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Thread: Breaking - St. Louis prosecutor announces charges against the McCloskey couple

  1. #31
    This is a good lesson for any lurkers:. If the government is going after this family of progressive lawyers who broke no law, imagine how they would attack anyone outside of their club.
    ...



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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Sammy View Post
    Folks the evil Government is taking our constitutional rights away.
    Its a basic human right to defend your private propery!
    Technically it was the city government (DA) that attempted this and the state government (AG and Gov) that protected them. Of course if you live in a leftist state and get caught up in a national situation like this, you'd be in a lot more stress but would still win, as long as it was done within context of the law.
    THE SQUAD of RPF
    1. enhanced_deficit - Paid Troll / John Bolton book promoter
    2. Devil21 - LARPing Wizard, fake magical script reader
    3. Firestarter - Tax Troll; anti-tax = "criminal behavior"
    4. TheCount - Comet Pizza Pedo Denier <-- sick

    @Ehanced_Deficit's real agenda on RPF =troll:

    Who spends this much time copy/pasting the same recycled links, photos/talking points.

    7 yrs/25k posts later RPF'ers still respond to this troll



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  5. #33
    This can't be repped enough.


    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    This is a good lesson for any lurkers:. If the government is going after this family of progressive lawyers who broke no law, imagine how they would attack anyone outside of their club.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    This is a good lesson for any lurkers:. If the government is going after this family of progressive lawyers who broke no law, imagine how they would attack anyone outside of their club.
    I imagine those attacks will be relentless and 10x worse.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    This is a good lesson for any lurkers:. If the government is going after this family of progressive lawyers who broke no law, imagine how they would attack anyone outside of their club.
    Are they really progressives?

    https://heavy.com/news/2020/06/mark-...le-guns-video/
    While some on social media have claimed the McCloskeys are registered Democrats, it was not immediately possible to determine whether the couple are actually registered as Democrats or if they are registered Republicans. But Federal Election Commission records show Mark McCloskey has contributed thousands of dollars to the Trump Make America Great Again Committee, the Republican National Committee and Donald J. Trump for President Inc. He also made contributions to a Republican congressional candidate, Bill Phelps, in 1996, and to the Bush-Quayle campaign in 1992.

    Patricia McCloskey also made a contribution to the RNC in 2018 and to a Republican Senate dinner in 1988.
    Maybe the real reason they are being targeted is because they are not progressives.

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm View Post
    But that's not the point. The point is to intimidate homeowners from defending their property in the future.
    + rep

    We're being governed ruled by a geriatric Alzheimer patient/puppet whose strings are being pulled by an elitist oligarchy who believe they can manage the world... imagine the utter maniacal, sociopathic hubris!

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    And there you have it.

    Nobody will ever hear that they got pardoned or that nothing happened.

    All they will remember is they got arrested for defending their home against a violent mob.

    The day is rapidly approaching where self defense will be a felony hate crime...especially force used against one of the Anointed.
    + rep

    We're being governed ruled by a geriatric Alzheimer patient/puppet whose strings are being pulled by an elitist oligarchy who believe they can manage the world... imagine the utter maniacal, sociopathic hubris!

  10. #38
    Mixed thoughts about this...

    These two have a right to defend their property from trespassers. No doubt about that. And they have a right to shoot people who are an imminent threat, especially on their own property. That is not in question.

    However their complete lack of situational awareness, and basic gun handling skills are worse than cringe-worthy.... they are dangerous and borderline negligent.

    They muzzle flash each other multiple times. They have their fingers on the trigger. They wave the guns at people who do not appear to be an imminent threat (you never point a gun at someone unless you're going to actually shoot them).

    Also they should have taken defensive positions... like on the roof or behind some of their bushes or columns. If the crowd had been an imminent threat, standing out in the open like this was the absolute worst place to be.

    I applaud them for defending their property and using the right to keep and bear arms to do so. But how they did it was inappropriate.

    Does it rise to the level of criminality? I don't think so. I suspect the local prosecutor is using this as a high profile PR event to their benefit.

    But with every right comes a responsibility. We have the right to free speech but we have the responsibility to make sure we don't misuse our speech. Same with firearms. Part of owning a firearm is learning how to use it safely and responsibly even if the law doesn't require us to do so (the 2A has no training requirement to keep and bear arms for example).

    Hopefully they are not prosecuted but instead attend at least a basic firearms training course because it is evident that they never have.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  11. #39
    Oh, and I have another question: just where the flying $#@! is NRA, GOA, Oathkeepers and half a dozen grifter groups I have donated thousands of dollars to over the years on this issue?
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr.3D View Post
    Are they really progressives?
    .
    Well, lawyers are evil enough, no offense to the few good people in that profession
    ...



