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Thread: COVID-19: WHY WE SHOULD ALL WEAR MASKS

  1. #1

    COVID-19: WHY WE SHOULD ALL WEAR MASKS

    COVID-19: WHY WE SHOULD ALL WEAR MASKS

    The official recommendation in the United States (and other Western countries) that the public should not wear face masks was motivated by the need to save respirator masks for health care workers. There is no scientific support for the statement that masks worn by non-professionals are “not effective”. In contrary, in view of the stated goal to “flatten the curve”, any additional, however partial reduction of transmission would be welcome — even that afforded by the simple surgical masks or home-made (DIY) masks (which would not exacerbate the supply problem).
    ...
    Since the CDC provides no scientific evidence for its statement that masks worn by the public “are not effective”, here we review the scientific support for protection conferred by surgical masks. We focus on mechanistic rationale (as opposed to epidemiological-phenomenological evidence). We conclude, by considering cough droplet ballistics and the latest research findings on the biology of transmission of the SARS-CoV2 virus (which causes COVID-19) that any physical barrier, as provided even by make-shift masks, may substantially reduce the spread of COVID 19. If we are soon to yield to the pressure to loosen lockdowns and allow limited social interactions to revive the economy, then public masks should have a role and could facilitate a middle-of-the-road approach.

    The official recommendation by CDC, FDA and others that masks worn by the non-health-care professionals are ineffective is incorrect at three levels: In the logic, in the mechanics of transmission, and in the biology of viral entry.
    ...
    Looking forward: if we are soon loosening the lockdown due to the political pressure to sustain the economy, perhaps encouraging face masks to be worn in the public would be a good compromise between total lockdown and total freedom that risks resurgence of the invisible enemy. There is now a robust scientific basis for putting an end to the officials’ anti-surgical mask hysteria and to recommend or even mandate a broad use of masks as in Asian countries that have bent the curve.
    ...
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    ...
    Much more: https://medium.com/@Cancerwarrior/co...e-280e08ceee71
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  3. #2
    Not wearing masks to protect against coronavirus is a ‘big mistake,’ top Chinese scientist says
    By Jon Cohen - Mar. 27, 2020

    Q: What mistakes are other countries making?

    A: The big mistake in the U.S. and Europe, in my opinion, is that people aren’t wearing masks. This virus is transmitted by droplets and close contact. Droplets play a very important role—you’ve got to wear a mask, because when you speak, there are always droplets coming out of your mouth. Many people have asymptomatic or presymptomatic infections. If they are wearing face masks, it can prevent droplets that carry the virus from escaping and infecting others.
    ...
    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...scientist-says
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  4. #3
    That infographic is pure gold. Thanks for putting it onto the front page. This should on drudge 24/7.

  5. #4
    I take it you have warehouses full of n95 masks that people are just choosing not to use?
    In New Zealand:
    The Coastguard is a Charity
    Air Traffic Control is a private company run on user fees
    The DMV is a private non-profit
    Rescue helicopters and ambulances are operated by charities and are plastered with corporate logos
    The agriculture industry has zero subsidies
    5% of the national vote, gets you 5 seats in Parliament
    A tax return has 4 fields
    Business licenses aren't even a thing nor are capital gains taxes
    Constitutional right to refuse any type of medical care

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    I take it you have warehouses full of n95 masks that people are just choosing not to use?
    Sure do. Its in Wuhan, though...

  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by swissaustrian View Post
    That infographic is pure gold. Thanks for putting it onto the front page. This should on drudge 24/7.
    This one is good too. Meanwhile the CDC is saying "why did Hong Kong and Singapore do so much better than the US in stopping the spread?"


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    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by idiom View Post
    I take it you have warehouses full of n95 masks that people are just choosing not to use?
    Read the article and get back to us.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    This one is good too. Meanwhile the CDC is saying "why did Hong Kong and Singapore do so much better than the US in stopping the spread?"


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    What is the source?
    I would like to give this to someone who is comparing goverment measures.



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by swissaustrian View Post
    What is the source?
    I would like to give this to someone who is comparing goverment measures.
    This guy seems to be the source:

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch

    John Burn-Murdoch
    @jburnmurdoch
    Stories, stats & scatterplots for @FinancialTimes
    | Daily updates of the coronavirus trajectory tracker | john.burn-murdoch@ft.com | #dataviz
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  12. #10

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/sta...23948821569539


    https://twitter.com/USAB4L/status/1245172451341819904
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    And ^that is how you flatten the curve! That and federally funded testing for all. Not some stupid "shelter in place/safer at home" order that large numbers of people aren't following anyway.
    9/11 Thermate experiments

    Winston Churchhill on why the U.S. should have stayed OUT of World War I

    "I am so %^&*^ sick of this cult of Ron Paul. The Paulites. What is with these %^&*^ people? Why are there so many of them?" YouTube rant by "TheAmazingAtheist"

    "We as a country have lost faith and confidence in freedom." -- Ron Paul

    "It can be a challenge to follow the pronouncements of President Trump, as he often seems to change his position on any number of items from week to week, or from day to day, or even from minute to minute." -- Ron Paul
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    The road to hell is paved with good intentions. No need to make it a superhighway.
    Quote Originally Posted by osan View Post
    The only way I see Trump as likely to affect any real change would be through martial law, and that has zero chances of success without strong buy-in by the JCS at the very minimum.

