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Thread: Is It Time for America to Break Apart?

  1. #61
    Does anyone really believe here that largest cities and largest gummit taxing/spending/Congessional depts are rotten?

    Lately there seems to be excessive and continued criticism here of American cities (including some of largest cities like NYC, Baltimore, Chicago, SF, LA etc) , American Congress, American government, American politicians, American Banking/Wall Street/Fed Reserve/pharma/GMO, America Education/tax/immigration/Obamacare/Welfare/TSA/Child services systems.. and list goes on.
    Many people see a country like a motherland, can any part of motherland be 'rotten' if looked at it with patriotic eyes?

    While in principle i don't believe in anyone issuing patriotism certificates to incessant critics but continued criticism at some stage can become a problem and affect national patriotic spirit and cohesiveness.




    Potentially Related

    Quote:
    We reached out to Sen. Paul’s office for clarification on his comment, asking which statement or statements of Omar’s he was referencing, and if he was alleging that she literally called America a “rotten country” or if he was characterizing remarks she made as saying as much. Finally, we asked which of Omar’s remarks Paul believed amounted to a description of America as a “rotten country.”
    A spokesperson for Paul did not provide the requested clarification but instead reiterated via email that the senator viewed Omar’s “continued criticism” as “unfair considering how much Rep. Omar has achieved”:



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  3. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    Increasingly, we live in a country that has become de facto little more than a mere geographical entity. True, it is still formally a nation, but a nation where there are in fact at least two very distinct Americas, with radically differing visions of what is real and what is not real, radically differing conceptions of what is moral and what is not, radically differing views about truth and error, and radically differing ideas about using whatever means are available to reach a desired and posited end.
    True, but this is nothing new. America has always been divided up between different nations. The reason that our founders created a federal republic in the first place is that they knew various sections of the country are so culturally different that they could not live under the same top-down approach without violent conflict. It turns out, they were correct.

    The War of Southern Independence was caused by the North's rejection of federalism and the original understanding of the Constitution.

    As far as the Constitutional right for a State to secede, the document is clear. Article 1, Section 10 does not prohibit a State from seceding. Jefferson was right when he argued that the Union was voluntary and States can come and go as they please.

    Ultimately, balkanization and breakup will happen. It is inevitable. It almost happened in the 1860s between two groups that had many similarities. It will happen when you introduce millions of people who have very little in common with heritage Americans and who have no understanding of federalism and respect for different cultures.

  4. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    That was then. Lincoln showed you that the union must be preserved and sent the army to make sure it was. The government has bigger weapons now.
    It's all about taking action and not being lazy. So you do the work, whether it's fitness or whatever. It's about getting up, motivating yourself and just doing it.
    - Kim Kardashian

    Donald Trump / Rand Paul (Vice Pres) 2016!!!!

  5. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    Does anyone really believe here that largest cities and largest gummit taxing/spending/Congessional depts are rotten?

    Lately there seems to be excessive and continued criticism here of American cities (including some of largest cities like NYC, Baltimore, Chicago, SF, LA etc) , American Congress, American government, American politicians, American Banking/Wall Street/Fed Reserve/pharma/GMO, America Education/tax/immigration/Obamacare/Welfare/TSA/Child services systems.. and list goes on.
    Many people see a country like a motherland, can any part of motherland be 'rotten' if looked at it with patriotic eyes?
    I am one of the most vocal when it comes to criticizing cities, to answer your question, yes I believe that cities and those who choose to live in them are morally decrepit.

    People are not built to be stacked on top of one-another, they don't do well.

    Cities may be a necessary evil but a sane man should limit his exposure and he should definitely keep his family from having to experience them for any longer than a brief visit.



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  7. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by tod evans View Post
    I am one of the most vocal when it comes to criticizing cities, to answer your question, yes I believe that cities and those who choose to live in them are morally decrepit.

    People are not built to be stacked on top of one-another, they don't do well.

    Cities may be a necessary evil but a sane man should limit his exposure and he should definitely keep his family from having to experience them for any longer than a brief visit.
    That post was an attempt at satirical sarcasm Another discussion here had also inspired that post.

    I'm actually big believer that we should err on the side of allowing more criticism of everything instead of trying to squash it or deter/label critcs as 'unpatriotic' etc.

  8. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Federalist View Post
    The question comes down to this: Is the fragile American experiment in republicanism begun in Philadelphia in 1787, which required a commonly-shared understanding of basic principles, now over, or at the very least is it entering its agonizing death throes?

