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Thread: A Lawless Political Assassination

  1. #1

    A Lawless Political Assassination

    By Andrew P. Napolitano
    January 9, 2020


    “America … goes not abroad in search of monsters to destroy.” — President John Quincy Adams (1767-1848)


    Last week, President Donald Trump ordered the U.S. military to invade a then-friendly country without the knowledge or consent of its government and assassinate a visiting foreign government official. The victim was the head of Iran’s military and intelligence. The formerly friendly country is Iraq. The killing of the general and his companions was carried out by the use of an unmanned drone. The general was not engaged in an act of violence at the time he was killed, nor were any of his companions. They were driving on a public highway in a van.

    The president’s supporters have argued that the general’s death was revenge for Americans and others killed by the general’s troops and surrogates. Trump has argued, more importantly, that he ordered the general’s death because of what evil the general might order his own troops and surrogates to do in the future.

    Can the president legally kill a person not engaged in an act of violence because of what the person might do in the future? In a word: No.

    Here is the backstory.

    The president has taken an oath to uphold the Constitution. The Constitution provides only two means for the federal government to kill a human being. The first is pursuant to a declaration of war, which only Congress can do. That permits the president to use the military to kill the troops of the government of the country against which war has been declared. Congress has not declared war on Iran.

    The second way that the Constitution permits federal government killings is pursuant to due process. That means that the person to be killed is lawfully in custody, has been properly charged, lawfully tried and fairly convicted of a capital crime, and the conviction has been upheld on appeal.

    Can the president kill foreign military personnel and claim the justification of self-defense? The laws of war permit him to do that, but self-defense — actually, defense of the country — only comes into play when the foreign military personnel are physically engaged in killing Americans or are certainly about to do so. That justification only applies — the law here is 600 years old and has been consistently applied — when force is imminent and certain.

    Were imminence and certainty not the requirement, then nothing would prevent a president from slaying any monster he chose simply based on a fear that the monster might someday strike. Such a state of affairs is contrary to two presidential executive orders, one issued by President Gerald R. Ford and the other by President Ronald Reagan, and neither negated by Trump. Such a territorial invasion and killing also violate the United Nations Charter — a treaty that prohibits unlawful invasions and killings of member nations’ territories and officials outside of a lawful and U.N. approved declaration of war.

    Roaming the world looking for monsters to slay not only violates long-standing principles of American domestic and international law, but also it violates basic Judeo-Christian moral principles, which teach that the end does not justify the means and might does not make right.

    Think about it. If the American president can kill an Iranian government official in Iraq because of fear of what he might do — without a declaration of war or any legal process — can the Chinese president kill a Mexican government official visiting in Texas or an American intelligence agent encouraging revolution in Venezuela for fear of what they might do?

    This is not a fanciful or academic argument. It not only goes to the fidelity to the rule of law that we require of our leaders in order to maintain personal liberty and limited government, it also goes to our safety. We have laws to prevent wanton killings, lest killers turn on us.

    In Robert Bolt’s play “A Man for All Seasons,” Sir Thomas More argues with his son-in-law, William Roper, about the extent of the law’s protections of those universally recognized as evil. Roper says that he would cut down all the laws in England to get rid of the Devil.

    More counters that even the Devil is entitled to the benefits of the law. Then he hurls this zinger: “And, when the last law was down, and the Devil turned round on you?—?where would you hide, Roper, the laws all being flat? This country’s planted thick with laws from coast to coast?—?man’s laws, not God’s?—?and, if you cut them down?—?and you’re just the man to do it?—?d’you really think you could stand upright in the winds that would blow then? Yes, I’d give the Devil benefit of law, for my own safety’s sake.”

    More crystalized the dangers of those who — like Trump — take the law into their own hands for the sake of expedience or to rid the world of a monster. Without law, how does one decide what monsters should go and what monsters may stay?

    When President Obama used drones to kill peaceful uncharged Americans in Yemen, candidate Donald Trump condemned that behavior. He offered that as president, he would bring the troops home, stop the nation building, quit being the world’s police force and end the endless wars. Instead, his act of state terrorism has succeeded in doing what the general he killed could never do while alive. Trump has united the Iranian people behind their fanatical government, and he caused the Iraqi government to kick out all American troops — troops that had no lawful or moral basis for being there in the first place and whose numbers have only increased.