  14. #12
    I'm thinking once global supply for masks is no longer an issue, we'll all be having a variety of masks ready to go.

    I wonder if it will become normal to see people wearing masks frequently like Asians countries, perhaps helping common colds. Might be the new fashionable thing to wear.
    https://www.vogmask.com/collections/all

    Or go for the "I'm not wearing a mask" look
    https://faceidmasks.com/
    “…let us teach them that all who draw breath are of equal worth, and that those who seek to press heel upon the throat of liberty, will fall to the cry of FREEDOM!!!” – Spartacus, War of the Damned

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  15. #13
    I think the biggest issue with masks is that people will use them as an alternative to social distancing. Someone with an n95 can still get other people sick and they can get sick if they don't do it right. Hopefully they don't try the authoritarian model and start mandatory quarantining people based on their GPS or cell phone who have had contact with someone with the virus. I keep seeing people praise countries that did that.

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    non ionized Charcoal filter pad inserts can filter 99.6 percent of viruses
    It was too weird to live, and too rare to die - hunter s. thompson .
    ..this is the darkest timeline..

  17. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by kpitcher View Post
    I'm thinking once global supply for masks is no longer an issue, we'll all be having a variety of masks ready to go.

    I wonder if it will become normal to see people wearing masks frequently like Asians countries, perhaps helping common colds. Might be the new fashionable thing to wear.
    https://www.vogmask.com/collections/all

    Or go for the "I'm not wearing a mask" look
    https://faceidmasks.com/
    Totally agree.
    People in Asia have been wearing masks against smog for a long time. Thats why they have ample supply.

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    I think the biggest issue with masks is that people will use them as an alternative to social distancing. Someone with an n95 can still get other people sick and they can get sick if they don't do it right. Hopefully they don't try the authoritarian model and start mandatory quarantining people based on their GPS or cell phone who have had contact with someone with the virus. I keep seeing people praise countries that did that.
    Yes, we have all seen the establishment media talking points. They will eventually stop making excuses. It's hard for them to admit either a mistake, or that they were lying with a hidden agenda.

    There weren't enough masks/respirators, and they don't want anyone asking why.

    The whys are simple:

    - Their failure to plan. The medical establishment didn't have a reserve of supplies.

    - The failure of the "just in time" supply chain. This brilliant supply management system which comes from the most prestigious Universities and business minds says "don't store anything, buy only as you need".

    - Every available mask in the US was purchased, some by early preppers in the US (who are shamed and blamed), and by people who shipped them to China by the cases to family, friends, and business partners (this must be covered up at all costs, so says the PC SJWs of the media and leftist government).
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainAmerica View Post
    non ionized Charcoal filter pad inserts can filter 99.6 percent of viruses
    Of course. Home masks can be made in a variety of ways, some better than n95.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Of course. Home masks can be made in a variety of ways, some better than n95.
    N95 respirators are not the most effective way for average people to protect themselves from the virus — the face masks can prevent wearers from breathing in particles as small as 0.3 microns, but coronavirus particles measure between 0.05 and 0.2 microns in diameter

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    N95 respirators are not the most effective way for average people to protect themselves from the virus — the face masks can prevent wearers from breathing in particles as small as 0.3 microns, but coronavirus particles measure between 0.05 and 0.2 microns in diameter
    Are you Zippy's replacement?

    The airborne droplets are usually much larger than the virus itself. Even aerosol particles are bigger than a single virus.

    Nothing is perfect. Reducing transmission is the point.
    Last edited by Brian4Liberty; 04-01-2020 at 10:47 AM.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Are you Zippy's replacement?

    The airborne droplets are usually much larger than the virus itself. Even aerosol particles are bigger than a single virus.

    Nothing is perfect. Reducing transmission is the point.
    At what cost? Doctors helping people with no mask? They are being fired for saying they can't get PPE. Should we go back to not hand washing in medicine too?

  24. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    At what cost? Doctors helping people with no mask? They are being fired for saying they can't get PPE. Should we go back to not hand washing in medicine too?
    Ah. So you are pushing the "no masks for the public" line because you think that it will make them unavailable for healthcare workers. The public should use homemade ones right now. Healthcare workers should use the best they can get.

    Hospital administrators that deny workers the right to wear them should be fired.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  25. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    Ah. So you are pushing the "no masks for the public" line because you think that it will make them unavailable for healthcare workers. The public should use homemade ones right now. Healthcare workers should use the best they can get.

    Hospital administrators that deny workers the right to wear them should be fired.
    No I don't think the public should not have masks. I think it should be understood that current models suggest that people would spread the virus more if they used masks rather than social distance. Maybe if they were n100 it would be an equivilance and social distancing wouldn't be as necessary but we don't have enough masks to get the same mitigation affect so that people aren't spreading it into places that don't have it. Plus people do not handle the equipment properly which would spread the virus.

