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Thread: Amash denounces armed protests in Michigan

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by fcreature View Post
    Wait, people here still care about this clown?

    We learned Amash's true loyalties when he threw his support in the shredding of the Constitution, and more importantly our god given natural rights, in an effort to destroy a politician he simply didn't like.
    I assume you think the WWE is real too right?
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.



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  3. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Apparently,, just another petty Authoritarian..
    Libertarian or classical liberal is what you are looking for. Courts, police and a military are essential parts of a free society. The absence of them is not freedom. It is mob tyranny.

    Anachism is not libertarianism.

  4. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Libertarian or classical liberal is what you are looking for. Courts, police and a military are essential parts of a free society. The absence of them is not freedom. It is mob tyranny.

    Anachism is not libertarianism.
    What passes for courts, police and military today sure isn't an essential part of a "free" society. The notion that this is a "free" society is laughable to anyone with any understanding of how the legal system really works. Corporate contract violation enforcers enforcing victimless crimes, for example, are not what free societies require.
    "Let it not be said that we did nothing." - Ron Paul

    The entire internet is the domain of paid shills and bots. If you don't know this by now....

    Israel, under control of the Crown and, ultimately, the Vatican, own the USA. If you don't know this by now....

    Talk to people about liberty. You won't find it on websites, you won't find it in politicians.

    But now you can't talk to people because of "social distancing"....brought to you by shills and politicians.

  5. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Anachism is not libertarianism.
    Authoritarianism is the Polar opposite of Liberty.

    Police are only needed to enforce BAD LAW.

    Good people enforce natural Laws by course,,

    They are totally unnecessary for a Free society..
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  6. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Police are only needed to enforce BAD LAW.

    Good people enforce natural Laws by course,,

    They are totally unnecessary for a Free society..

    The entirety of world history indicates that what you say is wrong.

    Mob justice is not justice. It is jungle rule. Your worldview would reduce to human life to the level of wild animals. The people who survive and rise to the top would do so not through merit and voluntary trade, but only though brute force or with the help of a gang.

  7. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by devil21 View Post
    What passes for courts, police and military today sure isn't an essential part of a "free" society. The notion that this is a "free" society is laughable to anyone with any understanding of how the legal system really works. Corporate contract violation enforcers enforcing victimless crimes, for example, are not what free societies require.
    There is a lot wrong with the legal system.

    But the United States is infinitely freer than Somalia, which is what you would have without police. No police = Complete loss of freedom. Unless of course you think living the life of a wild animal in the jungle is freedom.

  8. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    The entirety of world history indicates that what you say is wrong.

    Mob justice is not justice. It is jungle rule. Your worldview would reduce to human life to the level of wild animals. The people who survive and rise to the top would do so not through merit and voluntary trade, but only though brute force or with the help of a gang.
    Bush Sr, when promising a New World Order, also said... “not the law of the jungle”:



    Your posts have been troubling, to say the least.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  9. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Bush Sr, when promising a New World Order, also said... “not the law of the jungle”:


    Your posts have been troubling, to say the least.
    You know who also talks like that? Actual liberty loving people. Sorry, I am not an anti-government collectivist. Anarchists are as evil as Communists.

    If a society provided no organized protection against force, it would compel every citizen to go about armed, to turn his home into a fortress, to shoot any strangers approaching his door—or to join a protective gang of citizens who would fight other gangs, formed for the same purpose, and thus bring about the degeneration of that society into the chaos of gang-rule, i.e., rule by brute force, into perpetual tribal warfare of prehistorical savages.

    The use of physical force—even its retaliatory use—cannot be left at the discretion of individual citizens......—the use of force against one man cannot be left to the arbitrary decision of another.
    Anarchy, as a political concept, is a naive floating abstraction: . . . a society without an organized government would be at the mercy of the first criminal who came along and who would precipitate it into the chaos of gang warfare. But the possibility of human immorality is not the only objection to anarchy: even a society whose every member were fully rational and faultlessly moral, could not function in a state of anarchy; it is the need of objective laws and of an arbiter for honest disagreements among men that necessitates the establishment of a government.
    Picture a band of strangers marching down Main Street, submachine guns at the ready. When confronted by the police, the leader of the band announces: “Me and the boys are only here to see that justice is done, so you have no right to interfere with us.” According to the “libertarian” anarchists, in such a confrontation the police are morally bound to withdraw, on pain of betraying the rights of self-defense and free trade.
    http://aynrandlexicon.com/lexicon/anarchism.html
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 05-10-2020 at 09:30 PM.



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  11. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    You know who also talks like that? Actual liberty loving people. Sorry, I am not an anti-government collectivist. Anarchists are as evil as Communists.
    “Anti-government” and “collectivist” are complete contrary to one another.

