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Thread: Biggest Transfer of Wealth in U.S. History? UK AstraZeneca gets $1.2 BILLION for Vaccine

  1. #1

    Biggest Transfer of Wealth in U.S. History? UK AstraZeneca gets $1.2 BILLION for Vaccine

    Moderna COVID Vaccine Trial Sees 20% “Serious” Injury Rate as U.S. Invests BILLIONS More on Experimental COVID Vaccines



    On Monday this week (May 18, 2020) Moderna put out a press release stating that they had seen positive results to the first phase of their COVID-19 vaccine trial.

    The news sent their stock prices surging, as the pharmaceutical company is working with Dr. Anthony Fauci and the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases which Fauci heads.

    However, that all changed on Tuesday, May 19, 2020, when Stat News published an article stating that Moderna did not produce any data to back their claims.

    Heavy hearts soared Monday with news that Moderna’s Covid-19 vaccine candidate — the frontrunner in the American market — seemed to be generating an immune response in Phase 1 trial subjects. The company’s stock valuation also surged, hitting $29 billion, an astonishing feat for a company that currently sells zero products.

    But was there good reason for so much enthusiasm? Several vaccine experts asked by STAT concluded that, based on the information made available by the Cambridge, Mass.-based company, there’s really no way to know how impressive — or not — the vaccine may be.

    While Moderna blitzed the media, it revealed very little information — and most of what it did disclose were words, not data.

    Even the figures the company did release don’t mean much on their own, because critical information — effectively the key to interpreting them — was withheld.
    Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. also published his own observation on the little bit of data that was disclosed via his Instagram Account:

    CATASTROPHE! Moderna Vaccine has 20% “Serious” Injury Rate in High Dose Group

    Moderna’s cheery press release this morning, the clinical trial results for its groundbreaking COVID vaccine could not be much worse.

    The vaccine, developed and championed by Anthony Fauci and financed by Bill Gates, used an experimental MRNA technology that the two men hoped would allow rapid deployment to meet President Trump’s ambitions “warp speed” time line.

    Dr Fauci was so confident of his shot’s safety that he waved ferret and primate studies (Moderna suspiciously reported no health data from its mouse studies.)

    That appears to have been a mistake. Three of the 15 human guinea pigs in the high dose cohort (250 mcg)suffered a “serious adverse event” within 43 days of receiving Moderna’s jab.

    Moderna did not release its clinical trial study or raw data, but its press release, which was freighted with inconsistencies acknowledged that three volunteers developed Grade 3 systemic events defined by the FDA as “Preventing daily activity and requiring medical intervention.”

    Moderna allowed only exceptionally healthy volunteers to participate in the study. A vaccine with those reaction rates could cause grave injuries in 1.5 billion humans if administered to “every person on earth”.

    That is the threshold that Gates has established for ending the global lockdown. Moderna did not explain why it reported positive antibody tests for only eight participants.

    These outcomes are particularly disappointing because the most hazardous hurdle for the inoculation is still ahead; challenging participants with wild COVID infection.

    Past attempts at developing COVID vaccines have always faltered at this stage as both humans and animals achieved robust antibody response then sickened and died when exposed to the wild virus.

    Moderna’s press announcement heralded “Positive Interim Phase 1 findings”.

    I have forwarded that claim to my colleagues in securities law; FTC rules restrict the amount of lipstick public companies may slather on bad donkeys.
    The U.S. Government has invested about half a million dollars in the Moderna experimental COVID vaccine so far.

    Now today, Thursday May 21st, while record numbers of Americans in the millions and climbing are without jobs, UK drug company AstraZeneca has announced that it has received $1.2 BILLION from the U.S. Government to receive 300 million vaccine doses starting this fall of a COVID-19 vaccine that is still in development and not even approved yet.

    AstraZeneca scores $1.2B from U.S., signs up to deliver hundreds of millions of COVID-19 vaccines

    Excerpts:

    Only days after Moderna reported positive early results for its potential COVID-19 vaccine, AstraZeneca has stolen the spotlight back. On Thursday, the U.K. drug giant scored a $1.2 billion contribution from the United States for development, production and delivery of its potential shot starting this fall.

