Page 14 of 15 FirstFirst ... 412131415 LastLast
Results 391 to 420 of 423

Thread: Why the murderers of Ahmaud Arbery need to be prosecuted

  1. #391
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    I'm not seeing First Degree Murder. If that was the defendants intentions wouldn't they have just drove up and shot him straight out of hand? Or bumped him with the truck, tied a chain to him and dragged him down the road until dead?
    They gave him the choice to hold until cops came. That's called "detainment."
    If someone pointed a shotgun at me and told me to "hold" until law enforcement arrived that's exactly what I would do.
    It was felony murder, which carries the same sentence but isn't the same thing as first degree murder. Travis also got Malice, which makes no sense to me at all.. But for felony murder, they are saying that they committed false imprisonment, which is a felony, thus Arbery had the right to defend himself from them, which lead to his death, thus they committed a felony that lead to murder (felony murder).

    However it was based on the judge's misinterpretation of the citizen's arrest statute, which Andrew Branca explained so exquisitely in the Tim Pool video I posted above (Timcast IRL w/ Branca and Posobiec)

    Here it is again since we're on a new page, It starts at 43 min:

    Last edited by dannno; 11-25-2021 at 12:58 AM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."



  2. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  3. #392
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    The younger McMichael said he tried to be calm when calling out to Arbery during the chase and used polite language including "please."

    Dunikoski contrasted this with the threatening language McMichael's father used, according to his accounts to police.

    Quoting from one of the police interviews, Dunikoski asked the younger McMichael if he heard his father shout at Arbery: "'Stop or I'll blow your $#@!ing head off?'"

    McMichael said he did not recall hearing that.
    Do we know when he said that? We heard him yelling "STOP!!" several times on the 911 call while Arbery was fighting him for his gun, then things kinda get quiet and muffled. Is it possible he put the phone down and said that then? It would make sense that the son didn't hear him say it at that point during the scuffle, but probably not while they were driving around in the truck. I am extremely skeptical that he said that when they were just trying to ask him politely to stop.
    Last edited by dannno; 11-25-2021 at 01:16 AM.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."



  4. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  5. #393
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    This is from the cross examination of the younger McMichael.
    McMichael told jurors on Wednesday that while he and his father and co-defendant, Gregory McMichael, were chasing Arbery in their pickup truck, Arbery "turned and ran" when the younger McMichael told him the police were on their way.

    This is pretty telling.
    "He's talkin' to his gut like it's a person!!" -me
    "dumpster diving isn't professional." - angelatc
    "You don't need a medical degree to spot obvious bullshit, that's actually a separate skill." -Scott Adams
    "When you are divided, and angry, and controlled, you target those 'different' from you, not those responsible [controllers]" -Q

    "Each of us must choose which course of action we should take: education, conventional political action, or even peaceful civil disobedience to bring about necessary changes. But let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    "Paul said "the wave of the future" is a coalition of anti-authoritarian progressive Democrats and libertarian Republicans in Congress opposed to domestic surveillance, opposed to starting new wars and in favor of ending the so-called War on Drugs."

  6. #394
    Is this 30 second video the only video out there? If so, how did these three jugheads let themselves be convicted?

    So they follow this thief and call him an $#@! after shooting him, and people make a big deal out of that. That ain't a conviction in my book. It looks to me like McMichael uses some restraint. If he really was intent on shooting the thief, then he doesn't let him grab the gun.

    I don't know why it's so hard to find raw video, but I'm not wasting my time. I don't care about all these dumbass analyses. All I need is raw video.



    https://www.news4jax.com/video/news/...ahmaud-arbery/
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    ...I believe that when the government is capable of doing a thing, it will.
    Quote Originally Posted by Influenza View Post
    which one of yall fuckers wrote the "ron paul" racist news letters
    Quote Originally Posted by Dforkus View Post
    Zippy's posts are a great contribution.




    Disrupt, Deny, Deflate. Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3): http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthr...eptive-members

  7. #395
    In the end Arbery got himself killed by grabbing for the gun. If he didn't do that he would be alive today and the McMicheals would not be in prison.