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  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oh, and I have another question: just where the flying $#@! is NRA, GOA, Oathkeepers and half a dozen grifter groups I have donated thousands of dollars to over the years on this issue?
    Makes sense for the NRA to not say anything given their history of supporting gun control in the past, but the GOA definitely needs to come out with a statement.
    Last edited by Anti Globalist; 07-23-2020 at 07:35 PM.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    ...their complete lack of situational awareness, and basic gun handling skills are worse than cringe-worthy.... they are dangerous and borderline negligent.

    They muzzle flash each other multiple times. They have their fingers on the trigger. They wave the guns at people who do not appear to be an imminent threat (you never point a gun at someone unless you're going to actually shoot them).

    Also they should have taken defensive positions... like on the roof or behind some of their bushes or columns. If the crowd had been an imminent threat, standing out in the open like this was the absolute worst place to be...
    I get the impression that the McCloskey’s are not experienced gun users. We know they had a couple of guns, but I’m not sure they knew how to use them. The way the wife kept one hand on her hip while holding the pistol out, reminded me of Benny Hill. The fact that they chose to face an enemy while barefoot, seems really stupid. They may have simply been using them like props and hoping it would be enough to scare the mob away?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oh, and I have another question: just where the flying $#@! is NRA, GOA, Oathkeepers and half a dozen grifter groups I have donated thousands of dollars to over the years on this issue?
    Maybe it has something to do with the nature of their lawsuit AGAINST a gun manufacturer? No one has divulged what this lawsuit was about. Do they believe in suing gun manufacturers over a crimes commited with their guns? Maybe over lack of some safety feature? Perhaps the McClosky’s are standard progressives who in fact believe “the little people” aren’t entitled to own guns, but that they were entitled to have a few around because they are lawyers and therefore very special?

    In other words:
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
    There's a reason the McCloskeys became unglued. Their proper dinner party support for BLM turned into zoo escape.

    It's one thing to watch the animals behind bars. It's quite another to watch them in your own backyard.
    St. Louis prosecutor ordered crime lab to reassemble Patricia McCloskey's gun
    Author: Christine Byers (KSDK)
    Published: 3:32 PM CDT July 21, 2020 - Updated: 5:22 AM CDT July 22, 2020

    ...Patricia McCloskey and her husband, Mark McCloskey, have said the handgun Patricia McCloskey waved at protesters was inoperable because they had used it as a prop during a lawsuit they once filed against a gun manufacturer. In order to bring it into a courtroom, they made it inoperable...

    https://www.ksdk.com/article/news/lo...=snd-autopilot
    Last edited by Valli6; 07-23-2020 at 10:23 AM.

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Valli6 View Post
    Maybe it has something to do with the nature of their lawsuit AGAINST a gun manufacturer? No one has divulged what this lawsuit was about. Do they believe in suing gun manufacturers over a crimes commited with their guns? Maybe over lack of some safety feature? Perhaps the McClosky’s are standard progressives who in fact believe “the little people” aren’t entitled to own guns, but that they were entitled to have a few around because they are lawyers and therefore very special?
    There's all this talk of alliances even if you have differences...well, I could ally with people like this, long before I could with some $#@! street Marxist.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oh, and I have another question: just where the flying $#@! is NRA, GOA, Oathkeepers and half a dozen grifter groups I have donated thousands of dollars to over the years on this issue?
    Because this couple was an embarrassment and demonstrated the complete WRONG way to defend one's life and property. Those groups don't want to be associated with that couple and rightfully so.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Because this couple was an embarrassment and demonstrated the complete WRONG way to defend one's life and property. Those groups don't want to be associated with that couple and rightfully so.
    Go blow it out your ass Collins, you pedantic, pompous prick.

    They need some instruction, but they did nothing wrong under the law, they did nothing wrong morally, they hurt no one, they protected themselves and their property and kept the mob, that threatened to kill them, off them.

    - rep
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  19. #46
    What's this I'm hearing that the woman's pistol didn't even have a firing pin? And that the DA's office took it apart and put it back together, when it literally could not have been used as a deadly weapon? If true, it might explain some of the shaky trigger discipline.
    NeoReactionary. American High Tory.

    The counter-revolution will not be televised.

  20. #47
    So many ass**holes over analyzing this

    They did nothing wrong & 2nd amendment rights have never been more important for honest citizen

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaleoLibertarian View Post
    What's this I'm hearing that the woman's pistol didn't even have a firing pin? And that the DA's office took it apart and put it back together, when it literally could not have been used as a deadly weapon? If true, it might explain some of the shaky trigger discipline.
    Yes, apparently it was a courtroom prop that had been rendered inoperable by mounting the firing pin and return spring backwards.

    In order to be charged under the MO law that the prosecutor is trying here, the firearm used must be operable and able to deliver deadly force, a fake, a prop or broken one could not be used to prima facie prove the "deadly weapon" language of the law.