    The vaccine, developed by the University of Oxford’s Jenner Institute, contains the genetic material of SARS-CoV-2 spike protein. It isn’t replicating, so it can’t cause an ongoing infection in recipients, AZ says. The company hopes the vaccine can deliver a strong immune response from one dose by triggering the body to produce the spike protein and attack the novel coronavirus upon infection.

    AstraZeneca has signed up to deliver 400 million doses through its initial supply agreements. The United States deal—through the HHS’ BARDA agency—follows a U.K. pact unveiled Sunday for 100 million total doses. That gives the U.S. delivery of about 300 million vaccine doses starting this fall.

    BARDA, the Biomedical Advanced Research and Development Authority, says the money is “intended to help enable the Operation Warp Speed goal of making doses available by the end of 2020 and additional doses by the end” of the first quarter of 2021. President Donald Trump unveiled the “Warp Speed” program at a Rose Garden event late last week.
    As Health Impact News reported last week, President Trump appointed Dr. Moncef Slaoui, the former chairman of GlaxoSmithKline’s vaccines division, as Chief Adviser for Operation Warp Speed, the administration’s project to fast-track a COVID-19 vaccine.

    Dr. Slaoui is yet another Big Pharma leader Trump has added to his medical advisors with ties to Bill Gates, and has previously worked on vaccine development with his other medical advisors, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, Dr. Deborah Birx, and CDC Director Robert Redfield who all worked together with Bill Gates in the past to develop an HIV vaccine. See:

    Trump Mobilizes Military to Deliver Coronavirus Vaccine – Appoints Another Bill Gates Funded Big Pharma Exec as Chief Military Advisor

    While the future of a COVID-19 vaccine is still uncertain, one thing is very clear: a vast majority of the wealth of the United States is being transferred to Big Pharma as thousands of businesses are now closing down due to the COVID-19 scare while the U.S. Government gives hundreds of BILLIONS (maybe over $1 TRILLION now??) to Big Pharma.
    Last edited by Created4; 05-21-2020 at 03:23 PM.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)



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  3. #2
    AstraZeneca:

    2020

    In February 2020, AstraZeneca agreed to sublicense its global rights (except Europe, Canada and Israel) to Movantik (naloxegol) to Redhill Biopharma.

    In March 2020, the company announced that it would be donating PPE, including 9 million face masks, to help support various international health organisations mitigating the COVID-19 pandemic. In April, the Chief Executive, Pascal Soriot, reported that the company was working with GlaxoSmithKline and the University of Cambridge to develop a new laboratory capable of conducting 30,000 Covid-19 tests per day. The company also announced plans for a clinical trial to assess the potential use of Calquence in the treatment of Covid-19.


    Controversies

    Seroquel

    In April 2010 AstraZeneca settled a qui tam lawsuit brought by Stefan P. Kruszewski for $520 million to settle allegations that the company defrauded Medicare, Medicaid, and other government-funded health care programs in connection with its marketing and promotional practices for the blockbuster atypical antipsychotic, Seroquel. According to the settlement agreement, AstraZeneca targeted its illegal marketing of the anti-psychotic Seroquel towards doctors who do not typically treat schizophrenia or bipolar disorder, such as physicians who treat the elderly, primary care physicians, pediatric and adolescent physicians, and in long-term care facilities and prisons.

    In March 2011, AstraZeneca settled a lawsuit in the United States totalling $68.5 million to be divided up to 38 states.

    Nexium

    The company's most commercially successful medication is esomeprazole (Nexium). The primary uses are treatment of gastroesophageal reflux disease, treatment and maintenance of erosive esophagitis, treatment of duodenal ulcers caused by Helicobacter pylori, prevention of gastric ulcers in those on chronic NSAID therapy, and treatment of gastrointestinal ulcers associated with Crohn's disease. When it is manufactured the result is a mixture of two mirror-imaged molecules, R and S. Two years before the omeprazole patent expired, AstraZeneca patented S-omeprazole in pure form, pointing out that since some people metabolise R-omeprazole slowly, pure S-omeprazole treatment would give higher dose efficiency and less variation between individuals.[86] In March 2001, the company began to market Nexium, as it would a brand new drug.