  8. #396
    Quote Originally Posted by 69360 View Post
    In the end Arbery got himself killed by grabbing for the gun. If he didn't do that he would be alive today and the McMicheals would not be in prison.
    I don't think there is anyone denying that this whole thing is very unfortunate for everyone involved. Based on the video I do not think the intention was to kill anyone but it happened, 3 life sentences somehow doesn't sound like justice. I think that would be my criticism of the system.
    "I am a bird"

  9. #397
    Quote Originally Posted by luctor-et-emergo View Post
    I don't think there is anyone denying that this whole thing is very unfortunate for everyone involved. Based on the video I do not think the intention was to kill anyone but it happened, 3 life sentences somehow doesn't sound like justice. I think that would be my criticism of the system.
    Perhaps involuntary manslaughter would have been more appropriate if the jury felt the need. I don't think any of the parties involved here were innocent or upstanding citizens.

  10. #398
    Quote Originally Posted by NorthCarolinaLiberty View Post
    Is this 30 second video the only video out there? If so, how did these three jugheads let themselves be convicted?

    So they follow this thief and call him an $#@! after shooting him, and people make a big deal out of that. That ain't a conviction in my book. It looks to me like McMichael uses some restraint. If he really was intent on shooting the thief, then he doesn't let him grab the gun.

    I don't know why it's so hard to find raw video, but I'm not wasting my time. I don't care about all these dumbass analyses. All I need is raw video.

    https://www.news4jax.com/video/news/...ahmaud-arbery/
    I believe that is the only video of the actual shooting. They say that it was the video that got all of them convicted.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  11. #399
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Do you have a source for that? Besides Al Sharpton?

    I think you got fake newsd..

    (Edit: commented below in Post #392)
    Quote Originally Posted by dannno View Post
    Pretty sure that never happened. (edit: posted more about this below.. #392, still kinda skeptical)
    Most stories have the prosecutor alleging that the father said that.

    But some mention that the father told the Police that he said that after the incident, so it must be in a Police report.

    pointing to something the elder McMichael told police he shouted at Arbery: “Stop or I’ll blow your $#@!ing head off!”
    ...
    https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-a...06-p596j3.html
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #400
    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    I'm not seeing First Degree Murder. If that was the defendants intentions wouldn't they have just drove up and shot him straight out of hand? Or bumped him with the truck, tied a chain to him and dragged him down the road until dead?
    They gave him the choice to hold until cops came. That's called "detainment."
    If someone pointed a shotgun at me and told me to "hold" until law enforcement arrived that's exactly what I would do.
    Whether they are guilty of something less is debatable and dependent on details of the law and morality.
    They are absolutely not guilty of 1st degree murder.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment



  13. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  14. #401
    Quote Originally Posted by Invisible Man View Post
    You are cornered by an armed man pointing a gun at you. You try to flee, and he doesn't let you. You run until you're spent. You're on foot, and he has a truck and buddies in another truck. Now you're facing the man pointing the gun at you. What are your choices?

    Yes, obviously you can surrender and hope that all he wants to do is detain you until police arrive. But you have no assurance of this. You have reasonable fear that you will be executed on the spot, based on what has already transpired up to that point. Your only other choice is to take your chances with fighting for your life, knowing that you will likely get killed in the process.

    I don't think I would have chosen to fight. But I can't say that he was wrong to do it. In any case, what I can say clearly is that he was not the aggressor. He was the one trying to get away, who was pursued by the guy with the gun. You cannot be the aggressor, who pursues another person in order to kill or unlawfully detain them, while that other person tries to flee, and then claim self defense when they resort to fighting back and you shoot them. If you don't want to be a murderer, then when they try to flee, you let them.
    The idea that Arbery couldnt flee is bizarre.

    A guy on foot can go anywhere, into a neighborhood, into the woods, run into a home under construction etc.

    Its the people in a car which are limited as to where they can go.

    My point is more in general.

    Lately, weve seen people advancing on or trying to attack an armed individual.

    Obviously, anyone who is armed is not going to allow his firearm to be taken from him.

    Youre saying that if a guy thinks hes going to die regardless, he might as well try and fight.

    I cant tell you what Arbery was thinking although I have noticed that in a lot of these police shootings, specifically Black men, panic in regards to being handcuffed, arrested, taken to prison etc.

    Whereas I think in many, if not most cases, if they simply went along with the government storm trooper, they would have been taken to jail, "processed", booked and released.

    I have no doubt that if Arbery had simply ran behind a house, created some distance etc or even stopped and said WTF, instead of trying to attack an armed man, he would be alive today.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."