    See ya on the other side. Or, maybe I won’t ;-)
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  12. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    “Anti-government” and “collectivist” are complete contrary to one another.
    Someone smarter and more important to freedom than you or me disagrees.

    Anarchism is the most irrational, anti-intellectual notion ever spun by the concrete-bound, context-dropping, whim-worshiping fringe of the collectivist movement, where it properly belongs.
    All kinds of people today call themselves “libertarians,” especially something calling itself the New Right, which consists of hippies who are anarchists instead of leftist collectivists; but anarchists are collectivists. Capitalism is the one system that requires absolute objective law, yet libertarians combine capitalism and anarchism.
    They want to be hippies, but don’t want to preach collectivism because those jobs are already taken. But anarchism is a logical outgrowth of the anti-intellectual side of collectivism. I could deal with a Marxist with a greater chance of reaching some kind of understanding, and with much greater respect. Anarchists are the scum of the intellectual world
    http://aynrandlexicon.com/ayn-rand-i...tarianism.html

  13. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Collins View Post
    One thing I learned from the Virginia rally a few months ago is that armed protesters don't get shot, tazed, sprayed, or shut down. The cops pretty much just let them be because they don't want to force an armed conflict (cops would probably lose).

    And while I too prefer not having armed people at a protest, the reality is that in many cases it is now necessary to protect oneself from government abuse. Justin's messaging is wrong and once again throws his base under the bus.

    At this point he may not even get the LP nomination.
    John McAfee should get the nomination over Amash. One is a real Libertarian and the other...well I'm not going to resort to name calling. If only we could convince Dr. Ron Paul to run again, can't really use the "he's too old" argument this time around.

  14. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Libertarian or classical liberal is what you are looking for. Courts, police and a military are essential parts of a free society. The absence of them is not freedom. It is mob tyranny.

    Anachism is not libertarianism.

    Libertarian principles, if followed to their logical conclusion, lead one ineluctably to statelessness. It's an inarguable fact whether it pleases you or not.

    Libertarianism = anarchism.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  15. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    “Anti-government” and “collectivist” are complete contrary to one another.

    See ya on the other side. Or, maybe I won’t ;-)

    You're talking to a guy who thinks gun ownership should require a license. 'Nuff said.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  16. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Libertarian principles, if followed to their logical conclusion, lead one ineluctably to statelessness. It's an inarguable fact whether it pleases you or not.

    Libertarianism = anarchism.

    Given that anarchism can't work and results in a total loss of freedom, it is hard to see how it is logical.

  17. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Someone smarter and more important to freedom than you or me disagrees.
    What makes you believe she is much smarter than me?

    While I like and respect Ayn Rand, I do not agree with her 100%. Recall that she and Ron Paul differ and she shunned him at one point.

    I am a sovereign individual, which seems by the wayside around here anymore, I can and will promote free markets and abide by the NAP on my own.

    Btw, my sig is Ayn’s, which I hold to my heart.

    Maybe check out Larken Rose. He and I see eye to eye ;-)
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  18. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    You're talking to a guy who thinks gun ownership should require a license. 'Nuff said.
    Yep.
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)



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  20. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Given that anarchism can't work and results in a total loss of freedom, it is hard to see how it is logical.

    Wow. Your totally unsupported statements presented as gospel truth have convinced me. Who do I talk to about converting to Randian objectiveism? Not.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  21. #138
    amash is worse than Hillary because Amash is a parasite who has no allegiance except money .
    It was too weird to live, and too rare to die - hunter s. thompson .
    ..this is the darkest timeline..

  22. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainAmerica View Post
    amash is worse than Hillary because Amash is a parasite who has no allegiance except money .
    Fixed it
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)

  23. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by RonPaulRocksMyWorld View Post
    John McAfee should get the nomination over Amash. One is a real Libertarian and the other...well I'm not going to resort to name calling. If only we could convince Dr. Ron Paul to run again, can't really use the "he's too old" argument this time around.
    uhhh..... Justin does have credibility since he has been a Congressman for X years, McAfee does not have credibility.

    Last time around the LP needed McAfee's name recognition, Austin's marketing skills, and Gary's credibility. If they were able to merge those 3 it would have been a great candidate.
    __________________________________________________ ________________
    "A politician will do almost anything to keep their job, even become a patriot" - Hearst

  24. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Yep.
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    You're talking to a guy who thinks gun ownership should require a license. 'Nuff said.
    Feel free to find that quote from me. I am indifferent on the issue. I am not really for or against registering guns or having a license to own one. It isn't a big issue to me. I would be pretty surprised if I ever said you should have to get a license to own a gun though.
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 05-10-2020 at 10:31 PM.