    The (R)-enantiomer of omeprazole is metabolized exclusively by the enzyme CYP2C19, which is expressed in very low amounts by 3% of the population. Treated with a normal dose of the enantiomeric mixture, these persons will experience blood levels five-times higher than those with normal CYP2C19 production. In contrast, esomeprazole is metabolized by both CYP2C19 and CYP3A4, providing less-variable drug exposure. While omeprazole is approved only at doses of up to 20 mg for the treatment of gastroesophageal reflux, esomeprazole is approved for doses up to 40 mg.

    In 2007, Marcia Angell, former editor-in-chief of the New England Journal of Medicine and a lecturer in social medicine at the Harvard Medical School, said in Stern, a German-language weekly newsmagazine, that AstraZeneca's scientists had misrepresented their research on the drug's efficiency, saying "Instead of using presumably comparable doses [of each drug], the company's scientists used Nexium in higher dosages. They compared 20 and 40 mg Nexium with 20 mg Prilosec. With the cards having been marked in that way, Nexium looked like an improvement – which however was only small and shown in only two of the three studies."

    Study

    In 2004, University of Minnesota research participant Dan Markingson committed suicide while enrolled in an industry-sponsored pharmaceutical trial comparing three FDA-approved atypical antipsychotics: Seroquel (quetiapine), Zyprexa (olanzapine), and Risperdal (risperidone). University of Minnesota Professor of Bioethics Carl Elliott noted that Markingson was enrolled in the study against the wishes of his mother, Mary Weiss, and that he was forced to choose between enrolling in the study or being involuntarily committed to a state mental institution. A 2005 FDA investigation cleared the university. Nonetheless, controversy around the case has continued. A Mother Jones article resulted in a group of university faculty members sending a public letter to the university Board of Regents urging an external investigation into Markingson's death.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AstraZeneca
    Last edited by PAF; 05-21-2020 at 03:14 PM.

  4. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Moderna COVID Vaccine Trial Sees 20% “Serious” Injury Rate as U.S. Invests BILLIONS More on Experimental COVID Vaccines



    On Monday this week (May 18, 2020) Moderna put out a press release stating that they had seen positive results to the first phase of their COVID-19 vaccine trial.

    The news sent their stock prices surging, as the pharmaceutical company is working with Dr. Anthony Fauci and the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases which Fauci heads.

    However, that all changed on Tuesday, May 19, 2020, when Stat News published an article stating that Moderna did not produce any data to back their claims.



    Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. also published his own observation on the little bit of data that was disclosed via his Instagram Account:

    CATASTROPHE! Moderna Vaccine has 20% “Serious” Injury Rate in High Dose Group



    The U.S. Government has invested about half a million dollars in the Moderna experimental COVID vaccine so far.

    Now today, Thursday May 21st, while record numbers of Americans in the millions and climbing are without jobs, UK drug company AstraZeneca has announced that it has received $1.2 BILLION from the U.S. Government to receive 300 million vaccine doses starting this fall of a COVID-19 vaccine that is still in development and not even approved yet.

    AstraZeneca scores $1.2B from U.S., signs up to deliver hundreds of millions of COVID-19 vaccines

    Excerpts:



    As Health Impact News reported last week, President Trump appointed Dr. Moncef Slaoui, the former chairman of GlaxoSmithKline’s vaccines division, as Chief Adviser for Operation Warp Speed, the administration’s project to fast-track a COVID-19 vaccine.

    Dr. Slaoui is yet another Big Pharma leader Trump has added to his medical advisors with ties to Bill Gates, and has previously worked on vaccine development with his other medical advisors, including Dr. Anthony Fauci, Dr. Deborah Birx, and CDC Director Robert Redfield who all worked together with Bill Gates in the past to develop an HIV vaccine. See:

    Trump Mobilizes Military to Deliver Coronavirus Vaccine – Appoints Another Bill Gates Funded Big Pharma Exec as Chief Military Advisor

    While the future of a COVID-19 vaccine is still uncertain, one thing is very clear: a vast majority of the wealth of the United States is being transferred to Big Pharma as thousands of businesses are now closing down due to the COVID-19 scare while the U.S. Government gives hundreds of BILLIONS (maybe over $1 TRILLION now??) to Big Pharma.
    The United States has secured almost a third of the first 1 billion doses planned for AstraZeneca’s experimental COVID-19 vaccine by pledging up to $1.2 billion, as world powers scramble for medicines to get their economies back to work.

