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Thread: The Constitution Failed

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by r3volution 3.0 View Post
    Whoever enforces the law is necessarily above it, which is why the state cannot itself be bound by law.

    Constitutions end up being books of suggestions, to be followed or not at the pleasure of whoever controls the state.

    The US Constitution expresses many good ideas, but it isn't a useful means for seeing those ideas realized.
    There's two ways of looking at it. In the end the constitution failed but it did give us the most free nation for about 200 years.



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  3. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    There's two ways of looking at it. In the end the constitution failed but it did give us the most free nation for about 200 years.
    It still is a free nation, if you choose to live accordingly. It's just that, as Morpheus famously said, most people are not ready to unplug from the matrix and have, indeed, come to rely on it for their very existence. Brainwashing from cradle to grave is a powerful mind control tool.

    Today, I travel in my unregistered private car without license plates and without a license in one of the largest southeastern cities. Guess what happens when police (local PD, Sheriffs, State Troopers, etc) pull up behind me? NOTHING. Why? Because this still is a free nation and I never gave away my rights voluntarily. They know it and I know it. But few others do and most people, in effect, clamp the chains upon themselves then complain about the weight of the chains. Freedom-loving people who feel that freedom is completely gone should ask themselves a simple question: What have I done or am I doing that is restricting my own freedom? And am I doing them simply because someone else told me I should do them? How many times have I signed something and never asked myself "why am I signing this and do I comprehend what it is I am signing?"
    Last edited by devil21; 07-09-2020 at 11:55 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.



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  5. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    It still is a free nation, if you choose to live accordingly. It's just that, as Morpheus famously said, most people are not ready to unplug from the matrix and have, indeed, come to rely on it for their very existence. Brainwashing from cradle to grave is a powerful mind control tool.

    Today, I travel in my unregistered private car without license plates and without a license in one of the largest southeastern cities. Guess what happens when police (local PD, Sheriffs, State Troopers, etc) pull up behind me? NOTHING. Why? Because this still is a free nation and I never gave away my rights voluntarily. They know it and I know it. But few others do and most people, in effect, clamp the chains upon themselves then complain about the weight of the chains. Freedom-loving people who feel that freedom is completely gone should ask themselves a simple question: What have I done or am I doing that is restricting my own freedom? And am I doing them simply because someone else told me I should do them? How many times have I signed something and never asked myself "why am I signing this and do I comprehend what it is I am signing?"

    Out of + Rep.

    Me too.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Out of + Rep.

    Me too.
    Do ya? My man! It boils down to stop giving them legal jurisdiction by entering voluntary contracts with them. If you then otherwise live the libertarian life of harming no one else, common law jurisdiction (victim crimes) is not triggered. Suddenly the State loses a whole lot of power over your life.


    (Regarding your rep msg, no I haven't yet. Been focused elsewhere lately.)
    Last edited by devil21; 07-09-2020 at 06:39 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Do ya? My man! It boils down to stop giving them legal jurisdiction by entering voluntary contracts with them. If you then otherwise live the libertarian life of harming no one else, common law jurisdiction (victim crimes) is not triggered. Suddenly the State loses a whole lot of power over your life.


    (Regarding your rep msg, no I haven't yet. Been focused elsewhere lately.)
    Absolutely. And my bike hasn't been registered either in years. At the wing nights it makes for really great conversations, especially after I tell the cops I don't have an Avon sticker on the tank ;-)

    Get in touch he's super cool!
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    It still is a free nation, if you choose to live accordingly. It's just that, as Morpheus famously said, most people are not ready to unplug from the matrix and have, indeed, come to rely on it for their very existence. Brainwashing from cradle to grave is a powerful mind control tool.

    Today, I travel in my unregistered private car without license plates and without a license in one of the largest southeastern cities. Guess what happens when police (local PD, Sheriffs, State Troopers, etc) pull up behind me? NOTHING. Why? Because this still is a free nation and I never gave away my rights voluntarily. They know it and I know it. But few others do and most people, in effect, clamp the chains upon themselves then complain about the weight of the chains. Freedom-loving people who feel that freedom is completely gone should ask themselves a simple question: What have I done or am I doing that is restricting my own freedom? And am I doing them simply because someone else told me I should do them? How many times have I signed something and never asked myself "why am I signing this and do I comprehend what it is I am signing?"
    So what's your secret? Do you give off "liberty" vibrations or something? If my sticker was a week past due I'd instantly get pulled over when I used to live in Orlando. Since I moved to Alabama and now Tennessee I almost never get pulled over though. I think it more depends on where you live, not your vibrations.