    Trump cut down the laws to get to the Devil. Whom will he kill next?


    https://www.lewrockwell.com/2020/01/...assassination/
    “The right to life is the source of all rights—and the right to property is their only implementation. Without property rights, no other rights are possible. Since man has to sustain his life by his own effort, the man who has no right to the product of his effort has no means to sustain his life. The man who produces while others dispose of his product, is a slave.”

    Read the RPF trolls' playbook here (post #3)



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  3. #2

    Angry Saudi-Israel neocon stooge. Homegrown Terrorist

    President Trump is a bloodthirsty neocon stooge of Saudi Israel.



    He cares not the cost in blood & treasure to Joe & Jane Sixpack, as long as those donations and bribes keep rolling in.
    Last edited by RonZeplin; 01-09-2020 at 09:15 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    You only show up to attack Trump when he is wrong
    DACA S**thole Dreamers - Make America Great Again?

  4. #3
    ''In before the Trump-deranged character assassins show up.''

  5. #4
    Iran brags about being in a war with us and about killing our people.

  6. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Iran brags about being in a war with us and about killing our people.
    No they do not..

    That is Fabricated Bull$#@!..

    They have repeatedly warned of the FOLLY of any attack.. And they are Quite Well Defended,,and expecting attack since they are continually threatened with it.

    Yes,, They Have Graves Dug for that eventuality,,they are ready...

    Just how phucking Stupid do you want to be??
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  7. #6
    It was nothing but a Political Hit..against the most effective Tactical mind on the battlefield.

    It was a Hit,, on behalf of the Saudi/Israeli Alliance that created ISIS in the first place.

    Premeditated Murder,,set up and Baited purposely... And one more Deliberate Provocation against Iran.. one more in a long list.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  8. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    No they do not..

    That is Fabricated Bull$#@!..

    They have repeatedly warned of the FOLLY of any attack.. And they are Quite Well Defended,,and expecting attack since they are continually threatened with it.

    Yes,, They Have Graves Dug for that eventuality,,they are ready...

    Just how phucking Stupid do you want to be??
    There is no fabrication:

    The new leader of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps' elite Quds Force once boasted that U.S. troops have “suffered more losses from us than we have suffered losses from them” and has repeatedly ripped President Trump and America’s allies.
    Brigadier Gen. Esmail Qaani, 62, now spearheads the special military unit following the death of Gen. Qassem Soleimani, who was killed Thursday in a U.S. airstrike at Baghdad International Airport in Iraq. He had served as Soleimani’s deputy commander since 1997 – and the Treasury Department says he has used his power to direct funding toward terrorist groups like Hezbollah.
    Qaani, like many other Iranian government and military officials, also has a history of making hostile and inflammatory statements against the U.S.
    “America has suffered more losses from us than we have suffered losses from them,” the Middle East Institute quoted him as saying during a 2017 ceremony in commemoration of Iranian forces and Iranian-backed militias battling in Syria and Iraq.

    More at: https://www.foxnews.com/world/esmail...ce-iran-us-foe

    The original IRANIAN source:
    https://www.tasnimnews.com/fa/news/1...AF%D9%87%D8%AF

    Translated:
    https://translate.google.com/#view=h...8%A7%D9%85%2F*

    "The war we have with the United States has been successful in standing up and resisting in the country because we are in the province," Qaani said

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    There is no fabrication:

    The new leader of Iran’s Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps' elite Quds Force once boasted that U.S. troops have “suffered more losses from us than we have suffered losses from them” and has repeatedly ripped President Trump and America’s allies.
    Brigadier Gen. Esmail Qaani, 62, now spearheads the special military unit following the death of Gen. Qassem Soleimani, who was killed Thursday in a U.S. airstrike at Baghdad International Airport in Iraq. He had served as Soleimani’s deputy commander since 1997 – and the Treasury Department says he has used his power to direct funding toward terrorist groups like Hezbollah.
    Qaani, like many other Iranian government and military officials, also has a history of making hostile and inflammatory statements against the U.S.
    “America has suffered more losses from us than we have suffered losses from them,” the Middle East Institute quoted him as saying during a 2017 ceremony in commemoration of Iranian forces and Iranian-backed militias battling in Syria and Iraq.