    More at: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN22X0J9


    It's a pledge.
    And since there will never be a vaccine they will never get the money.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  5. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The United States has secured almost a third of the first 1 billion doses planned for AstraZeneca’s experimental COVID-19 vaccine by pledging up to $1.2 billion, as world powers scramble for medicines to get their economies back to work.

    More at: https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN22X0J9


    It's a pledge.
    And since there will never be a vaccine they will never get the money.
    100% WRONG. Again.

    From your own link:

    The U.S. deal allows a late-stage, or Phase III, clinical trial of the vaccine with 30,000 people in the United States.
    The money they are receiving pays for its development in Phase III, which means they get the money whether or not there is an actual vaccine, just as all the other Big Pharma companies they have given money to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    And since there will never be a vaccine
    This belief belongs in the religion forum, and moderators need to create a new topic in the Religious Forum for the "Trump Cult."
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    100% WRONG. Again.

    From your own link:



    The money they are receiving pays for its development in Phase III, which means they get the money whether or not there is an actual vaccine, just as all the other Big Pharma companies they have given money to.



    This belief belongs in the religion forum, and moderators need to create a new topic in the Religious Forum for the "Trump Cult."
    They will proceed with the trial because they have a guaranteed customer if they develop a vaccine.

    But there will be no vaccine and they will not be paid.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    But there will be no vaccine and they will not be paid.
    That's your belief. Show one source where this is documented.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    That's your belief. Show one source where this is documented.
    Show me proof they got the money.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Show me proof they got the money.
    Already did. It is for Phase III trials, not conditioned upon a finished vaccine. This is common. These companies won't spend their own money for the trials when it is fast tracked like this.

    The Phase III trials are happening whether it results in a vaccine or not.

    YOU are the one saying they are not getting the money before a vaccine is produced, which NONE of these press releases are saying, so the burden of proof is on you to prove your statement.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Already did. It is for Phase III trials, not conditioned upon a finished vaccine. This is common. These companies won't spend their own money for the trials when it is fast tracked like this.

    The Phase III trials are happening whether it results in a vaccine or not.

    YOU are the one saying they are not getting the money before a vaccine is produced, which NONE of these press releases are saying, so the burden of proof is on you to prove your statement.
    That's not proof, it's your opinion.

    If they already got the money it wouldn't say "pledging UP TO" there would be a definite amount that they got not that was pledged.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That's not proof, it's your opinion.

    If they already got the money it wouldn't say "pledging UP TO" there would be a definite amount that they got not that was pledged.
    No, it is not my opinion. I am quoting press releases. You are making stuff up in your mind once again. The money will probably go out in stages as they proceed through Phase III trials, and if they need more and the studies look promising they will probably get more, but there is nothing stating they will not get the money unless a vaccine is created.

    That is a figment of your imagination, and you have supplied no proof.

    I can't argue with religious beliefs.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  13. #11
    F that if Dershowitz tries to force me on the vaccine, hes gonna get Arburied
    @Ehanced_Deficit's real agenda on RPF :
    DNCIA-SB (Soros, Brennan)
    CLINTON-PELO-SCHIFF
    NYT-CNN-SOCIALIST

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    No, it is not my opinion. I am quoting press releases. You are making stuff up in your mind once again. The money will probably go out in stages as they proceed through Phase III trials, and if they need more and the studies look promising they will probably get more, but there is nothing stating they will not get the money unless a vaccine is created.

    That is a figment of your imagination, and you have supplied no proof.

    I can't argue with religious beliefs.
    Press releases are not proof and your opinion that they wouldn't proceed unless they were actually in possession of the money is not proof.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  15. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Press releases are not proof and your opinion that they wouldn't proceed unless they were actually in possession of the money is not proof.
    Prove your statement that they won't get the money unless they produce a vaccine. You made the claim, you must prove it. You obviously can't.