  15. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by jmdrake View Post
    Simple. If you think you're going to die anyway, attempting to wrestle away a firearm makes perfect sense. Example, the unarmed black man who disarmed the Waffle House shooter in Nashville TN.



    Here's another example. A Nashville pastor who tackled an armed man who was approaching his pulpit and other members of the congregation wreslted away the gun.

    https://www.wxyz.com/news/national/t...t-parishioners

    I'm sure if you look hard enough you can find plenty of other examples of good citizens who are unarmed who wrestle guns away from killers. In the case of Arbery the defendants had pursued him for an extended period of time and one of them even bumped into him with his truck. If Arbery thought he was going to end up like Emmit Till if he submitted to the McMichaels, and based on the circumstances that was not unreasonable for him to think, then going for the gun made perfect sense. And if he hadn't taken his right hand off the gun to punch his assailant he might have been successful.
    I got you, if you think youre going to get waxed anyway.

    In regards to the Arbery case, those men werent looking to kill anyone.

    Arbery may have though otherwise but we'll never know the outcome had Arbery simply stood there or ran into a house or into the woods etc.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."

  16. #403
    Quote Originally Posted by unknown View Post
    I got you, if you think youre going to get waxed anyway.

    In regards to the Arbery case, those men werent looking to kill anyone.

    Arbery may have though otherwise but we'll never know the outcome had Arbery simply stood there or ran into a house or into the woods etc.
    Or how about if they didn't follow him in the first place?
    There is no spoon.

  17. #404
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Or how about if they didn't follow him in the first place?
    I dont have a problem with following someone especially if you think theyve done something wrong/illegal.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."

  18. #405
    Quote Originally Posted by unknown View Post
    I dont have a problem with following someone especially if you think theyve done something wrong/illegal.
    My POV is 1st, you'd better KNOW, not "think" & 2nd talking to someone is one thing, chasing them down with trucks & guns is a whole different ballgame.
    There is no spoon.

  19. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by unknown View Post
    The idea that Arbery couldnt flee is bizarre.

    A guy on foot can go anywhere, into a neighborhood, into the woods, run into a home under construction etc.

    Its the people in a car which are limited as to where they can go.
    ...
    Whereas I think in many, if not most cases, if they simply went along with the government storm trooper, they would have been taken to jail, "processed", booked and released.

    I have no doubt that if Arbery had simply ran behind a house, created some distance etc or even stopped and said WTF, instead of trying to attack an armed man, he would be alive today.
    Exactly.

    An interesting aspect of this situation is also the attitude involved and an opinion shared by many: if Arbery had actually answered and talked to those guys, it would have made him a p*ssy. Guess he isn't a p*ssy.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Pharma-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul

    Proponent of real science.
    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  20. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    An interesting aspect of this situation is also the attitude involved and an opinion shared by many: if Arbery had actually answered and talked to those guys, it would have made him a p*ssy. Guess he isn't a p*ssy.
    He clearly didn't have nine lives.
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  21. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    My POV is 1st, you'd better KNOW, not "think" & 2nd talking to someone is one thing, chasing them down with trucks & guns is a whole different ballgame.
    While I don't like or advocate it and it may be incredibly creepy or even weird, no rights are being violated if I choose to follow someone for any reason.

    There was a chase because he ran...

    Just saying from a practical perspective, if you intend to follow someone and they start running, naturally you have to either start running or use a car etc to keep up.
    Last edited by unknown; 11-27-2021 at 03:40 PM.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."



  22. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  23. #409
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Exactly.

    An interesting aspect of this situation is also the attitude involved and an opinion shared by many: if Arbery had actually answered and talked to those guys, it would have made him a p*ssy. Guess he isn't a p*ssy.
    I don't understand that at all.

    Obviously this is all hypothetical but if Arbery had said hey wtf are you guys doing?

    And they replied, we think you're intention is to steal from this house (or that you've stolen from this house) and we intend to follow you until the police arrive.

    If he started to walk or run away, and they followed him, I don't see that as a violation of any rights.
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."

  24. #410
    Well, let me ask this, if I'm following someone, does it violate their rights?

    Or do I have a right to simply follow someone?
    "An idea whose time has come cannot be stopped by any army or any government" - Ron Paul.

    "To learn who rules over you simply find out who you arent allowed to criticize."

  25. #411
    Quote Originally Posted by unknown View Post
    Well, let me ask this, if I'm following someone, does it violate their rights?
    Are you asking me? Or are you asking a Karen?

