of the "evidence" of this "massacre" is from 50-90 years after the fact.

The same way that movies in the past 30 years have gotten extremely much better CGI and special effects, "historians" have increasingly tried to make history more colorful & interesting. Any recent evidence, for anything 50+ years ago, is lies by default unless proven otherwise.

[TheTexan]

As an example of the way historians try to make history more colorful:

The Race Riot Commission's 2001 report is below:
https://www.okhistory.org/research/forms/freport.pdf

Not even once is the word "massacre" used.

Somewhere in the past 20 years, it went from "Race Riot" to "Race Massacre", despite there being no meaningful evidence to make that distinction.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

Back in the 1970s the GAP band song "You dropped the bomb on me" was about the Tulsa massacre.

Not according to the guy who wrote the song:

Charlie Wilson wrote the song, and said that despite the rumors, the only bomb the song is referring to is one made of love.

And who had cell phones in 1921 or any kind of quick photography to catch a photo of a falling bomb? Who would stop to do that while running for his/her life?

All I asked for was a plane pic, bombs or not.

And I don't think anyone with the IQ of a snail thinks the KKK footage was from the riot itself but rather a representation of the men who carried out the killings.

Representations aren't facts. Representations are fictional accounts in TV--like the show with the bombing airplane.

I've scene newspaper clippings from that era where the KKK meetings were covered on the front page of the Birmingham News as a local football game would be covered today and documents showing all of the major politicians of the time were klan members. I doubt it was that different in Oklahoma.

Extrapolation fallacy. Again, I'm not interested in all your representations, speculations, and other events. We're discussing the facts of this particular Tulsa event.







`

[TheTexan]

All I asked for was a plane pic, bombs or not.

The 2001 report linked above said that there was no evidence of bombs being dropped, and the planes were most likely police vehicles doing recon.

[TheTexan]

Extrapolation fallacy. Again, I'm not interested in all your representations, speculations, and other events. We're discussing the facts of this particular Tulsa event.

If you're looking for facts you're in the wrong thread. There are very few facts of what happened that day. There is plenty of speculation, conflicting testimony, and spurious assumptions, if you're into that sort of thing.

The simple fact of the matter is, noone knows what happened. Trying to place blame or justify reparations, without actual evidence, is just a waste of time.

[Ender]

Her testimony means literally zero to me. First, she was 6 years old when it happened. Second, it was 100 years ago, it is proven that memories drift significantly over time. Third, she's 107 years old. Fourth, she probably has an agenda, just like anyone else. Fifth, why testify now, and not 50+ years ago?

Maybe she did testify back 50+ years ago. Tell me I'm wrong.

Otherwise her testimony is absolutely useless, especially on a politically charged issue such as this where she has a clear agenda ($$)

So next you're gonna tell me that the "Civil" war was about slavery, right? 'Cause that's what everyone is taught so it must be so. amirite?

[TheTexan]

So next you're gonna tell me that the "Civil" war was about slavery, right? 'Cause that's what everyone is taught so it must be so. amirite?

You're reading comprehensions are extremely bad.

[devil21]

Yeah... that seems like a difficult (actually impossible) thing to "misremember." But let's go with that. Do you think the rest of the story is BS then? Seriously, I find this "Well I don't think a plane was used to bomb a city to BS" argument completely banal. It's not even the most important part of the story.

And Hollywood didn't put out a "documentary" about the event. An episode of a superhero TV show, that didn't get great ratings anyway, isn't a "documentary." There have been quite a few documentaries on the Tulsa massacre that are decades old, so your whole premise is inaccurate. And there's something about the 100 year anniversary of an event that causes the event to get greater public awareness.

But I will ask you this question one more time because I didn't see a straight answer. Why do you think it fantastical that people who had access to airplanes and a willingness to use explosives in racial terrorism might actually put those two things together? Is it simply because that wasn't an everyday occurrence? Here's another "fantastical" (your words) story. Not long after the Civil War, some racists angry at the outcome of an election used a cannon against a black militia who were trying to defend the actual election winners. Is that "fantastical" to you too? If someone decides to use that story in a script in the future will you discount the eyewitnesses (all dead now) just because Hollywood?

So no pictures of leveled houses and associated carnage from bombing a city neighborhood, then? That is what bombs do. It's just too fantastical of a story to believe without further evidence, Hollywood social engineering concerns aside. Sometimes extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I can believe most of the story otherwise, though. It's just the plane bombing part that I can't buy. Any way, it doesn't really matter. Sounds like the whole thing was messed up with or without bombs.

(Btw, the 9/11 event was foreshadowed in the pilot episode of an obscure tv show The Lone Gunmen about 2 years before it happened. Most of us accept that the official msm version of 9/11 isn't the real story. Seeding of narratives to be injected later into the mainstream is Hollywood SOP.)

[TheTexan]

I've heard that the death totals were actually closer to 500

[acptulsa]

So no pictures of leveled houses and associated carnage from bombing a city neighborhood, then? That is what bombs do.

There are lots of pics of the scorched earth. That's one of the few things of which we do have several pics. A few pics of wagonload of bodies, too.

Nobody ever said 1921 civilian single engine biplanes did B-52 carpet bombing. Nobody said anything about precision guided bunker busting munitions, or even Norden bombsight levels of accuracy. Nobody accused any actual air force of the vast international conflict ended just three years earlier of hitting anything they were trying to dump on more than ten percent of the time. We're talking about rednecks lobbing stuff out of proto-cropdusters, airplanes that make the Stearman look like a Lear jet. Whether it was sticks of dynamite or jars of gasoline, they probably had hell even getting one or two of the fuses lit in an open cockpit before they ran out of gas.

Everyone carries on about one or two wood and canvas biplanes like it was some kind of blitzkrieg. This is Keystone Kops level $#@!.

There's no extraordinary evidence because it's not that damned extraordinary a claim.

(Btw, the 9/11 event was foreshadowed in the pilot episode of an obscure tv show The Lone Gunmen about 2 years before it happened. Most of us accept that the official msm version of 9/11 isn't the real story. Seeding of narratives to be injected later into the mainstream is Hollywood SOP.)

Everything I've related here I learned over ten years before The Watchmen was published, reading it in papers preserved in microfilm reels in dusty boxes at the library or by talking to old locals. This is me telling you this. You may decide I can't be believed. But you can't say you don't know why I don't buy that one. That's a lot of prep for a psyop that doesn't really begin for another four and a half decades.

[devil21]

There are lots of pics of the scorched earth. That's one of the few things of which we do have several pics. A few pics of wagonload of bodies, too.

Post 'em up then. That's all I've asked for in my last few posts on the thread.

[acptulsa]

Post 'em up then. That's all I've asked for in my last few posts on the thread.

I don't own them, I don't have copies to scan, I don't own the rights, I don't know where to find most of them as I saw them years ago, and this site's software doesn't allow me to attach pics anyway.

Solve all--not just one or two--of these problems for me and your wish is my command, sahib.

Why? What difference does it make?