    The government has a website tracking this funding:

    https://www.medicalcountermeasures.g...s/COVID19.aspx

    BARDA’S RAPIDLY EXPANDING COVID-19
    MEDICAL COUNTERMEASURE PORTFOLIO
    BARDA has a proven track record of responding to pandemics and developing lifesaving medical countermeasures. We are rapidly executing new partnerships and building a robust COVID-19 MCM Portfolio because Americans deserve to have safe, effective medical products.
    click on Astrazeneca

    Description:
    The AZD1222 vaccine consists of the replication-deficient simian adenovirus vector ChAdOx1, containing the structural surface glycoprotein (Spike protein) antigen of the SARS CoV-2 (nCoV-19)


    Unique Impact:
    The late stage clinical testing of the vaccine candidate in parallel with developing large scale manufacturing is intended to help enable the Operation Warp Speed goal of making doses available by the end of 2020 and additional doses by the end of 1Q2021.


    Award Amount: $1,200,000,000.00
    Funding is for "late stage clinical testing of the vaccine candidate in parallel with developing large scale manufacturing is intended to help enable the Operation Warp Speed goal of making doses available by the end of 2020 and additional doses by the end of 1Q2021."

    OFFICIAL Government source.

    If you want to belief they won't get the money unless a vaccine is produced, then provide the proof of your belief. (You obviously can't, so we're done here.)
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  16. #14
    Also, Fauci has a history of doing this, having received BILLIONS to develop first an HIV vaccine, and later a Zika vaccine, neither of which ever hit the market.

    But that didn't stop them from collecting the government money to develop a vaccine to save the word from [fill in the blank with your favorite epidemic/pandemic].

    Dr. Fauci’s History in Spending Billions of Government Funds on Vaccine Research with Little to Show for it
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Prove your statement that they won't get the money unless they produce a vaccine. You made the claim, you must prove it. You obviously can't.

    The government has a website tracking this funding:

    https://www.medicalcountermeasures.g...s/COVID19.aspx



    click on Astrazeneca



    Funding is for "late stage clinical testing of the vaccine candidate in parallel with developing large scale manufacturing is intended to help enable the Operation Warp Speed goal of making doses available by the end of 2020 and additional doses by the end of 1Q2021."

    OFFICIAL Government source.

    If you want to belief they won't get the money unless a vaccine is produced, then provide the proof of your belief. (You obviously can't, so we're done here.)
    Thank you for the link.
    I clicked on the "View Announcement" link there and found this:

    Under this public-private partnership, BARDA can provide up to $1.2 billion to support, in parallel, advanced clinical studies, vaccine manufacturing technology transfer, process development, scaled-up manufacturing, and other development activities.
    Please note the word "CAN"

    Early milestones enable BARDA and AstraZeneca to determine how the program progresses forward.

    So they have not been given all the money and maybe not any money.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Also, Fauci has a history of doing this, having received BILLIONS to develop first an HIV vaccine, and later a Zika vaccine, neither of which ever hit the market.

    But that didn't stop them from collecting the government money to develop a vaccine to save the word from [fill in the blank with your favorite epidemic/pandemic].

    Dr. Fauci’s History in Spending Billions of Government Funds on Vaccine Research with Little to Show for it
    Then this is not anything new and it isn't Trump's doing, but Trump would be crucified if he interfered.


    There will not be a successful vaccine.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Then this is not anything new and it isn't Trump's doing, but Trump would be crucified if he interfered.


    There will not be a successful vaccine.
    You have a habit of saying this won't that won't, but here we are. You haven't learned after USMCA, Omnibus, "emergency spending bill". And now Fauci, Slaoui, Moderna, all tied to Gates. But you will try to convince us "Operation Warp Speed" is somehow 10D Chess. And "Vote Trump!".

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Thank you for the link.
    I clicked on the "View Announcement" link there and found this:



    Please note the word "CAN"




    So they have not been given all the money and maybe not any money.
    Nice way to try and save face. But this is not what you said. You said:

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    But there will be no vaccine and they will not be paid.
    They will be paid whether there is a vaccine or not, because they are being paid for clinical trials.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Then this is not anything new and it isn't Trump's doing, but Trump would be crucified if he interfered.
    Straw man argument. I never said it was "Trump's doing." I am proving that it is THE HABIT OF THE US GOVERNMENT TO FUND VACCINE TRIALS WHETHER A VACCINE IS EVER DEVELOPED OR NOT.


    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    There will not be a successful vaccine.
    Depends on how you define "successful."

    It is ALREADY SUCCESSFUL because the U.S. Government has paid HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS TO DEVELOP it.

