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Thread: Trump police executive order seeks to limit chokeholds

  1. #1

    Trump police executive order seeks to limit chokeholds

    President Trump on Tuesday signed an executive order on police reform amid a broad national debate sparked by the police killing of George Floyd in Minneapolis, which has itself led to heightened calls to address racial justice issues in the United States.

    The order amounted to Trump’s most concrete action to date after he faced criticism for failing to address underlying causes of racial inequality and police brutality.

    The measure prioritizes federal funding for police departments that embrace de-escalation tactics, including a ban on chokeholds outside of instances where an officer’s life is in danger, and improves the government’s ability to track officers with a history of excessive force complaints.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...life-in-danger

    So Trump supports defunding the police if they don't reform. Interesting.



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  3. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by revgen View Post
    So Trump supports defunding the police if they don't reform. Interesting.
    You used the wrong side's talking point, prepare for angry tears from Trumpkins.
    "The one permanent emotion of the inferior man is fear - fear of the unknown, the complex, the inexplicable. What he wants above everything else is safety."
    H. L. Mencken

    Quote Originally Posted by Contumacious View Post
    Yes, indeed , we will never be able to prove fraud.

  4. #3
    He will get no credit for this whatsoever. The right needs to stop trying to appeal to the left. It's a religious war, not a positional difference.
    NeoReactionary. American High Tory.

    The counter-revolution will not be televised.

  5. #4
    This isn't going to do much. His executive order should have been to demilitarize the police, abolish all gun laws, and end the War on Drugs. Do those three things and I guarantee you many problems are going to be solved.
    "Perhaps one of the most important accomplishments of my administration is minding my own business."

    Calvin Coolidge

  6. #5
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

    Since when is Police management a Federal issue? And since when does an executive order have any effect on Police? Can Trump now legislate and rewrite the Constitution from the Whitehouse?
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  7. #6
    I guess trump can require no federal police choke anyone .

  8. #7
    There are a lot of federal police . More than people think , Indian Bureau ( Dept of Interior ) Fed Res police , Fed Res
    swat teams (SRT ) , FBI , DEA , Fed Marsh , BATFE etc etc

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    I guess trump can require no federal police choke anyone .
    Yeah, I suppose it probably is just Federal employees. So it wouldn't apply to any city police forces or Sheriff’s departments.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaleoLibertarian View Post
    He will get no credit for this whatsoever. The right needs to stop trying to appeal to the left. It's a religious war, not a positional difference.
    Saw a clip of CNN today of them criticizing Trump for walking down a ramp too slowly, and questioned his health. Looked like a piece from the Onion.
    A savage barbaric tribal society where thugs parade the streets and illegally assault and murder innocent civilians, yeah that is the alternative to having police. Oh wait, that is the police

    We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
    - Edward R. Murrow

    ...I think we have moral obligations to disobey unjust laws, because non-cooperation with evil is as much as a moral obligation as cooperation with good. - MLK Jr.

    How to trigger a liberal: "I didn't get vaccinated."

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by revgen View Post
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...life-in-danger

    So Trump supports defunding the police if they don't reform. Interesting.
    Nope,,
    The measure prioritizes federal funding for police departments
    I read it as increased Federal Funding and Control over local police.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

    Since when is Police management a Federal issue? And since when does an executive order have any effect on Police? Can Trump now legislate and rewrite the Constitution from the Whitehouse?
    1 Police reform their use of force to some extent
    2 Federal dollars stop being spent of local police

    I don't really see a problem with either option.

    Trump is NOT legislating or amending the Constitution, the local police can continue to use excessive force and give up federal dollars.
    If you want federal support for local police to end entirely then talk to Congress, Trump is doing the best he can with the executive branch.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Nope,,


    I read it as increased Federal Funding and Control over local police.
    It's not increased, Trump can't increase it by himself, it's just altering where the same amount goes.

    1 Police reform their use of force to some extent
    2 Federal dollars stop being spent of local police

    I don't really see a problem with either option.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by ThePaleoLibertarian View Post
    He will get no credit for this whatsoever. The right needs to stop trying to appeal to the left. It's a religious war, not a positional difference.
    It's not just the left that is concerned with excessive use of force by the police.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by oyarde View Post
    I guess trump can require no federal police choke anyone .
    Why does the American police even have the choke tactic? i would understand the American SWAT team but normal police forces?

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    1 Police reform their use of force to some extent
    2 Federal dollars stop being spent of local police

    I don't really see a problem with either option.

    Trump is NOT legislating or amending the Constitution, the local police can continue to use excessive force and give up federal dollars.
    If you want federal support for local police to end entirely then talk to Congress, Trump is doing the best he can with the executive branch.
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...fe-communities
    The executive order released following the president’s remarks instructs the Justice Department to allocate discretionary grant funding to police departments
    I read it as More Funding and Control (Via Funding)..

    and the Militarized Police State needs more than Choke Training..