    The prosecutors office had the police armorer dissemble the weapon, and re-assemble it back to functioning mode.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    They need some instruction, but they did nothing wrong under the law, they did nothing wrong morally, they hurt no one, they protected themselves and their property and kept the mob, that threatened to kill them, off them.
    Actually in most places it is not legal to point a gun at someone unless you're going to actually shoot them (in self defense). You need to go back and reread my entire comment above because you obviously didn't.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  24. #50
    As for their gun handling, you can be taught something, but if it is not drilled and trained, that knowledge won't be there when it hits the fan. I have seen people do dumber things under pressure.

    If you do not wish to be critiqued as harshly, make sure you get some regular training in. Take a few combat shooting courses as well. Because a lot of people who bad mouth the McCloskeys' mistakes would behave similarly when the adrenaline hits. Holding a gun and facing a mob that outnumbers you, who may kill you and burn down your home will do funny things to your head if your training is limited.
    Last edited by RJB; 07-23-2020 at 07:37 PM.
    ...

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by RJB View Post
    I don't think that @TheCount is showing enough outrage for the anti 2nd Amendment harassment that this couple is facing. TheCount should spend equal time and outrage on this thread as the Portland arrest thread.
    I don't think he can hear you over the crickets chirping.

    Last edited by nobody's_hero; 07-23-2020 at 07:49 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Eliot's The Hollow Men

    "One of the penalties for refusing to participate in politics is that you end up being governed by your inferiors." - Plato

    We Are Running Out of Time - Mini Me

    Quote Originally Posted by Philhelm
    I part ways with "libertarianism" when it transitions from ideology grounded in logic into self-defeating autism for the sake of ideological purity.

  26. #52
    Mrs. McCloskey's pistol was non-operable when it arrived in police custody, the firing pin spring had been installed in front of the firing pin.

    The prosecutor ordered crime lab experts to disassemble and reassemble the gun so that it was readily capable for lethal use, which is a requirement for the type of crime the McCloskey's had been charged.

    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  27. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Actually in most places it is not legal to point a gun at someone unless you're going to actually shoot them (in self defense). You need to go back and reread my entire comment above because you obviously didn't.
    Those laws need to be changed.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  28. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Those laws need to be changed.
    In a public place "brandishing" is usually a crime.

    But this was their own home, on their property, in a "Stand Your Ground" state with a violent mob in their back yard.

    I'm pretty sure the only thing they did wrong is to not be properly "TactiCool".
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  29. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    In a public place "brandishing" is usually a crime.

    But this was their own home, on their property, in a "Stand Your Ground" state with a violent mob in their back yard.

    I'm pretty sure the only thing they did wrong is to not be properly "TactiCool".
    Even in a public place it should be legal to brandish a weapon when you are threatened.
    It is a natural instinct and most people will do it whether it may or may not be the wisest thing, you shouldn't need to be trained in order to exercise your rights.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  30. #56
    Brandishing a weapon is fine in this situation on your own property. Pointing it at someone you don't intend to shoot is not.

    These two should have had their weapons in a defensive "low-ready" position unless they were in the act of shooting the trespassers. It's gun safety and gun law 101.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst



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  32. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Brandishing a weapon is fine in this situation on your own property. Pointing it at someone you don't intend to shoot is not.

    These two should have had their weapons in a defensive "low-ready" position unless they were in the act of shooting the trespassers. It's gun safety and gun law 101.
    Yes, they should have...nobody disagrees with that.

    But given the totality of the situation, no crime was committed.
    Another mark of a tyrant is that he likes foreigners better than citizens, and lives with them and invites them to his table; for the one are enemies, but the Others enter into no rivalry with him. - Aristotle's Politics Book 5 Part 11

  33. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post

    But given the totality of the situation, no crime was committed.
    I'm really not sure if that's the case. But again, as I wrote previously, even if it is the case then they shouldn't be charged.

    But if a judge mandated they take a damn gun safety course I would actually be ok with that.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  34. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    Brandishing a weapon is fine in this situation on your own property. Pointing it at someone you don't intend to shoot is not.

    These two should have had their weapons in a defensive "low-ready" position unless they were in the act of shooting the trespassers. It's gun safety and gun law 101.
    The law should not enforce wisdom any more than it should enforce morality.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  35. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Oh, and I have another question: just where the flying $#@! is NRA, GOA, Oathkeepers and half a dozen grifter groups I have donated thousands of dollars to over the years on this issue?
    That's a good question. They've been so quiet that I've forgotten about them.
    "I shall bring justice to Westeros. Every man shall reap what he has sown, from the highest lord to the lowest gutter rat. They have made my kingdom bleed, and I do not forget that."
    -Stannis Baratheon

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