    One can certainly trace a progressively destructive trajectory in American history since the overthrow of the American constitutional system in 1865.
    The Usurpation of 1865 was just the completion of the Usurpation of 1787 ... (a thing that should be kept in mind for whatever comes after the status quo ...)


    Frédéric Bastiat (1801-1850)

    • "When law and morality are in contradiction to each other, the citizen finds himself in the cruel alternative of either losing his moral sense, or of losing his respect for the law." - The Law (p. 54)
    • "Government is that great fiction, through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else." - Government (p. 99)
    • "[W]ar is always begun in the interest of the few, and at the expense of the many."
      - Economic Sophisms - Second Series (p. 312)
    • "There are two principles that can never be reconciled - Liberty and Constraint."
      - Harmonies of Political Economy - Book One (p. 447)

    · tu ne cede malis sed contra audentior ito ·
    MOFA (Make Orwell Fiction Again)

  9. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    By Constitution, two thirds of states must agree before any one can leave.
    Well, then, so much the worse for the Constitution.

    "Sorry, everybody! False alarm. The Declaration of Independence has been rejected by His Majesty's Government. Move along, now! There's nothing to do here ..."
    -- Thomas Jefferson, 1776



    Quote Originally Posted by phill4paul View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    That was then. Lincoln showed you that the union must be preserved and sent the army to make sure it was. The government has bigger weapons now.
    And have those bigger weapons allowed them to subjugate Afghanistan? Iraq? Syria? How do the optics change when they begin using them on civilians? How many in the army would support or defect?

    It's much more complicated then saying "They have a mighty military." King George had one of the mightiest.
    You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to phill4paul again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti Globalist View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    Nobody secedes and lives to tell about it. Ask the Confederacy.
    The 13 colonies seceded from the British and they lived to tell about it.
    In modern times, the Soviet republics seceded/separated from the USSR and lived to tell about it.

    And as for the "bigger weapons" argument: the Soviet Union's weapons weren't any smaller than the U.S. federal government's are ...
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 08-18-2019 at 09:22 PM.

  10. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by enhanced_deficit View Post
    That post was an attempt at satirical sarcasm Another discussion here had also inspired that post.

    I'm actually big believer that we should err on the side of allowing more criticism of everything instead of trying to squash it or deter/label critcs as 'unpatriotic' etc.
    No, it wasn't meant as sarcasm, and I totally agree with Tod.
    "The Patriarch"

    Quote Originally Posted by UWDude View Post
    I get most of my news from Swordsmyth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That is a lie.
    @Brian4Liberty, devil keeps spreading this lie.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I will report violations of the forum rules to the forum staff when they are egregious enough.

    You should remember that.

  11. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Well, then, so much the worse for the Constitution.

    "Sorry, everybody! Move along, now! There's nothing to do here! The Declaration of Independence has been rejected by His Majesty's Government ..." -- Thomas Jefferson, 1776

    Why are you giving any credibility to zippy's lie?

    The Constitution says no such thing.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  12. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    Well, then, so much the worse for the Constitution.

    Thomas Jefferson: "Sorry, everybody! Move along, now! There's nothing to do here! The Declaration of Independence has been rejected by His Majesty's Government ..."





    In modern times, the Soviet republics seceded/separated from the USSR and lived to tell about it.

    And as for the "bigger weapons" argument: the Soviet Union's weapons weren't any smaller than the U.S. federal government's are ...
    The Soviet Union completely collapsed. It wasn't a peaceful division. Or a voluntary union in the first place. And some countries only barely survived and some were swallowed back up. Others have done well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    The quality seems to have dropped significantly since I came here, I guess you get what you pay for.
    "There is always a tweet. That has become accepted fact in the Trump presidency: For every pronouncement the President makes, there is at least one tweet from his past that directly contradicts his current view." -CNN

    I am Zippy and I approve of this post. But you don't have to.

  13. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by euphemia View Post
    That was then. Lincoln showed you that the union must be preserved and sent the army to make sure it was. The government has bigger weapons now.
    Lincoln was a tyrant, pure and simple.
    "The Patriarch"

    Quote Originally Posted by UWDude View Post
    I get most of my news from Swordsmyth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    That is a lie.
    @Brian4Liberty, devil keeps spreading this lie.
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    I will report violations of the forum rules to the forum staff when they are egregious enough.

    You should remember that.

  14. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by Swordsmyth View Post
    Why are you giving any credibility to zippy's lie?