  25. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Feel free to find that quote from me. I am indifferent on the issue. I am not really for or against registering guns. It isn't a big issue to me. But I would be somewhat I surprised if I said guns should be registered.

    Except I didn't say you said guns should be registered. I said youbsaid gun ownership should require a license, you compared it to a driver's license as I recall. I'll see if I can dig up the quote when I have time to do some searching.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  26. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by PAF View Post
    Fixed it
    thanks CCP china
    It was too weird to live, and too rare to die - hunter s. thompson .
    ..this is the darkest timeline..

  27. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Wow. Your totally unsupported statements presented as gospel truth have convinced me. Who do I talk to about converting to Randian objectiveism? Not.
    I did support it when I said thousands of years of world history demonstrates anarchism doesn't work. Not working so hot in Somalia.

    Limited government on the other hand.. works quite well. See the United States, Hong Kong, Switzerland. Very big success.



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  29. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Except I didn't say you said guns should be registered. I said youbsaid gun ownership should require a license, you compared it to a driver's license as I recall. I'll see if I can dig up the quote when I have time to do some searching.

    Pretty sure I said licensing dogs was not a big infringement on freedom. And that was to pay for animal control. Not guns. And I did say restricting guns from people with mental illness and people convicted of violent crimes was legitimate. I also remember agreeing with Rand Paul that having a multiday waiting period for people on a terrorist watch list was not a big infringement on freedom. I don't remember saying anything about a license though.

  30. #146
    The leftarian party is dead . Done , toast , never coming back .Time to move on to the big leagues . I realize it does not leave many choices . That is how it is , pick one .

  31. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by CCTelander View Post
    Except I didn't say you said guns should be registered. I said youbsaid gun ownership should require a license, you compared it to a driver's license as I recall. I'll see if I can dig up the quote when I have time to do some searching.

    Pretty random that you remember one word from a quote in six years. Apparently I did say it. I am pretty indifferent and don't consider it a big infringement on freedom though. I remember why I said guns though. My dad had a stroke that week which caused diminished faculties. I am completely in favor of limiting gun ownership to someone like that. So maybe a licensing regime would be the best way to do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Given that roads are public, requiring a minimum level of competency is hardly an infringement on freedom. I don't want some 102 year old blind woman on the road crashing into people. It basically one of the few licenses I support. I also support licensing dogs, cars and guns.

    I am strongly against occupational licensing because they are anti-competitive. They end up raising costs to consumers.
    Last edited by Krugminator2; 05-10-2020 at 10:57 PM.

  32. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Pretty random that you remember one word from a quote in six years. Apparently I did say it. I am pretty indifferent and don't consider it a big infringement on freedom though. I remember why I said guns though. My dad had a stroke that week which caused diminished faculties. I am completely in favor of limiting gun ownership to someone like that. So maybe a licensing regime would be the best way to do that.

    I have a VERY good memory but it has gotten a bit spottier in my advancing years.

    Be that as it may I do want to thank you sincerely for digging that up and saving me the time and effort of doing so. I may not think much of your politics bit I do very much appreciate your honesty in this matter. Props.
    Chris

    "Government ... does not exist of necessity, but rather by virtue of a tragic, almost comical combination of klutzy, opportunistic terrorism against sitting ducks whom it pretends to shelter, plus our childish phobia of responsibility, praying to be exempted from the hard reality of life on life's terms." Wolf DeVoon

    "...Make America Great Again. I'm interested in making American FREE again. Then the greatness will come automatically."Ron Paul

  33. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    The entirety of world history indicates that what you say is wrong.
    No
    The entirety of Human History is filled with Authoritarians who Wared with each other and forced people to die for them.
    They Conscripted whoever the Police collected.
    Police also Controlled the Slaves..
    Were Muscle for Local political machines.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  34. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Krugminator2 View Post
    Police are an part of a free society. In fact, protecting rights with law enforcement and the military is the whole reason for government existing.

    So no, I don't have a problem with there being security at the Capitol. There are people hipped up on crystal meth and low IQ who might do lawmakers harm like the guy who shot Steve Scalise.
    Mutual self defense between the states in the union in a time of war (constitutional) is not police "protecting" Americans or enforcing "laws".

    I've seen more low IQ and psychopath cops, on video, murder people and dogs than I can count. More so, they get away it. If armed citizens at a state capital makes you uneasy than nobody should be armed - no public, no cops, no lawmakers, so state employees.
    You've got Sharia patrols in the USA..?

    No, not in America, only in the big cities. there are no americans there, only democrats.

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