  9. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    So what's your secret? Do you give off "liberty" vibrations or something? If my sticker was a week past due I'd instantly get pulled over when I used to live in Orlando. Since I moved to Alabama and now Tennessee I almost never get pulled over though. I think it more depends on where you live, not your vibrations.
    It starts with you.

    First, by having an expired sticker, you are showing your prior compliance, and that is when you will be more prone to harassment. Second, if you have a D/L, expired or not, and present it when being questioned about your expired sticker, you will be more prone to harassment.

    Take the sticker off. Do not carry "ID". If you are stopped/questioned, keep a level head and be polite. If/when more folks do the same, it will set a trend.

    As an Agorist, I weigh each and every cost; if I can save money by not buying permits/licenses/registration, and if I am forced to court, do I have sufficient funds to represent myself or hire a constitutional attorney? You need to answer whether that answer is Yes or No, and act accordingly. This is the only way to shift the paradigm so that eventually you/I/we can win.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  10. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    It starts with you.

    First, by having an expired sticker, you are showing your prior compliance, and that is when you will be more prone to harassment. Second, if you have a D/L, expired or not, and present it when being questioned about your expired sticker, you will be more prone to harassment.

    Take the sticker off. Do not carry "ID". If you are stopped/questioned, keep a level head and be polite. If/when more folks do the same, it will set a trend.

    As an Agorist, I weigh each and every cost; if I can save money by not buying permits/licenses/registration, and if I am forced to court, do I have sufficient funds to represent myself or hire a constitutional attorney? You need to answer whether that answer is Yes or No, and act accordingly. This is the only way to shift the paradigm so that eventually you/I/we can win.
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320
    So what's your secret? Do you give off "liberty" vibrations or something? If my sticker was a week past due I'd instantly get pulled over when I used to live in Orlando. Since I moved to Alabama and now Tennessee I almost never get pulled over though. I think it more depends on where you live, not your vibrations.
    PAF isn't wrong in his explanation but it's not the legal reasoning, which is ultimately what matters when dealing with police and courts. The simple fact is that police and courts gain legal jurisdiction over the car, and you, through your voluntary act of registering the car and requesting a drivers license. It's really that simple. Registering a car (or registering anything really) legally turns over ownership of whatever is registered to the entity that it is registered with! The car is placed under a state administered legal trust and the state is the trustee, thus becoming legal title holder. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trust_law So when you're tooling around in a car registered to the state, guess who's car it is? That is where their legal jurisdiction over the car originates from. The title that you have is called "color of title" and is a "usage" title but is not ownership. It is the state's property and they can regulate the use of the state's property! Same with the drivers license. You asked for it, received it and -signed- it, yes? By requesting and signing, you entered into a voluntary contract with the state to follow the motor vehicle code and any contract has penalties for failing to uphold your end of the contract, such as observing the speed limit. That is where police and courts gain legal jurisdiction over you physically. Both of these actions is why a police officer demands "license and registration, sir" FIRST. Both of those documents establish that the state has legal jurisdiction over both the car and you. Without those, there is no legal jurisdiction established and they can't touch you. They know it, too and will usually continue on.

    It's a little deeper than that, considering the name on the DL isn't you, but instead is a trust created by the state from your birth certificate, so understanding legal trusts is also very important. Then there's the part where contracts are two-way agreements and cops can be liable for failing to uphold their end of a contract. That's probably best saved for a later lesson.

    In my particular situation, I live in a state where I have NEVER asked for a drivers license, therefore I have never agreed to abide by the motor vehicle code. No legal jurisdiction over me physically. My car was purchased in a different state and was never registered in my current state. No legal jurisdiction over the car. Instead of a plate, I have a laminated legal notice in the same place as a plate that says "UNREGISTERED INSURED PRIVATE AUTOMOBILE - NCGS 25-1-308". Legal jurisdiction is not geographical, in that you aren't subject to speed limit rules (rules, not laws) simply because of where you happen to be at that moment. Jurisdiction does not exist simply because you exist. It is a legal construct. I do have insurance but that took some shopping around to secure, as most insurance companies won't deal with you if you don't have a license or aren't registered. The truth is that insurance companies insure the car on behalf of the owner, your state...

    Like I said, it really all boils down to asking yourself what it is you're doing that is bringing the chains upon yourself, especially in a country with a Bill of Rights like ours. Perhaps the answer is that you are unknowingly contracting away your rights simply because someone else (like your parents who made you get a license before you could take mom's car out for the night) told you that you must. You are also free to REMOVE yourself from open ended contracts, thus terminating the original voluntary action that gave them legal jurisdiction.
    Last edited by devil21; 07-11-2020 at 04:21 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  11. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    So what's your secret? Do you give off "liberty" vibrations or something? If my sticker was a week past due I'd instantly get pulled over when I used to live in Orlando. Since I moved to Alabama and now Tennessee I almost never get pulled over though. I think it more depends on where you live, not your vibrations.
    Some of us are lucky, others are not.