    And that is what the OP is about, which you have tried (unsuccessfully) to hijack for your Trump religion.

    The point is MILLIONS OF PEOPLE ARE WITHOUT JOBs, THOUSANDS OF BUSINESSES ARE CLOSING DOWN, and Trump keeps giving BILLIONS to Big Pharma.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Nice way to try and save face. But this is not what you said. You said:



    They will be paid whether there is a vaccine or not, because they are being paid for clinical trials.
    Nobody is saving face (unless that is what you are trying to do), you provided new information and I added to it and then stated what the situation was.

    When they fail at one of the milestones (and they will, corona virus vaccines always do) they will cease receiving any money.
    We don't know how much if any they have already been given.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    you provided new information
    LOL. I didn't provide any new information. I just supplied a link (which is also in the OP article) to prove what all the major networks reported today.

    Take your religion to the religion forum where it belongs.
    Last edited by Created4; 05-21-2020 at 06:34 PM.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Straw man argument. I never said it was "Trump's doing." I am proving that it is THE HABIT OF THE US GOVERNMENT TO FUND VACCINE TRIALS WHETHER A VACCINE IS EVER DEVELOPED OR NOT.




    Depends on how you define "successful."

    It is ALREADY SUCCESSFUL because the U.S. Government has paid HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS TO DEVELOP it.

    And that is what the OP is about, which you have tried (unsuccessfully) to hijack for your Trump religion.

    The point is MILLIONS OF PEOPLE ARE WITHOUT JOBs, THOUSANDS OF BUSINESSES ARE CLOSING DOWN, and Trump keeps giving BILLIONS to Big Pharma.
    Some here want to make this about Trump, if you do not then that is good.

    The government has not paid "Hundreds of billions", in this case they have not paid 1.2 billion yet and may never pay that much.
    And I suspect that the agencies involved would have spent their budget on other things anyway, they usually do.
    We certainly need to get rid of the agencies and cut the budget but there is not something new going on.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Some here want to make this about Trump, if you do not then that is good.

    The government has not paid "Hundreds of billions", in this case they have not paid 1.2 billion yet and may never pay that much.
    And I suspect that the agencies involved would have spent their budget on other things anyway, they usually do.
    We certainly need to get rid of the agencies and cut the budget but there is not something new going on.
    The HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS is to Big Pharma, and does not include just vaccines, but ventilators, masks, worthless tests, hospitals, hospital ships, etc., etc.

    Transfer of wealth as the OP states, and yes, this IS about Trump. How could it not be??
    Last edited by Created4; 05-21-2020 at 06:42 PM.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    this IS about Trump. How could it not be??
    Because he tried to downplay it and limit the reaction but he can't buck the system completely or he will be removed from office, the Demoncrats and RINOs have already been talking about impeaching him for the administration's response to the Wuhan Flu.

    Trump has been pushing a cheap and easy cure.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Because he tried to downplay it and limit the reaction but he can't buck the system completely or he will be removed from office, the Demoncrats and RINOs have already been talking about impeaching him for the administration's response to the Wuhan Flu.

    Trump has been pushing a cheap and easy cure.
    Thank you. That is the most honest thing you have written so far in this thread, and I suspect there is some truth to it.

    But I disagree. As Ron Paul's broadcast mentioned today, 600 physicians sent Trump a letter explaining that the lockdowns are causing more health problems then COVID ever could.

    If Trump had stuck to his promises of reforming Big Pharma instead of catering to them, he would have a LOT more support today than he does.

    Those 600 physicians claim they represent 1000s, and all the years I have been covering and reporting about how corrupt Big Pharma is, I have constantly featured the few brave doctors who are willing to come forward and expose the corruption, often at the risk of their own careers, and sometimes even their own lives (look up Dr. Bradstreet for example.)

    For example, his first choice for the FDA after he was elected was Jim O'Neill, an associate at Peter Thiel. He was pro-small businesses, and he was also pro-marijuana.

    He wouldn't have been my first choice, but he at least was not an industry insider.

    But he caved to criticism that said O'Neill was "too libertarian" and not a medical doctor (which is EXACTLY why he SHOULD HAVE BEEN APPOINTED!!!), and chose Scott Gottlieb instead, an insider that Big Pharma could control.