    The Police Need a Short Leash and tight collar.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by AngryCanadian View Post
    Why does the American police even have the choke tactic? i would understand the American SWAT team but normal police forces?
    Learned from Zionists Occupiers in the Middle East.

    https://israelpalestinenews.org/minn...eck-restraint/

    2 yrs ago
    https://www.aa.com.tr/en/americas/tw...israel/1327229
    Last edited by pcosmar; 06-16-2020 at 09:43 PM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Maybe the American police do indeed need reforming. I didn't hear anything about this at all. In Canada alot of police officers would be wearing cameras on their uniforms.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...fe-communities


    I read it as More Funding and Control (Via Funding)..

    and the Militarized Police State needs more than Choke Training..

    The Police Need a Short Leash and tight collar.
    The money is already being given out, this just limits it.

    Read the actual EO:

    The Attorney General shall, as appropriate and consistent with applicable law, allocate Department of Justice discretionary grant funding only to those State and local law enforcement agencies that have sought or are in the process of seeking appropriate credentials from a reputable independent credentialing body certified by the Attorney General...


    ...the State or local law enforcement agency's use-of-force policies prohibit the use of chokeholds -- a physical maneuver that restricts an individual's ability to breathe for the purposes of incapacitation -- except in those situations where the use of deadly force is allowed by law...





    https://www.scribd.com/document/4658...der#from_embed

    NO new money is allocated anywhere in the EO.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The money is already being given out, this just limits it.

    Read the actual EO:
    OK,
    Just did..

    The Union (police union) will love it.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  23. #20

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    1 Police reform their use of force to some extent
    2 Federal dollars stop being spent of local police

    I don't really see a problem with either option.

    Trump is NOT legislating or amending the Constitution, the local police can continue to use excessive force and give up federal dollars.
    If you want federal support for local police to end entirely then talk to Congress, Trump is doing the best he can with the executive branch.
    Holding back Federal dollars is now a tradition, I just missed where that was authorized in the Constitution.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #22
    Why are local police forces even getting federal dollars. Federal money is nothing but extortion and bribery. First to militarize and now this.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by misterx View Post
    Why are local police forces even getting federal dollars. Federal money is nothing but extortion and bribery. First to militarize and now this.
    That's the screwing behind all this police stuff. The Feds are now firmly planting their feet deep into LOCAL policing and the masses cheer as they lose another local issue to the DC swamp. Trump writing EOs directing a local cop on what tactics they can and can't use? Surely this will end well Problem>reaction>solution. Feds have controlled equipment and money and now they'll control tactics and search protocol. Nowhere are such things authorized in the Constitution.
    Last edited by devil21; 06-17-2020 at 07:22 PM.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It's not just the left that is concerned with excessive use of force by the police.
    That's not really true.

    It's maybe 3% libertarians who don't like police and every so often normiecons pretend to care and capitulate. Like what was done here. The rest are leftists.
    NeoReactionary. American High Tory.

    The counter-revolution will not be televised.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by revgen View Post
    https://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...life-in-danger

    So Trump supports defunding the police if they don't reform. Interesting.
    Only federal police should receive federal funding. When police departments are paid by the people they serve, they will serve them better. Federal funding comes with federal mandates that are not in the interest of the people they serve.

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by dean.engelhardt View Post
    Only federal police should receive federal funding. When police departments are paid by the people they serve, they will serve them better. Federal funding comes with federal mandates that are not in the interest of the people they serve.
    I agree. But that's up to congress. The money has already been appropriated. Trump is just prioritizing where it goes.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

    Since when is Police management a Federal issue? And since when does an executive order have any effect on Police? Can Trump now legislate and rewrite the Constitution from the Whitehouse?
    Police do get federal money. Withholding that money for policy reasons is constitutional. (Questionable if the funding itself is constitutional). Though that should be done through legislation rather than executive order. Still, Obama demanded gender neutral bathrooms through executive order.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Holding back Federal dollars is now a tradition, I just missed where that was authorized in the Constitution.
    So...you think once the federal government starts giving states money it is constitutionally bound not to stop giving that money? What a government giveth it can taketh away. You might as well say "The constitution doesn't authorize cutting off foreign aid."
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    That's the screwing behind all this police stuff. The Feds are now firmly planting their feet deep into LOCAL policing and the masses cheer as they lose another local issue to the DC swamp. Trump writing EOs directing a local cop on what tactics they can and can't use? Surely this will end well Problem>reaction>solution. Feds have controlled equipment and money and now they'll control tactics and search protocol. Nowhere are such things authorized in the Constitution.
    + REP to you and @pcosmar

    @Cap wanted to know if it requires a house falling on a head before things start to make sense. Me thinks it would require the earth to explode before folks around here begin to think "gee, maybe".
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    An Agorist Primer

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior_of_Freedom View Post
    Saw a clip of CNN today of them criticizing Trump for walking down a ramp too slowly, and questioned his health. Looked like a piece from the Onion.
    Well to be fair Trump and Fox questioned Hillary's physical health and everybody who's honest questions Biden's mental health.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

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