    I am in the unlucky category, just like you.

    Rode "dirty" for years, and got my head thumped, bike impounded, tossed in jail on more than one occasion.

    Fought a fifteen year running battle with the IRS and only copped a plea when it became clear I was going to prison if I did not.

    Not to mention that both my mariner's documents and pilot's documents would become liable to suspension/revocation for multiple convictions of that sort.

    I salute the people who can do it and get away with it, I really do.

    But I'm one of the unlucky ones who cannot...I was always the kid that got caught for something, while everybody else skated.
    There are only two things we should fight for.
    One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. - Smedley Darlington Butler

  12. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Some of us are lucky, others are not.

    I am in the unlucky category, just like you.

    Rode "dirty" for years, and got my head thumped, bike impounded, tossed in jail on more than one occasion.

    Fought a fifteen year running battle with the IRS and only copped a plea when it became clear I was going to prison if I did not.

    Not to mention that both my mariner's documents and pilot's documents would become liable to suspension/revocation for multiple convictions of that sort.

    I salute the people who can do it and get away with it, I really do.

    But I'm one of the unlucky ones who cannot...I was always the kid that got caught for something, while everybody else skated.
    Believe me, much of what I learned about how this commercial legal system works came from receiving those same hard lessons early on, also. But once I started to comprehend -how- the system works, I realized that most of those hard lessons came from choices that I (ignorantly) made. Choices that I didn't know why I was making them at the time and/or that other people told me I needed to make, without questioning why?

    Ever notice how if you "buy" a car at a dealership (lol, all you're buying is a debtor's contract), the dealer usually requires that they handle the "taxes, tags, license, registration"? That was implemented to try to avoid the state not gaining legal jurisdiction over a car by the buyer not registering it. Then it later became enshrined in legislation that state licensed dealers MUST do it. That is a perfect example of how the attorneys that make up most legislatures continue to grow the state's power over society. eta: And those attorneys love to put it right in our face every chance they get. I laugh when I see a license plate with "IN GOD WE TRUST" on it. Heck, even the county courthouse has, in giant letters etched into the stone at the entrance, "sufficient for high Trust". They refer to the Trust law system, not the traditional definition of the word "trust", meaning confidence. Learn Trust law to comprehend how the entire system works. Practically everything is legally a Trust structure and is based on the Vatican's Cestui Que trust law system (motor vehicles, banking, real estate, children, etc). https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cestui-que-vie.asp
    Last edited by devil21; 07-11-2020 at 08:45 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.



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  14. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    It starts with you.

    First, by having an expired sticker, you are showing your prior compliance, and that is when you will be more prone to harassment. Second, if you have a D/L, expired or not, and present it when being questioned about your expired sticker, you will be more prone to harassment.

    Take the sticker off. Do not carry "ID". If you are stopped/questioned, keep a level head and be polite. If/when more folks do the same, it will set a trend.

    As an Agorist, I weigh each and every cost; if I can save money by not buying permits/licenses/registration, and if I am forced to court, do I have sufficient funds to represent myself or hire a constitutional attorney? You need to answer whether that answer is Yes or No, and act accordingly. This is the only way to shift the paradigm so that eventually you/I/we can win.
    But how do I buy beer?

  15. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Some of us are lucky, others are not.

    I am in the unlucky category, just like you.

    Rode "dirty" for years, and got my head thumped, bike impounded, tossed in jail on more than one occasion.

    Fought a fifteen year running battle with the IRS and only copped a plea when it became clear I was going to prison if I did not.

    Not to mention that both my mariner's documents and pilot's documents would become liable to suspension/revocation for multiple convictions of that sort.

    I salute the people who can do it and get away with it, I really do.

    But I'm one of the unlucky ones who cannot...I was always the kid that got caught for something, while everybody else skated.
    Yeah, every time I've tried to "blow off the system" by not doing what the government requires it ends up way worse.

    I just try to stay under the radar and not attract their attention. The people I really feel sorry for are the successful business owners. They are the ones that by far attract the most unwanted attention from government. Owning a business, especially a big successful one, is like having a big chunk of red meat wrapped around your neck around a bunch of lions.

  16. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    Yeah, every time I've tried to "blow off the system" by not doing what the government requires it ends up way worse.