    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    https://twitter.com/ChefGruel/status...24423471763456
    "Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out?"--Will Rogers

    "All I know is what I read in the newspapers, and that's an alibi for my ignorance."--Will Rogers

  26. #412

  27. #413
    Quote Originally Posted by unknown View Post
    Well, let me ask this, if I'm following someone, does it violate their rights?

    Or do I have a right to simply follow someone?
    That can be determined as "stalking". "The crime of stalking can be simply described as the unwanted pursuit of another person."

    Also, if 3 black guys were following you in their trucks would you just calmly stand there & ask them what they wanted or would you take off & try to get out of sight?
    There is no spoon.

  28. #414
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    That can be determined as "stalking". "The crime of stalking can be simply described as the unwanted pursuit of another person."

    Also, if 3 black guys were following you in their trucks would you just calmly stand there & ask them what they wanted or would you take off & try to get out of sight?
    A citizen's arrest is an actual thing. I'm not going to defend the McMichaels, because I do not know enough about the case, but I do recommend you watch Tim Pool's IRL with Andrew Branca on this topic. I found it interesting:


  29. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by A Son of Liberty View Post
    A citizen's arrest is an actual thing. I'm not going to defend the McMichaels, because I do not know enough about the case, but I do recommend you watch Tim Pool's IRL with Andrew Branca on this topic. I found it interesting:

    I'm aware of the right of citizen's arrest- but looking inside a unfinished building structure, which most of us have done, is questionable grounds for stalking someone. Plus, if tools are actually being stolen, then any smart person would make sure stuff was locked up & safe.
    There is no spoon.

  30. #416
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    I'm aware of the right of citizen's arrest- but looking inside a unfinished building structure, which most of us have done, is questionable grounds for stalking someone. Plus, if tools are actually being stolen, then any smart person would make sure stuff was locked up & safe.
    There is more to the story than this one individual "looking inside an unfinished building". The community had recently experienced a crime wave, including the theft of a firearm. Their neighborhood was on heightened alert as a result. (Also, I personally haven't "looked around inside and unfinished home", and I don't think *most* of us have... it's not my stuff, so it's not my business.)

    Again, I would recommend listening to Branca's comments on this matter. As I said, I'm not going to take a hard line on this one because I haven't looked into it as much as I did the Rittenhouse case, but it does seem that there is more here than meets the eye.



  31. Remove this section of ads by registering.
  32. #417
    I wonder what it is about Arbery that makes it so that, apparently, he either had a duty to flee rather than standing his ground, or else needed to submit to the other men's demands and surrender himself to police.


    Neither one of those are normally popular assertions on this forum...
    "The abiding purpose of every nationalist is to secure more power and more prestige, not for himself but for the nation or other unit in which he has chosen to sink his own individuality."
    -George Orwell, "Notes on nationalism"

  33. #418
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    I wonder what it is about Arbery that makes it so that, apparently, he either had a duty to flee rather than standing his ground, or else needed to submit to the other men's demands and surrender himself to police.


    Neither one of those are normally popular assertions on this forum...
    Neither are you,, but here you are..

    and still with no point.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  34. #419
    Quote Originally Posted by Ender View Post
    Or how about if they didn't follow him in the first place?
    Then the neighbourhood will get hit again and again and again. Opportunity comes but once. The problem with the result of this case now is that it would embolden the criminals to be even more brazen and bold with their thieving. Imagine next time a criminal runs out of a building and the neighbours try to chase him, all he has to do now is to run towards them and pick a fight, if they kill him, he dies and the neighbours go to jail but if he succeeds, he would evade the chasers and live another day.

  35. #420
    Quote Originally Posted by TheCount View Post
    I wonder what it is about Arbery that makes it so that, apparently, he either had a duty to flee rather than standing his ground, or else needed to submit to the other men's demands and surrender himself to police.


    Neither one of those are normally popular assertions on this forum...
    Is that an argument being made in this thread? Honest question.

Page 14 of 15 FirstFirst ... 412131415 LastLast


Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 13
    Last Post: 05-12-2020, 11:20 PM
  2. Why does RPF love defending murderers?
    By eduardo89 in forum Open Discussion
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 08-26-2013, 06:33 AM
  3. The Murderers of Christianity by Pat Buchanan
    By bobbyw24 in forum Peace Through Religion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-09-2010, 07:35 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •