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Appears the girl shot was a vet and staunch Trump supporter. I would assume with so much video evidence they will be rounding up everyone they can and at that point we can see what organizations these people are from. I'd bet money Trump supporters outnumber all other groups combined.Originally Posted by pcosmar
let us teach them that all who draw breath are of equal worth, and that those who seek to press heel upon the throat of liberty, will fall to the cry of FREEDOM!!! Spartacus, War of the Damned
BTC: 1AFbCLYU3G1dkbsSJnk3spWeEwpqYVC2Pq
All due respect, I think you're projecting your perspective onto these people.
While I respect the righteous indignation that they feel, they could not have accomplished less yesterday.
It felt good, seeing the seat of all evil stormed like that, but it was a directionless, impotent mob, and their actions ASSURED Biden's election last night. The last vestiges of opposition in Congress melted away in the wake of the violence. And - FAR WORSE - this will make easy the moves the left already planned on making.
They SHOULD have IGNORED Washington, D.C., and instead stormed their state capitols and demanded that their assemblies begin drafting articles of secession.
There was NO evidence displayed yesterday of any thoughtful opposition to Washington, D.C. Again, for as much as I can appreciate some element of their frustration, this was little more than an artless, mindless, impotent and juvenile outburst of anger.
Be glad you had nothing to do with it. The MAGA crowd is an untamed stallion, much like the rabble that made up the majority of the Revolutionary generation. You're a very bright and articulate man, AF. You should be spending your energies taming those of them within your reach, and herding them in the right direction. Not encouraging on their self-destructive behavior.
Not nearly so much as you believe he is.
Accelerating the left's actions is a good thing.It felt good, seeing the seat of all evil stormed like that, but it was a directionless, impotent mob, and their actions ASSURED Biden's election last night. The last vestiges of opposition in Congress melted away in the wake of the violence. And - FAR WORSE - this will make easy the moves the left already planned on making.
Your proposed approach is more impotent than what transpired today at getting anything to happen.
They SHOULD have IGNORED Washington, D.C., and instead stormed their state capitols and demanded that their assemblies begin drafting articles of secession.
You think directing our energies toward state legislators and demanding an end to the Federal union is LESS effective than a one-off mob LARP'ing a revolution that had the net effect of securing once and for all Biden's election, and justifying all manner of leftist expansions from gun control to censorship, while the opposition is in complete disarray and effectively leaderless? And now that mob is basically radioactive so anyone who might have thought to step in and try to lead it wouldn't touch it with a ten meter cattle prod?
If this is the mindset of this movement, we're screwed.
ETA: Sorry, let me restate: please explain what you mean by that.
Last edited by A Son of Liberty; 01-07-2021 at 05:09 AM.
Yes. The state legislators are in no way susceptible to secession advocates. Worse, all that approach does is leave an unhampered federal government to use its resources against those advocating for secession in those states. An unfortunate side effect of the American Civil War was the determination that secession will be forever stopped by the federal government using lethal force.
The left is going to pass everything they want to pass without meaningful resistance from Republicans. This puts any resistance squarely on the shoulders of the people where it always has been. Individuals are going to actually have to do something about what they regard as intolerable acts instead of relying on politicians. Well, that or grow comfortable with the heavy chains rapidly placed on them. The key is getting people as pissed off as possible in as short a time as possible, so it is critical the left's actions are accelerated. If the left's actions are spread out, then there is an opportunity for anger to dissipate.
That "mob" was going to be radioactive regardless of whatever they did or did not do. Unless you have forgotten, the media has persistently framed anyone right of Marx as radioactive for quite a few years now. Any potential "leader" that was scared off by what resulted is a man unbefitting the epithet.And now that mob is basically radioactive so anyone who might have thought to step in and try to lead it wouldn't touch it with a ten meter cattle prod?
There will be no peaceful extrication from tyranny.If this is the mindset of this movement, we're screwed.
Last edited by BSWPaulsen; 01-07-2021 at 05:26 AM.
The accelerationist model... I don't agree with this on it's face, but I'm willing to give it a think.
[quote]That "mob" was going to be radioactive regardless of whatever they did or did not do. Unless you have forgotten, the media has persistently framed anyone right of Marx as radioactive for quite a few years now. Any potential "leader" that was scared off by what resulted is a man unbefitting the epithet.
I think there was a difference between a peaceful gathering and a riotous mob.
But, again, for anything to actually be accomplished, there must be some strategy and coordination. PERHAPS this was the first step in that direction, but if the liberty movement doesn't move in and stake a claim, the movement that is organized will be at best a populist/nationalist movement and at worst a cult of personality.There will be no peaceful extrication from tyranny.
Who are the Hancock's, the Jefferson's, the Henry's and the Paine's? The warrior poets who'll lead this rabble?
I think you will find that this was, in the terms of the press, a "mostly peaceful gathering".
The larger crowd did remove some barriers and peacefully moved into places they weren't supposed to. But there was also a nefarious element in the crowd. Some of them have also been the agitators at BLM "protests". I'm not sure you can stage any kind of large-scale protest without attracting that element.
That being said, this was a registering of frustration. And unlike that BLM/OWS/Antifa protests, this one had almost no property damage. So, when you say, "riotous mob", you have to recognize that those are media terms.
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
I used to disagree with it until I realized the "boiling the frog" model has been fantastically successful for those in power. It is possible that acceleration backfires horribly, but the current course does not strike me as one with a successful outcome. Basically, it is a calculated risk necessitated by the otherwise inevitable acquiescence of people to leftist dictates introduced over a longer period of time. Others can use their own evaluations to arrive at their own conclusion.
I do not disagree there is a difference in nature but given the left was calling them seditionists before anything happened I do not think optics matter all that much. There is value in the people seeing that they have real power to do something about their predicament if they have the will to act, so today can be regarded as having accomplishing something. Absent a feeling of empowerment, the disenfranchised only feel demoralized.I think there was a difference between a peaceful gathering and a riotous mob.
Strategy and coordination comes from getting men on board with a common vision they will fight for. Normally, communities are best at establishing a common culture among a group of people, so it will have to take the form of a thousand brushfires. The liberty movement can present a powerful image of prosperity that harkens to the traditions of this country, and this would serve to attract a decent number of people. It is a good time for liberty advocates to be proactive in eloquently professing their stances, using their rhetoric to inflame the passions of men, and acting out their ungovernability.But, again, for anything to actually be accomplished, there must be some strategy and coordination. PERHAPS this was the first step in that direction, but if the liberty movement doesn't move in and stake a claim, the movement that is organized will be at best a populist/nationalist movement and at worst a cult of personality.
Who are the Hancock's, the Jefferson's, the Henry's and the Paine's? The warrior poets who'll lead this rabble?
As for the men whose names are remembered long after the fact? It would be wonderful to find out.
and be at a solidarity rally for the Climate. Not saying it's not possible, but I can't believe this guy is a die hard Trump supporter.
https://www.azcentral.com/picture-ga...ld/2391592001/
The wisdom of Swordy:
On bringing the troops home
On fighting corruption:
Fascism Defined
How many people were there??
Well folks get ready for the new normal
Henceforth Deep State bureaucrats
1- will decide who our prime minister, excuse me , our president will be ;
2- they alone will decide what constitutes evidence
3- they alone will decide what your eyes actually saw ;
4- they alone will decide what firearms, if any , you are allowed to carry
5- they alone will decide what is constitutional
6. - they alone will decide when covid19 will disappear and when a new virus will appear in order to keep us in our place;
7- they alone will decide who is a terrorist, who is crazy and who needs to disappear
8- bear in mind that you must wait for the deep state to declare when your rights have been transgressed upon and when , if ever, violence is necessary, If in doubt contact Pierre Delecto for guidance.
The new improved Nanny State is here to stay.
And remember when you are in the presence of a deep state bureaucrat you must curtsy, frequently say yes sir no sir , and do not forget to kiss the hem of their garment.
And lastly, no you do not have a right to visit our #45 President who was declared an enemy of the state and is undergoing rehab at the Attica Correctional Facility. .
TaTa
.
Last edited by Contumacious; 01-07-2021 at 07:07 AM.
Oh bull$#@!. Trump is going to retire to Florida and continue to whine on twitter. The democrats will hand out free money for 2-4 years until it gets out of control and the GOP regains power. Then repeat the cycle in 4 years, nothing has changed.
If you think nothing has changed, you're not paying attention.
What has changed?
Nothing ever will change. It's the end of the world every 4 years.
Plenty. A billionaire reality show star was elected president in 2016. Governments throughout the country implemented widespread lockdowns of the population. Socialism has become an open aim of a large portion of one of the major parties. Factions have emerged, and have openly engaged in violence. Etc.
I'll grant you that the country has been on this trajectory, but the rate of climb has increased, clearly.
I agree that the lockdowns are noteworthy. That's the one big leap of a change that I see that will have lasting consequences.
The rest is either not a change, or just incremental changes of the sort that have always been happening. There's plenty of past precedent of more violence in years past than anything we saw in 2020-21, as well as for open advocacy of socialism. Factions have always been around. Maybe new ones emerged, as the factions of the day, but the factionalizing itself is nothing new. The media, especially partisan media aimed at scaring people into turning to this or that political party to save them, has blown things out of proportion and portrayed these very precedented things as unprecedented.
Last edited by Invisible Man; 01-07-2021 at 07:40 AM.
For every Tax hike,new welfare program & attacks on the 2nd Amendment people should blame you.
You stood with Biden,china,the deep state,The media,the evil left against President Trump.
In what way did Krugminator do that? You mean just because he didn't speak out in support of Antifa storming the Capitol building yesterday?
These people who stormed the capitol building are Heroes.
Krugminator is a Zionist troll who never supported Ron Paul.
He attacked ron paul supporters like Scott horton but praised & promoted ron paul haters like Ben shapiro.
Whether Antifa helped lead the charge into the capitol, or not, is virtually irrelevant to me.
It's been needing to happen one way or another. Even as nothing more than a "symbolic" event, it's something that can make enough people uncomfortable and/or allow others to see there is some power left in the people.
So at this point, if it was a combo of Trump supporters and Antifa, well then by golly look at that. Maybe we should actually take that headline and run with it?
To the members/cowards in Congress who conveniently used yesterday's event as their excuse to challenge the election results: screw you and shame on you.
Also remember: our state department and mainstream media always cover events like yesterday as the will of the people taking back power when it's done in other countries. I guess it just doesn't apply here or at least not when leftists aren't doing it.
And to the people saying violence has no place? I'll spare asking where these people were all Summer of 2020, but I'll bring something else - where have you been as the U.S. commits atrocities abroad? It's OK then, but not for some precious police officers (who I thought were all racist and needed to be defunded? CAN SOMEONE LET ME KNOW WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE MAD AT TODAY? I SEEM TO HAVE LOST MY AGENDA) who are punching, macing, etc. people who, in my mind have the right to push to the steps of the capitol.
And lastly, ya'll (we) need to quit fighting over semantics. We'll never have a unified libertarian front because it's in our nature not to, but Jesus. The petty arguing over semantics is just a joke.
Welcome to the R3VOLUTION!
What makes them heroes?
In what way is anything they did even good at all?
I never knew you were such a staunch defender of Antifa.
1. Can you point to a specific example?
2. If so, do you actually side with the state department and MSM in that coverage?
Trump lost. When you lose, you leave. The end. Only baboons disagree.
And I can see why you like Trump so much that you think it worth completely destroying the country over. He is a semi-socialist who panders to protectionist theocrats like you.
Feel free not to call me anti-American in future neg reps. The Founding Fathers were pro-reason educated elites. They would hate you.
The script has flipped.
A summer of violence. Looting, stealing, arson, crimes of every imaginable kind. How many of these protestors were killed by the authorities? How much property damage was there? How many completely innocent lives were destroyed? How many people terrorized?
What did the police do? Well, they were told to stand down and, in many cases, actually protected the "protestors" while they broke the law.
For a year we've been told by the left and their propagandists in the media that "protesting" is perfectly fine and that rioters should be given their space to express their anger in whatever form of violence they wanted.
By the way, in these protests violence was expected and was in large part, the norm for those attending.
Then yesterday you have just a few of hundreds of thousands let into the Capitol and break some windows. One tries to climb through it and is killed. 3 others are killed likely by tear gas.
If this were Biden and his supporters, not only would no one have been killed but right now the entire world would be calling for the police who pulled the trigger to be summarily executed without trial and we'd be told to grieve such an affront of our god given right and duty to protest.
Yes - the protestors yesterday should have known better, especially given that we all know the rules are not equally applied. But personally, I cannot stomach the hypocrisy of it anymore. It's just disgusting.
Some of them also stormed British vessels and destroyed property over a 3 cent tax on a pound of tea.
And let's not forget the Boston Massacre. Unsavory things are bound to happen when governance is unresponsive.
"And now that the legislators and do-gooders have so futilely inflicted so many systems upon society, may they finally end where they should have begun: May they reject all systems, and try liberty; for liberty is an acknowledgment of faith in God and His works." - Bastiat
"It is difficult to free fools from the chains they revere." - Voltaire
This event has opened many eyes that have been hooded for literally decades.
People who don't agree with either the right or the left have been forced to admit that Big-Gov only serves itself and will never represent them.
My hope is that the American people will finally come to the conclusion that the federal government serves no good domestic purpose and that it's long sense overstepped it's foreign authority.
Some might look deeper and conclude that the large metroplexes in their state exert undue authority over them and their interests.....
One can hope.....
Yet the simple fact that many eyes were actually opened makes them heroes.
I have seen zero instances of this kind of eye opening here.
I do see a lot of deeper entrenchment in the divisions that already existed between the staunch supporters and staunch opponents of Trump. But no changing of any minds or opening of eyes.
The result I've seen that could conceivably be framed as opening of eyes is the opposite of what I think you may have dreamed up, which is that people who supported Trump, not as enthusiastic rally-going Trumpers, but as ordinary conservatives and Republicans who tolerated him as the lesser evil, which made up the majority of his voters, have had their eyes opened to how much worse he and his more zealous supporters were than they already thought, and are now more ashamed of the votes they cast for him than they already were.
But the crowd who stormed the Capitol (whoever they were, whether Antifa or not) haven't won people over to their cause (if they even have one) who weren't already in it.
What came of this "storming of the Capitol"?
A few broken doors, windows?
A lot of media screeching.
What a joke.
This should have been happening every day for the past 200 years, lol.
"An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.
"To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."
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