    There are so many physicians in this country who understand the corruption in Big Pharma but are too afraid to speak out that would come forward and support Trump if they knew he had their back, and many others who are sitting on the fence that would join them if they knew the administration was going to protect them.

    But they feel betrayed, and for good reason, when they turn on their TVs and see all the Bill Gates cronnies running the country and heading us down the path of pure Medical Tyranny.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  30. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Thank you. That is the most honest thing you have written so far in this thread, and I suspect there is some truth to it.

    But I disagree. As Ron Paul's broadcast mentioned today, 600 physicians sent Trump a letter explaining that the lockdowns are causing more health problems then COVID ever could.

    If Trump had stuck to his promises of reforming Big Pharma instead of catering to them, he would have a LOT more support today than he does.

    Those 600 physicians claim they represent 1000s, and all the years I have been covering and reporting about how corrupt Big Pharma is, I have constantly featured the few brave doctors who are willing to come forward and expose the corruption, often at the risk of their own careers, and sometimes even their own lives (look up Dr. Bradstreet for example.)

    For example, his first choice for the FDA after he was elected was Jim O'Neill, an associate at Peter Thiel. He was pro-small businesses, and he was also pro-marijuana.

    He wouldn't have been my first choice, but he at least was not an industry insider.

    But he caved to criticism that said O'Neill was "too libertarian" and not a medical doctor (which is EXACTLY why he SHOULD HAVE BEEN APPOINTED!!!), and chose Scott Gottlieb instead, an insider that Big Pharma could control.

    There are so many physicians in this country who understand the corruption in Big Pharma but are too afraid to speak out that would come forward and support Trump if they knew he had their back, and many others who are sitting on the fence that would join them if they knew the administration was going to protect them.

    But they feel betrayed, and for good reason, when they turn on their TVs and see all the Bill Gates cronnies running the country and heading us down the path of pure Medical Tyranny.
    Thank you, that is perfectly reasonable and more like what I am used to with you.

    Just one question, would O'Neill have been confirmed by the Senate?
    He has to deal with the Senate he has and they are not cooperating about his appointments at all.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Thank you, that is perfectly reasonable and more like what I am used to with you.

    Just one question, would O'Neill have been confirmed by the Senate?
    He has to deal with the Senate he has and they are not cooperating about his appointments at all.
    Trump is President of the United States and he has a Republican controlled Senate. If he had wanted him appointed, he would have gotten it done.

    Trump has been president for over 3 years now, and things are getting worse, not better. I am the same as I have always been. I follow the truth, not politicians or political parties. Trump deserves all the criticism he is getting now from those who trusted him in the beginning that he was going to change things.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  32. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Trump is President of the United States and he has a Republican controlled Senate. If he had wanted him appointed, he would have gotten it done.

    Trump has been president for over 3 years now, and things are getting worse, not better. I am the same as I have always been. I follow the truth, not politicians or political parties. Trump deserves all the criticism he is getting now from those who trusted him in the beginning that he was going to change things.
    Trump is an outsider and the Senate resents him, they have refused to confirm a number of his picks and they conspire to keep him from making recess appointments.

    Trump has made many things get better and he will make more things get better as he gains more power by defeating the deepstate, he is not a dictator and the government is full of his enemies, thinking he was going to be able to defeat them all and impose perfection in a few short years is not rational.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Trump has made many things get better
    Like what?

    I went to bed one night in the USA and woke up the next morning, and it had turned into Communist China. And this happened under Trump's watch.

    This is the worst shape this country has ever been in during my lifetime. Wake up Swordsmyth. The charade is over.
    There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts out fear. For fear has to do with punishment, and whoever fears has not been perfected in love.
    (1 John 4:18)

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Created4 View Post
    Like what?

    I went to bed one night in the USA and woke up the next morning, and it had turned into Communist China. And this happened under Trump's watch.

    This is the worst shape this country has ever been in during my lifetime. Wake up Swordsmyth. The charade is over.
    I have posted many things that Trump has improved.
    And he is not a dictator, he is not omnipotent and he tried his best to limit and now end this lockdown nonsense.

    He can't help it if you think that just because he was elected the entire swamp disappeared overnight.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankindÖitís people I canít stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

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