    I just try to stay under the radar and not attract their attention. The people I really feel sorry for are the successful business owners. They are the ones that by far attract the most unwanted attention from government. Owning a business, especially a big successful one, is like having a big chunk of red meat wrapped around your neck around a bunch of lions.
    Keep thinking about what I've written in this thread. You speak of "business owners"....but aren't you told to register a business with the state? Follow the logic with me here. If the registration of a car turns ownership over to the state then what does the registration of a business do? If registration of a car gives the state legal jurisdiction over the operation of the car, what does the registration of a business do? The first thing any court (the enforcement arm) must do is establish that it has jurisdiction over the person and the subject matter in order to proceed with any action. This pattern of jurisdiction via registration extends throughout our entire economic reality and is where the state (whether a 50 state or the feds or whoever) derives most of its legal authority over the day-to-day actions that most people engage in. The end result is that you literally are owner of nothing, with various governmental authorities owning everything. You think you "own" the car or the business but you do not. The collective STATE owns them, as trustees, thus controlling the operation of them.

    In a nutshell, this is the Rothschild's City of London money matrix implemented by their attorney footsoldiers, designed to keep us all on their plantation. And most, if not all, of it is based on your -voluntary- actions, which you perform because someone else told you that you must and you don't ever ask this simple question: "Well, why?"
    Last edited by devil21; 07-12-2020 at 10:04 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  17. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    But how do I buy beer?
    I'm not sure, I make my own wine ;-)

    Trade?
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  18. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    In a nutshell, this is the Rothschild's City of London money matrix implemented by their attorney footsoldiers, designed to keep us all on their plantation. And most, if not all, of it is based on your -voluntary- actions, which you perform because someone else told you that you must and you don't ever ask this simple question: "Well, why?"
    That's basically the definition of facism. The government permits you to "own" your business but they control almost all the operations of that business. So you don't really own it. As opposed to communism where you're not even permitted to own private property period.

  19. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    That's basically the definition of facism. The government permits you to "own" your business but they control almost all the operations of that business. So you don't really own it. As opposed to communism where you're not even permitted to own private property period.
    I'd define it definitely as much more a socialist system for the common man on its surface, at least when it come to property ownership, since the property is held by various governments. In the examples in this thread (registering a business or car), you are "equitable owner" but not title holder. An "equitable owner" is someone who has a financial interest in something but does not have ownership of it in any way. These days, there's not much difference between socialist and fascist though, since governments are actually corporations themselves now "Incorporated City of XXXXXX", "State of XXXXXXX (Inc.)", etc. Whether it's truly fascist or socialist or some unholy mix is dependent on your level of understanding the true nature of the money matrix and what changes the City of London decides to make over time. This Covid-19 thing is a period of "money matrix changes". Events like "Covid-19" are how major monetary and societal system control changes are made, which otherwise wouldn't be possible without the "crisis" as cover story.
    Last edited by devil21; 07-14-2020 at 09:53 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  20. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    Keep thinking about what I've written in this thread. You speak of "business owners"....but aren't you told to register a business with the state? Follow the logic with me here. If the registration of a car turns ownership over to the state then what does the registration of a business do? If registration of a car gives the state legal jurisdiction over the operation of the car, what does the registration of a business do? The first thing any court (the enforcement arm) must do is establish that it has jurisdiction over the person and the subject matter in order to proceed with any action. This pattern of jurisdiction via registration extends throughout our entire economic reality and is where the state (whether a 50 state or the feds or whoever) derives most of its legal authority over the day-to-day actions that most people engage in. The end result is that you literally are owner of nothing, with various governmental authorities owning everything. You think you "own" the car or the business but you do not. The collective STATE owns them, as trustees, thus controlling the operation of them.

    In a nutshell, this is the Rothschild's City of London money matrix implemented by their attorney footsoldiers, designed to keep us all on their plantation. And most, if not all, of it is based on your -voluntary- actions, which you perform because someone else told you that you must and you don't ever ask this simple question: "Well, why?"
    Yes, this is all true, but has no bearing at all where the rubber meets the road.

    The state says you must register.

    You refuse.

    If you are small enough fry, you skate, for a while.

    But if you are a large and successful business owner, you will have cops show up and they will shut you down for failure to comply.

    Look at what happened to VW over the diesel nonsense.

    Look at what's happening all over to businesses that refuse to comply with China virus nonsense.

    I hope the time comes that enough people refuse to comply across the board that real pushback can happen.
    There are only two things we should fight for.
    One is the defense of our homes and the other is the Bill of Rights. - Smedley Darlington Butler

  21. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Yes, this is all true, but has no bearing at all where the rubber meets the road.

    The state says you must register.

    You refuse.

    If you are small enough fry, you skate, for a while.