  26. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    ... I think it should be understood that current models suggest that people would spread the virus more if they used masks rather than social distance. ...
    "Current models"? What current models? Proven by whom?

    And who suggested that masks should replace social distancing?

    Plus people do not handle the equipment properly which would spread the virus.
    More excuses. Are you saying that masks/ventilators are such complex devices, the general public can not properly operate them? Even if someone does not handle their mask correctly, if they are wearing it, they are protecting others, and hindering the spread.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  27. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    "Current models"? What current models? Proven by whom?

    And who suggested that masks should replace social distancing?



    More excuses. Are you saying that masks/ventilators are such complex devices, the general public can not properly operate them? Even if someone does not handle their mask correctly, if they are wearing it, they are protecting others, and hindering the spread.
    No but obviously there are reasons why they study this virus in gear more protective than n95. There are also some people who would not handle it properly due to error or ignorance rather than incompetence. For one I would bet you most people think an n95 equivilant is 100% effective. Doctors are getting the virus wearing them. Makeshift masks that are not even n95 would be worse.



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  29. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    No but obviously there are reasons why they study this virus in gear more protective than n95. There are also some people who would not handle it properly due to error or ignorance rather than incompetence. For one I would bet you most people think an n95 equivilant is 100% effective. Doctors are getting the virus wearing them. Makeshift masks that are not even n95 would be worse.
    You didn't answer the question. What "current models" say that the virus spreads more with masks?

    As for your statement about the effectiveness of masks, that's like saying that only 1000SPF sun block works, so no one should wear 45 or 30 SPF.
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  30. #26
    The US makes masks, and then they are exported:


    https://twitter.com/NatashaBertrand/...42605719052290
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  31. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    You didn't answer the question. What "current models" say that the virus spreads more with masks?

    As for your statement about the effectiveness of masks, that's like saying that only 1000SPF sun block works, so no one should wear 45 or 30 SPF.
    I'm more likely to spread the virus if I am not social distancing if I have it than not. If everyone is wearing the mask than people who may be completely immune or not vulnerable won't filter it out of the air. ECT. China doesn't even let you travel there because masks alone won't stop you from giving it to their population.

  32. #28
    Asia may have been right about coronavirus and face masks, and the rest of the world is coming around

    Hong Kong (CNN)In the coming weeks, if they have not already, your government is likely to begin advising you to wear a face mask to protect against coronavirus.
    ...
    In other parts of the world, this message may be confusing, coming after weeks of public health authorities, politicians and media figures confidently claiming masks do not help and urging people instead to focus on washing their hands and maintaining social distancing.

    The tone of such claims ranged from condescending to frustrated, with the US Surgeon General Jerome Adams tweeting in late February -- in all caps -- "STOP BUYING MASKS!"

    "They are NOT effective in preventing general public from catching #Coronavirus, but if healthcare providers can't get them to care for sick patients, it puts them and our communities at risk," he added, in a post that has since been retweeted over 43,000 times.

    That same week, Robert Redfield, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), appeared before lawmakers. Asked if people should wear masks, he had a straightforward answer: "No."

    Now he's not so sure. On Monday, Redfield said told NPR that the CDC was reviewing its guidelines and may recommend general mask use to guard against community infection. It's likely only a matter of time before other mask holdouts, most prominently the World Health Organization (WHO), follow suit.

    Writing last month, Adrien Burch, an expert in microbiology at the University of California, Berkeley, noted that "despite hearing that face masks 'don't work,' you probably haven't seen any strong evidence to support that claim. That's because it doesn't exist."
    In fact, there is evidence of the exact opposite: that masks help prevent viral infections like the current pandemic.
    ...
    More: https://edition.cnn.com/2020/04/01/a...hnk/index.html
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  33. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by nikcers View Post
    I'm more likely to spread the virus if I am not social distancing if I have it than not. If everyone is wearing the mask than people who may be completely immune or not vulnerable won't filter it out of the air. ECT. China doesn't even let you travel there because masks alone won't stop you from giving it to their population.
    LOL, wut? You think and expect that humans are filtering the air by breathing?

    Seriously, are you associated with the same organization as Zippy? CNN even says that the officials are going to reverse themselves soon. Will you get orders to change your story?
    "Foreign aid is taking money from the poor people of a rich country, and giving it to the rich people of a poor country." - Ron Paul
    "Beware the Military-Industrial-Financial-Corporate-Internet-Media-Government Complex." - B4L update of General Dwight D. Eisenhower
    "Debt is the drug, Wall St. Banksters are the dealers, and politicians are the addicts." - B4L
    "Totally free immigration? I've never taken that position. I believe in national sovereignty." - Ron Paul
    They are what they hate.” - B4L


    The views and opinions expressed here are solely my own, and do not represent this forum or any other entities or persons.

  34. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by Brian4Liberty View Post
    LOL, wut? You think and expect that humans are filtering the air by breathing?

    Seriously, are you associated with the same organization as Zippy? CNN even says that the officials are going to reverse themselves soon. Will you get orders to change your story?
    If officials reverse themselves will you? I'm not changing my position on this. I took this position before the administration did. If this virus becomes worse the people will embrace absolute authoritarianism to combat it.

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