    The Constitution says no such thing.
    I don't really care whether it's a lie or not. I am not a Constitutionalist.

    Even granting his claim arguendo, his statement is still irrelevant. (That was the point of my sarcastic fake Jefferson quote.)
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 08-18-2019 at 10:03 PM.



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  16. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Zippyjuan View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    In modern times, the Soviet republics seceded/separated from the USSR and lived to tell about it. [emphasis added by Zippyjuan - OB]

    And as for the "bigger weapons" argument: the Soviet Union's weapons weren't any smaller than the U.S. federal government's are ...
    The Soviet Union completely collapsed. It wasn't a peaceful division. Or a voluntary union in the first place. And some countries only barely survived and some were swallowed back up. Others have done well.
    In what way does any of that rebut. refute or counter my claims that:

    (1) the Soviet republics seceded/separated from the USSR and lived to tell about it (which is exactly what happened, however one pleases to characterize it), and
    (2) the Soviet Union's weapons weren't any smaller than the U.S. federal government's are ... ?
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 08-18-2019 at 11:57 PM.

  17. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Occam's Banana View Post
    The Usurpation of 1865 was just the completion of the Usurpation of 1787 ... (a thing that should be kept in mind for whatever comes after the status quo ...)
    Yep- the Anti-Federalists were right.
    There is no spoon.

  18. #75
    Let's see, do I want to live in a socialist state that obsesses over culture...

    ...or a socialist state that obsesses over culture?

    I guess I'm indifferent, so have at it.
    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."

    -H. L. Mencken

  19. #76
    Yup. My political viewpoint is simple: one is either a secessionist or one is a fascist.

  20. #77
    No it is time for America to break with Israel now that we will soon know which politicians Israel has blackmailed through Epstein.

  21. #78
    No, the US should stay the way it is.

  22. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Republicanguy View Post
    No, the US should stay the way it is.
    Pipe down Limey, don't you have problems of your own on your side of the pond.

  23. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Parasiticmoocherguy View Post
    No, the US should stay the way it is.
    RPF's resident Orwellian prole chimes in ...
    Last edited by Occam's Banana; 08-20-2019 at 09:05 PM.



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  25. #81

  26. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Republicanguy View Post
    No, the US should stay the way it is.
    It's none of your business, Redcoat.
    Never attempt to teach a pig to sing; it wastes your time and annoys the pig.

    Robert Heinlein

    Give a man an inch and right away he thinks he's a ruler

    Groucho Marx

    I love mankind…it’s people I can’t stand.

    Linus, from the Peanuts comic

    You cannot have liberty without morality and morality without faith

    Alexis de Torqueville

    Those who fail to learn from the past are condemned to repeat it.
    Those who learn from the past are condemned to watch everybody else repeat it

    A Zero Hedge comment

  27. #83
    "It's probably the biggest hoax since Big Foot!" - Mitt Romney 1-16-2012 SC Debate

  28. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by otherone View Post
    Yup. My political viewpoint is simple: one is either a secessionist or one is a fascist.
    Damn straight
    "It's probably the biggest hoax since Big Foot!" - Mitt Romney 1-16-2012 SC Debate

  29. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Pauls' Revere View Post
    L.A. can be the capital of Liberal America. Dallas can be the capital of conservative America.
    What about us that want nothing to do with either of you morons, and realize the two party system and moronic 'you're either this or that' mentality is what ruined this country?

  30. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by rpfocus View Post
    What about us that want nothing to do with either of you morons, and realize the two party system and moronic 'you're either this or that' mentality is what ruined this country?

    Danke Awarded Top Rated Influencer

    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!


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    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

  31. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by Danke View Post
    A Trumpcuck says what?

  32. #88



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  34. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by rpfocus View Post
    A Trumpcuck says what?
    Oh wow. I didn't know that you're an angry drunk. Go slower on the whiskey next time. It can hit suddenly.
    Last edited by RJB; 08-21-2019 at 05:51 PM.

  35. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by rpfocus View Post
    A Trumpcuck says what?
    Danke Awarded Top Rated Influencer

    Quiz: Test Your "Income" Tax IQ!


    Short Income Tax Video

    The Income Tax Is An Excise, And Excise Taxes Are Privilege Taxes

    The Federalist Papers, No. 15:

    Except as to the rule of appointment, the United States have an indefinite discretion to make requisitions for men and money; but they have no authority to raise either by regulations extending to the individual citizens of America.

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