    More at: https://www.foxnews.com/world/esmail...ce-iran-us-foe

    The original IRANIAN source:
    https://www.tasnimnews.com/fa/news/1...AF%D9%87%D8%AF

    Translated:
    https://translate.google.com/#view=h...8%A7%D9%85%2F*

    "The war we have with the United States has been successful in standing up and resisting in the country because we are in the province," Qaani said
    What is your point? Why are we there? We killed this guy because he was a impediment to out machinations in the Middle East. No more, no less.
    "The Patriarch"



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  11. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post

    "The war we have with the United States has been successful in standing up and resisting in the country because we are in the province," Qaani said
    Is that a google translation of another fabricated Translation,,,??? like others have proven to be.


    They consider ISIS to be US assets. Armed Trained and Funded by the US and Protected in Syria BY the US.

    They defeated the US assets.. and very possibly few US soldiers attached to ISIS.
    Last edited by pcosmar; 01-10-2020 at 09:12 PM.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  12. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    What is your point?
    That the IRGC considers itself at war with us and kills Americans.


    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    Why are we there?
    No good reason, we should leave.


    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    We killed this guy because he was a impediment to out machinations in the Middle East. No more, no less.
    We killed him because he was killing Americans, we should protect our people until we bring them home.

  13. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That the IRGC considers itself at war with us and kills Americans.



    No good reason, we should leave.



    We killed him because he was killing Americans, we should protect our people until we bring them home.
    Insane thinking.

    Sane thinking;
    Bring them home, problem solved.
    "The Patriarch"

  14. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    Is that a google translation of another fabricated Translation,,,??? like others have proven to be.

    I put the article into Google translate myself.

    I provided the original Iranian source so you can have it re-translated however you wish.

  15. #13

  16. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by angelatc View Post
    NetenYahoo approved.
    "The Patriarch"

  17. #15
    https://www.businessinsider.com/vide...attack-2019-10
    Video footage of a purported "bombing of Kurd civilians" by Turkish military forces shown on ABC News appeared to be a nighttime firing of tracer rounds at a Kentucky gun range.
    Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. When we accept or even welcome automobile checkpoints, random searches, mandatory identification cards, and paramilitary police in our streets, we have lost a vital part of our American heritage. America was born of protest, revolution, and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long.
    Ron Paul 2004

    Registered Ron Paul supporter # 2202
    It's all about Freedom

  18. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by pcosmar View Post
    It was nothing but a Political Hit..against the most effective Tactical mind on the battlefield.

    It was a Hit,, on behalf of the Saudi/Israeli Alliance that created ISIS in the first place.

    Premeditated Murder,,set up and Baited purposely... And one more Deliberate Provocation against Iran.. one more in a long list.
    Exactly.
    There is no spoon.



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  20. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Origanalist View Post
    What is your point? Why are we there? We killed this guy because he was a impediment to out machinations in the Middle East. No more, no less.
    This is true.

    The way I see it: We really don't have anything to prove. If anyone doubts the military power of the USA then they've been living under a rock for the past couple-hundred years.

    So all the bravado seems rather unnecessary. The troops shouldn't be there in the first place so all the huzzah about killing a guy who was planning attacks to get us out of the middle east seems altogether unnecessary, especially when the alleged plan is for us to leave anyway.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Elliot's The Hollow Men

  21. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by nobody's_hero View Post
    This is true.

    The way I see it: We really don't have anything to prove. If anyone doubts the military power of the USA then they've been living under a rock for the past couple-hundred years.

    So all the bravado seems rather unnecessary. The troops shouldn't be there in the first place so all the huzzah about killing a guy who was planning attacks to get us out of the middle east seems altogether unnecessary, especially when the alleged plan is for us to leave anyway.
    We have to protect our people until we leave and secondarily it proved that we are willing to use our might to protect our people, something that past administrations had created doubt about.

  22. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    We have to protect our people until we leave and secondarily it proved that we are willing to use our might to protect our people, something that past administrations had created doubt about.
    But that's exactly my point. If anyone on this planet doubts that the USA will protect it's people, then they've been living under a rock. We have nothing to prove. We can just come home. It would be the much wiser choice.
    Quote Originally Posted by timosman View Post
    This is getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    It started silly.
    T.S. Elliot's The Hollow Men

  23. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by nobody's_hero View Post
    But that's exactly my point. If anyone on this planet doubts that the USA will protect it's people, then they've been living under a rock. We have nothing to prove. We can just come home. It would be the much wiser choice.
    We should come home.
    I believe we will.



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