    But if you are a large and successful business owner, you will have cops show up and they will shut you down for failure to comply.

    Look at what happened to VW over the diesel nonsense.

    Look at what's happening all over to businesses that refuse to comply with China virus nonsense.

    I hope the time comes that enough people refuse to comply across the board that real pushback can happen.
    That's just fear talking. In every YT video about this sort of info, there's always random commenters writing how "you'll go to prison!1!!11" if you diverge from the engineered "normal". It's all engineered -voluntary- compliance based on fearmongering and ignorance. A lot of people have a vested interest in maintaining the system for various reasons, whether power, financial, religious, or otherwise (or all of the above). Fear and ignorance is how the money matrix is sustained.

    To your point: No doubt that the system has been designed to make it as difficult as possible to not somehow trigger some form of legal jurisdiction that's been quietly enacted over the last 150+ years, but at the same time people should ask themselves why is growing a business into a large business such a big deal in the first place? To collect more of those Rothschild legal money matrix funny bux in order to "buy" more cars and houses that you don't ever even own? Is that your purpose on the planet? To live a life of collecting things? A heavy philosophical question, for sure, but worth thinking about.

    (Btw, if something did happen to your business where you end up in court, the first thing your newly hired attorney does is consent to the court's jurisdiction on your behalf...)

    relevant: 12 Presumptions of Court
    https://anticorruptionsociety.wordpr...-of-the-court/
    Last edited by devil21; 07-14-2020 at 11:15 AM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.



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  23. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Yes, this is all true, but has no bearing at all where the rubber meets the road.

    The state says you must register.

    You refuse.

    If you are small enough fry, you skate, for a while.

    But if you are a large and successful business owner, you will have cops show up and they will shut you down for failure to comply.

    Look at what happened to VW over the diesel nonsense.

    Look at what's happening all over to businesses that refuse to comply with China virus nonsense.

    I hope the time comes that enough people refuse to comply across the board that real pushback can happen.
    This is probably what pisses me off the most. If you're a worker you can fly under the radar most of the time. If you own a business you've got a small target on your back. If you own a large, successful business you've got a massive target on your back. I hate "special" laws that target only large businesses, and there's probably thousands of them. Most people don't give a crap about them because those laws don't target them. Imagine if individuals had to comply with discrimination laws. "This is your third wife and they're all white. We're not going to permit you to marry any more white women."

    How long would the politician who passed that law stay in office?

  24. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Madison320 View Post
    This is probably what pisses me off the most. If you're a worker you can fly under the radar most of the time. If you own a business you've got a small target on your back. If you own a large, successful business you've got a massive target on your back. I hate "special" laws that target only large businesses, and there's probably thousands of them. Most people don't give a crap about them because those laws don't target them. Imagine if individuals had to comply with discrimination laws. "This is your third wife and they're all white. We're not going to permit you to marry any more white women."

    How long would the politician who passed that law stay in office?
    I don't know if your perception is accurate or not since I have a small business and little desire to turn it into a big business. But is the target based on having already registered your business with state, thus bringing the target onto your business? Or is your perception based on something you have no personal experience with, such as operating a business outside of the voluntary legal framework? Consider that voluntary actions like "registering" your business and "filing" IRS business organization forms is what triggers legal jurisdiction and required compliance with their rules. Have you tried operating a business without doing those sorts of voluntary actions and then see whether there really is a target on you? As a business operator, when you file paperwork with the IRS, for example, you're entering into yet another contract to follow their rules and act as an unpaid tax collector. I doubt there are really -any- larger business operators who have actually tried to run a liberty-oriented business model to see whether there is indeed a target or not. The fear of what may happen ensures voluntary compliance.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  25. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    I don't know if your perception is accurate or not since I have a small business and little desire to turn it into a big business. But is the target based on having already registered your business with state, thus bringing the target onto your business? Or is your perception based on something you have no personal experience with, such as operating a business outside of the voluntary legal framework? Consider that voluntary actions like "registering" your business and "filing" IRS business organization forms is what triggers legal jurisdiction and required compliance with their rules. Have you tried operating a business without doing those sorts of voluntary actions and then see whether there really is a target on you? As a business operator, when you file paperwork with the IRS, for example, you're entering into yet another contract to follow their rules and act as an unpaid tax collector. I doubt there are really -any- larger business operators who have actually tried to run a liberty-oriented business model to see whether there is indeed a target or not. The fear of what may happen ensures voluntary compliance.
    I've never owned a business and I have great respect for people that do. I think business owners are the true persecuted minority (as Ayn Rand would say). I'm basing that on all the laws that are specifically targeted at big business owners.

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